GUILTY Australia - Jill Meagher, 29, Melbourne, 22 Sep 2012 #3

[marlywings]

THOUSANDS of Victorians have come to grieve for Jill Meagher at the last place she was seen before her tragic death.
Bunches of roses, lilies and flowers from peoples' gardens were laid upon Sydney Rd in Brunswick.

Police sergeant Laurie Noonan said more than 2000 people had visited the site before 1pm.
"People are just so sad. They just keep coming and they keep thanking me for what my colleagues and the public have done to find her.''

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...before-her-death/story-fndo1wyv-1226483973847

 

[cluciano63]

Sad thought, but maybe that's why he killed her..because she fought him tooth and nail. Is it better to not fight? I don't know.

Hard to say...Mickey Shunick fought her attacker with his knife and caused severe injuries which caused him to go to the hospital...but he shot her in the head before he buried her. If not for the gun, she may have been able to get away.

 

[ozgirl70]

Some 18 year old male observers of the video also thought similarly i.e. that he went ahead to get a weapon (gun) from another person or from his car, then came back, hand in left hoodie pocket, more deliberate in his approach as he 'closed in on his prey'. My opinion only, not fact.

I agree. He definitely returns with something in his left hand pocket. His whole demeanour at that time reminds me of a drug addict who has just scored, has a hold on the dope in his pocket so it doesn't fall out, and is on a mission to get to where he is going.


The thought has occurred to me that he may have had a taser, rather than a gun. JMO

 

[Makara]

It is illegal, plus you have to be trained to use mace. Eg distance that you hold it from perp and how much you release ect.

Second problem with that is that it is not taken from you and used on yourself.

BBM.

Exactly. If you're going to arm yourself with something, think about how easy it would be for an attacker to take if from you and use it to harm you. Your best form of protection is to learn some form of self-defence and to always be aware of your surroundings. Even just a knee to the groin (and as he doubles over bring your knee up to meet his head) could give you enough time to run. Another one I've learned is if someone has their hands around your throat, whack him as hard as you can on the ears with both of your open palms. This can burst eardrums. And never forget, we have a lot of strength in our elbows. Think of a boney elbow connecting with an adam's apple. Ouch!

The best defence though IMO is the gift of the gab. Lie your head off if you have to. The Dutch girl who was raped did just that. She invited the rapist back to her place and the fell for it. And then she screamed. Smart girl!

MOO.

 

[marlywings]

The Victorian Government has ordered an audit of Melbourne's CCTV network following the death of ABC employee Jill Meagher.

Premier Ted Baillieu has requested Victoria Police audit Melbourne's CCTV network and identify any blackspots in the city or suburbs.

As part of the audit, Mr Baillieu says he expects more CCTV cameras to be installed over the next 12 months.

"We committed in Opposition to continue the roll out of CCTV cameras, we believe they play an important role in providing security and safety for the public and we've seen this week that there's a huge contribution that can be made," he said.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-09-...v-review-in-wake-of-meagher-abduction/4287336

 

[Maigret]

I agree. He definitely returns with something in his left hand pocket. His whole demeanour at that time reminds me of a drug addict who has just scored, has a hold on the dope in his pocket so it doesn't fall out, and is on a mission to get to where he is going.


The thought has occurred to me that he may have had a taser, rather than a gun. JMO

If he had a taser and tasered her he could then have looked like he was helping a very inebriated girlfriend back to his car

 

[LegallyBrunette]

Then why would the Pizza Woman say "She wasn't even supposed to be around here..." When we all know she was supposed to be exactly there and even past it?

Also, why would it be the "last footage of Jill alive" if it was south of 517?

I'm sure I heard/read one report that said something to the effect of: she wasn't meant to be up this far.

Alluding to North, well past 517.

Too many gaps here.

This may have been answered already, if not- pizza shop lady said she (meaning herself) wasn't meant to be at work on the Sunday but she came in and decided to check cctv for the hell of it. And she saw footage of Jill.

 

[LegallyBrunette]

BBM.

Exactly. If you're going to arm yourself with something, think about how easy it would be for an attacker to take if from you and use it to harm you. Your best form of protection is to learn some form of self-defence and to always be aware of your surroundings. Even just a knee to the groin (and as he doubles over bring your knee up to meet his head) could give you enough time to run. Another one I've learned is if someone has their hands around your throat, whack him as hard as you can on the ears with both of your open palms. This can burst eardrums. And never forget, we have a lot of strength in our elbows. Think of a boney elbow connecting with an adam's apple. Ouch!

The best defence though IMO is the gift of the gab. Lie your head off if you have to. The Dutch girl who was raped did just that. She invited the rapist back to her place and the fell for it. And then she screamed. Smart girl!

MOO.

Best defence is not to walk home by yourself in the early hours- which the Dutch girl did - and don't get into a stranger's car- which Dutch girl did.
Sure, we should all be able to walk anywhere and everywhere at anytime, but unfortunately there are people out there who aren't good people. People under influence of substances. And general loonies.

 

[BreakingNews]

So now I am really confused.

Am I understanding correctly that this man can now plead "not guilty" after confessing and leading police to Jill's body? How in the world is that possible??

:banghead:

Does anyone have a reliable source that explains criminal procedure in Victoria? I'm googling, but I am finding mostly links to law textbooks or websites that do not seem particularly reliable.

