Anthony's Deceptions and Seeking Full Immunity#3 Poll Added

[flnana]

That was Good!
Having a beer with George could be risky.........
all of his shoulder shrugging might knock you off your bar stool.

Yeah, but don't you think he'd be extremely grateful for the opportunity to say what he wanted, when he wanted and be able to just sit and enjoy a beer without anyone telling him when to take a swig and how big a swig he could take????
I voted no for all the reasons already stated, specifically that I couldn't trust it really was the truth.

 

[Fandy]

I have no sympathy at all for any of the Anthony family. To lie and try to deceive LE is way past the pale, and they should receive the harshest punishment the law allows.

If they had told the truth in the beginning, that baby would not have to had laid in the woods in a garbage bag for months, and for that I hold them accountable as should LE.

ITA, but I think LE will play this card close to the vest and we won't know until the trial begins.

Cindy doesn't know the whole truth from ummm a hole in her backyard (but i am thinking something else), she moves the strings and George's head bobs up and down. If they hadn't found Caylee's remains, they would still be pounding the networks with their interviews and *sightings*.

 

[whiteangora]

Yeah, but don't you think he'd be extremely grateful for the opportunity to say what he wanted, when he wanted and be able to just sit and enjoy a beer without anyone telling him when to take a swig and how big a swig he could take????
I voted no for all the reasons already stated, specifically that I couldn't trust it really was the truth.

I suppose it would be interesting to get him away from the 'tyrant'.

 

[SailorMoon]

Interesting. It would not surprise me in the least that KC would throw 'em all under the bus. I am particularly drawn to the GA theory. It has always bothered me that he refers to Caylee in such detached terms as "the little girl".

Me too. He also refers to Casey to as my daughter, my daughter. I was watching the NG thing last night and thinking of how I would refer to my daughter and it would be by name, 9 times out of 10.

 

[debs]

Beer with the Anthony's........hmm. Cindy's would be a Twisted Lemonade because she makes even the simplest thing convoluted, George's would be a red beer because of all the pent up frustration of having his spine controlled by others, Lee's beer would be a bitter ale because he's the golden child and it's never about him, and Casey's would be a near-beer because you THINK you're getting a beer but it's only after you've had a few that you realize that what you got was fake, phoney, and nothing like what you thought it was.

The dogs no doubt have a champagne appetite. I'll have a beer with the cat.

But as for immunity for George and Cindy, I continue to say "Thanks, but no thanks." It will be a hard reality they have to face if they are charged with anything. They made choices fully aware of what those choices could lead to, and it is unfortunate that they went down the road they did. It isn't as though we here at WS, as well as people in the media, people outside their homes, their own family members weren't standing before them screaming at them to not make these decisions. It wasn't as though they were unaware.

So..okay. If there are charges, so be it. If they get immunity, so be it. If it turns out that this immunity is for nothing huge, so be it. If it is huge but they get it anyway, so be it. But I won't pretend at the end of the day that it was their grief that led them down this road. If they aligned themselves with less than savory people (which I believe they did) it is only because anyone else was adamant that the Anthony's behave in a manner above reproach and with dignity and truthfulness. Their choice. The truth will out.

 

[Nana46]

How would you ever know when any of them are telling the truth? I mean really.....unless there are things that cannot be disproven? I just don't see how you would ever know they are now being honest

 

[sharpar]

These people are scary enough sober - I cant imagine what they are like under
the influence - YIKES

They have all made their choices and I am all for letting the chips fall where they will .

I do want LE to make it impossible for them to profit off that little girl . Whatever
is necessary so they can never see the camera lights pointed in their direction or spew their propaganda in public again .

 

[madeleine]

I think they're in deep deep trouble right now and Conway isn't fooling me.We probably don't know half of what's going on but everything I've heard lately makes me believe they're not going to get away with it.Whatever "it" is.

 

[gigi331]

The way I look at is like this; would you choose to lose your grandaughter or your daughter? Then would you choose to also lose your daughter? It's a decision no parent would ever want to make.

I think the Anthonys are seriously grieving for Caylee. It has finally hit them that she's dead. Gone. Casey KILLED her.

They've already lost one 'daughter', I have no doubt they're clinging on to everything to save another.

At the end of the day though, I don't exactly see where they have lied so badly they've obstructed the case. I don't believe they knew when or where Casey killed Caylee. I don't believe they knew where the body was. I don't believe they knew that Zanny wasn't real. Cindy has seemed pretty truthful in her LE interviews, yes she spins and plays on words, but she hasn't really withheld anything that is that imperative. I don't think they have any involvement in this case except for being grandparents suffering the loss of their grandchild, should they be offered immunity, I think we'll find that some things they tell are pretty insignificant.

