AUS - Khandalyce Kiara Pearce, Wynarka, Bones of a Child Discovered, July'15 - #5

[Deleted member 102539]

Hello, Oh no I just wrote a long thread & don't*think*it posted.....

Experiences that I know very well .....

 

[WoollyMummoth]

Who wears such a hat? Flower pickers, fruit pickers? The murderer maybe exerts this job? Maybe on a flower farm in Adelaide Hills? Maybe the suitcase was dumped on Easter Monday? Maybe the little girl was a child from the Netherlands (2012) or a child from another nation living near the flower farm (after 2012)? Maybe the murderer (or an accessory) was on the way to Leeton while dumping the suitcase? Something to do with the murder in Leeton on Easter Sunday?
My theory and gut feeling stands if not something special will happen.

This hat would be worn by road workers. I doubt it is a clue of any sort personally.

 

[Earth]

Have any of these been ruled out? Because I can't find a list of rule-outs anywhere.

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/ARBA/594/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/ARBA/603/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/UK02/11ENQ050611/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/ESNI/EEG7_1236/2

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/ITAK/023/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/UK02/10STRATH221009/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/1154539/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/963601/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/1115793/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/1046946/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/1185956/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/1198982/1

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/924939/1

 

[MsDee]

I've been thinking this is a possible (horrendously unpleasant ) scenario too.

Melissa's mother was found murdered in 2000 on Garden Island with no sign of her daughter.

It is possible that she was held captive somewhere in that area and gave birth to a daughter. (Close to a place of work?)

The clothes, quilt and suitcase could have all come from the nearby landfill site (Garden Island was also landfill until 2000. )

This would explain the odd mixture of sizes, boys clothes etc.

There really isn't anywhere around there that you could hold someone captive and nobody be aware of it. Even the caravan they were originally staying in that was parked there was seen by a lot of people, and eventually people get curious and the police or council come checking.

I replied to this post of yours because I asked a friend about Garden Island being used as landfill. He is a truckie who has worked in and and around the area for years. He said he knew, and as far as he was aware all the landfill at Garden Island was hard waste sealed in drums.

Re the conjecture of bikies being involved. The bikie landscape has changed over say the last 20 yrs here in Adelaide. It used to be predominantly anglo's who were involved, and their code was such that kids were off the radar. You touch a kid, you are a dog. Over time they have morphed with the introduction of middle eastern people, who I think were attracted more to the criminal side of things than anything else. Considering some of them don't even ride, it is a fairly safe assumption to make. I don't know enough about them to know whether or not they hold the same values about children that the older generations of bikies did. But I think that is a long bow to draw, and if a bikie were involved, I doubt you would find any evidence of it whatsoever. JMO.

 

[they'll get you]

Who wears such a hat? Flower pickers, fruit pickers? The murderer maybe exerts this job? Maybe on a flower farm in Adelaide Hills? Maybe the suitcase was dumped on Easter Monday? Maybe the little girl was a child from the Netherlands (2012) or a child from another nation living near the flower farm (after 2012)? Maybe the murderer (or an accessory) was on the way to Leeton while dumping the suitcase? Something to do with the murder in Leeton on Easter Sunday?
My theory and gut feeling stands if not something special will happen.

I hear what your saying FG & it fits the Stanford scenario. The Stanford family arrived 'dirt poor'. How many families out there that fly under the radar with one or two members with mental problems capable of murder and concealment of a body.

 

[ninjabynight]

I rotated this 90 degrees counterclockwise and it looks like a camel.

It's the camel for sure.

Edit: Whoops I can see we're way beyond this discussion now! Sorry to clog the thread.

 

[Silverdraco69]

I hear what your saying FG & it fits the Stanford scenario. The Stanford family arrived 'dirt poor'. How many families out there that fly under the radar with one or two members with mental problems capable of murder and concealment of a body.

I am thinking V or M Stanford.. been wondering this myself..

Sent from my SM-T230NU using Tapatalk

 

[curiouslib]

I am still hedging my bets on wether or not he was a resident ..... but completely agree (IMO) that he didn't use a car as that would be a dead give away if his car was witnessed "stopped" on that particular stretch of the hwy at anytime if the suitcase was found.

Just a thought but what if he drove a truck and parked it somewhere? In some ways a truck might actually be far less likely to be noticed in a country town than a car? It's also less likely to be noticed if it is stopped on the side of the road. A truck has it's own cabin and you often see them on the side of the highway. If you see a car you are more likely to note it because you will assume they have broken down?

 

[AtaraMalka]

True, but there are always exceptions. Just think of Neal Falls, the likelihood is that he was a prolific serial killer, his only brush with the law was a string of parking tickets.

That's what I mean, Hericania - even if there isn't much on the database about the perp, there will probably still be people around him who would have a lot of information because there will have been so many strange things going on in his life. Neal Falls was a good example of that, in that they suspected him of having killed many women yet the evidence was scant or came too late.(I must admit I don't know that case too well, so correct me if I'm wrong.)

