ARDI -- new hope The return of the IDI

[Roy23]

That makes three of us.



I sympathize, Roy. Honestly, I do. But I found it helpful to ask myself this question: which of the two would NEED to do all of that?



If you ask me, it was pure dumb luck. Smarts had nothing to do with it.

I apologize for all of my butting in here, folks. But I'm kind of hepped up today, for some reason. So bear with me.

Why would the Ramsey's need to write an RN?

The only way I see this scenario with all of this is if Burke and one of his friends did this to JBR. And then the R's covered it up. I think the R and intruder scenario of this is equally ridiculous. But yeah, it did happen.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

That makes three of us.



I sympathize, Roy. Honestly, I do. But I found it helpful to ask myself this question: which of the two would NEED to do all of that?



If you ask me, it was pure dumb luck. Smarts had nothing to do with it.

I apologize for all of my butting in here, folks. But I'm kind of hepped up today, for some reason. So bear with me.

OK I understand dumb luck prevented RDI from sourcing the DNA from an unknown male found on multiple articles of clothing JBR was wearing at the time she was murdered.

Would that be the same dumb luck that prevented sourcing of the cord, tape, pineapple, implement that caused JBR's skull fracture, and the so-close-yet-so-far handwriting? RDI, lacking any valid link, goes ahead and claims to have sourced these items when in reality they're not sourced.

 

[BBB167893]

Why would the Ramsey's need to write an RN?

I'm very glad you asked. Because, and this is what CASKU thought as well, once they decided to stage a crime, they had to explain why the crime happened and why JB wound up dead. Having the RN creates a criminal (or several) who could have done this. Them violating the instructions by calling the police and half the neighborhood over to the house explains why "they" killed her. That's how I look at it. Not only me.

The only way I see this scenario with all of this is if Burke and one of his friends did this to JBR. And then the R's covered it up.

There are a few people who would agree with that scenario.

I think the R and intruder scenario of this is equally ridiculous. But yeah, it did happen.

That about sums it up. It's impossible, yet there it is.

 

[Tadpole12]

"And then to be smart enough to put somebody else DNA and skin cells on top of it too." -

Within the RDI scenario, it could have just been blind luck .... perhaps using a glove belonging to another person would leave dna, but then how to explain the matching partial dna taken from JBR's fingernails, other than suggesting 'contamination'.

 

[BBB167893]

OK I understand dumb luck prevented RDI from sourcing theDNA from an unknown male found on multiple articles of clothing JBR was wearing at the time she was murdered.

Do you now?

Would that be the same dumb luck that prevented sourcing of the cord, tape, pineapple, implement that caused JBR's skull fracture, and the so-close-yet-so-far handwriting?

In a manner of speaking, HOTYH, that's precisely it. How did they know the DA couldn't be bothered to conduct a proper investigation by issuing the proper searches for those items? It's not as hard to understand as you make it out to be.

RDI, lacking any valid link, goes ahead and claims to have sourced these items when in reality they're not sourced.

You wouldn't accept any of them anyway.

 

[stereo21]

1. So the staging is a "failed" kidnapping with sexual abuse scenario? It seems strange that a stager (PR) adds a ransom note for a body that is still in the basement? What kind of motherly figure "wraps" her beauty up, then stages a sexual-garroting?

Kidnapper: He writes the ransom note BEFORE to delay the search (and mislead it) for what was going to be a sexual kidnap/murder scenario for him.

Hits girl on head, thinks she will be easy to get out with her unconscious. OR he tries to feed her pineapple, she refuses to go outside with him, then he hits her on the head.

Realizes he might have done overkill, brings her into the basement to chill and figure out what the heck to do. So he says to himself, already wrote the ransom note. But the girl is no longer of any use to him if she is really messed up (bleeding, etc). So he chokes her, puts here in the backroom and sets up a scene that gets him off, or whatever, and then bails.

The main problem with this is why he didn't bring the body. But maybe he was too worried about a trail with the blood, and bringing her out the door.

