Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #5

[crabstick]

The hospitality guy that has gone missing from a share house. Mmmm interesting.. Cutler?

Ciara had only been the Freshwater bay yacht club day prior to organise the catering for her sisters wedding.

And a OBH patron that felt that she could hold her liquor, passed out in a coma then came to with a bloke who was molesting her in another car?

Had someone spiked her drink with GBL at the OBH? GBL, a chemical that makes women feel as if they are extremely drunk but puts them in a coma?

How long does this stuff take to synthesize into GBH in the system?

https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

Was he leaving clues? Hints at his identity? Hospitality. A game with police? He had deliberately picked out girls names?

Cutler Name Meaning. English: occupational name for a maker of knives, from an agent derivative of Middle English, Old French co(u)tel, co(u)teau 'knife', Late Latin cultellus, a diminutive of culter 'plowshare'.

 

[crabstick]

The hospitality guy that has gone missing from a share house. Mmmm interesting.. Cutler? Had he worked with Cutler? He would need a TFN at the Parmelia (14 Mill st)
Did he work with Dixie? So many questions.

Hes probably long gone. A share house with no ID. A commodore with fake number plates? Had he worked at several venues? Catering in Southern Cross? Maybe in New Zealand now.

https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

 

[crabstick]

Who worked in hospitality, both Parmelia Hilton hotel, and Southern Cross mines? Same TFN? Tax office?

An example of New Zealand serial killer living in Perth. Was his name John?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3418462/New-Zealand-serial-rapist-suspect-living-Perth.html

 

[Sutton]

where is the 5600ha of dense scrub?

How did you determine the exact location of the accident that is pinned in your map? Has this been published somewhere?

 

[Sutton]

Ciaras uncle was a property developer also who funded a large chunk of investigation with a hefty donation

...Ciara had only been the Freshwater bay yacht club day prior to organise the catering for her sisters wedding...

Interesting. Can you please provide the source to these two statements? Thanks.

 

[CSK?]

It is highly possible that the CSK did in fact contact Don Spiers, however, this was a desperate man in a desperate situation, when faced with those circumstances one would want to believe almost any lead, even if it was some sick prank, it is possible of all the disgusting trolls that contacted him that this was the only one that didn't directly insult him e.t.c and instead trolled him posing as the killer with the information as to the location of his daughter, this would stand out to anyone in his position but it doesn't mean that it really was the CSK, I personally take that phone call with a pinch of salt and consider it one of the many prank calls he received.

 

[crabstick]

Devils garden

Interesting. Can you please provide the source to these two statements? Thanks.

 

[crabstick]

Police stated the accident happened 5km east of Carrabin

image reference:http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/p...uman-remains-in-carrabin-20160506-gooe9v.html
http://www.coronerscourt.wa.gov.au/_files/McLean & Wallam findings.pdf

How did you determine the exact location of the accident that is pinned in your map? Has this been published somewhere?

 

[crabstick]

The body of one of these, Ms Jane Rimmer (23), was found last August. She had been strangled. The second woman, Ms Sarah Spiers, who was also in her early 20s and vanished last year, is still missing. It is understood that all three were past pupils of the Iona Presentation Convent in Perth, where Mrs Glennon had worked as a teacher.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/irishwoman-s-death-linked-to-australian-serial-killer-1.58756

 

[Sutton]

Ciaras uncle was a property developer also who funded a large chunk of investigation with a hefty donation

...Ciara had only been the Freshwater bay yacht club day prior to organise the catering for her sisters wedding...

Interesting. Can you please provide the source to these two statements? Thanks.

Devils garden

I cannot find either of those statements within The Devil's Garden. I did an electronic search for 'uncle', 'developer', 'donation', 'funded', 'funds', 'Freshwater', 'yacht', 'cater', and 'catering'.

Can you post the page numbers or electronic locations? I believe the statements you posted might be false information.

 

[Sutton]

where is the 5600ha of dense scrub?

Police stated the accident happened 5km east of Carrabin

image reference:http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/p...uman-remains-in-carrabin-20160506-gooe9v.html
http://www.coronerscourt.wa.gov.au/_files/McLean & Wallam findings.pdf

I am confused by your reply.

Firestarter posted a news video that said the accident was approximately 5km from Carrabin. But a pin was dropped in your map on a specific location. Has that exact location been reported anywhere?

Why did you link a 60-page Coroner's Inquest from 2011? The inquest covers two vehicular deaths in the same area, but is there a reason why you posted it in this thread?

Sorry, I must be missing something here.

 

[crabstick]

Here is the accident approximation as stated in several news articles

I am confused by your reply.

Firestarter posted a news video that said the accident was approximately 5km from Carrabin. But a pin was dropped in your map on a specific location. Has that exact location been reported anywhere?

Why did you link a 60-page Coroner's Inquest from 2011? The inquest covers two vehicular deaths in the same area, but is there a reason why you posted it in this thread?

Sorry, I must be missing something here.

 

[firestarter]

I am confused by your reply.



Why did you link a 60-page Coroner's Inquest from 2011? The inquest covers two vehicular deaths in the same area, but is there a reason why you posted it in this thread?

Sorry, I must be missing something here.

I read somewhere in the report that there may have been a third person in the car.
Maybe that's why the stick posted the link.

That's my guess.

 

[crabstick]

The remains more than likely that of a car accident someone didn't report out of repercussions. Parkie stated the remains are male (*without a source). If so, it sounds like it will be unrelated to the Claremont crime.
Although police have never declared they have found Sarah which may indicate she is out wider.