Perhaps when we find the perp of this murder it will open up a can of worms regarding outer unsolved crimes....

 

[Hericania]

The pumpkin sunflower square has bothered me for awhile, 2 thoughts, it could be kitchen fabric that was treated with fire retardent chemicles so it may not decompose as fast, could it be a patch that was added much later in the quilts life, maybe the original square got a tear, so they put a new patch over it the material would be much stronger as it had not been laundered for as many years

It could just be a synthetic fabric, polyester or even a polyester/cotton blend would be a lot tougher than 100% cotton quilting fabric and wouldn't rot in the same way. It could well be cut from a piece of clothing maybe an apron or a tablecloth or something. Maybe the maker was just one octagon short and added it in to save having to buy more fabric. To me it looks like a quilt that an older lady on a fairly tight budget might make.

 

[AtaraMalka]

All these scenarios involving young girls held captive and having babies who were subsequently murdered seem really far-fetched to me.
After all, we know that someone made this child a hand-made quilt and bought her trendy clothes, so she cannot have lived in total isolation.
I think it will turn out to be a much more mundane domestic violence crime.

I don't want to be pedantic, but (sadly) isn't that an assumption?

The quilt ( and clothes for that matter ) could have been hand me downs....charitable donations originating from persons completely unconnected to the family.....stolen off someone's washing line for all we know at this point.....

 

[ninjabynight]

All these scenarios involving young girls held captive and having babies who were subsequently murdered seem really far-fetched to me.
After all, we know that someone made this child a hand-made quilt and bought her trendy clothes, so she cannot have lived in total isolation.
I think it will turn out to be a much more mundane domestic violence crime.

Yes, there are plenty of far fetched scenarios doing the rounds here. Imagination is stronger than powers of reasoning, it seems, in many cases! But that's the culture of this forum, and it is generally a very nice culture, even if I personally long for a more robust analytical discussion of the evidence at hand.

In the spirit of the devil's advocate, I want to mention that the stolen suitcase scenario also seems very far fetched to me. This is for a number of reasons. The chances of such a crime being discovered in this way must be incredibly slim, particularly since up until this point the evidence had been hidden. Secondly, why on earth would anyone steal a battered old suitcase, even more so if they had taken a moment to look in it and seen rotting clothes? Then there is the police statement that the body was recently moved into the suitcase: it seems most likely that the body was packed into the suitcase in order to be moved, ie to the roadside, rather than just a case of shuffling things around and then leaving it in a shed. And finally, unless the suitcase man was also the person who stole the suitcase, what are the chances that he would know where to go looking for the suitcase? The whole idea seems rather random. It's within the realms of possibility, but surely very unlikely?

 

[Hericania]

There really isn't anywhere around there that you could hold someone captive and nobody be aware of it. Even the caravan they were originally staying in that was parked there was seen by a lot of people, and eventually people get curious and the police or council come checking.

I replied to this post of yours because I asked a friend about Garden Island being used as landfill. He is a truckie who has worked in and and around the area for years. He said he knew, and as far as he was aware all the landfill at Garden Island was hard waste sealed in drums.

I'm sure you are right about the drums on Garden Island, I would imagine they were fairly careful about how waste was disposed there with it being so close to the water.

They may well have been a bit less stringent on the mainland part of the Gillman area. Just speculating though really.

I had a look at Torrens Island too, there's an disused quarantine centre and an abandoned second world war concentration camp, it looks as though they have started doing tourist excursions around them now. That could be a trigger to move anything incriminating!

Yes I realise my speculation is getting a bit wild here, and it is extremely unlikely! !!

There have been several well publicised cases where kidnap victims have been held in basements or houses in residential areas without neighbours (and even family in the same house) being aware. So it's very rare but not impossible.

JMO

 

[they'll get you]

Just a thought but what if he drove a truck and parked it somewhere? In some ways a truck might actually be far less likely to be noticed in a country town than a car? It's also less likely to be noticed if it is stopped on the side of the road. A truck has it's own cabin and you often see them on the side of the highway. If you see a car you are more likely to note it because you will assume they have broken down?

There is that dirt side track which is concealed by trees that follow the train tracks. We saw the vid of the dirt bike fanging along and it appears most cars could drive behind the bushy area, place the bag and continue back onto the road. Too Easy.

 

[Dogface]

There really isn't anywhere around there that you could hold someone captive and nobody be aware of it. Even the caravan they were originally staying in that was parked there was seen by a lot of people, and eventually people get curious and the police or council come checking.

I replied to this post of yours because I asked a friend about Garden Island being used as landfill. He is a truckie who has worked in and and around the area for years. He said he knew, and as far as he was aware all the landfill at Garden Island was hard waste sealed in drums.

