AUS - Khandalyce Kiara Pearce, Wynarka, Bones of a Child Discovered, July'15 - #6

[Imagining]

This is hardly scientific but I was thinking about decomposition and remembering a dead rat on the floor of a holiday house we rented.
It was pretty much just mummified skin and bones when we arrived.
We scooped it up with a dustpan and it was past smelling, but the surprising thing was that a rat body sized hole was in the cheap nylon blend carpet and in the rubber underlay, so when we cleaned it up everything underneath had rotted away down to the cement floor.
For this reason I am doubtful that the clothes and quilt were in contact with the body as it decomposed.
Seems funny to say it, but I think the quilt is actually too well preserved to have been wrapped around a decomposing body.

This dead rat story made me laugh.

I also think, in my earlier post, that the quilt was separately deteriorated, mainly because the inner layer is very much intact/preserved.
A number of people here mentioned the pumpkin patch preserved so well because of its synthetic material, but I think it can’t be only just one tiny piece is synthetic material and the rest aren’t. Aren’t there a few more pumpkin patches (should be using the same synthetic material) on the quilt but they looked so deteriorated though!

 

[Imagining]

A few years ago we had 2 little girls living next door and I'd talk to them whenever we were both outside.
I can even remember them playing dress-ups in the garden and I remember commenting on how they looked, but I have no visual memory of what they wore.
Maybe I am just odd that way, but I close my eyes and I can visualise them doing things in their garden but cannot remember anything about their clothes.
Can I ask if other people can clearly remember such things?

I can remember/recognise some of my nephews' clothes but might be only after they got older. I don't think I remember the clothes when they were younger.

 

[Imagining]

If the parent/carer chose black because of not showing up dirt, it might shows that this person is practical and thoughtful.

Now looking at this light blue suitcase, a colour that is definitely easily showing up dirt, would it suggested that the person who choose the suitcase is a different person who choose the quilt and tutu color.

Two different taste. So it might be the mum got the dress and quilt and the father got the suitcase. However, the choice might have to do with cost saving with limited colour choices rather than two different people.

Since there are heaps of this kind of suitcase out there in the scrub, it is possible the perpetrator just pick one up and used it for putting the bones in.

The perpetrator might got the idea of dumping the suitcase in the area because seeing so many there. The perpetrator might believe that no one cares about the suitcases dumped in the area. It seems no one pick up the rubbish or might be eventually the rubbish collectors will clean it up.

 

[sosocurious]

No ideas, but as I see it, other than the tutu dress, all those clothes are just so ordinary I doubt anyone would notice them.
A few years ago we had 2 little girls living next door and I'd talk to them whenever we were both outside.
They were real little chatterboxes, but I'm blowed if I can recall a single item of clothing they ever wore.
I can even remember them playing dress-ups in the garden and I remember commenting on how they looked, but I have no visual memory of what they wore.
Maybe I am just odd that way, but I close my eyes and I can visualise them doing things in their garden but cannot remember anything about their clothes.
Can I ask if other people can clearly remember such things?

You got me thinking JaneSA - at the weekend I attended a BBQ at a friends. There were 1/2 dozen young children running around playing happily.
I can only remember what one of them had on, my grandson because I dressed him.

 

[Makara]

How would you expose/find a family that is so insular that their daily activities are unknown for years ????

I really feel , given the vast amount of information that the police have given out with the clothing items - by now someone should have come forward... the only reason I can think of why no one has come forward - is that the family/extended have maintained a low social profile (For whatever reason)

But if the family kept solely to themselves....how could you find them ???

Any ideas ..

Perhaps they've already been exposed. I'm talking about the House of Horrors revealed in all it's horror in 2008. There is every possibly that there is a connection here. Trudy Quinlivan, who is now on the run, was part of that family. This was briefly discussed back in an earlier thread and I still believe it possible that there could be a connection to this case.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...7-to-authorities/story-e6frea83-1226654327658

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...t-to-stand-trial/story-e6frea83-1226077069252

https://www.facebook.com/victoriapo...d=853928664679271&offset= 0&total_comments=26

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-03-20/woman-charged-over-sa-child-neglect-wanted-on-warrant/6335552

Trudy Quinlivan could certainly fit in with the Wynarka case IMO. She disappeared in April of this year and the suitcase was found in July. So where is Trudy? Someone is obviously hiding and helping here. I don't think she could survive on her own. I have found no mention of her arrest between April and time of writing.

