ARREST!!! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 -#24

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It is hard to imagine how everybody (incl. the Dickies) managed that sad day. Because I come from the idea that this murder was not pre-planned and just an escalation of events after a fight (and sheer panic afterwards) I do also believe that perhaps that moment was when he realised the enormity of what he had allegedly done. Contrary to most people's thinking on this forum, I don't necessarily think he is a mean/narcissitic/psychopath type of person. He maybe a control freak though (which would stem from being very insecure). All my humble opinion.

Someone posted last night about the Dickies situation at the funeral. It wouldn't surprise me if the Dickies did confront GBC privately after the body was found. I certainly would have, if I was in their terrible situation.

i totally agree. like i have said earlier, i just think hes an "ordinary" man, not a psychopathic, sociopathic dangerous killer.
i still think he acted alone, losing his temper to the extreme at the heat of an other argument and think he will be feeling absolutely devastated at what he has allegedly done, he has ruined his perfect little life, beautiful children, beautiful clever wife, the comforts and familiarity of a family to come home to and even a mistress!
he has a lot of time now to be reflecting on what hes done, and will imo, be feeling really depressed and sorry for himself now he realises what hes lost, forever.
i also think the nbc reaction through all of this is possibly they are private people and in terrible shock and ashamed. they are also elderly and probably not coping, i would hide from the public if a member of my family did something this terrible. all my opinion only
 
That's right CC but the only information you can get re: Mortgages is if you do a title search and then it only states which bank holds the Mortgage and when it was lodged. There is no possible way of knowing how much the mortgage is so not sure where they would have gotten the figure of $300k.

There were a few posters who did quite a bit of sleuthing regarding this and also into the ASIC records. I can't recall the exact details, but it seemed as some had access to info like this.
 
i totally agree. like i have said earlier, i just think hes an "ordinary" man, not a psychopathic, sociopathic dangerous killer.
i still think he acted alone, losing his temper to the extreme at the heat of an other argument and think he will be feeling absolutely devastated at what he has allegedly done, he has ruined his perfect little life, beautiful children, beautiful clever wife, the comforts and familiarity of a family to come home to and even a mistress!
he has a lot of time now to be reflecting on what hes done, and will imo, be feeling really depressed and sorry for himself now he realises what hes lost, forever.
i also think the nbc reaction through all of this is possibly they are private people and in terrible shock and ashamed. they are also elderly and probably not coping, i would hide from the public if a member of my family did something this terrible. all my opinion only

spot on i think. my grandchildrens father knows him and he is renowned for having a foul temper. for what its worth
 
also, how will we know us @ cricket?

Just be mindful of his, you would only need one sympathiser of the charged person to come along and ruin your day (if you did identify yourselves). Unlikely, but anything could happen.

Protect your online persona as much as you can.
 
i also think the nbc reaction through all of this is possibly they are private people and in terrible shock and ashamed. they are also elderly and probably not coping, i would hide from the public if a member of my family did something this terrible. all my opinion only

I would have to disagree. I know I would probably hide from the public too, but these people actively flirted with the media. They made an exhibition of themselves with the now famous Granny Pash, made sure of checking the mailbox during the day and while the cameras were there, (when easily a friend could have checked it for them, as proven by seeing a friend in the footage) and so on and so forth. These are not the actions of genuinely private people. These are the actions of media *advertiser censored*. I believe once ABC was found, and they realised all their carefully hidden evidence was out in the open, that's when they decided to go all private, as shown in IW's Facebook status.

JMO.
 
There were a few posters who did quite a bit of sleuthing regarding this and also into the ASIC records. I can't recall the exact details, but it seemed as some had access to info like this.

A persons credit info is not public record and can't be sleuthed unless it is done illegally. We have very strict privacy laws in Australia with regards to the Consumer Credit Code and I have worked in the Banking industry for over 20 years so I can assure you this information cannot be accessed by the public and I would suggest to any posters who are posting this info to be careful as there are some very hefty fines for individuals who breach these laws.

http://www.alrc.gov.au/publications...n, Complaint Handling and Penalties/penalties
 
spot on i think. my grandchildrens father knows him and he is renowned for having a foul temper. for what its worth

Would you clarify please Squizzey? Who does your grandchildren's father say has the foul temper? GBC or NBC?
 
A persons credit info is not public record and can't be sleuthed unless it is done illegally. We have very strict privacy laws in Australia with regards to the Consumer Credit Code and I have worked in the Banking industry for over 20 years so I can assure you this information cannot be accessed by the public and I would suggest to any posters who are posting this info to be careful as there are some very hefty fines for individuals who breach these laws.

http://www.alrc.gov.au/publications...n, Complaint Handling and Penalties/penalties

The information re $300,000 loan was published. I just wish I could remember where. If I find it I'll post it. It was a MSM publication.
 
