Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #3

[Thinking]

if gbc did murder abc imagine what terrible gnawing stomach churning stress he must be going through every waking and possibly sleeping moment. what a constant nightmare wondering if there will be a knock at the door. on top of that having to put on a brave/grief stricken face for his girls and family etc.
if he is guilty, he would also be trying to tie up all loose ends and get everything in order with his business and personal affairs in case he gets put away.
also wondering if the neighbours reported hearing a fight then the children probably witnessed or heard it too, and if he hit her, they may have told the first attending police on the friday morning. they would have been traumatised.

Yes it would be torture for him right now, guilty or innocent.

Yes I agree - I have previously mentioned my concern that if the children were home they may have witnessed something. Not much will get past little kids and they might have seen something and not said anything at the time out of fear or confusion. I wonder if one of them said to the police, something like "mummy went away in the car with daddy", for example - they may have noticed the car leave but GBC didn't realise this. If there was a disturbance at night my oldest would definitely wake up - our neighbours were arguing the other night and he came into us all upset as he could hear it.

 

[Thinking]

The other thing I would like to revisit is the assumption we seem to have taken on, that there has been ongoing domestic abuse. I can't recall whether we had any support for this assumption - or are we only guessing?

 

[pinhead]

I don't understand any of the above.

Where are you getting that GBC assumed Allison left the house at 11.15pm?

He never stated that he thought she watched the whole Footy Show. He stated that he last saw her at 10pm watching the Footy Show. Even if this was true, and it might not have been, there is nothing to say she watched it all.

What phone calls? I don't recall anything being reported that he tried to call her that night to see where she was. I thought he called police at 7.30am the next morning. There was a report I read in one of the online articles saying he was frantically texting people that night, but I dont think it was a direct quote from him or the police.

Was there something saying he had been frantically calling her on the Thursday night? I'm just not sure where this is all coming from and am feeling a bit confused. Hopefully you can clarify.

PS I also thought that the whole idea of him being concerned about her whereabouts on the Thursday night had been ruled out - because the reports confirmed that he said he last saw her watching the Footy Show and then he went to bed - and i don't recall anything about him waking up later in the night and trying to work out where she was. I thought he had said he called police at 7.30am after she didnt return from her morning walk which he assumed she had been on (although he didnt see her leave.) Have I got this wrong?

I agree itsthevibe, hence my curiosity as to why he was so concerned at 7.30am as to call the police if he didnt actually know that she hadnt simply gone for her morning walk and was running a bit late.

 

[True]

I've just woken up, having a good read. Good work on identifying the conference she was attending. That conference was advertised in my daughters school news letter, so I think Ipswich Grammar newsletter probably advertised it too. Probably how Allison found out about it. Keybordem, your post was fantastic, you seem to be ver intuitive. Also the bridge photo was very helpful.

 

[pinhead]

Hi all
I have read all the threads from the start. There seems to be alot of circumstantial evidence against Gbc. The latest to my knowledge the public are being asked about by the police is anyone around the roundabout between said times to come forward.
So heres my possible feel free to shoot me down
GBC and Abc had an "argument" at home in the evening Thursday it became physical Abc wanted to leave the house maybe gbc withheld her car keys maybe she had been drinking,but anyway she left on foot.
Gbc waits and waits for her return texts and phones people.Maybe leaves his children unattended and goes for a look in his car.
At 7.30 in the morning she hasnt returned and he cant contact her by phone the children need to be getting sorted for school something she would not fail at no matter what their problems were he decides to phone the police the right thing to do.
He tells the police on their arrival that they had argued the night before and had physical fight, there is the police mobilising everything for obvious reasons.Gbc knows he looks guilty as *advertiser censored* so lawyers up.
So what happened to Abc?
She left the house on foot pissed at Gbc around 11pm on a dark no moon night in quite dark clothing when she was struck by a drunk driver.
So Why not a simple hit and run? Because criminals are repeat offenders and he worked out the last time he was caught was because he left the victim next to his smashed headlight this time he removed her from the scene.

I would expect some serious damage to her body i.e. broken bones etc from a car hit, no mention of any injuries as yet from police.

 

[truth_morph]

There's some discussion a couple of pages back regarding 'Oasis Finance' and GBC's association (and a suggestion of conflict of interest).

I have a family member who is a partner in a Real Estate firm and it's very common for RE's to have a lending arm to their business. It's appears to me that this provides clients with a 'one-stop-shop' - i.e. they purchase a home/rental property and they can arrange finance for said purchase.

I wouldn't have thought there's anything unusual about GBC's involvement in 'Oasis Finance' :waitasec:

Moving along ... the focus on the roundabout seems to be the key in pressing charges. There's such a huge emphasis from Detectives.

