Australia Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #12

[Look4Clues]

RETPI mentioned in a post on here that Osborne Park was on the title of 10 Fountain Way as a previous address - around May/June 1991.

It was mentioned (on here I believe)
Renting a unit there before the house purchase. Can't find anything else about it currently

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[JoWa]

RETPI mentioned in a post on here that Osborne Park was on the title of 10 Fountain Way as a previous address - around May/June 1991.

It is astonishing how much information you sleuths can find on the internet. You are all amazingly resourceful for amateurs, I still have a lot to learn!


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[RETPI]

I agree with all of this Mandy Maree including Robyn Santen......

Agree all you like, however, the Coroner's Court has ruled the Robyn SANTEN case a likely suicide.

 

[Falco120]

and that happened more than people would like to imagine.

Back in the late eighties I remember tuning in my television and picked up some phone conversations from cordless phones in my neighbourhood. About ten years later I had a radio scanner and was able to do the same thing.

 

[Spinnaker]

Been considering the short time frames in regards to SS disappearance which has been quoted from the below link:

http://missingandmurderedaustralia.blogspot.com.au/search/label/WA%20Missing%20Female link:

2:06 am Sarah telephoned Swan Taxis from a phone box on Stirling Road near the intersection of Stirling Highway. Sarah requested a taxi collect her from that location and take her to Mosman Park. After the phone call it is believed Sarah crossed the road and waited at the intersection of Stirling Road and Stirling Highway for the taxi to arrive. Three young men drove down Stirling Road and stopped at the intersection at the red light. One of the men took notice of a woman who was leaning against a bollard outside BC The Body Club. It is suspected this is Sarah due to the similarities of her description. He also noticed that another car was travelling down the road behind them towards the intersection. The traffic control lights turned green and they moved off turning right on Stirling Highway heading towards Fremantle. As they drove off down the highway, the man noticed the car he had seen travelling behind them hadn't entered the intersection, in fact it hadn't made it to the intersection. He was a little concerned by this and mentioned it to his friends, suggesting they should go back and check on the girl (Sarah) but they agreed it was probably an overreaction, that she would be fine. At about 9 minutes past 2, three minutes after Sarah called Swan Taxis, the cab that had accepted the job to collect Sarah pulled up at the intersection of Stirling Highway and Stirling Road. The driver looked up the street to the telephone box and did not see any person, he didn't see any one in the street at all. Since that time Sarah has not been seen.

Effectively in a 3 minute timeframe of ringing for taxi and taxi arriving - SS disappeared.

I do wonder about this timeframe as 3 minutes is very quick for a taxi in those days - I remember waiting hours.

However if this is indeed correct, then it is apparent that the mystery car behind the men (mentioned in the above) did indeed pick SS up.

If this is the case then there are only two options:

1. Bogus taxi car
2. SS knew the driver

In addition. with just a 3 minute window, it is highly likely that this person had stalked SS prior to get the timing right. You would think/hope that perhaps there is some video footage SOMEWHERE which shows this - connecting the person or car.

 

[SherlockSleuth]

If this is the case then there are only two options:
1. Bogus taxi car
2. SS knew the driver
[/COLOR]

Sorry but there are other options beside the 2 you mention. Friendly looking couple or any other ruse. Threatened with a firearm. Blitz (but I think unlikely).

I hope we learn the truth about how each girl was picked up. The only 'crime' each girl committed was allowing herself to become isolated from her group. Something that 99.5% of people have done / do regularly on a night out.

Whilst not completely implausible, I'm not a big fan of the bogus taxi theory. I believe the CSK either had some familiarity with the girls or, more likely, some 'clever' story to encourage them into his car. But then, where are the stories about the failed attempts?

