Are the Ramseys involved or not?

[Jupiter]

I almost couldn't believe what I was seeing. I really don't know much about the Dr. Phil interview...Do you think his lawyers knew about this? If so, would they have tried to prevent it from airing? I mean really, smiling? Behavior that doesn't fit.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

The smiling will probably help him with some of the public. The ones who also feel socially awkward and maybe have some frusturation over not being a outgoing extrovert with flawless social skills. I think you will see a lot of people projecting--OMG if people think he is a murderer because he smiled, what do they think of me? type of thing. Or maybe their child also has inappropriate reactions and they are worried about how they will be perceived.

 

[nona's mum]

I'm sorry if this has already been discussed a million times, but those of you who believe Patsy and/or Burke were involved, when do you think John realised what had happened?

 

[madeleine]

I'm sorry if this has already been discussed a million times, but those of you who believe Patsy and/or Burke were involved, when do you think John realised what had happened?

I am opened to all scenarios.was wondering the other day whether it is possible that Bdi and Pr covered for him without Jr knowing.in this case he probably discovered the body when he first went to the basement,smelled something is not right but couldn't bring it up cause Pr was surrounded by friends?

 

[nona's mum]

I am opened to all scenarios.was wondering the other day whether it is possible that Bdi and Pr covered for him without Jr knowing.in this case he probably discovered the body when he first went to the basement,smelled something is not right but couldn't bring it up cause Pr was surrounded by friends?

That's what I was leaning towards too. Someone in another thread made the very good point of why was Patsy putting on the whole act of "where's my baby"? For John and Burke's benefit? Seems odd if they were all in on it. What would have prompted him to go to the basement though? Did Patsy 'fess up?!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I'm sorry if this has already been discussed a million times, but those of you who believe Patsy and/or Burke were involved, when do you think John realised what had happened?

I don't have a solid opinion on this. I sometimes think he suspected something wasn't right the minute he saw the ransom note. And I sometimes think he discovered her body long before he carried her up those stairs. I sometimes think he would have turned on Patsy IF he had been sure it was her and not Burke who had accidentally killed her. Sometimes. Other times I think he knew exactly what happened very early on and just couldn't bring himself to participate in the staging.

In short...I dunno.

 

[nona's mum]

I'd forgotten about the period of time John was unaccounted for. I'd assume this must be when he first came accross the scene

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I'd forgotten about the period of time John was unaccounted for. I'd assume this must be when he first came accross the scene

That, and the fact that when Melinda and her boyfriend, Stuart, showed up at the house, John told Stuart he found her body at 11 am. That would have been the time period when Arndt lost track of him, so it does make one wonder.

 

[InstantProof]

I'm sorry if this has already been discussed a million times, but those of you who believe Patsy and/or Burke were involved, when do you think John realised what had happened?

My feeling is that he suspected immediately that Patsy was putting on a show, and this is why he tells her to call 911. Reading the ransom note, directed completely at him, he sorts out what is really going on some more. He seems uninvolved yet still painted into a corner.

 

[DeDee]

I am opened to all scenarios.was wondering the other day whether it is possible that Bdi and Pr covered for him without Jr knowing.in this case he probably discovered the body when he first went to the basement,smelled something is not right but couldn't bring it up cause Pr was surrounded by friends?

If BR did it, PR covered for him in a most gruesome way in order to lead clues away from the members of the household. Who would think to tie a stick to the end of the rope to stage a pretend kidnapping that included making her vagina bleed as part of a failed kidnapping plot by the Foreign Faction? I noticed Dr Phil call those who feel BDI as a "faction".

I recall watching in shock and horror on the news when the video showed the Rs walking out of their home and into awaiting vehicles on the evening of Dec 26th after the Coroner left. PR vowed to never return and she never did go back to that house. It is ironic that with the book, WHYD, written by Paula W, that Patsy can speak to us from the dead. PR was always a Drama Queen who adored attention.

That's what I was leaning towards too. Someone in another thread made the very good point of why was Patsy putting on the whole act of "where's my baby"? For John and Burke's benefit? Seems odd if they were all in on it. What would have prompted him to go to the basement though? Did Patsy 'fess up?!

No, mhoo. If JR wasn't in on it from the get go then, she never told him that she was. I don't PR would even confess to anyone but her prayers to God and not tell even her own mother or a sister, much less her husband, if she'd done something like strangle the life from her beautiful child.

LS helped JR cast that IDI theory a long way. In fact, I would say that LS convinced JR that it was an intruder. I am eager to see the CBS special with former FBI profiler Jim Clemente. Why would JC say that if he had one question to ask it would to PR? JC states that he would ask PR more about her finding the RN. JC says there are a couple of "unaccounted for hours" of activity.

The team of forensics experts along with JC includes 'Rice Cooked' Henry Lee. Hence, Dr Lee may make it a DNA case, based on advancement in technology compared to the yr '96, thus lead the forensics team to IDI.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/li...eries-investigators-926624?utm_source=twitter with video

Where the RN is placed on the steps in the 3rd image looks stupid.
http://www.cbs.com/shows/the-case-o...low-the-clues-in-the-case-of-jonbenét-ramsey/ with a dozen photos from the new set built for the program

The @CBS show will hastag #HerNameWasJonBenet
http://criminalminds.wikia.com/wiki/James_T._Clemente
https://twitter.com/jimclemente @jimclemente

 

[BBB167893]

I'm sorry if this has already been discussed a million times, but those of you who believe Patsy and/or Burke were involved, when do you think John realised what had happened?

