ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 6

[Dushi]

Thanks to both of you. So it's just a question of the volume of US travelers to the island? Just seems kind of odd to me. I always thought there was a large volume of travelers from South and Central America, and a fair amount from the US, but I would have thought there would be more US travelers to a number of other Caribbean islands. I was just curious if there might be some other reason they set up in Aruba. Doesn't much matter, I guess.

It may have something to do with the amount of flights per day, going to busy US airports, frees things up at the other end

From Canada, there are no regular scheduled flights, only charters weekend and maybe a weekday now and then

There are quite a few US flights to Aruba each day


Well over a million tourists yearly and about seventy five percent are American

 

[LambChop]

Thanks to both of you. So it's just a question of the volume of US travelers to the island? Just seems kind of odd to me. I always thought there was a large volume of travelers from South and Central America, and a fair amount from the US, but I would have thought there would be more US travelers to a number of other Caribbean islands. I was just curious if there might be some other reason they set up in Aruba. Doesn't much matter, I guess.

Aruba and the US have always cooperated with one another. South America is too big to put customs in every airport where Aruba is small for the amount of Americanw traveling to and from the island. It just made sense to do it. Plus there's not the drug issue coming into the US that there would be from SA, Mexico, other Caribbean islands, etc.

I have even seen US Frigates in the past in Aruba. They've always been a friend to the US. jmo

 

[Dushi]

I will go along with Aruba being friendly to other countries
It was a nato destination at one time, at least for Canadian military

But I do doubt thats drugs are not an issue

 

[LambChop]

I will go along with Aruba being friendly to other countries
It was a nato destination at one time, at least for Canadian military

But I do doubt thats drugs are not an issue

I was talking about leaving the country and coming into the US. Luggage is scanned and I'm sure they have the dogs back there, both coming and leaving. And I know they check because my luggage had a note inside when I got home that it had been checked. In Miami they had the dogs out on the floor while we waited for our luggage coming back from St. Maartin years ago before going through customs. I do not think Aruba is known for the wholesaling of drugs to the US. lol

 

[Dushi]

I was talking about leaving the country and coming into the US. Luggage is scanned and I'm sure they have the dogs back there, both coming and leaving. And I know they check because my luggage had a note inside when I got home that it had been checked. In Miami they had the dogs out on the floor while we waited for our luggage coming back from St. Maartin years ago before going through customs. I do not think Aruba is known for the wholesaling of drugs to the US. lol

So i don't understand how that is different from any traveller coming into the US, regardless of where they come from, I am quite sure luggage is checked whether its aruba or mexico

Aruba has big drug problems, plain and simple

Arubas drug problems may not originate there, but they end up on the Island

 

[Dushi]

I am a huge fan of the Island
I hope to spend a great deal more time there
I love the people, I love the island
Its home

But I do not lull myself into thinking that the Island does not have some serious issues

Such as teenage pregnancy and far too many suicides along with drug issues

I do not believe the people are involved in a conspiracy to hide murder on the Island
I think the majority are hard working, honest people
But like everywhere in the world, Aruba has a criminal element
JMO

 

[LambChop]

So i don't understand how that is different from any traveller coming into the US, regardless of where they come from, I am quite sure luggage is checked whether its aruba or mexico

Aruba has big drug problems, plain and simple

Arubas drug problems may not originate there, but they end up on the Island

All countries have big drug problems. There is no way to get away from it, honestly. If you want drugs you can find them there in Aruba as well as anywhere else. What I'm saying is if Americans are buying drugs there, they use it while they are there they don't bring it home with them. With Columbia so close I don't know how they wouldn't have some problems, it's just not so much of an issue as it is here in the US. My grandson and his future wife were in DisneyWorld last year and someone approached them about buying some drugs. Of all places I thought at least it was pretty safe there. It isn't safe anywhere today with the drugs. jmo

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

Why would GG think that JB could ever be of help to him?????

EH! Does the headline "Casey Anthony NOT GUILTY" ring a bell???

Whatever you think about JB personally or ethically--Gotta give the guy props for the work he does for his clients.

 

[LambChop]

I am a huge fan of the Island
I hope to spend a great deal more time there
I love the people, I love the island
Its home

But I do not lull myself into thinking that the Island does not have some serious issues

Such as teenage pregnancy and far too many suicides along with drug issues

I do not believe the people are involved in a conspiracy to hide murder on the Island
I think the majority are hard working, honest people
But like everywhere in the world, Aruba has a criminal element
JMO

Oh, you bet I know that. My condo was broken into two years ago. They took my cellphone, a piece of costume jewelry and my friend had left a gold necklace on her bureau. They also broke into 4 other condos within 1/2 an hour as it was the dinnertime. Everyone of my neighbors said it was an inside job. I had seen a young man hanging around on his cellphone a lot that week but I thought he was just a visitor. I also saw him speaking to one of the workers at the condo which is not unusal. One neighbor said that when we left there was a young man sitting on the steps watching everyone leave for dinner and he was on his phone.