They have lied badly to try to obstruct the case.....to the point of insaneness. When it was obvious that Caylee was dead, they not only refused to believe, which I can';t entirely fault them for......However, they defended Casey over and over and over until it made most of us sick to our stomachs. They would come up with complete nonsense to explain things away that Casey had done.

I voted NO.....they will NEVER tell the truth. I am convinced that they will protect Casey at all costs. They should have done what was right the first time, then they wouldn't need to be seeking immunity now.

 

[Steely Dan]

The original Son of Sam laws were largely knocked down at the supreme court level based on them limiting free speech. The newer way to do, and it has held up, is through these statutes. Upon conviction you owe the state money for your court costs, prosecution etc, if there is a victim or victims family that can file for damages they file suit and the state files a lien on their behalf as well. The lien applies to any assets belonging to the convict which stops them from directly profiting from a book or movie deal.

It was asked earlier if immunity would restrict George, Cindy or Lee from profiting. It doesn't, unless you can show that Casey somehow benefits from it directly, but if she is in for life that will be difficult to show.

960.292 Enforcement of the civil restitution lien through civil restitution lien order



960.293 Determination of damages and losses.--
(1) In a civil suit for damages filed by a crime victim against a convicted offender, the crime victim is entitled to liquidated damages in an amount equal to the actual damages award.
(2) Upon conviction, a convicted offender is liable to the state and its local subdivisions for damages and losses for incarceration costs and other correctional costs.
(a) If the conviction is for a capital or life felony, the convicted offender is liable for incarceration costs and other correctional costs in the liquidated damage amount of $250,000. (b) If the conviction is for an offense other than a capital or life felony, a liquidated damage amount of $50 per day of the convicted offender's sentence shall be assessed against the convicted offender and in favor of the state or its local subdivisions.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0960/titl0960.htm&StatuteYear=2008&Title=-%3E2008-%3EChapter%20960

http://list.msu.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0602a&L=aejmc&P=22286 interesting read on how the laws started and evolved

Thank you very much. :thumb: I wasn't sure that a conviction for OJ would matter that much. It sounds like they could make money off the crime anyway.

I'll probably take one on the chin for this, and this is my first post ever though I am an avid fan/reader of WS and am hooked on this case, but here goes....After looking at every bit of information available to us, I agree that the GP's were in denial initially. Families fight, but when they have a common enemy, they band together. Look at brothers and sisters. So, it is my opinion that initially, the GP's felt as though KC was being crucified by law enforcement and media, up to and including Nancy G. Their instinct to protect their child and really consider a positive, non-KC explanation for Caylee's disappearance kicked in. I believe this is what lead them to make statements to try to really believe in and consider a non-KC explanation. Despite evidence to the contrary, I can understand that they could not come to grips with the fact that their own child could do this and that the worst possible outcome had happened to Caylee.

Now that Caylee has been found however, any explanations and hopes have eroded and they really have to look at the quagmire of facts and history that surround them. Their eyes, I am certain, are now wide open to the dismal truth. I think now, they have had some time to process, think back over everything that has occurred and are succombing to truth. Thus, no visits to KC during the holidays and they are agreeing to aid in the prosecution of their daughter if given immunity.

I believe the wrong-doing on the GP's part was inspired by instinct to protect their daughter, again from the 'quick draw' decision by law and media on KC's guilt. They wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt. Given that, I have no problem voting yes in the poll, I believe that now they know Caylee is gone they want to move forward, up to and including doing the right thing, even though it means KC is essentially lost to them too.

The biggest crime here is what was done to Caylee, not anything that was said by the GP's. If it means giving them immunity to improve the prosecution's case, I say give it to them. I really don't believe they were involved or 9-1-1 would never have been called, they would not have made statements about the car to several different people, and CA would not have offered up all the evidence that she did, some of which was denied by law enforcement (this still blows my mind).

I agree with everything bold in red. Stick to your guns no matter how much crap your given. You have a right to free speech! :woohoo:

BTW, I'm a newbie too so I will say, :Welcome-12-june:

Here's another oar in the water on the immunity/Son of Sam law relationship, in general. I'm trying for plain English! If a person were given full immunity from prosecution, then it follows that they would not be convicted of any crimes. As a result, Son of Sam type laws or restitution statutes would theoretically never come into play or be triggered.

It's a whole other question whether a person might be covered or restricted by a SOS law in the first place. I tried to look once, and I think Florida has both a SOS type law and another, separate civil restitution statute. They would control, as interpreted by the courts. This was all in issue in a case concerning the guy who murdered all the Florida coeds several years ago, Rolling? Rollings? I'm going just from memory, but I think the court used the restitution statute to support the result of keeping money from the convicted defendant for selling his art or something. There may have been a girlfriend or spouse involved as well. The court avoided ruling on the constitutionality of the FLA Son of Sam type statute.