2. If the Rs were truly innocent, it would explain some of their insane behavior. The problem is that their guilt would as well.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Y'know there used to be this guy that posted over and over 'there's zero evidence of an intruder'.

The DNA, handwriting, tape, cord, pineapple, and mystery implement used to strike JBR are all evidence that tends to bolster the intruder theory because none can be factually sourced to the R's. Therefore, they are 'evidence of an intruder'.

 

[BBB167893]

"And then to be smart enough to put somebody else DNA and skin cells on top of it too." -

Within the RDI scenario, it could have just been blind luck .... perhaps using a glove belonging to another person would leave dna,

There's an idea. But it could be a whole lot simpler than all that.

but then how to explain the matching partial dna taken from JBR's fingernails, other than suggesting 'contamination'.

Don't dismiss contamination too quickly, Tadpole. But to answer that question, IF the DNA from her nails DID match (and despite the insistence of some, there's no way 2 markers could scientifically be called a "match" to anything), that means JB could have transferred it herself.

 

[BBB167893]

1. So the staging is a "failed" kidnapping with sexual abuse scenario?

Best guess.

It seems strange that a stager (PR) adds a ransom note for a body that is still in the basement?

Even stranger for an intruder, wouldn't you say?

What kind of motherly figure "wraps" her beauty up, then stages a sexual-garroting?

I think it was the other way around.

 

[stereo21]

Even stranger for an intruder, wouldn't you say?

If it was actually a failed kidnapping, then it wouldn't make sense to take the note. If it was an accidental death, there is less of a need for a kidnapping note. If the girl dies unexpectly (or she goes into a coma), then the whole purpose of kidnapping for rape is gone.

I think it was the other way around.

My point is that they are totally disparate impulses. * I need to make this look crazy and sexually depraved....also I FEEL SO BAD FOR WHAT HAPPENED....*

ON the other hand, if I am a sexual molester, I may have some weird love for the girl that causes me to do weird **** no matter what.

 

[Tadpole12]

Don't dismiss contamination too quickly, Tadpole. But to answer that question, IF the DNA from her nails DID match (and despite the insistence of some, there's no way 2 markers could scientifically be called a "match" to anything), that means JB could have transferred it herself. - SD

Hi SD.
TY for that insight. Something to consider.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

If it was actually a failed kidnapping, then it wouldn't make sense to take the note. If it was an accidental death, there is less of a need for a kidnapping note. If the girl dies unexpectly (or she goes into a coma), then the whole purpose of kidnapping for rape is gone.




My point is that they are totally disparate impulses. * I need to make this look crazy and sexually depraved....also I FEEL SO BAD FOR WHAT HAPPENED....*

ON the other hand, if I am a sexual molester, I may have some weird love for the girl that causes me to do weird **** no matter what.

Oh I can help with that one. Totally disparate is the name of the game for RDI. IOW, the less sensical the better, what with the R's being so nonsensical and all. RDI have granted themselves this wildcard, allowing any and all phenomenon to be explained away without any real cause to do so.

RDI wants you to forget the facts and not apply any logic. It truely is the DARK SIDE.

 

[Roy23]

Best guess.



Even stranger for an intruder, wouldn't you say?



I think it was the other way around.

I don't think it is necessarily stranger for an intruder Dave. It is strange on both accounts. Really. But, I think that if JBR was targeted and an intruder was in their house before they arrived home the intruder could have intended on abducting her. Maybe he thought he may not have the opportunity to accomplish his deed. Maybe JBR fought and he panicked. I think a lot of scenarios could be the case, but yeah it is weird. No matter RDI or IDI.

I do not think the Ramsey's needed to write a note nor did the intruder. My .02.

 

[Tadpole12]

ON the other hand, if I am a sexual molester, I may have some weird love for the girl that causes me to do weird **** no matter what. - Stereo21

Hi Stereo.

Ya, it's difficult to attribute. 'normal behaviour patterns' to someone who is deranged .... or under a delusion.

 

[BBB167893]

If it was actually a failed kidnapping, then it wouldn't make sense to take the note. If it was an accidental death, there is less of a need for a kidnapping note. If the girl dies unexpectly (or she goes into a coma), then the whole purpose of kidnapping for rape is gone.

