Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #2

[Sarahlou]

Can someone tell me what it means to be "into unicorns"?

Into mythical stuff? In mythology unicorns have potent healing powers. Kind of ironic.

 

[emirates1957]

This seems really feasible to me. More feasible than, say, the in-laws discussing a possible reconciliation between the couple…

All JMO

And I was just about to ask about the motivation, I think you have nailed it.

 

[kittythehare]

I agree.

Perhaps I should have been more precise. I meant that whether or not he canceled the same day or earlier than that, it was bizarre to still go ahead with the get-together. Especially as the kids wouldn't be present either.

Even if Erin didn't cancel, why did the others still come?

I don't see anything bizarre about 5 friends meeting for lunch.

 

[ch_13]

I don't see anything bizarre about 5 friends meeting for lunch.

I very much doubt those four were her friends. But, I'll agree to disagree.

 

[Ellery84]

And I was just about to ask about the motivation, I think you have nailed it.

Thanks Emirates. So, are we thinking possibly that “person of interest” Erin felt as though her in-laws and the extended family of her ex were trying to band together against her to take her children away from her, and she just decided to essentially take them all out?

All hypothetical and jmo.

 

[bearbear]

"Toxins are substances created by plants and animals that are poisonous (toxic) to humans. Toxins may also include some medicines that are helpful in small doses, but poisonous in large amounts" -- Medical Encyclopedia


"Among poisonous compounds retrieved in mushrooms, there are specific toxic proteins/peptides that promote toxic effects acting on different targets (e.g., ribosome-inactivating proteins and ribotoxin-like proteins damaging ribosomes; proteins with haemolytic effect; lectins able to destroy erythrocytes and cyclic peptides that are selective inhibitors of RNA polymerase II).

On the other hand, in the foreseeable future, these toxic polypeptides may become a possible tool for their use in the treatment of several human diseases or in plant biotechnology applications to attain resistance against pests/pathogens."

Toxins

Toxins, an international, peer-reviewed Open Access journal.

www.mdpi.com

yes, this, i know a lot of plants have been used forever to treat ailments, even ones we call poisonous, and in homeopathy they use very tiny amounts, so if the dc mushrooms were bought from an asian grocer they may have been sold intended for medicinal use and possibly called something else?
and anyone could research their chinese/indian etc name and useage, doseage etc

 

[ch_13]

I disagree with the statement "She provided the poisonous lunch. That is not in question."

As far as I'm aware, there has been no such official statement (unless I've missed something, in which case, I'll stand corrected.)

IMO there would still be substantial investigative work to be undertaken, along with toxicology results, before such a definitive statement could be officially made. JMO

I think at some point we have to use common sense. Five people attended a lunch and shortly afterwards three died, the fourth is direly ill and the fifth reported symptoms of poisoning. It stands to reason that the meal that was served was the culprit.

Sure, we can come up with alternate explanations: It's been suggested in this thread that the victims were poisoned in separate incidents and its just coincidence that they all attended this lunch. Or that they were poisoned at a cafe that they went to afterwards. Or that it was a murder-suicide and one of the victims was the poisoner.

But I just don't find any of these theories credible. I think the only logical explanation is that the poisoning happened at Erin Patterson's home and the toxin was in something that she served to her guests.

 

[mangoes999]

Mushroom soup......

revenge is a dish best served cold.... well the whole saga with instant news these days is like a tv series. is crazy the whole scenario. her no comment, dehydrator machine saga and then blaming Melbourne bought mushrooms a couple of weeks later. just awful if was her intent to do this.

 

[Bats]

It sounds like EP is insinuating that the mysterious mushrooms she bought 3 months earlier are the culprit for the cause of poisoning.

For me, its a bit wierd that someone would go to the effort of making this particularly elaborate dish that I'd expect would have been made from ingredients bought in the days previous, including using fresh mushrooms, yet also pulls out some packet of mushrooms she bought 3 months earlier.

Why hadn't those 3 months old dried mushrooms been used in a dish prior?

Because it is a lie in my opinion.

Phrases like, "I let them choose their meal" and "my kids ate the same meal but scraped off the mushrooms".

Actions like, disposing of the dehydrator and then lying to the police about when that happened.

...are all showing a conciousness of guilt, again, in my opinion.

 

[mangoes999]

MSN

www.msn.com

Supermarkets and mushroom suppliers have insisted there is zero chance they would sell poisonous fungi after Erin Patterson claimed she bought the ingredients from a grocery store instead of foraging for them.


But producers have emphatically denied that poisonous mushrooms would ever be sold to customers - with Coles and Woolworths the latest to defend their products.

The consequences of lying are far reaching.

esp since in oz all mushrooms sold in supermarket/grocery stores are grown hydroponically .she didnt buy them from a weekend farmers market or such.

 

[jjleroche]

Bombshell claims as woman at centre of fatal mushroom lunch ‘clears the record’

Erin Patterson has given her first detailed account of what transpired before and after the fatal lunch.