I only have the paper version of Devils Garden. Ive only partially read it once. Itll take a while to find the source for the investigation philanthropist. Nothing yet. From memory the figure was $100000

Almost immediately afterwards the Secure Community Foundation was set up by Denis Glennon's colleagues to raise money for extra resources to help the police investigation.
Denis Glennon sits in the boardroom of Western Australian Environmental Protection Authority (EPA)
http://www.irishtimes.com/culture/f...ss-as-serial-killer-still-roams-free-1.149685

 

[elastic]

This article says Julie was living in Freemantle and attended Curtin University.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5fez6q7n6...Vanished woman's uni link to suspect.pdf?dl=0

That is a very interesting article, there arent too many on Julie Cutler..

The fact Lance Williams was in the class makes it awfully suspicious. It raises a large number of questions if Julie Cutler was a victim. That means 5 CSK victims that are known about. 1 survivor. So if he successfully killed Julie Cutler it seems he had no problems waiting 6 years for another attack, unless the OBH rape is linked he must have started again quite soon after. Its hard to say how thoroughly the Police investigated this

 

[Bartholemeus]

Not that it matters or not but the Lakeway Drive in rape ordeal started at The Cottesloe Hotel (The Cott) rather than the OBH. They are different hotels and have different car parks.

 

[elastic]

Not that it matters or not but the Lakeway Drive in rape ordeal started at The Cottesloe Hotel (The Cott) rather than the OBH. They are different hotels and have different car parks.

Thanks for clarifying, couldn't remember which one it was.

If we assume some of the other attacks are linked then he was consistently looking for someone to rape. I wonder if Lance was ever investigated during the time for Julie Cutlers murder? whether he ever made it onto the POI list or not. or If Lance's name came up years later after CSK and not during Julie Cutlers investigation then it would almost seem like they were trying to make the case fit the man, rather than the evidence. They were trying to build a case around Lance Williams at the time after nabbing him in 1998. They didn't declare the Julie Cutler link until 2000? am I correct?

I thought the boyfriend was the main suspect in the Julie Cutler murder, or a couple of former boyfriends. I wonder whether Lance was ever romantically involved with Julie Cutler. She may have started the resentment maybe?

 

[elastic]

It is highly possible that the CSK did in fact contact Don Spiers, however, this was a desperate man in a desperate situation, when faced with those circumstances one would want to believe almost any lead, even if it was some sick prank, it is possible of all the disgusting trolls that contacted him that this was the only one that didn't directly insult him e.t.c and instead trolled him posing as the killer with the information as to the location of his daughter, this would stand out to anyone in his position but it doesn't mean that it really was the CSK, I personally take that phone call with a pinch of salt and consider it one of the many prank calls he received.

I could imagine the hopelessness and devastation he felt would have made this ordeal excruciating, especially with people basically harassing him whilst he grieved. It is not clear whether the caller was genuine, however Don believes it was, which may mean the caller said something about Sarah that only the father and people close to her really knew, eg. A birthmark, a scar, or something that would indicate he had her. It could be that these calls were from random hoaxers but he seems convinced on one call, the same call he wont reveal any further details.

 

[elastic]

Devils garden

Anyone know where I can re-read this for free, I sold my copy years ago at a Garage Sale, I didn't think I would want to read it again, just wanted to confirm some details.

 

[elastic]

Elastic I think that's unfair. We have to presume that Mr Spiers would have given the details to Police, and neither he nor the Police would have wanted a large contingent of amateur sleuths poking around the area.

Yes I know it came out a bit harsh. But he specifically gives vague details, eg. 5600ha of land, but fails to actually say where this location is. 5600ha is definitely to large for one man, and even a Police search party, you would need the public's help, and random scouts and people hiking are perfect for locating these things, over the years it would probably have attracted more people to the location to hike etc just in case they randomly found the body. I dont see how not revealing this location could be anything but detrimental to finding the body of his daughter.

The helplessness Don Spiers would have felt if he was actually speaking to the caller, he would have felt at the killers mercy desperate for information. I wonder if he promised to call back if Don Spiers didn't say anything or reveal the dump/burial location. But maybe never did. The call came in at 2am which means it was around the same time as the abduction. I am not sure of the night, but whether this was deliberate/symbolic is possible, maybe he also picked the same night of the week. If the caller mentioned something distinct about Sarah he may have convinced Don Spiers he was in fact the killer.
You would assume the Police would have investigated this call so thoroughly, must have felt like potentially a major breakthrough avenue to investigate. Hopefully they did try and track the call, or call location down and see if any cameras were around the area/phone booth etc. I wonder if the caller tried to disguise his voice similar to other serial killers/rapists that have called their victims/family eg. The Original Nightstalker.

If the killer did infact call Don Spiers, was this the only victims father the killer decided to call? if so then why? and what statement would he have tried to make? If Sarah was the second victim (After Julie Cutler) was their a reason to call the father? Maybe Sarah was the first murder victim and Julie was not related, being the first kill he felt obligated to continue the misery on the victims family and taunt the father? or was he feeling remorceful and wanted to help the father locate the body knowing it was never likely to be discovered, hence giving the father a subtle hint and pointing him in the rough direction. Then with the next two victims he decided to just dump them in an area around the city where it was more than likely they would be discovered within a year or two. Was it because Jane Rimmer and Ciara Glennons dump locations were so close to the city he did not think it necessary to taunt the victims family (Father) knowing they would retrieve the bodies at some stage, or maybe after enough time the CSK knew Sarah Spiers Body would have no evidence obtainable from it and decided he would point Don Spiers in the right location to try and locate her?

It does raise some interesting questions as to why he would call this particular victims father, Don Spiers, and not call any other victim/s family?