In either case, the idea is to keep a person convicted of a crime from profiting from it. Some of the early SOS statutes were very broad, and included both the convicted defendant AND people associated with him (like family members, lawyers), even though they had committed no independent "crime of their own." They also covered a lot of potential forms of expression or speech and prohibited them outright. The courts have struck down several of these SOS statutes as overly broad under the first amendment, because they unduly infringe the right to free speech. The more recent approach has been not to have a blanket, broad prohibition of activities/expression, but to switch to a system where the victims can find out about money being made and have an opportunity to go after it.

Thank you too for your dumbing things down for me. :clap:

It sounds like both of you are saying that even without any immunity for them they could still profit from any books or movie deals they'd make.

With that in mind I'd say give them limited immunity and if the things they say are lies and can be proven as such then they'll be in deeper doo-doo.

On every case LE holds some things back that only the perp would know. If CA and GA can answer some questions with those pieces of info that they got from KC then give them immunity.

 

[gigi331]

Beer with the Anthony's........hmm. Cindy's would be a Twisted Lemonade because she makes even the simplest thing convoluted, George's would be a red beer because of all the pent up frustration of having his spine controlled by others, Lee's beer would be a bitter ale because he's the golden child and it's never about him, and Casey's would be a near-beer because you THINK you're getting a beer but it's only after you've had a few that you realize that what you got was fake, phoney, and nothing like what you thought it was.

The dogs no doubt have a champagne appetite. I'll have a beer with the cat.

But as for immunity for George and Cindy, I continue to say "Thanks, but no thanks." It will be a hard reality they have to face if they are charged with anything. They made choices fully aware of what those choices could lead to, and it is unfortunate that they went down the road they did. It isn't as though we here at WS, as well as people in the media, people outside their homes, their own family members weren't standing before them screaming at them to not make these decisions. It wasn't as though they were unaware.

So..okay. If there are charges, so be it. If they get immunity, so be it. If it turns out that this immunity is for nothing huge, so be it. If it is huge but they get it anyway, so be it. But I won't pretend at the end of the day that it was their grief that led them down this road. If they aligned themselves with less than savory people (which I believe they did) it is only because anyone else was adamant that the Anthony's behave in a manner above reproach and with dignity and truthfulness. Their choice. The truth will out.

Great post....I totally agree. The A's had to align themselves with shady people because no one else would listen to their nonsense. And they were looking for people who would go along with their "Caylee is Alive" theory. Most intelligent people wouldn't go along with this, so they had no choice but to involve themselves with those who believed their theories or would pretend to believe their theories.

 

[SWGAL]

Not giving Caylee's hair brush to LE, and then bragging about it is OJ imo. She was also commenting about Caylee's toothbrush.

No one will ever convince me that she didn't know what she was doing when she washed Casey's clothes. She is an RN. She knows what decomposition smells like, as does Geo., and he admitted it to the investigators. It probably won't happen, but they need to be charged with OJ. Just my opinion, of course.:behindbar

 

[suzet]

They are incapable of telling the truth. Whether it be a blatant lie or by omission, they will never share the whole story in the interest of justice for Caylee if it means they have to help send Casey to prison.

I totally agree. They are incapable of telling the truth. Cindy, imo, is the biggest liar of the three. I believe George would offer more truth than Cindy, but he will still lie. I believe Lee would rather stay quiet than lie. So if he is forced to speak, he will lie.

 

[Manny]

I do not believe the GP's are capable of adopting the attitude 'its all about Caylee' when it concerns justice. So far 'its all about Casey' and protecting the family's image.

We tell our children at this age to tell the truth regardless of the consequences and I am sure the family has asked this of Caylee many times. Her family even when it involves the death of their own child wants the truth to be conditional of them not having to face the consequences of their actions. Yet, they have asked the same of Caylee many times.

The unconditional truth would have shown some token of love and respect for this poor child and would brought about some closure and forgiveness. It would have shown others, as they have asked Caylee to tell the truth and face the consequences ... they are willing to do the same for her.

In the end, Caylee has given so much more to her family (the truth) then what they are willing to give to her.

What do you think?

Would the GP's be totally candid and truthful if provided full immunity?

I feel that in the beginning the GP were in instinct mode and wanted to protect both Casey and Caylee. That was their primary motivation. Now I feel they are ready to deal with the reality. I think it is wise of them to ask for the attorney's advice now. I am sure it is unfamiliar territory and a very emotional one at that, so I think they will tell whatever they know now that they will have immunity from LE about anything they may have done in error. I think this must have been the most horrendous thing that could happen to anyone. I can't even imagine what it would be like or how I would react.

 

[Zuckerschnecke]

I originally said to give them immunity IF they were going to be truthful and it would help the case....but I am changing my opinion on this after realizing that they may have known where the body was for some time before it was found. If the matter were simply that they didn't want to face what was happening and it was too unbearable so they made stupid mistakes to protect the reality they prolonged facing, I can have some sympathy for that. I can't judge their emotions and how devastating knowing in their hearts that Caylee was dead must have been for them. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes. And I think the attorney talked some sense into them too, about the seriousness of what that reality was.