 

[CP345]

Been considering the short time frames in regards to SS disappearance which has been quoted from the below link:

http://missingandmurderedaustralia.blogspot.com.au/search/label/WA%20Missing%20Female link:

2:06 am Sarah telephoned Swan Taxis from a phone box on Stirling Road near the intersection of Stirling Highway. Sarah requested a taxi collect her from that location and take her to Mosman Park. After the phone call it is believed Sarah crossed the road and waited at the intersection of Stirling Road and Stirling Highway for the taxi to arrive. Three young men drove down Stirling Road and stopped at the intersection at the red light. One of the men took notice of a woman who was leaning against a bollard outside BC The Body Club. It is suspected this is Sarah due to the similarities of her description. He also noticed that another car was travelling down the road behind them towards the intersection. The traffic control lights turned green and they moved off turning right on Stirling Highway heading towards Fremantle. As they drove off down the highway, the man noticed the car he had seen travelling behind them hadn't entered the intersection, in fact it hadn't made it to the intersection. He was a little concerned by this and mentioned it to his friends, suggesting they should go back and check on the girl (Sarah) but they agreed it was probably an overreaction, that she would be fine. At about 9 minutes past 2, three minutes after Sarah called Swan Taxis, the cab that had accepted the job to collect Sarah pulled up at the intersection of Stirling Highway and Stirling Road. The driver looked up the street to the telephone box and did not see any person, he didn't see any one in the street at all. Since that time Sarah has not been seen.

Effectively in a 3 minute timeframe of ringing for taxi and taxi arriving - SS disappeared.

I do wonder about this timeframe as 3 minutes is very quick for a taxi in those days - I remember waiting hours.

However if this is indeed correct then it is apparent that the mystery car behind the men (mentioned in the above) did indeed pick SS up.

If this is the case then there are only two options:

1. Bogus taxi car
2. SS knew the driver

In addition. with just a 3 minute window, it is highly likely that this person had stalked SS prior to get the timing right. You would think/hope that perhaps there is some video footage SOMEWHERE which shows this.

I noticed the same thing about the small time window in this report. However, I'm sure that I've read elsewhere that it was more like a 7 minute window. I believe the cab that took the job was over near Eric street somewhere and it took 7 minutes to arrive. I'll see if I can find it.

Regardless, still a small window. The witnesses who saw her saw her when she'd already made the call. After hanging up she'd had time to cross Stirling street. The guys said she was leaning up against the wall so she was settled. In other words she hadn't just crossed the road. Let's say they saw her 3 minutes after she called. Makes it extremely unlikely that the car rolling up after the witnesses wasn't involved in my view.

 

[Owlie]

I totally agree with you.
A lot of assaults happened near Club Bayview and at least 2 of the Claremont victims had been there that night. I believe CSK met the girls there at some point. Maybe not that night-but he must have been familiar to them for them to get in his car willingly.

Kk rape 1995- victim was leaving Club Bayview and walking to a friends when she was ambushed,taken in a car and assaulted.

Early 96-a woman is assaulted in Church Lane near Club Bayview and escapes.

Personally I think due to these (and possibly others )- BRE decided he needed to change his style.

SS -Australia Day 1996
A car is seen stopping where she was waiting for a taxi. Unless two people were involved-she couldnt have been blitzed by this car. And with such a short window of time-I doubt anyone else came after this person in car.
I believe she knew him or had seen him around and accepted a lift.

JR
Had been at Club Bayview before the Continental. She never went in the Continental and didnt want to leave with her friends in a taxi.
I believe she had prearranged to meet a man there that she met previously at Club Bayview.
MM definitely resembles BRE in his younger years. This MM never came forward. Has to have had something to hide.
I believe JR left with him willingly

CG
CG was aware there was a killer on the loose.
She was last seen leaning over talking into a car window.
I doubt she would have got in this car had she not felt safe.

The CSI crime doc seems to believe SS and CG got into the car willingly.

Whats interesting is SS and JR were taken on long weekends . The Church Lane assault also occurred on a long weekend
Maybe BRE had the home to himself on long weekends or just needed the extra day to dispose and clean etc.
He may well have taken SS and JR back to his home.
CG ...I think something went wrong with her. She would have put up quite a fight as soon as he started acting odd as she knew 2 girls had already gone missing in the area
The plan went wrong. This may have frightened him and he changed his MO again..



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I'm not having a go at you because this is a great post but you've got some of Janes timeline wrong.