Trudy had given birth to three children from memory. Perhaps Trudy gave birth to a fourth child. A daughter who was badly beaten (not necessarily by Trudy) and died. The people living in that house would not have reported the death of a child or even sought medical help IMO. So what to do? Wrap the body up and secret it somewhere on the property. The child may have not been Trudy's daughter but one of the other 21 (or more) kids living in that house. Maybe it was a child that Trudy cared about and she has clung onto the remains ever since. Scooping up clothing, not necessarily all belonging to the deceased little girl, and stuffing them into an old suitcase, along with the remains of the little girl. Some of the clothing may have belonged to some of the other children, both boys and girls.

I have no idea how and why little Angel ended up where she was found but one thought is that Trudy has made her way to the Mallee area, is hiding out in one of the bush camps and has either dumped the suitcase herself or someone who is hiding her has done so.

I'm happy for everyone to poke holes in this theory but I feel it needs to be discussed further.

 

[Makara]

I can remember/recognise some of my nephews' clothes but might be only after they got older. I don't think I remember the clothes when they were younger.

You got me thinking JaneSA - at the weekend I attended a BBQ at a friends. There were 1/2 dozen young children running around playing happily.
I can only remember what one of them had on, my grandson because I dressed him.

Ah, but would you remember a little girl in a black (or navy blue) tutu?

 

[DutchTreat]

so a few scenarios of the person who disposed of this little angel on the side of the road could be...
he didnt kill her, knew he couldnt be implicated, so didnt care where he put her?
or
he did kill her, didnt care anymore, tying up loose ends, knew he was going to die, illness/ suicide?
or
he did kill her, didnt think there would be any dna left to implicate him, she wasnt related to him, sold house, moving overseas?

I think he/she didn't kill her. Did know her. Cared about her, but can't for some reason speak about what happened and wanted her to be found. To put an end to this tragedy and find peace of mind. And for little Angle to have a proper grave.

Anyone who, that brutally, killed little Angel, for sure wouldn't after years suffer from a guilty consciousness. So would not go back to retrieve a body and risk being discovered. Wouldn't care about Angel being found. And would have chosen to hide the remains properly, if there would have been a reason to retrieve her remains.

 

[sosocurious]

Ah, but would you remember a little girl in a black (or navy blue) tutu?

I think I would Makara.

 

[musicaljoke]

Ah, but would you remember a little girl in a black (or navy blue) tutu?

Someone might have a photo taken at such a gathering.

 

[DutchTreat]

Yeah that one little word "Most" is interesting .... if that is true then it conjures up an image of her remains having to be rushed up quickly at some point to be placed in the suitcase with her clothing.... a sense of urgency.... so could that mean some sudden unexpected reason to remove/hide her remains.

I'd been working on a theory of some planned upcoming event requiring the remains to be hidden .... but if the "Most" is true then I am rethinking to a sense of complete urgency...some extreme change in circumstance surrounding the individuals home and possible threat of angels remains being found.

What if the girl was beaten to death, burried and then dug up, put in a suitcase and placed a in a shed or some other room. The death was probably not planned. The body had to be hidden all of a sudden. Until who killed her had arranged an other spot where he (I don't think 'she') could hide the remains better. And where discovery was less likely. And until the detectible part of decomposition (where you would have smelled the decomposition process) would have been completed. After that I guess the body must have been, for some time, in a very humid/water environment, cause the jacket has turned largely purple and it looks like mold.

I wonder if the body could have been buried, dug up, wrapped in the quilt and than kept above grond. I think the condition of the quilt could fit with that scenario.

 

[Makara]

I think I would Makara.

Someone might have a photo taken at such a gathering.

And I think that is what SAPOL is hoping for. That someone may remember seeing a little fair haired girl in the tutu or any of the other clothes found in the suitcase. Musicaljoke, that would be the icing on the cake wouldn't it? For someone to come forward with an actual photo.