On the other hand, the hairbrush, the possibly knowing of where the body was, going public with pictures of kids and trying to pass them off as 'Caylee sightings' - it's a downhill snowball that they started rolling on their own. They could have come clean much earlier and told what they know. They are a little late to be coming now with wanting immunity, IMO.

 

[SWGAL]

I agree that this has been the most horrendous of circumstances that could happen to anyone.
However, to continue blatantly lie as have Cindy, and Geo., has done nothing to help their daughter. When Cindy said on national television that they had a nice evening on June 15th, and Geo. shook his head in agreement, I wondered why she even brought it up. The neighbor heard the screaming between Cindy and Casey, and we all know that she tried to choke Casey for not being "The Mother of te Year," and Casey stealing from her grandparents and parents.

 

[Gma Kat]

I think they would still lie if they thought they could get away with it. They are not about justice for Caylee, because JUSTICE for Caylee would include punishing them.

 

[natsound]

I originally said to give them immunity IF they were going to be truthful and it would help the case....but I am changing my opinion on this after realizing that they may have known where the body was for some time before it was found. If the matter were simply that they didn't want to face what was happening and it was too unbearable so they made stupid mistakes to protect the reality they prolonged facing, I can have some sympathy for that. I can't judge their emotions and how devastating knowing in their hearts that Caylee was dead must have been for them. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes. And I think the attorney talked some sense into them too, about the seriousness of what that reality was.

On the other hand, the hairbrush, the possibly knowing of where the body was, going public with pictures of kids and trying to pass them off as 'Caylee sightings' - it's a downhill snowball that they started rolling on their own. They could have come clean much earlier and told what they know. They are a little late to be coming now with wanting immunity, IMO.

Zucker, there's no solid evidence that the A's knew where the body was. All of this PI videotaping stuff is too confusing to really understand why they were there/who sent them there. We need more information. I'm sticking with the belief that the A's are following an instinct to defend and protect their own daughter in this harrowing situation. Granted, they've taken it way too far, their denial went way too far, and they're not the smartest tools in the shed. But I'll go out on a limb and say I still don't believe they knew where Caylee's remains were. I have a lot of sympathy for the A's.

 

[doogiesgirl]

I have not read this whole thread so if this has already been brought up, sorry.

No, IMO CA would not be totally honest if given immunity. Think about CA's ability to deny that KC was pregnant. Look at the picture of KC at CA's brother's wedding and ask yourself how unbalanced one would have to be to believe that their daughter was not pregnant. It is stupefying. And to think of how the whole family followed suit??!! None of them confronted KC with the OBVIOUS truth.

And I can honestly say that if I were in CA's shoes I would support and believe my child where there are no facts to prove otherwise. I would NOT encourage my child to propagate a lie to get themselves out of trouble or to keep me from losing a child to prison. If the facts showed my child guilty then I would encourage my child to tell the truth, letting them know that I will still love them through the punishment.

There is no way I could ever believe a thing that CA says because of the lies she's told up to this point, the judgement she has shown regarding her own daughter when confronted with facts, and because any person, let alone a nurse at that, who could deny their daughter's pregnancy when the physical manifestation is looking them in the face, well.....that has to be, at the least, an unbalanced person. Not someone I would trust the justice of Caylee too. Sorry, thats how I feel.

And as far as GA goes, I have had hope for him a few times but have come to realize that as CA goes, there goes GA also. MOO

 

[doogiesgirl]

I have not read this whole thread so if this has already been brought up, sorry.

No, IMO CA would not be totally honest if given immunity. Think about CA's ability to deny that KC was pregnant. Look at the picture of KC at CA's brother's wedding and ask yourself how unbalanced one would have to be to believe that their daughter was not pregnant. It is stupefying. And to think of how the whole family followed suit??!! None of them confronted KC with the OBVIOUS truth.

And I can honestly say that if I were in CA's shoes I would support and believe my child where there are no facts to prove otherwise. I would NOT encourage my child to propagate a lie to get themselves out of trouble or to keep me from losing a child to prison. If the facts showed my child guilty then I would encourage my child to tell the truth, letting them know that I will still love them through the punishment.

There is no way I could ever believe a thing that CA says because of the lies she's told up to this point, the judgement she has shown regarding her own daughter when confronted with facts, and because any person, let alone a nurse at that, who could deny their daughter's pregnancy when the physical manifestation is looking them in the face, well.....that has to be, at the least, an unbalanced person. Not someone I would trust the justice of Caylee too. Sorry, thats how I feel.

And as far as GA goes, I have had hope for him a few times but have come to realize that as CA goes, there goes GA also. MOO