The information re $300,000 loan was published. I just wish I could remember where. If I find it I'll post it. It was a MSM publication.

are u sure thats not the $300,000 GBC owes his former partners. that is the only time i have seen $300,000 ever published. i could have missed something i suppose
 
Social media is a juggernaut. It's way too big and embedded to control or shut down. It can be regulated though, with the cooperation and common sense of everyone involved in it. I think internet communities have been given a huge amount of power and its largely up to them to consider how they use it. It has grown too quickly for the law to keep pace. Australians have always valued a fair go and as a culture I think we strike a pretty good balance between not letting ourselves be dictated to by authority but also respecting the rights of others. That's why I love the joint. We're not perfect but i think we do it better here than in most other places.

I know almost nothing about Mr Baden Clay except that the QPS believe he murdered his wife. As a fellow Aussie I reckon I owe him the right to a proper hearing based on the evidence that passes the court's test for fairness. I reckon his family and those who care about him, including his kids, also deserve some respect and consideration. It would be bad enough having lost one family member then having another one accused of killing her without every Tom, Dick and Harry suggesting all sorts of other horrific things without any regulation at all. If enough people repeat an allegation, no matter how little real evidence there is for it, it starts to acquire the trappings of 'fact'. People forget where the rumour started and it gets passed on as if it's true. That can be truly hurtful to the subject of the allegations but also totally devestating if the the subject is facing a serious criminal charge that could result in them having the rest of their life ruined and their family torn apart.

On the other hand, I don't feel any particular sympathy for the guy beyond that, for all the reasons that were discussed here before the arrest. And all the talk about permanent stays on indictments and aborted trials I reckon doesn't really help. It just confuses people further and it causes defensive reactions and perhaps even intensifies the level of animosity when people feel their right to have an opinion is threatened. I listened to the lunch break video on the CM yesterday and it all just sounded like confused waffle to me. All well intentioned but full of mixed messages and uncertainty about what they were actually trying to say.

I also reckon that most people are fair minded enough that when a judge tells them to make a decision based only on the evidence they hear in the court that they can and will do that. Presumably judges are fair and decent enough to follow that advice themselves, so why can't we extend the same assumption of decency to the members of the community who do jury service? So many people are on social media and internet forums now that there's little point in hoping that vague warnings about subjudice will just stop internet speculation. That would be just sticking our heads in the sand.

I've got no answers to any of this, but I think that each of us could at least pause for thought before we press 'submit' on a post and consider whether what we are doing or saying is fair to all concnerned. I don't reckon that the law can effectivley regulate, on its own, what happens in social media these days but we can all play our part by valuing the wider audience it gives to our thoughts and by continuing to question our own actions. Just MOO. I'd really like to hear other people's opinions about this.

Hawkins, I agree. Despite my initial posts on this matter, I have now come to realise that everyone should be (and is) free to make their own decisions about what they think is suitable to post. After all, the mods have reminded us that we "own" our own words so the responsibility for our posts - in both the short and long term - rests with us.

I think the most telling thing we could all take note of is the approach that some posts take in how they are written, and what info is used. When I consider all the various legal advice given in obviously very informative posts on this topic, made by those who have ex cop, barrister, law prof, journalist, criminologist, etc backgrounds, it's clear to see that these are the posts which do not make *any* specific comments about the case (or those involved in and around it). While some people advocate a more relaxed approach to the law and others are more mindful about adhering to the letter of the law, the end result of their posts is very much on the side of caution. Therefore, I think actions speak louder than words - if we are to consider the advice from others.

There has been so much information now posted on this forum about legal issues that there can be no doubt about what may or may not be problematic, and luckily we all have Google at our fingertips if we ever want to become more knowledgable about any of these aspects. MOO :)
 
can anyone verify the vacuum cleaner bag story?(Marly, link queen?) traces of pollen perhaps?

This was the first mention re the vacuum cleaner bag from itsthevibe...

"Also from the same source was that when police were doing their searches, they wanted to seize the contents of a vacuum cleaner dust bag, and NBC refused to give it to them if they didn't have a search warrant. (I'm assuming this was at the NBC house but I dont know for sure)"

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8026080&postcount=403"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Australia Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #19[/ame]
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175051&page=17
 
Hi, I'm new to this forum so apologies if this has been discussed earlier. There is some suggestion that the murder was premeditated. If so what do you think the motive was?

Thanks
Inquisitive2
 
Hi, I'm new to this forum so apologies if this has been discussed earlier. There is some suggestion that the murder was premeditated. If so what do you think the motive was?

Thanks
Inquisitive2

Welcome! ... I personally don't believe it was premeditated, but other possible motives (theorised by others) have been she may have been an obstacle to his affair and success, there may be some fraud that she may have found out about, she may have wanted a divorce which would have ruined him financially, etc.
 