Earlier on the evening of her disappearance on Saturday the 8th of June, 1996, Jane was at the Shenton Park Hotel where her Mum worked (I'm having trouble finding the reference for this but believe it's in the CSK No Discussion thread).

She then went to The OBH (Ocean Beach Hotel) in Cottesloe some time between 8.00 pm and 8:30 pm, where Sarah Spiers had also been early on the night of her disappearance.

At that location, Jane met up with some friends. They stayed there for about an hour, before Jane and her friends caught a taxi to the Continental Hotel in Claremont arriving at about 9:30 pm.

Jane and her friends stayed at the Continental Hotel until they left just after 11:30 pm, to go to Club Bay View. This is the same nightclub that Sarah Spiers was socialising at shortly before she went missing.

Jane and her friends didn’t enter the nightclub, instead they decided to catch a cab to a friend’s place where they would continue to party. As they got to the taxi rank near the Continental Hotel, Jane informed her friends that she didn’t want to go home and without any more explanation, she walked off back to the Continental.

Her friends jumped in a cab and pulled up outside the Continental and yelled over to Jane who was standing outside to join them but she declined.

At about midnight, Jane is sighted on security camera footage outside the Continental.

At about a minute past midnight, a male person is seen to approach Jane and there is a brief interaction between the two before the security camera recording changes views to another part of the hotel.

When the recording returns to Jane, about 28 seconds later, this man is no longer in view.

This person has been named the ‘mystery man’. Despite extensive inquiries police have been unable to identify this person. Approximately 700 people were shown the footage or still photographs of the male.

Jane remained outside the Continental Hotel for another 2½ minutes.

At about 4 minutes past midnight , the security footage changes view and when it returns to where Jane was standing she is no longer in view.

Police have several possible sightings of Jane in the immediate vicinity but nothing is confirmed.

55 days later on the 3rd of August ,1996, Jane’s body was discovered in Wellard, about 40 kilometres south of the Perth CBD.

https://www.crimestopperswa.com.au/open-cases/jane-louise-rimmer/


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[Spinnaker]

Sorry but there are other options beside the 2 you mention. Friendly looking couple or any other ruse. Threatened with a firearm. Blitz (but I think unlikely).

I hope we learn the truth about how each girl was picked up. The only 'crime' each girl committed was allowing herself to become isolated from her group. Something that 99.5% of people have done / do regularly on a night out.

Whilst not completely implausible, I'm not a big fan of the bogus taxi theory. I believe the CSK either had some familiarity with the girls or, more likely, some 'clever' story to encourage them into his car. But then, where are the stories about the failed attempts?

Thanks SherlockSleuth - I am not a big fan of the bogus taxi story either, however there were some incidents around the time involving taxis, so really should be included.

My view is that the CSK knew the girls in some way (met a few times through friends, out and about, group etc) and that they were easily persuaded into the car. I do not believe there were failed attempts.

 

[Owlie]

Thought I would raise Iona Presentation College, Catholic School for Girls in Mosman Park as features in all of the below:

JC – attended Iona
https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=103679664

SS – Attended Iona
http://www.news.com.au/national/cla...d/news-story/21cde6933aafd13a378dd1c89aff974a

CG – Well reported she attended Iona and mother worked there

JR – Not sure if she attended

Lorrin Whitehead (attended Iona, Cottesloe Raised)
http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au...s/news-story/4660796762fa08830aeaabe1a56d55fc

Would be interesting to know which school BE Wives went to? (2nd wife family restaurant very close).

Has anyone else got info to add or clarify?

I've read on earlier threads that Jane Rimmer went to Hollywood Senior High School, not Iona but I haven't been able to find the link.


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[Spinnaker]

I've read on earlier threads that Jane Rimmer went to Hollywood Senior High School, not Iona but I haven't been able to find the link.


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Thanks Owlie for clarifying - I did not think that she attended, interesting connection though with the other girls! Quite a coincidence.