Since I stay there for three weeks imagine my surprise when in the middle of the third week I saw this young man walking down the steps talking to the worker and when he spotted me a look of shock was on his face. I reported it and the worker is no longer there so I guess they solved their problem because there have been no further breakins.

Funny thing is my friend had made me the jewelry that was stolen so it was quite unique. Imagine my surprise while shopping in town that third week I spotted what looked like my necklace on one of those display carts. lol So, I am guessing the cart person bought the jewelry thinking someone on the island made it. And then I think about the fact that even American thieves go on vacation. jmo

 

[LambChop]

EH! Does the headline "Casey Anthony NOT GUILTY" ring a bell???

Whatever you think about JB personally or ethically--Gotta give the guy props for the work he does for his clients.

Actually, I don't have to give him any credit at all because he did nothing to benefit KC except keep her parents away from her. KC got herself off. JB's opening statement was so horrific and he was able to prove nothing from that statement. Some people just can't believe that someone who looks like KC could ever do anything that horrible and there had to be some other reason. In his last case the person did not think he did so well and has filed an appeal. I just don't happen to feel that attorneys should take money for cases they can't possibly defend. Forensic expert, that is a good one.... jmo

 

[OneLove]

EH! Does the headline "Casey Anthony NOT GUILTY" ring a bell???

Whatever you think about JB personally or ethically--Gotta give the guy props for the work he does for his clients.

No props from me, and I think that is true of MOST people who are not themselves criminally minded.

To serve his client well, he should have had her admit what she actually did do and then get her the best sentence possible and get her the help she so desperately needs.

A good "defense" was not EVER supposed to be about helping a guilty person walk away scot free from a crime they committed and continue on in life victimizing society at large. But, unfortunately, the more unethical, criminally-thinking attorneys pat themselves on the back and jump with joy when their "hard work" #cough# allows a criminal to walk free.

ETA: IT'S ABOUT EGO

 

[LambChop]

No props from me, and I think that is true of MOST people who are not themselves criminally minded.

To serve his client well, he should have had her admit what she actually did do and then get her the best sentence possible and get her the help she so desperately needs.

A good "defense" was not EVER supposed to be about helping a guilty person walk away scot free from a crime they committed and continue on in life victimizing society at large. But, unfortunately, the more unethical, criminally-thinking attorneys pat themselves on the back and jump with joy when their "hard work" #cough# allows a criminal to walk free.

ETA: IT'S ABOUT EGO

You have to think about how it would have worked out if as soon as the remains were found he stated she panicked, the baby drowned. She is sick about what she did afterwards with Caylee's remains. It certainly would have given him a little more leverage to paint a picture of KC as a victum. While she is free from jail, she will never be free from public opinion.

Now JB is out there presenting himself as a "forensic" special attorney for GG. And JB calls the Aruban authorities "grossly incompetent". jmo

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

Thanks for your many observations!

In fact, rapes and disappearances DO happen and it is not a personal black mark against Aruba. The same can be said about many places in the states also. The citizens at large are not responsible for "allowing" the individual crime, nor could they prevent it. It is how it is handled AFTER the fact that the eyes of the world are focused upon.

I do believe this to be true. Aruba is beautiful, and it is certainly understandable why Americans would want to go there. Aruba depends on that tourist trade as a valuable economic tool. Needless to say the last thing they would want is another "Natalie Holloway" like case. I am sure there is every reason the people of Aruba would want to do everything possible to see that justice is served.... and I believe they will.

However I believe it to be naive to think that "monsters" do not live among us, even in Aruba. The kind of person that does the kind of things Onelove has stated, is not someone who would be satisfied with "a prostitute " for the night. Their mind functions on a level of evil normal people cannot possibly comprehend. I pity the "profiler" and their descent into that kind of madness. Unfortunately even with their help these kind of people continue to live among us and our children bringing inconsolable pain and heartache to their victims as well as those who love them. They are in every country, island, city and small town. The many cannot be blamed for the crimes of the One, but we cannot close our eyes to the "possibility" evil exists in the hearts and minds of the most innocent looking faces. That is what makes it so insidious.
Where there is demand for "services" , you can bet someone will find a way to provide it for a price. If South America deals in human trafficking, it will find a way to bring it to them---even by way of Aruba.