I don't know about anyone else but in my sleuthing using Google and social media etc., I am constantly looking for photos of any of those garments that were found with the suitcase and most especially the quilt.

 

[DutchTreat]

And I think that is what SAPOL is hoping for. That someone may remember seeing a little fair haired girl in the tutu or any of the other clothes found in the suitcase. Musicaljoke, that would be the icing on the cake wouldn't it? For someone to come foward with an actual photo.

I don't know about anyone else but in my sleuthing using Google and social media etc., I am constantly looking for photos any of those garments that were found with the suitcase and most especially the quilt.

If a pedophile killed her. The tutu could have been worn for the first time when she died.
It could have been a 'present', the girl could have been asked to put it on and show it (make take pictures). So it is possible that nobody ever saw her in that garment.

But then it would be really, really interesting to know what size the tutu is (anyone?). What the everage age/build of a child wearing that size would have been. And when it was bought and where. Cause that might even be the very day, the girl died.

 

[jigzy]

Perhaps they've already been exposed. I'm talking about the House of Horrors revealed in all it's horror in 2008. There is every possibly that there is a connection here. Trudy Quinlivan, who is now on the run, was part of that family. This was briefly discussed back in an earlier thread and I still believe it possible that there could be a connection to this case.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...7-to-authorities/story-e6frea83-1226654327658

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...t-to-stand-trial/story-e6frea83-1226077069252

https://www.facebook.com/victoriapo...d=853928664679271&offset= 0&total_comments=26

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-03-20/woman-charged-over-sa-child-neglect-wanted-on-warrant/6335552

Trudy Quinlivan could certainly fit in with the Wynarka case IMO. She disappeared in April of this year and the suitcase was found in July. So where is Trudy? Someone is obviously hiding and helping here. I don't think she could survive on her own. I have found no mention of her arrest between April and time of writing.

Trudy had given birth to three children from memory. Perhaps Trudy gave birth to a fourth child. A daughter who was badly beaten (not necessarily by Trudy) and died. The people living in that house would not have reported the death of a child or even sought medical help IMO. So what to do? Wrap the body up and secret it somewhere on the property. The child may have not been Trudy's daughter but one of the other 21 (or more) kids living in that house. Maybe it was a child that Trudy cared about and she has clung onto the remains ever since. Scooping up clothing, not necessarily all belonging to the deceased little girl, and stuffing them into an old suitcase, along with the remains of the little girl. Some of the clothing may have belonged to some of the other children, both boys and girls.

I have no idea how and why little Angel ended up where she was found but one thought is that Trudy has made her way to the Mallee area, is hiding out in one of the bush camps and has either dumped the suitcase herself or someone who is hiding her has done so.

I'm happy for everyone to poke holes in this theory but I feel it needs to be discussed further.

Wow, thanks for this Makara. I missed it on the earlier thread but will definitely read the links when I can later.

I'm no criminal profiler but my thoughts on this case are:
One parent possibly with a new partner
A social housing situation, with neighbours in close proximity
Some form of addiction
A history of neglecting, abusing and battering the child
Couldn't remove the body because didn't own a vehicle, and neighbours close by would have seen, also judgement impaired by addiction
Stashed the body in loft or cellar wrapped tightly in plastic
A situation arose where the house was being reclaimed/ they were being evicted
Had to hastily pack the remains into the suitcase and leave

I've also had the thought that it was a private landlord who found the remains in one of his properties; not wanting to draw attention to a possibly illegal tenancy arrangement/ tax dodging, etc. disposed of the remains in a suitcase where it was likely to be found but not linked back to him.

All jmo.

 

[Makara]

If a pedophile killed her. The tutu could have been worn for the first time when she died.
It could have been a 'present', the girl could have been asked to put it on and show it (make take pictures). So it is possible that nobody ever saw her in that garment.

But then it would be really, really interesting to know what size the tutu is (anyone?). What the everage age/build of a child wearing that size would have been. And when it was bought and where. Cause that might even be the very day, the girl died.

Yes Dutch, but it could also be that Angel wore her tutu every chance she got. It may have been simply to play outside or to go to the shops with Mummy. The tutu may have been a hand-me-down from an older sibling or another family member who also may have been seen wearing the tutu in the past. And then there is the thought that the tutu may not have belonged to Angel at all.