7news.com.au

The woman who cooked a meal that is believed to have led to the mushroom poisoning and subsequent deaths of three people has spoken out, claiming she bought the fungi at a supermarket and an Asian grocery store.

Does that not mean she provided the poisonous lunch?


Thats why she is the suspect.


mainstream media are official WS sources of information.

She is a suspect. This statement has not been made by LE officials - it is speculation.
As toxicology results have not yet been received AFAIK, it cannot be definitively stated that mushroom poisoning even occurred. We may suspect that it had, but we don't know that for sure at this point. JMO

 

[Waverider]

I’m just becoming aware of this case. Why does she know a lot about mushrooms and how does everyone know this?

TIA!!

It was just a guess, but turns out that it may be correct: https://www.news.com.au/national/vi...ws-story/13ea59d2bcb3947bb5e9d2503819e8ba?amp

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Also I wonder if somebody specific was her target, and if the others were collateral damage. Tragic

I wonder this too - that maybe if she didn't realise how deadly the mushrooms are or she didn't handle them in a 'clinical' way that there was effectively all sorts of potential cross contamination and maybe that very toxic powdered mushroom isn't as easy to control as one would imagine

Also if she thought the effects would be long and slow and not quite so dramatic?

 

[JennieM]

It sounds like EP is insinuating that the mysterious mushrooms she bought 3 months earlier are the culprit for the cause of poisoning.

For me, its a bit wierd that someone would go to the effort of making this particularly elaborate dish that I'd expect would have been made from ingredients bought in the days previous, including using fresh mushrooms, yet also pulls out some packet of mushrooms she bought 3 months earlier.

Why hadn't those 3 months old dried mushrooms been used in a dish prior?

Because it is a lie in my opinion.

Phrases like, "I let them choose their meal" and "my kids ate the same meal but scraped off the mushrooms".

Actions like, disposing of the dehydrator and then lying to the police about when that happened.

...are all showing a conciousness of guilt, again, in my opinion.

Dried mushrooms can be stored for a very long time and have a long shelf life. It’s not unusual that someone would buy them and use them much later, just as when they need them. The Well. recipe does also include dried mushrooms, as well as fresh mushrooms, so nothing unusual in that again.

 

[JennieM]

She is a suspect. This statement has not been made by LE officials - it is speculation.
As toxicology results have not yet been received AFAIK, it cannot be definitively stated that mushroom poisoning even occurred. We may suspect that it had, but we don't know that for sure at this point. JMO

This is so important as mushroom poisoning has not been established yet. They suspect but don’t know. It might turn out to be something else entirely.

 

[jjenny]

This is so important as mushroom poisoning has not been established yet. They suspect but don’t know. It might turn out to be something else entirely.

That's highly unlikely. Doctors had to treat the patients, and treatment is specific to the poison.

 

[jjenny]

Dried mushrooms can be stored for a very long time and have a long shelf life. It’s not unusual that someone would buy them and use them much later, just as when they need them. The Well. recipe does also include dried mushrooms, as well as fresh mushrooms, so nothing unusual in that again.

Yea, nothing unusual. She claims she bought fresh mushrooms, dried mushrooms. Why did she throw away the dehydrator and lied to police about it then? Sounds like she didn't need to use it at all if she purchased the mushrooms. I mean, she is throwing away an appliance she didn't even need to use in preparing this meal if she actually purchased the mushrooms as she claims.

 

[JennieM]

Yea, nothing unusual. She claims she bought fresh mushrooms, dried mushrooms. Why did she throw away the dehydrator and lied to police about it then? Sounds like she didn't need to use it at all if she purchased the mushrooms. I mean, she is throwing away an appliance she didn't even need to use in preparing this meal if she actually purchased the mushrooms as she claims.

My reply was specifically about the use of dried mushrooms so long after their purchase and their use in the Well. recipe. Nothing unusual at all on both these points.

 

[JennieM]

That's highly unlikely. Doctors had to treat the patients, and treatment is specific to the poison.

Maybe so, but LE has yet to confirm cap mushroom poisoning.

 

[SMK777]

The problem I have with this whole business is that no one in their right mind, and having reasonable intelligence, would expect to get away with killing people with death cap mushrooms -- especially if they are known (as is EP) to be a regular mushroom forager who could therefore be reasonably expected to be very aware of toxic varieties.

I agree with what another poster has said:
In my experience of following murder cases for many years, and the reading of many true crime books, I have found again and again (Chris Watts, Lori Vallow, Scott Peterson, to name just a few famous examples out of hundreds) that the murderer is far too confident that they won’t be suspected in the first place; or that even if suspected, they will be able to explain everything away, declare their innocence, and there won’t be enough evidence to convict.

Many many true murder books which end with the suspect convicted and sentenced to life in prison still have them boldly declaring their absolute innocence, and it’s very clear that they had assumed it would never even reach the point of arrest.