Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #2

[ozprincessinoz]

Keybordem, you are absolutely correct. There is no way a man who considers himself a real estate icon would rent a house unless he absolutely had to. Appearances mean everything to him, and probably meant a lot to her too. So he sold his Lexus? The replacement car in my opinion still gives the outward appearance they have money. They have 2 of them! Big newish petrol guzzlers! If you rent in Brisbane, people look down on you. I am constantly asked this question when people visit my home. To tell you the truth I am shocked at the rate I am asked it. Second Question: What does your husband do and Third question I'm usually asked is "where do your children attend school".

I usually find the questions go: 1. What school did you/husband/partner go to? 2. What school do your children go to? 3. Where do you live? 4. Yours/husbands occupation. I've never come across it before and have lived in other major cities. School is a definite preoccupation with Brisbaneites. IMOH

 

[laserdisc10]

Keybordem, you are absolutely correct. There is no way a man who considers himself a real estate icon would rent a house unless he absolutely had to. Appearances mean everything to him, and probably meant a lot to her too. So he sold his Lexus? The replacement car in my opinion still gives the outward appearance they have money. They have 2 of them! Big newish petrol guzzlers! If you rent in Brisbane, people look down on you. I am constantly asked this question when people visit my home. To tell you the truth I am shocked at the rate I am asked it. Second Question: What does your husband do and Third question I'm usually asked is "where do your children attend school".

Didn't use to be that way, True

I've lived in SE Qld longer than most here have been alive, I suspect

Those sort of questions are the product of southerners who've moved up there but can't drop their old attitudes

It's a legacy of the early pioneers. Imported from the Old Country

There were so many nouveau riche in old Sydney Town in the early and later 1800s that it was hard to tell the genuine blue bloods from new-money

So they devised a mini-interrogation:

Which suburb do you hail from?

What do you / your husband do for a living?

Do you own your own hooooooome?


Carried on from there. Travelled up from NSW and Vic to Qld in the moving vans with the goods and chattels

The most idiotic demonstration of this I've encountered came from an Ipswich family who moved to Sydney for a few years. When they came back to Qld, they settled in Burleigh Waters and insisted on telling everyone, unsolicited, that they were from Manly in Sydney. Then they wondered why people laughed

 

[Gorecki]

I really don't mean to be picky in anyway at all but I think I'd just like to hear from police about that one as to whether or not it was possibly Allison. As I said before, she may not have been anywhere near the house when those screams were heard. ...we've not heard anymore on it.

I agree, I would be nice to get confirmation from the police as to whether they've discounted the reports of screaming.

 

[willough]

Indogwetrust....I can tell you right now, that if this happens for a few months, the police will react quickly....If she stays with a person like that, and those sort of calls occur for more than 6 months, they will not respond so quickly with concern......She should heed why the police were so caring and understand the police have the safety of her best interests at heart.............and get her bum as far away from that man as she can. Over time the police will lose sympathy...........................and it will be at that pivotal moment, that she actually requires true rescuing, when they will view it as a "wolf cry".....and goodbye friend.

 

[maverik1]

Ooops. For a moment there, I thought you were one of the MavericKs

You sound so much like them

All of you have the same style, same way of speaking down to others

same way of assuming you are the sole authority here


Are you triplets ?

Quadruplets ?

Sorry Laserdisc 10...My intent was not to sound condescending or trying to speak down on anyone..and am sure the same can be said about the other Maverick..incidentally I did not know there was another Maverick on the site when I registered!

I was under the impression that this site is all about expressing an opinion - rightly or wrongly. I am not an authority, and can only state what I have heard...this does not make me right all the time.....

I am not a very wordy person, which may be why comments may have been perceived as condescinding. My appologies....it was never meant that way!

 

[minni]

I just read the link you posted, thanks....it seemed clear but I wanted to point out the possible scenarios are endless and most of the theories contain a lot of hearsay. With the house being labelled a crime scene it reiterates the obvious suspect!