Also, I can't wrap my head around nuisance calls to Crimestoppers. Someone way back called them with useless information which was 'I think you should look here'. You can't waste resources calling them with an opinion. Imagine if everyone did that, what a waste of Detectives time trawling through all those useless pieces of information .... it would surely slow the process down of pressing charges. :banghead:

 

[rhb]

Regarding the camera at the roundabout (people were wondering if it only took still images every 60 seconds): I read in an article a couple of days ago (I'm still looking for it) that although the web page shows stills, the actual cameras take a live stream of the traffic, so if a specific car went through there they would see it. Also, and I'm 90% sure this was also in the article (although, I could have possibly read it here): there are cameras that face in both directions at that roundabout. The webpage only shows images from one of them.

 

[minni]

Pretty sure that QPS know what they are doing, they currently have a very good track record for solving murders in recent times, we know they will have more evidence than they will tell us atthis point in time. After all, poker players do not show their hand at the start.......do they? The secret is like survivor.....Outwit, Outlast, Outplay

QPS are doing a great job but now is the time for patience as they await the autopsy results.....they do not get them back within an hour like on CSI! methinks some people watch too much tv.

well I wish we had Gibbs, DiNozzo and Abs on this one....would have been solved DAYS ago!!!

 

[STELLA85]

I know some people say we didn't get much rain, but on the weekend Allison went missing I do remember quite a substantial amount. I remember this as I have dodgy car wipers and remember having to use them on max speed more than once.

There was heavy rain and Buscombe Rd was closed due to flooding. It was very heavy during night and on the Saturday it rained most of the day. I remember driving inward on Mt Crosby Road around 5pm on the Saturday and it was heavy. I hate driving on that road during bad weather.

 

[Curiousasacat]

Roundabout speculation.
I have read somewhere else sorry but I can't link as it's on another forum.
The vehicle was seen going around the wrong way to avoid detection on the CTV camera.
This could be someone purely making things up but it could make sense.
They do not have video footage of the car in question due to this, perhaps the "tests" last night were to test the times against the witness?
Also I wonder why 20 minutes is the specific time they closed the roundabout off to traffic?

 

[minni]

Any supersleuths out there who can work out which conference she was to attend on Friday 20 April in Brisvegas? My landline has gone down : (

http://www.carternewell.com/news/partner-to-speak-at-2012-property-management-conference.aspx

 

[Keyboredom]

Thank you for your summation Keyboredom. With regard to the roundabout, and assuming that he took that route to Kholo Creek, I wonder why he chose it in preference to a most likely quicker route along Rafting Ground Road and then turning right onto Moggill Road. Do you have any ideas on that? Do you think her mobile phone could be somewhere via that roundabout route?

Hard to guess mate.

Either complete panic - head for road, start driving, adrenalin, no time to think.

Or Allison was attacked somewhere en route to the roundabout (seems unlikely).

Or if Allison was moved from in or around her home, the person responsible would have been able to hear goings on round much of the neighbourhood. Someone wouldn't head for Rafting Ground if they knew they were more likely to be spotted in that direction, for some reason. If as reported there was a teenage party with yahoos sticking their heads from car windows and screaming in that area (reported on Channel 7 I think, following the newspaper article about the bloke who heard screams at 10 pm). Teen parties have a habit of spilling into the roads here, and people wandering around looking for cabs or whatever. That could be heard from Brookfield Road, or maybe seen in the distance if someone started heading down Boscombe Road or Rafting Ground Road before changing their mind. Could be enough reason to head for the better lit areas, hoping not to run into anyone.

 

[ozazure]

Perhaps they need people who can testify to going through the intersection who were not caught on camera to substantiate police claims that someone went through the intersection without being detected? If you can offer GPS data from your phone or navigation device, and your testimony you were there, the lack of footage from an intermittent camera cannot be used as evidence an accused was never there.

 

[STELLA85]

I also find it interesting they make it aware it was conducted with a white car. Why not just state car?

Yes my first thought was white Prado! are they trying to trigger peoples memories. I think anyone who was at the round about during the hours mentioned should report to police even if they didn't see anything as it will help police narrow the time down. I wonder if the WBC atm camera looks onto Brookfield rd.

 

[barrosa]

If the car was being driven erratically by the roundabout could it be that she was kicking and screaming i'n the car? Another query what was the 300k for??

 

[alicat]

Hard to guess mate.

Either complete panic - head for road, start driving, adrenalin, no time to think.

Or Allison was attacked somewhere en route to the roundabout (seems unlikely).