Right.

My point is that they are totally disparate impulses. * I need to make this look crazy and sexually depraved....also I FEEL SO BAD FOR WHAT HAPPENED....*

I realize that they are disparate impulses, stereo21. But just the way you phrased it kind of outlines what I'm saying. It's a difference between what's in someone's head and in their heart.

Let me lay this on you: Jeffrey MacDonald went to the trouble of preparing a bottle for his daughter and putting it in the crib with her AFTER he killed her in a horrible fashion.

ON the other hand, if I am a sexual molester, I may have some weird love for the girl that causes me to do weird **** no matter what.

Yeah, I'm familiar with that argument. I used to believe it myself.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

I don't think it is necessarily stranger for an intruder Dave. It is strange on both accounts. Really. But, I think that if JBR was targeted and an intruder was in their house before they arrived home the intruder could have intended on abducting her. Maybe he thought he may not have the opportunity to accomplish his deed. Maybe JBR fought and he panicked. I think a lot of scenarios could be the case, but yeah it is weird. No matter RDI or IDI.

I do not think the Ramsey's needed to write a note nor did the intruder. My .02.

Ah, but you're applying logic here.

Why panic? Maybe because its night time in a upper-middle class neighborhood with police, and the perp's person or car might be the only thing around?

Do things go wrong with criminal plans? Apparently each and every kidnapping case we've discussed, from L&L to Barbara Mackel, to the Linbergh baby, eventually they all went wrong.

 

[BBB167893]

Oh I can help with that one. Totally disparate is the name of the game for RDI. IOW, the less sensical the better, what with the R's being so nonsensical and all.

It's a fair sight more nuanced than THAT.

RDI have granted themselves this wildcard, allowing any and all phenomenon to be explained away without any real cause to do so.

Speaking purely for myself, I work like hell to SHOW cause and not resort to "wildcards." But then, calling them "wildcards" is a convenient way not to actually deal with any arguments...

RDI wants you to forget the facts and not apply any logic. It truely is the DARK SIDE.

I'd laugh at that assertion, if I weren't so offended by it.

 

[Roy23]

Ah, but you're applying logic here.

Why panic? Maybe because its night time in a upper-middle class neighborhood with police, and the perp's person or car might be the only thing around?

Do things go wrong with criminal plans? Apparently each and every kidnapping case we've discussed, from L&L to Barbara Mackel, to the Linbergh baby, eventually they all went wrong.

Good point. I think logical thinking is probably not the way to go at all probably. Just keep following the evidence.

 

[Tadpole12]

I don't think it is necessarily stranger for an intruder Dave. It is strange on both accounts. Really. But, I think that if JBR was targeted and an intruder was in their house before they arrived home the intruder could have intended on abducting her. Maybe he thought he may not have the opportunity to accomplish his deed. Maybe JBR fought and he panicked. I think a lot of scenarios could be the case, but yeah it is weird. No matter RDI or IDI.

I do not think the Ramsey's needed to write a note nor did the intruder. My .02.

"I do not think the Ramsey's needed to write a note"-Roy23

Ya for sure, in hindsight, one could imagine better means to disguise JBR purposeful or accidental death.

"nor did the intruder." ..... unless the perp was part of the Ramsey's inner circle and was the individual that had previously molested JBR. Then the rn and 'staging' would serve the same purpose as attributed to the RDI scenarios.

 

[BBB167893]

I don't think it is necessarily stranger for an intruder Dave. It is strange on both accounts. Really. But, I think that if JBR was targeted and an intruder was in their house before they arrived home the intruder could have intended on abducting her. Maybe he thought he may not have the opportunity to accomplish his deed. Maybe JBR fought and he panicked. I think a lot of scenarios could be the case, but yeah it is weird. No matter RDI or IDI.

Don't forget who you're talking to, Roy. I've been down that road.

I do not think the Ramsey's needed to write a note nor did the intruder. My .02.

I get you.