Hi all - woke up worrying about the girls. I have been trawling through the last thread re bail/ access to the kids and I don't think we had a definitive hypothesis? (very well could be wrong...). I'll set out some scenarios - does anyone know if any of the last few are a remote possibility? Do we have precedents on access to children for (alleged) murderers, if they happen to get bail? (tummy turns). Please, please, let the girls be completely safe physically and mentally post-Thursday. ok - here goes:
a) ABC family get/keep full custody with no access to any adult BCs
b) ABC family get/ keep custody with some access to non-arrested BCs
c) ABC family get/ keep custody with some access by bailed BC
d) BC family get custody, with some access to ABC family
e) Bailed BC gets custody, with some access to ABC family
f) Bailed BC gets custody, with no access to ABC family

I guess there are other random options like Child Safety getting care for them from a 'neutral outsider', but I imagine one of the above will be the outcome on Thursday? Surely there are no instances of e) or f), especially where mental health appears to be in issue? Thoughts?

PS - have I told you lately that I luv u guys?? Love the ongoing vigil. Al deserves no less

IMO if GBC achieves Bail, he will get his kids back unless they form part of the Bail conditions, however, it is MO that the children will play an important role in his Application

Why
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...ayney-was-bailed/story-e6frg143-1225983133034

West Law is very similar to Qld Law

Only the Family Court can alter custody on a permanent basis and Commonwealth Law is an overriding principle IMO, he could just go and collect his children without any reprisal, the Dickies would have to Apply to the Family Court, IMO, no other way I m afraid unless he is deemed an "unwilling and unable parent" by DOCS

He doesn t have to let the Dickies near him if he chooses and an Application to the Family Court by the Dickies could take some time
 
I would have to disagree. I know I would probably hide from the public too, but these people actively flirted with the media. They made an exhibition of themselves with the now famous Granny Pash, made sure of checking the mailbox during the day and while the cameras were there, (when easily a friend could have checked it for them, as proven by seeing a friend in the footage) and so on and so forth. These are not the actions of genuinely private people. These are the actions of media *advertiser censored*. I believe once ABC was found, and they realised all their carefully hidden evidence was out in the open, that's when they decided to go all private, as shown in IW's Facebook status.

JMO.

yes, but maybe thats just social awkwardness, trying to imagine myself in her shoes, i think ebc was seeing her friend off and checking the mail was kind of like a pretending not to notice the cameras and trying to be casual defense mode and the pash in the garage, maybe thats just normal to them and the zoom lense of the camera just caught them. i dont know them at all but just by what ive seen and read, they seem like just an average family, who probably think they have a high social standing in the community because of their name, very proud of their heritage, a bit snobby.
in my opinion, i also think gbc has probably always struggled to impress his father but never felt good enough in his own head, because deep down he probably doesnt feel good enough to enjoy his success, people like this set themselves up to fail all the time, and probably why hes had affairs, most likely with women he feels superior to, and kept his "angel" allison on a pedestal. in my opinion, i think hes a weak and emotionally damaged man who has been struggling behind this public "business as usual" happy persona, but probably very different at home and bad tempered and controlling, probably depressed also, maybe allison had built up her resources and decided to leave him, and he just couldnt handle it any more. another failure!
sorry to ramble, i just feel sorry for everyone involved in this tragedy, especially the little girls.
 
Just noticed a shopfront on the corner of Moggill Rd. (near the old Coffee Club, now Rosa Mexicana) with Century 21 Westside Real Estate Signage on windows. Doors were cello-d shut. Looks New? Hmmmm

can anyone verify the vacuum cleaner bag story?(Marly, link queen?) traces of pollen perhaps?

also, how will we know us @ cricket?

I think that was his original premises before he moved to Swann Road but still shows up on google maps etc
 
IMO if GBC achieves Bail, he will get his kids back unless they form part of the Bail conditions, however, it is MO that the children will play an important role in his Application

Why
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...ayney-was-bailed/story-e6frg143-1225983133034

West Law is very similar to Qld Law

Only the Family Court can alter custody on a permanent basis and Commonwealth Law is an overriding principle IMO



Plentyofnous and everyone who has knowledge in this area, I think there is a chance the Dickies matter may have fallen under the state legislation or under the Child Protection Act, and would have gone through in a Magistrates Court somewhere. The Dickies may have obtained an interim Child Protection Order whereby the children would have come under the care of the Department of Child Safety, and in this case the Department would have granted them care of the children - your thoughts?

Perhaps even if the father gets bail, I would think the Department may get a 12 month Child Protection Order or something along those lines (I realise in your post above you are talking about permanent custody/residence)....(MOO)
 
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