IMO, almost immediately.

 

[RickshawFan]

I am new to this whole JBR thing and have read very little (way too much to catch up on). It all looks like PR Munchausen by proxy to me. All those doctor visits..... With PR creating problems so she'd seem like a great mom for helping her daughter through difficult "issues". And that PR overdid it that night and her daughter died and she made it look like something else, like "the poor mother is handling yet another difficult issue regarding her lovely daughter, and isn't she holding up well; she's been through so much." And JR and BR might very well have known, at least in the backs of their minds, that PR was hurting her daughter for some bizarre reason.

Pure speculation on my part. Maybe founded in ignorance of provable facts.

While I'm posting....Who dresses their child for bed in long underwear? In the mid '90's that's what you wear skiing, not sleeping (unless you're on a backpacking expedition). A child beauty queen in long johns?

 

[nona's mum]

I am new to this whole JBR thing and have read very little (way too much to catch up on). It all looks like PR Munchausen by proxy to me. All those doctor visits..... With PR creating problems so she'd seem like a great mom for helping her daughter through difficult "issues". And that PR overdid it that night and her daughter died and she made it look like something else, like "the poor mother is handling yet another difficult issue regarding her lovely daughter, and isn't she holding up well; she's been through so much." And JR and BR might very well have known, at least in the backs of their minds, that PR was hurting her daughter for some bizarre reason.

Pure speculation on my part. Maybe founded in ignorance of provable facts.

While I'm posting....Who dresses their child for bed in long underwear? In the mid '90's that's what you wear skiing, not sleeping (unless you're on a backpacking expedition). A child beauty queen in long johns?

i'm not sure I agree. Yes JB had medical issues - bed wetting, infections etc - and you could argue they were at least made worse by the dynamics in the home. But I don't think Patsy purposely caused the issues to get attention, which is my understanding of Munchausen's. I do however think Patsy had a bit of a historionic (sp?) personality.

 

[BBB167893]

i'm not sure I agree. Yes JB had medical issues - bed wetting, infections etc - and you could argue they were at least made worse by the dynamics in the home. But I don't think Patsy purposely caused the issues to get attention, which is my understanding of Munchausen's. I do however think Patsy had a bit of a historionic (sp?) personality.

Actually, nona's mum, that's only one form of Munchausen-by-Proxy. it's all about being a sympathy junkie.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Actually, nona's mum, that's only one form of Munchausen-by-Proxy. it's all about being a sympathy junkie.

I think you guys might be confusing Munchausen Syndrome and Munchausen-By Proxy.

http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/munchausen-syndrome
http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/tc/munchausen-syndrome-by-proxy-topic-overview

 

[PositiveLight]

Quick question is there a link to the acronyms used on the forum by any chance?

 

[RickshawFan]

I think you guys might be confusing Munchausen Syndrome and Munchausen-By Proxy.

http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/munchausen-syndrome
http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/tc/munchausen-syndrome-by-proxy-topic-overview

Yes, I specifically meant Munchausen-by-proxy. Where Person A makes Child B suffer terribly so Person A can get attention. Most often, this entails a mother going to great lengths to make her child ill. Not infrequently, this results in the child's death. It is very difficult to prove that Person A is the source of their child's illnesses and inexplicable symptoms.

The whole poop motif in this case could have been induced or staged by the mother.

It would be very easy for the whole family to be in denial if MBP were in the mix: no problem at all being innocent when being questioned.

My speculation.

 

[Hope4More]

The housekeeper said that most people didn't know the wineceller was there. You had to go through another room first- the door was not off the main basement areas. The calling in of the friends and clergy and victims' advocates literally minutes after being warned not to (under threat of JB's death) is to me, on of the main reasons why they did it. Because they had been warned not to. Therefore, if she turned up dead (and she was already dead) they could blame it on that. They even put it in the note that the house and phones were being monitored. It is pretty complicated to "monitor" a phone line unless the kidnappers were FBI, Police or worked for the phone company. This gave them the perfect explanation for their dead child- she was killed because they called people.
The other thing we can thank that posse of "friends" for is wiping down the kitchen counters - and area where both the potential weapon and pineapple evidence was located. Oops!

I like how you think.

 

[SCH2326]

Hello! I have been following this case since it happened. I have never posted on here but figured I would give it a try! At times I feel like PR did it...or JR or BR or they were all involved because there are so many things pointing that way!! Then I think about the DNA that was found which cleared them all of being involved-especially since the new technology shows that the DNA is that of a Hispanic Male. I just cannot stop wondering and thinking about the "coincidences" of the handwriting, the pineapple, the amount mentioned in the ransom letter, etc. Is anyone else feeling the same way?! It's driving me crazy!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Luvrosco]

I still think PR killed JB,although I think she might have hit her head accidentally. PR panicked and staged the rest. I always believed she was a narcissist with control issues. The perfect family was part of a facade. JR was distant and cold,but in PR's mind he was a good catch for financial reasons. JR helped with the cover up of the crime in part to save his reputation. JMO