 

[Maverick.au]

And what does THAT have to do with THIS particular case?

It's not a for/against police here, in case that's slipped your mind

It's about finding a reason police DID respond unusally swiftly
and speculation as to whether or not ABC phoned or partially phoned
emergency services and was possibly intercepted and her phone tossed out of a window or door
--- all of which is part of websleuthing


(edited to say: came back to find what sounds like a defensive police person

Perhaps I struck a raw nerve? )

And what does your comments to which I was responding to have to do with this particular case? You started talking about women with AVO's being murdered and blaming the police.

There is absolutely nothing to suggest that she was calling the police at her time and death, everything points to there being an argument and the most likely scenario is her falling or being pushed and striking her head.

IF and it's an IF she had made a distressed call to the police and the operator (Telstra or Police) had heard this they would have sent a car.

 

[Nads]

This is where he would of got bruises on his ribs trying to hoick a body off a bridge as well as lifting, dragging and the fight she would have put up. The autopsy will still show bruising prior to death even though the body was submerged, it just means a lengthy process. He would have had quite a workout that night, I know when I go to the Gym after a lengthy absense ( I wish I did it more often) my ribs feel sore the next day so I cant imagine how I would feel if the training session went all night and included carrying 65 kilos around in and out cars up and down paddocks and over bridges and then the massive drain from such an adrenalin packed night ( fight or fligth response takes an enormous toll on the body after the ordeal)

She would have been barely 55kg. Not an important detail I know.

 

[indogwetrust]

Indogwetrust....I can tell you right now, that if this happens for a few months, the police will react quickly....If she stays with a person like that, and those sort of calls occur for more than 6 months, they will not respond so quickly with concern......She should heed why the police were so caring and understand the police have the safety of her best interests at heart.............and get her bum as far away from that man as she can. Over time the police will lose sympathy...........................and it will be at that pivotal moment, that she actually requires true rescuing, when they will view it as a "wolf cry".....and goodbye friend.

Agreed, but I hope it provides a possible explanation behind what happened in Allison's case.

We don't know GBC's history, we have some strong suspicions, but it could have been similar. He may have done something in the past, it was on the police's records radar, he calls that morning along with even more scary stuff like scratches on his body, she'd left on foot (?), can't get hold of her on her mobile .... makes sense why the police moved in so quickly when they did so for my friend, who they had actually spoken to on the phone before finding her.

 

[BrisbaneGirl]

I usually find the questions go: 1. What school did you/husband/partner go to? 2. What school do your children go to? 3. Where do you live? 4. Yours/husbands occupation. I've never come across it before and have lived in other major cities. School is a definite preoccupation with Brisbaneites. IMOH

Having only been here for 4 years, I have to say I agree, I dont know why, love to know why,I tell everyone it is top secret and them leave it at that Then when they press me I say it again My friends think it is a hoot but then again I dont think it is a stranngers business what people do, where they live and sadly the pressure from keeping up appearances is destructive to families as well as marriages

 

[Maverick.au]

Fact, she was missing for 11 days

Fact, Tyamolum Scout camp and waterways nearby weren't searched, even though the person who should have been their biggest suspect (as he is closest to her) is involved in scouts.

FACT: He _was_ involved in a minor way with the Oxley scout group.
FACT: That camp site is used by scout groups from all over QLD and Australia and nothing indicates he spent any time there.
FACT: He is a real estate agent and has access to many homes that are unoccupied, he also knows about many homes that are not listed with him or anyone else that are unoccupied for long periods of time and this is a logical place to start looking if you want to take a stab in the dark.
FACT: The police have to search in a methodical manner with limited resources, there are thousands of places she could have been dumped around Brookfield alone.

Why the heck, wasn't this logical area searched? and I agree BrisbaneGirl....Surely getting people to search that area shouldnt have been a hard thing to do. But because they took so long, her body has probably diminished too much.