 

[Spinnaker]

The below article states that BRE's "old high school friends were equally surprised, saying that one of their year 12 students had studied law at the University of Western Australia with Ciara Glennon".

http://www.news.com.au/national/courts-law/quiet-boy-and-helpful-neighbour-nicknamed-bogsy-is-man-accused-of-claremont-serial-killings/news-story/44d3d60b4c894e632bb30a23a11bc787

It is very possible that BRE met CG out and about through mutual friends (as an acquaintance).

 

[mandy.maree]

The below article states that BRE's "old high school friends were equally surprised, saying that one of their year 12 students had studied law at the University of Western Australia with Ciara Glennon".

http://www.news.com.au/national/courts-law/quiet-boy-and-helpful-neighbour-nicknamed-bogsy-is-man-accused-of-claremont-serial-killings/news-story/44d3d60b4c894e632bb30a23a11bc787

It is very possible that BRE met CG out and about through mutual friends (as an acquaintance).

I think he met them all previously as it seems to me they got in his car willingly. I dont see them getting in a strangers car.
BRE ex wife was also in law...

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[CSK?]

Been considering the short time frames in regards to SS disappearance


Effectively in a 3 minute timeframe of ringing for taxi and taxi arriving - SS disappeared.

I do wonder about this timeframe as 3 minutes is very quick for a taxi in those days - I remember waiting hours.

However if this is indeed correct, then it is apparent that the mystery car behind the men (mentioned in the above) did indeed pick SS up.

If this is the case then there are only two options:

1. Bogus taxi car
2. SS knew the driver

In addition. with just a 3 minute window, it is highly likely that this person had stalked SS prior to get the timing right. You would think/hope that perhaps there is some video footage SOMEWHERE which shows this - connecting the person or car.

If BRE is responsible for SS then I have no doubt she was blitzed in that time frame. We know BRE is a blitz attacker based off of KK victim stating she was blitzed and his attempted home invasion/sexual assault which is also a method of blitz. By the time the taxi arrived SS didn't have to be gone, she only needed to be out of sight.


If you were to blitz attack young vulnerable females in that area nothing beats using the phone booth for bait.

 

[SN76]

Agree all you like, however, the Coroner's Court has ruled the Robyn SANTEN case a likely suicide.

Absolutely aware of this....doesn't change MY opinion though.

 

[nini83]

I have a theory in relation to the failed attempts.

To date the only picture we have seen of BRE during the late 80s - 90s is a school picture the next set is some of him playing footy in the 2000s. We don't know exactly what he looked liked at that period of time we can only make assumptions.

Based on his stature, and he was involved in sport, he would be a fit guy with lots of hair, driving a fairly new station wagon (assumption) young etc

He didn't look like a crazed drug affected creep, middle aged etc.

He wouldn't be someone you would think was a serial killer or a rapist at first sight. Many people that have met or known him have said he was quiet, non descript normal etc.

What's to say he hasn't approached other women but because he was so normal it wasn't something you would have thought about or cared to remember. Because during that period even if he did approach you, you would even now dismiss it now because you would think you were wrong, wasn't the same guy, maybe he gave a different name etc.

I think more stories will come out once details emerge of how he operated or pictures of him during that time are released.

After that doco on the birnies was released a few days ago people in various forums, facebook etc are connecting the dots to what happened 30 years ago and whilst some claims may be falsified but some may genuinely be true because you wouldn't have thought of a couple trying to offer you a lift in a fairly new car to want to murder or kill you.

My thoughts...

Sorry but there are other options beside the 2 you mention. Friendly looking couple or any other ruse. Threatened with a firearm. Blitz (but I think unlikely).

I hope we learn the truth about how each girl was picked up. The only 'crime' each girl committed was allowing herself to become isolated from her group. Something that 99.5% of people have done / do regularly on a night out.

Whilst not completely implausible, I'm not a big fan of the bogus taxi theory. I believe the CSK either had some familiarity with the girls or, more likely, some 'clever' story to encourage them into his car. But then, where are the stories about the failed attempts?

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[CP345]

I have a theory in relation to the failed attempts.

To date the only picture we have seen of BRE during the late 80s - 90s is a school picture the next set is some of him playing footy in the 2000s. We don't know exactly what he looked liked at that period of time we can only make assumptions.