 

[jessie]

I've been thinking that she wasn't wrapped in the quilt ever.
Did the police actually say she was?

Isn't it possible the quilt would have been in worse condition if a body had decomposed in it.?
Also, and this is my main feeling - would LE have put out photos of a quilt that had been wrapped around a dead child?
The quilt was in the case with the body, and I realise it is a unique item (unlike the clothes) so important to find if anyone recognises it.
I might be quite wrong, but putting in public pictures of something that contained the remains of a brutally murdered unknown child doesn't seem something the police would do. Only my opinion of course.

 

[DutchTreat]

And then there is the thought that the tutu may not have belonged to Angel at all.

That I do not think. The police wouldn't call it their strongest lead if they weren't convinced that it belonged to the girl.

Personally I think she died in it. Cause the top of the tutu and the black smilie t-shirt are the only items (as far as I can tell), that have holes in them. They do not apear to have been part of a folded pile of clothes that were, at some point, put in a suitcase with the remaines.
Why would anyone put such a distinctive tutu in the suitcase at a later moment in time if it wasn't hers and it would have been around the (decomposing) body.
Which makes me suspect even more that she had just gotten the tutu and hadn't been seen in it by other people. Or whoever killed her would have removed it and gotten rid of it.

 

[EmiLove832]

I have been reading this thread since the beginning but haven't chimed in.

I'm curious why the tutu is so alarming to some of the posters? Is it because it's black? Or a tutu?

I have a niece who went through a tutu skirt phase about 5 years ago. I remember buying her a black tutu skirt from Target with little silver hearts all over it. She received several tutu skirts from other family and friends for her birthday, I recall one was red and one purple. Another friend bought the same black tutu skirt that I had.

Can someone explain why the tutu is so alarming so I can understand?


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[DutchTreat]

I have been reading this thread since the beginning but haven't chimed in.

I'm curious why the tutu is so alarming to some of the posters? Is it because it's black? Or a tutu?

I have a niece who went through a tutu skirt phase about 5 years ago. I remember buying her a black tutu skirt from Target with little silver hearts all over it. She received several tutu skirts from other family and friends for her birthday, I recall one was red and one purple. Another friend bought the same black tutu skirt that I had.

Can someone explain why the tutu is so alarming so I can understand?


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Personally a black tutu for a 2,5-4 year old wouldn't have been my choice. I don't know much about what little 2,5-4 year olds would pick themselves, but wouldn't they rather go for the pinky colors/princess stuff, or pastel, (light) blue, silver and gold stuff?

I would like to know what other (still undisclosed) items were in the suitcase.
If there actually would be women's items like a g-string (rumor) and a Miss X Australia item (originating from a store that sells adult (sexy) products?) among the suitcase items, that would make the black tutu awkward to me personally. That would give me a feeling of sex exploitation/pedophiles.

 

[EmiLove832]

Personally a black tutu for a 2,5-4 year old wouldn't have been my choice. I don't know much about what little 2,5-4 year olds would pick themselves, but wouldn't they rather go for the pinky colors/princess stuff, or pastel, (light) blue, silver and gold stuff?

I would like to know what other (still undisclosed) items were in the suitcase.
If there actually would be women's items like a g-string (rumor) and a Miss X Australia item (originating from a store that sells adult (sexy) products?) among the suitcase items, that would make the black tutu awkward to me personally. That would give me a feeling of sex exploitation/pedophiles.

I guess that makes me and my friend who bought the same black tutu for my niece odd in your eyes. She was 4 at the time and loved it. I don't think the color every phased her. Not all little girls like pink, purple and princesses.

I don't see it as odd at all. I'm in California and 3-5 years ago I saw tutu skirts everywhere for toddlers and young girls. In all colors.

I don't get the assumption that a black tutu equates to a pedophile.

Personally I think this is the case of abuse at home. I think her clothing was thrown into the suitcase and other items (the thong, if it's true) and men's shirts made it in by accident.

I think whoever dumped the suitcase knew about it and wanted her to be found.

Seems like the simplest explanation to me.




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[JerricaBenton]

My girls HAD to wear black leotards/tutus for their dance classes.