Or if Allison was moved from in or around her home, the person responsible would have been able to hear goings on round much of the neighbourhood. Someone wouldn't head for Rafting Ground if they knew they were more likely to be spotted in that direction, for some reason. If as reported there was a teenage party with yahoos sticking their heads from car windows and screaming in that area (reported on Channel 7 I think, following the newspaper article about the bloke who heard screams at 10 pm). Teen parties have a habit of spilling into the roads here, and people wandering around looking for cabs or whatever. That could be heard from Brookfield Road, or maybe seen in the distance if someone started heading down Boscombe Road or Rafting Ground Road before changing their mind. Could be enough reason to head for the better lit areas, hoping not to run into anyone.

I read on here that someone said he decided to leave that way so he could roll start the car and wouldn't be as noticed? I don't know the road well at all so I have no idea.

 

[True]

There's some discussion a couple of pages back regarding 'Oasis Finance' and GBC's association (and a suggestion of conflict of interest).

I have a family member who is a partner in a Real Estate firm and it's very common for RE's to have a lending arm to their business. It's appears to me that this provides clients with a 'one-stop-shop' - i.e. they purchase a home/rental property and they can arrange finance for said purchase.

I wouldn't have thought there's anything unusual about GBC's involvement in 'Oasis Finance' :waitasec:

Moving along ... the focus on the roundabout seems to be the key in pressing charges. There's such a huge emphasis from Detectives.

Also, I can't wrap my head around nuisance calls to Crimestoppers. Someone way back called them with useless information which was 'I think you should look here'. You can't waste resources calling them with an opinion. Imagine if everyone did that, what a waste of Detectives time trawling through all those useless pieces of information .... it would surely slow the process down of pressing charges. :banghead:

Actually, it's probably not that common for Real Estate agencies to have a lending arm. I've bought 2 properties from different estate agents in the 4 years and I was never approached with in-house financing, actually I don't think anyone I know has. Buying a car, YES, it's standard practice.

Which brings me to the point. Maybe Mortgages WERE an interest of his and maybe he did try to assimilate this option into his business? The real estate market sunk before interest rates went up, which would have left him owing a lot of money, particulary if he had his own interest rate scale. He then would have been left owing a lot of money to a hedge fund of some sort, then probably investors. Maybe we are looking at a far more stressful situation for him which was first thought? Hence the $300,000 loan. Maybe these investors didn't have a clue about how the financial arm of the business was going and maybe it was just another investment in a business, they were led to believe was doing okay? Book diddling? Fake investment certificates, maybe he chucked a Bernie Madoff?

I looked up Oasis finance and all I can find is an institution based in Mildura?
Strange

 

[PolyDot]

Hi all.
So perhaps the in laws had to mortgage their house to help GBC's business. The whole GBC family would be financially involved in the business I would assume?
If GBC was about to file for bankruptcy they would lose their house?
Perhaps Allison wasn't co operating anymore and told them it was their mess to sort out.
A man about to lose his castle could make an angry man or an angry wife?

i think you would lose your Real Estate license if your are bankrupt ..
i think his money worries added to his stress but not the sole reason -

 

[alicat]

Also, I can't wrap my head around nuisance calls to Crimestoppers. Someone way back called them with useless information which was 'I think you should look here'. You can't waste resources calling them with an opinion. Imagine if everyone did that, what a waste of Detectives time trawling through all those useless pieces of information .... it would surely slow the process down of pressing charges. :banghead:

I hear what you are saying, but you never know what could help.

Before her body was found, a poster mentioned they called Crimestoppers to check out the Scout Camp near where Allison was found. If they would have done so, perhaps they would have seen drag marks etc and searched further to then find her body two days earlier than it was.

 

[Sebastian01]

Hard to guess mate.

Either complete panic - head for road, start driving, adrenalin, no time to think.

Or Allison was attacked somewhere en route to the roundabout (seems unlikely).

Or if Allison was moved from in or around her home, the person responsible would have been able to hear goings on round much of the neighbourhood. Someone wouldn't head for Rafting Ground if they knew they were more likely to be spotted in that direction, for some reason. If as reported there was a teenage party with yahoos sticking their heads from car windows and screaming in that area (reported on Channel 7 I think, following the newspaper article about the bloke who heard screams at 10 pm). Teen parties have a habit of spilling into the roads here, and people wandering around looking for cabs or whatever. That could be heard from Brookfield Road, or maybe seen in the distance if someone started heading down Boscombe Road or Rafting Ground Road before changing their mind. Could be enough reason to head for the better lit areas, hoping not to run into anyone.

I posted earlier that I was bothered that the Kenmore/Moggill roundabout route was taken as opposed to the Rafting Ground Road way. However if we look at GBC as a suspect, I agree with Keyboredom. This I believe was due to him panicking. This is also the way he would have travelled into Taringa each day to work (and the way he would have traveled with his old office being in the original area). He panicked and wasn't thinking when he first left the house (speculation only).