Based on his stature, and he was involved in sport, he would be a fit guy with lots of hair, driving a fairly new station wagon (assumption) young etc

He didn't look like a crazed drug affected creep, middle aged etc.

He wouldn't be someone you would think was a serial killer or a rapist at first sight. Many people that have met or known him have said he was quiet, non descript normal etc.

What's to say he hasn't approached other women but because he was so normal it wasn't something you would have thought about or cared to remember. Because during that period even if he did approach you, you would even now dismiss it now because you would think you were wrong, wasn't the same guy, maybe he gave a different name etc.

I think more stories will come out once details emerge of how he operated or pictures of him during that time are released.

After that doco on the birnies was released a few days ago people in various forums, facebook etc are connecting the dots to what happened 30 years ago and whilst some claims may be falsified but some may genuinely be true because you wouldn't have thought of a couple trying to offer you a lift in a fairly new car to want to murder or kill you.

My thoughts...








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Some photos of him from the mid 90s might certainly trigger some memories. If they exist I find it hard to believe we haven't seen them already for exactly that reason. If police want the further info they've requested and they had such a photo I'm sure we'd have seen it somehow. While I realise that the 90s weren't a time with today's curse of people pouting into their own phones and posting the results on Facebook as if anyone gives a toss, there were still enough people taking photos at birthdays and weddings etc. If there's a complete lack of photos from this period it'd be unusual. A deliberate attempt to avoid them for some reason you'd think. If that reason is related the criminal activity then there's either witnesses who've seen something he's worried about or he's ultra cautious or paranoid.

 

[Spinnaker]

If BRE is responsible for SS then I have no doubt she was blitzed in that time frame. We know BRE is a blitz attacker based off of KK victim stating she was blitzed and his attempted home invasion/sexual assault which is also a method of blitz. By the time the taxi arrived SS didn't have to be gone, she only needed to be out of sight.


If you were to blitz attack young vulnerable females in that area nothing beats using the phone booth for bait.

the below article mentions that after making the phone call it is believed that SS crossed the road and waited at the intersection of Stirling Rd and Stirling Hwy for the taxi to arrive. I just can't see BRE doing a blitz attack so much in the open where he can be seen (I could be wrong) - its just seems more likely that SS got into BRE's car voluntarily.

http://www.australianmissingpersonsregister.com/Spiers.htm

 

[lampformypath]

Some photos of him from the mid 90s might certainly trigger some memories. If they exist I find it hard to believe we haven't seen them already for exactly that reason. If police want the further info they've requested and they had such a photo I'm sure we'd have seen it somehow. While I realise that the 90s weren't a time with today's curse of people pouting into their own phones and posting the results on Facebook as if anyone gives a toss, there were still enough people taking photos at birthdays and weddings etc. If there's a complete lack of photos from this period it'd be unusual. A deliberate attempt to avoid them for some reason you'd think. If that reason is related the criminal activity then there's either witnesses who've seen something he's worried about or he's ultra cautious or paranoid.

This is what I've said in earlier posts, crimes happened 20 years ago, why not have a photo released of BRE 20 years ago? Surely WAPOL has some photos after going through all the homes he's been living in for his adult life, and why wouldn't they just get at least one from his parents I'm pretty sure they'd have some from weddings, parties, family outings? I think WAPOL are keeping this under wraps for later down the track perhaps, further charges pending, if BRE is found guilty or even if he's found not guilty on these charges, for whatever reasons. I'm sure WAPOL will splash a young photo of him all over the media when it suits to draw out other potential witnesses/victims/women who declined a ride?

 

[JoeDetective]

There was a google map with it someone made a while back but as with everything it got taken down, I was planning on making an editable wiki with all the info and map but never found the time.

I am going to use a simple online editable wiki app to compile the data that has been referenced throughout these threads and others for reference purposes when using these threads, this is not in any way an attempt to undermine Web Sleuths just an attempt to make things easier for everyone, as the same questions are being asked and answered repeatedly.
I will probably do this in 3 weeks time, it will require a significant amount of trawling, map construction, etc but I hope it will make things significantly easier for everyone.
Hopefully others will want to contribute some time.