Re the conjecture of bikies being involved. The bikie landscape has changed over say the last 20 yrs here in Adelaide. It used to be predominantly anglo's who were involved, and their code was such that kids were off the radar. You touch a kid, you are a dog. Over time they have morphed with the introduction of middle eastern people, who I think were attracted more to the criminal side of things than anything else. Considering some of them don't even ride, it is a fairly safe assumption to make. I don't know enough about them to know whether or not they hold the same values about children that the older generations of bikies did. But I think that is a long bow to draw, and if a bikie were involved, I doubt you would find any evidence of it whatsoever. JMO.

I would snip but it's so hard to do on my phone, but I agree that bike gangs use to have a lot more of a moral code, but, I posted a story a few pages back from an Adelaide paper that discussed how one member had been sent to terrorize someone's family and shot an 11 year old twice, so I don't think that is true anymore unfortunately. The article also discussed how they heavily recruit those coming from jail.

What are the bike gangs like there? Are they more transient? Do they have clubhouses? I only have known the one biker, but his life was a strange dichotomy. He worked hard in the oil rig business which had him away from home a lot, but when he was home he was very family orientated, but then he would leave and head to the clubhouse for days.

 

[musicaljoke]

I don't want to be pedantic, but (sadly) isn't that an assumption?

The quilt ( and clothes for that matter ) could have been hand me downs....charitable donations originating form persons completely unconnected to the family.....stolen off someone's washing line for all we know at this point.....

That's true. However, there's a chance that it might have been made for the child, so it's worth putting our very best efforts into helping to find the quilter.

 

[debirlfan]

In the spirit of the devil's advocate, I want to mention that the stolen suitcase scenario also seems very far fetched to me. This is for a number of reasons. The chances of such a crime being discovered in this way must be incredibly slim, particularly since up until this point the evidence had been hidden. Secondly, why on earth would anyone steal a battered old suitcase, even more so if they had taken a moment to look in it and seen rotting clothes? Then there is the police statement that the body was recently moved into the suitcase: it seems most likely that the body was packed into the suitcase in order to be moved, ie to the roadside, rather than just a case of shuffling things around and then leaving it in a shed. And finally, unless the suitcase man was also the person who stole the suitcase, what are the chances that he would know where to go looking for the suitcase? The whole idea seems rather random. It's within the realms of possibility, but surely very unlikely?

It does sound far fetched - but I recall the case of someone stealing a computer - and finding it full of child *advertiser censored*. If I remember correctly, the thief went to the police...

 

[AtaraMalka]

A few thoughts, LindyLoo...

What makes the police think Angel had a traumatic death?
Did they find a damaged skull in the case?

I don't think the autopsy results are in the public domain, but for what it's worth a recent newspaper article said the child had been badly bashed.

If so I can't believe that the people who rummaged through the suitcase earlier didn't see it too. So why would they not report what they how found? Its not a crime to look through an abandoned, old suitcase.

The bones, or most of them, are presumably very tiny. In between a lot of old clothes, they could easily have been overlooked. The skull was in parts. Eventually someone found the jaw bone and that person did report the suitcase.

Are the bones showing any signs of previous fractures or different stages of healing, suggesting ongoing abuse? If not maybe her death was a tragic accident. Crushed by farm machinery or similar.

Good question but again, no autopsy report released.

And why oh why didn't any of the residents have a nosey in the suitcase themselves.

Would they have known where it was? Would they have been likely to be walking down the highway a couple of miles outside the town?

Surely if the case had been lying down the road for over 2 months, one of them would have been intrigued enough to look. Especially in such a small place.

 

[AtaraMalka]

That's true. However, there's a chance that it might have been made for the child, so it's worth putting our very best efforts into helping to find the quilter.

Oh yes, of course, I'm not trying to pour cold water over that exercise; it's very important.

Just making the point that there may not necessarily have been a loving relationship between the quilter and the child.

And of course there are the people around the child - family, social workers, whoever - who may recognize the quilt, even if they didn't make it.

​

 

[reasypeasy]

How about this for a scenario. Bored kid from the next town or two over breaks into an unlocked shed in Wynarka to steal stuff. Not much in the shed of interest to him and he is a bit nervous hanging round doing the crime. The suitcase has some weight to it so he grabs it and runs with it the undergrowth where if his torch is seen it won't be obvious he is in the process of breaking in. He opens it up and pokes around and works out it has human remains. Scared, he closes it up and runs away. Later he loses his nerve and tells his dad. His dad is horrified. There may be be fingerprints on the handle! His son will be outed as a delinquent! So much scandal! His dad then spends a couple of days in town searching for the suitcase so he can slip it into another suitcase, deal with the fingerprints on the handle and in the dark of night return it to where it came from so it will eventually be found in a context that does not involve his son at all. But alas, the kid's descriptions of where it was left are unclear, or it has been moved by curious people in the meantime. The kid's dad does not find the suitcase.