Yes, doesn't make sense. But I suspect the plea is "not guilty" because of legal advice. Now that just might be the problem??? Do lawyers ever ask their clients if they are guilty?

 

[Fuskier]

I know tae kwan do, but I don't count it as useful when it comes to defending myself in dangerous situations because I'm a woman and I don't weigh much. I'm easily overpowered...

Unfortunately, sadly, she did not stand a chance. Some facts here are that she had been drinking, so her reflexes would have been blunted; her shoes put her at a distinct disadvantage; and her slight female physical build. The predator was not only male, but with a muscular build from working out at a gym. Fuelled by adrenaline and the intent to do harm, he easily overpowered her with tragic results.

This predator was looking for a victim and she was it. We don't know if this sequence of random abduction, rape, murder and bury was an escalation or a serial offence. It makes him a very dangerous man and we are thankful to Victoria Police for apprehending him so soon, before he could do it again.

I have read some information on www.aussiecriminals.com.au and now have the opinion that the Parole Board has much to answer for .
We should be asking why this man was permitted to live among us - without our knowledge. My opinion only.

 

[catswhiskers]

Surely police would have already asked all the building/business owners to hand over any relevant footage - rather than just waiting for it to be offered up as an afterthought?

 

[alioop]

This may have been answered already, if not- pizza shop lady said she (meaning herself) wasn't meant to be at work on the Sunday but she came in and decided to check cctv for the hell of it. And she saw footage of Jill.

According to their opening times, crust Pizza doesn't open until 3pm on a Sunday afternoon. If it is godfathers pizza, it doesn't open til 4pm on a sunday. So whichever one it is the pizza shop lady came in earlier in the day when the shop was not open and looked at the cctv footage. Good on you pizza shop lady.

https://www.crust.com.au/stores/4d522dd0b386272a0800029f

 

[they'll get you]

Yes her mum mentioned it...

EDITH MCKEON: She's quite slight, but she, you know, she has done tae-kwon-do and she is a fighter

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3597056.htm

Would not have helped, he'd just pick her up when the time was right she would have been blindsided.

 

[LegallyBrunette]

Yes, doesn't make sense. But I suspect the plea is "not guilty" because of legal advice. Now that just might be the problem??? Do lawyers ever ask their clients if they are guilty?

If client admits their guilt to lawyer, they can still plead not guilty, BUT, lawyer cannot plead a defence such as alibi etc. Basically, it's left to prosecution to adduce evidence to prove guilt 'beyond reasonable doubt'. If prosecution does not succeed, client gets off.

 

[marlywings]

Surely police would have already asked all the building/business owners to hand over any relevant footage - rather than just waiting for it to be offered up as an afterthought?

I would say police would have spoken to owners of all the stores etc in the area & asked for their CCTV footage.

Sep 26, 2012 10:09am

Police also revealed more than 130 calls to Crime Stoppers had been received and detectives had “collected extensive CCTV from the area” which is “being thoroughly reviewed.”

http://www.optuszoo.com.au/news/top/perth-now/jill-meagher-case-mystery-man-captured-on-cctv/793303

 

[aust amateur slueth]

This may have been answered already, if not- pizza shop lady said she (meaning herself) wasn't meant to be at work on the Sunday but she came in and decided to check cctv for the hell of it. And she saw footage of Jill.

What I've read was that the woman from the pizza shop said that she decided to check the CCTV footage on sunday not expecting to see Jill because she (Jill) wasn't meant to be up that far.


the CCTV footage from a pizza shop that was before Duchess wouldn't be the last footage and it wouldn't show his face clearly would it?

 

[Makara]

This is my point. I imagine that if the woman (from the Turkish shop) works in the area and is familiar with the comings and goings/antics of people in the early hours of Saturday morning -why did she hear the scream and call the police? If it was something she heard regularly and was desensitised to?

It's my understanding from the interview with the owner of the Turkish restaurant that she made mention of there having been other incidents in Sydney Road where business owners have called the police but they haven't attended. It's not clear whether she immediately reported hearing the screams to police or came forward afterwards.

Sorry but I can't find the link to that interview now. :banghead:

MOO.

 

[catswhiskers]

Thanks marlywings - and my point was that the pizza person says it was just a random thing - checking the cctv. I think they were seen somewhere unexpected.

 

[LegallyBrunette]

It's my understanding from the interview with the owner of the Turkish restaurant that she made mention of there having been other incidents in Sydney Road where business owners have called the police but they haven't attended. It's not clear whether she immediately reported hearing the screams to police or came forward afterwards.

Sorry but I can't find the link to that interview now. :banghead:

MOO.

I think kebab shop lady said she heard screams, rang Police and they didn't attend.

 

[alioop]

And this is what makes me think AB had a weapon. It really does look like he has a gun in his right hand and Jill puts her hands in front of her in the Duchess Boutique CCTV footage.

I am not convinced he had a gun but I am really troubled by how he would have got her to walk to the corner with him and turn into Hope street where he could attack her. There are about 11 buildings between Duchess shop and the corner. Its a way to walk in those heels. A weapon is one explanation. He was clearly bothering her, why would she walk with him. I keep thinking if he walked off maybe she didn't see him go around the corner so she thought he was gone. If she was concentrating on her phone, maybe she didn't notice where he went. I don't think he pushed her into his car on Sydney Road, it happened around off the main road.