It is easy to speculate when you do not have all the facts and I don't have them all either but I do know that what you are suggesting in terms hiding someone in Aruba, while anything is possible, it is highly unlikely because there is literally no place to hide anyone without someone knowing. And it's not as if the police do not know everyone.

Maybe not hiding, but boats go out everyday, right? How hard would it be to dispose of a body, or while drugged , export one? Not that that is what happened, but it could be.

 

[Dushi]

Oh, you bet I know that. My condo was broken into two years ago. They took my cellphone, a piece of costume jewelry and my friend had left a gold necklace on her bureau. They also broke into 4 other condos within 1/2 an hour as it was the dinnertime. Everyone of my neighbors said it was an inside job. I had seen a young man hanging around on his cellphone a lot that week but I thought he was just a visitor. I also saw him speaking to one of the workers at the condo which is not unusal. One neighbor said that when we left there was a young man sitting on the steps watching everyone leave for dinner and he was on his phone.

Since I stay there for three weeks imagine my surprise when in the middle of the third week I saw this young man walking down the steps talking to the worker and when he spotted me a look of shock was on his face. I reported it and the worker is no longer there so I guess they solved their problem because there have been no further breakins.

Funny thing is my friend had made me the jewelry that was stolen so it was quite unique. Imagine my surprise while shopping in town that third week I spotted what looked like my necklace on one of those display carts. lol So, I am guessing the cart person bought the jewelry thinking someone on the island made it. And then I think about the fact that even American thieves go on vacation. jmo

Actually, I am not surprised at all

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

Actually, I don't have to give him any credit at all because he did nothing to benefit KC except keep her parents away from her. KC got herself off. JB's opening statement was so horrific and he was able to prove nothing from that statement. Some people just can't believe that someone who looks like KC could ever do anything that horrible and there had to be some other reason. In his last case the person did not think he did so well and has filed an appeal. I just don't happen to feel that attorneys should take money for cases they can't possibly defend. Forensic expert, that is a good one.... jmo

No props from me, and I think that is true of MOST people who are not themselves criminally minded.

To serve his client well, he should have had her admit what she actually did do and then get her the best sentence possible and get her the help she so desperately needs.

A good "defense" was not EVER supposed to be about helping a guilty person walk away scot free from a crime they committed and continue on in life victimizing society at large. But, unfortunately, the more unethical, criminally-thinking attorneys pat themselves on the back and jump with joy when their "hard work" #cough# allows a criminal to walk free.

ETA: IT'S ABOUT EGO

OOPS!!!! Sorry !!!-OneLove -does that statement make me criminally minded??

Believe me I am no fan of JB, as my many comments under the Caylee Anthony thread imply. I am only trying to say for someone like GG --JB would be the "Go to Guy". The question was "what could JB do for GG" When you are in a position that GG is in, having an attorney with no moral compass , but still gets someone like CA found not guilty. Well I think that is just the person he would want. That was all I was implying.

I never thought I would say this since I thought everything about the defense team was outrageous........Actually , I am gonna leave it there. I think I made a bad decision on my prior JB comment. I know how raw nerve endings still prevail when it comes to that entire case. Yikes, what was I thinking:truce: :banghead:--BAD RUK!!!!

 

[Dushi]

All countries have big drug problems. There is no way to get away from it, honestly. If you want drugs you can find them there in Aruba as well as anywhere else. What I'm saying is if Americans are buying drugs there, they use it while they are there they don't bring it home with them. With Columbia so close I don't know how they wouldn't have some problems, it's just not so much of an issue as it is here in the US. My grandson and his future wife were in DisneyWorld last year and someone approached them about buying some drugs. Of all places I thought at least it was pretty safe there. It isn't safe anywhere today with the drugs. jmo

I don't see how we can compare crime in the US to crime statistics in Aruba given the difference in size
Maybe I am reading your posts wrong
Earlier you said it wasn't a problem ?

I guess I am reading it wrong, I do apologize

 

[LambChop]

I don't see how we can compare crime in the US to crime statistics in Aruba given the difference in size
Maybe I am reading your posts wrong
Earlier you said it wasn't a problem ?

I guess I am reading it wrong, I do apologize

You are, indeed, reading it wrong. lol Maybe it is just me but I have not seen anything going on that would lead me to believe they have a drug problem. If someone who knows tells me there is a problem I might believe it but so far I've never heard of it. With my breakin I experienced two years ago, that was my first thought, it might be drug related.