I am emotional about this aspect because I cannot understand logically why it wasn't searched and I doubt any one can convince me of otherwise.

So your idea for searching would be to send people all over the place?

It's all very well with the benefit of hindsight to say search the campsite but how many people do you send there? What about searching all the homes he had access to as well? And all the unoccupied homes? And what about putting divers down all along the river?

 

[indogwetrust]

So your idea for searching would be to send people all over the place?

It's all very well with the benefit of hindsight to say search the campsite but how many people do you send there? What about searching all the homes he had access to as well? And all the unoccupied homes? And what about putting divers down all along the river?

No one here is suggesting to have sent people all over the place.

Instead, as Keyboredom pointed out and as most of us living here know - there are only 4 exits out of here - two of which would be highly risky as they head into the city.

Gap creek Rd could have been the next logical to Rafting ground/Moggill.

Then you figure out roughly a distance extending out from the point of the BC house - time enough to drive out, leave Allison then come back.

Many of the elder locals kept saying the river/water/creeks.

True, it is easy to see it all in hindsight, however, to follow at least arterial roads which provide a quick getaway and lead into bush where there is major waterways ...

That's not sending people all over the place, it's being strategic.

 

[CaseClosed]

I want to be proved wrong about this ASAP but I FEAR that the body was submerged for too long, the elements have taken their toll and all surface injuries that could show minor marks have been eroded by nature's elements and creatures, this is why it took them so long to confirm her official identify as she would have been unrecognisable beyond belief for anyone to do a visual confirmation

Forensic pathology is an amazing science. I regularly watch a show on Foxtel about a Medical Examiner in Florida (real autopsy cases) and what they can work out from what the body "tells" them is quite amazing. Toxicology reports are the thing that takes longer and until they have the toxicology results, they cannot finish the autopsy. In the US these reports take upto 2-3 weeks, therefore it may be similar here. For example, if there was water and matter (mud, leaves, etc.) in her lungs, they can pinpoint the location due to the microorganisms and minerals, etc. in the mud, compared to samples taken from the river. Her ID might have been done through dental records.

 

[Strangeworld]

No one here is suggesting to have sent people all over the place.

Instead, as Keyboredom pointed out and as most of us living here know - there are only 4 exits out of here - two of which would be highly risky as they head into the city.

Gap creek Rd could have been the next logical to Rafting ground/Moggill.

Then you figure out roughly a distance extending out from the point of the BC house - time enough to drive out, leave Allison then come back.

Many of the elder locals kept saying the river/water/creeks.

True, it is easy to see it all in hindsight, however, to follow at least arterial roads which provide a quick getaway and lead into bush where there is major waterways ...

That's not sending people all over the place, it's being strategic.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, there is likely details to this case that we are unaware of, that prompted police to search the way they did. The police force and SES have been around a long time, and they know how to search strategically. I have no doubt they searched in the most appropriate manner. Locals may have insight into the area, but the police had insight into the case.

 

[indogwetrust]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, there is likely details to this case that we are unaware of, that prompted police to search the way they did. The police force and SES have been around a long time, and they know how to search strategically. I have no doubt they searched in the most appropriate manner. Locals may have insight into the area, but the police had insight into the case.

Locals who have been born and bred here have insight into:

1. The community i.e the prominent personalities - some have a good handle on what is BS and what isn't that runs along the ever present bush telegraph out here.

2. The terrain - many know this place extremely well not just bc they have been born here but also bc they volunteer on the rural firebrigade and other things.

The police may have had insight into the case but it always had to be within the context of the community and the area.

 

[marlywings]

FACT: He _was_ involved in a minor way with the Oxley scout group.
FACT: That camp site is used by scout groups from all over QLD and Australia and nothing indicates he spent any time there.
FACT: He is a real estate agent and has access to many homes that are unoccupied, he also knows about many homes that are not listed with him or anyone else that are unoccupied for long periods of time and this is a logical place to start looking if you want to take a stab in the dark.
FACT: The police have to search in a methodical manner with limited resources, there are thousands of places she could have been dumped around Brookfield alone.