You cannot compare Aruba to the US, all I am saying is they have their problems with drugs the same as any small community or country. But you could never compare Aruba with Mexico and their problems, or Columbia. It has gotten out of hand here in the States. It is really sad what drugs can do to people.

But I'm not a real party animal when I'm down there (in bed by 9:30...sigh) so I may not have information that others have. All I know is what I've heard from some of the locals I've known for years down there.

And I have personally never heard of anyone where I stay complaining about someone pressuring them to buy drugs down there. Although I'm sure it happens. jmo

 

[Dushi]

You are, indeed, reading it wrong. lol Maybe it is just me but I have not seen anything going on that would lead me to believe they have a drug problem. If someone who knows tells me there is a problem I might believe it but so far I've never heard of it. With my breakin I experienced two years ago, that was my first thought, it might be drug related.

You cannot compare Aruba to the US, all I am saying is they have their problems with drugs the same as any small community or country. But you could never compare Aruba with Mexico and their problems, or Columbia. It has gotten out of hand here in the States. It is really sad what drugs can do to people.

But I'm not a real party animal when I'm down there (in bed by 9:30...sigh) so I may not have information that others have. All I know is what I've heard from some of the locals I've known for years down there.

And I have personally never heard of anyone where I stay complaining about someone pressuring them to buy drugs down there. Although I'm sure it happens. jmo

I believe , earlier you made reference to Aruba not being an issue to the US as would be Mexico or SA, thats true, but still its there

Your quote was " Plus there's not the drug issue coming into the US that there would be from SA, Mexico, other Caribbean islands, etc. "

I feel that it may not be as big , but it is big, and certainly aruba does not have the same depth of crime as other countries

And I too, have been going to Aruba for years , but i think we see the Island differently

I don't see it as a small village or a gated community
I know the people I have known for years do not know everyone else or their business
Nor do i feel the police know everyone

If you wish to research, you will see they are fighting a hard battle to keep drug related crime under control and I am proud of the job they are doing.

I am not saying the crime is worse than any place else or even as bad.

I am saying it exists, chollers, crack houses etc, its all there.

And why wouldn't it be? it is a community like any other

 

[LambChop]

I believe , earlier you made reference to Aruba not being an issue to the US as would be Mexico or SA, thats true, but still its there

Your quote was " Plus there's not the drug issue coming into the US that there would be from SA, Mexico, other Caribbean islands, etc. "

I feel that it may not be as big , but it is big, and certainly aruba does not have the same depth of crime as other countries

And I too, have been going to Aruba for years , but i think we see the Island differently

I don't see it as a small village or a gated community
I know the people I have known for years do not know everyone else or their business
Nor do i feel the police know everyone

If you wish to research, you will see they are fighting a hard battle to keep drug related crime under control and I am proud of the job they are doing.

I am not saying the crime is worse than any place else or even as bad.

I am saying it exists, chollers, crack houses etc, its all there.

And why wouldn't it be? it is a community like any other

I just said it is highly unlikely that drugs are being smuggled into the US through Aruba because US customs is right there.

I also know quite a few people and have been told news travels fast. I was never aware there were crack houses there and am a bit surprised but I will make a point to ask my friends when I go down there if they know about them.

It isn't as if people are being robbed on the street, kidnapped and beaten. If it weren't for GG acting strangely about RG it would have been believed that she drowned while swimming which isn't all that uncommon in Aruba.

But compared to the rest of the world, I believe Aruba is pretty safe. jmo

 

[annalia]

I just said it is highly unlikely that drugs are being smuggled into the US through Aruba because US customs is right there.

I also know quite a few people and have been told news travels fast. I was never aware there were crack houses there and am a bit surprised but I will make a point to ask my friends when I go down there if they know about them.

It isn't as if people are being robbed on the street, kidnapped and beaten. If it weren't for GG acting strangely about RG it would have been believed that she drowned while swimming which isn't all that uncommon in Aruba.

But compared to the rest of the world, I believe Aruba is pretty safe. jmo

I don't think drug traffickers normally fly commercial with suitcases full of drugs.

Problems with drug trafficking going through Aruba to the US had been reported for years, primarily because of the location. You can google it.

It's illogical to try to compare it to a country like the US that has over 300 million people, that was a common tactic in the NH case. Aruba has crime, they've had murder, they have crimes with guns, they have drug related crimes. I'm surprised if you say you've never even heard of the crackhouses.

Aruba is still considered a safe destination, there are other islands considered safe too, not just Aruba. To keep saying that there's no serious crime there just isn't true.