With all due respect Maverick.au, members on here don't know whether some of your "facts" are indeed facts or not. I don't know how involved he was with scouts....haven't heard anything from police as to whether he was or wasn't. Or about the houses in the area. You are making them seem as though you have "facts" but it's really only your word = a member of a forum, like the rest of us.

I do agree though with your last "fact" re police needing to search in a methodical manner etc....it has to be done in that manner.

 

[PolyDot]

And there have been plenty of cases where a partner has murdered another partner and that victim has had dozens of opportunities to press charges but each time fails to do so. Each time the police attend a domestic violence situation they have to fill in 8+ hours of paperwork to numerous organisations. Perhaps if those victims would press charges police would have more time to follow up on AVOs instead of doing paperwork.

police can actually take out dvo against the man too , and often women don't take out dvos because they are scared of repercussions - that is why it is good for police to take out dvo's to ease pressure of women.
often the most dangerous time for women is when the leave a r/ship that is often when a violent incidence and sometimes murder occurs

 

[CaseClosed]

FACT: He _was_ involved in a minor way with the Oxley scout group.
FACT: That camp site is used by scout groups from all over QLD and Australia and nothing indicates he spent any time there.
FACT: He is a real estate agent and has access to many homes that are unoccupied, he also knows about many homes that are not listed with him or anyone else that are unoccupied for long periods of time and this is a logical place to start looking if you want to take a stab in the dark.
FACT: The police have to search in a methodical manner with limited resources, there are thousands of places she could have been dumped around Brookfield alone.



So your idea for searching would be to send people all over the place?

It's all very well with the benefit of hindsight to say search the campsite but how many people do you send there? What about searching all the homes he had access to as well? And all the unoccupied homes? And what about putting divers down all along the river?

I agree with Maverick. The police have procedures and protocols to follow and they need to adhere to them. Sending officers and SES on a wild goose chase would have been fruitless. As we know, initially they tried to pinpoint her location by triangulation of her phone signal, however battery died. The police have to be very careful that their case is not thrown out of court on a technicality, etc.

 

[True]

Forensic pathology is an amazing science. I regularly watch a show on Foxtel about a Medical Examiner in Florida (real autopsy cases) and what they can work out from what the body "tells" them is quite amazing. Toxicology reports are the thing that takes longer and until they have the toxicology results, they cannot finish the autopsy. In the US these reports take upto 2-3 weeks, therefore it may be similar here. For example, if there was water and matter (mud, leaves, etc.) in her lungs, they can pinpoint the location due to the microorganisms and minerals, etc. in the mud, compared to samples taken from the river. Her ID might have been done through dental records.

Yup. All being submerged in water will do is remove trace evidence. It won't remove a fractured skull, a snapped neck, a stab wound or microbes from her lungs. We don't know how long she was in the water for anyway. As someone said very early on, we haven't had a downfall that would send an object such as a body too far along a water way. It looks more to me like the water level dropped and deposited her on the bank rather than being washed up by a torrent of water.

 

[marlywings]

Forensic pathology is an amazing science. I regularly watch a show on Foxtel about a Medical Examiner in Florida (real autopsy cases) and what they can work out from what the body "tells" them is quite amazing. Toxicology reports are the thing that takes longer and until they have the toxicology results, they cannot finish the autopsy. In the US these reports take upto 2-3 weeks, therefore it may be similar here. For example, if there was water and matter (mud, leaves, etc.) in her lungs, they can pinpoint the location due to the microorganisms and minerals, etc. in the mud, compared to samples taken from the river. Her ID might have been done through dental records.

Fantastic program that one isn't it!! It's incredible what they can find from the smallest piece of material...technology of course has helped immensely in this area.