Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, June 1997 #9

[Estelle]

I think almost certainly. I also think RB was the mystery man in the car and Marion was with him the night Sally called for her at Lesley’s and she wasn’t there.

Were they in Marion's car? The night Sally said her mother wasn't there - could that have been his last night and in the morning Marion drove him to the airport? Perhaps they stayed at the Novotel?

 

[centred]

Casselden's posture and demeanour is that of a headmaster reprimanding a naughty school kid
I missed the full frontal to camera. What were they talking about that warranted such a display?

Underwear I think

 

[Deleted member 249471]

"It does seem that he went to greater lengths to cover his tracks with Marion than the other two women we've heard from."

This makes me think that he had to make sure that Marion met her demise. When they go over the places he visited and lived in the UK, it makes me suspect that they think that Marion may have met her demise there. Also Casselden was curious about those two days he thought RB could have remained in England after he put JO on the train. Did he visit where Marion was buried? Or did he go to see the hitman? The reason I say that is because if Marion died in England, RB or his wife could not have done it. He would have to have found a hitman to do it.

However, if Marion met her demise in Australia, RB and DH are my prime suspects especially when I heard when they bought and sold that car. Yes the car could have just been so that they could get around to the bank every day but also to do other things like hide a body then bury it. Then you sell the car and there is no trace to you (you hope).

Interesting Estelle. But what makes you think they couldn't 'deceased' her in UK, only in Aus?

 

[Estelle]

This was excellent!
Thank you for writing this out!

I absolutely agree with you. At this stage, I don't get the sense he is a killer. I agree, I think he's a conman where it's potentially gone wrong.

I would LOVE to hear from his daughter.
He seems to speak quite highly of his daughter and I get the impression he has an OK to good relationship with her.

Perhaps this 2 month break really will bring forward a lot more information. Maybe even his children will be called to witness.

I am wondering what the atmosphere is like in the RB household tonight?

 

[Endorphin]

"It does seem that he went to greater lengths to cover his tracks with Marion than the other two women we've heard from."

This makes me think that he had to make sure that Marion met her demise. When they go over the places he visited and lived in the UK, it makes me suspect that they think that Marion may have met her demise there. Also Casselden was curious about those two days he thought RB could have remained in England after he put JO on the train. Did he visit where Marion was buried? Or did he go to see the hitman? The reason I say that is because if Marion died in England, RB or his wife could not have done it. He would have to have found a hitman to do it.

However, if Marion met her demise in Australia, RB and DH are my prime suspects especially when I heard when they bought and sold that car. Yes the car could have just been so that they could get around to the bank every day but also to do other things like hide a body then bury it. Then you sell the car and there is no trace to you (you hope).[/QUOTE

"It does seem that he went to greater lengths to cover his tracks with Marion than the other two women we've heard from."

This makes me think that he had to make sure that Marion met her demise. When they go over the places he visited and lived in the UK, it makes me suspect that they think that Marion may have met her demise there. Also Casselden was curious about those two days he thought RB could have remained in England after he put JO on the train. Did he visit where Marion was buried? Or did he go to see the hitman? The reason I say that is because if Marion died in England, RB or his wife could not have done it. He would have to have found a hitman to do it.

However, if Marion met her demise in Australia, RB and DH are my prime suspects especially when I heard when they bought and sold that car. Yes the car could have just been so that they could get around to the bank every day but also to do other things like hide a body then bury it. Then you sell the car and there is no trace to you (you hope).

The hitman theory feels far too sophisticated, and expensive to me MOO.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Golden State Killer

Joseph James DeAngelo - Wikipedia

Who is GSK?

 

[Deleted member 249471]

In case anyone needs a pick me up... Coroner: "You carried you underpants in your hand?" Day 9, starts 2:11:20

 

[Estelle]

Marion got her to sell house and go overseas, separated her from family, got her assets (plan succeeded)

What does 'success' look like for RB? Take everything from this victims? Or take everything and erase them?
I honestly have no clue.

This is the 64000$ question ........

I am convinced as i think we all have established by now that he pulled this off somehow .....

We know a basic outline of the HOW he does it .....

We do not know WHAT happened when they returned ? Although i think it is more than probable Marion returned on that flight ...

We know HOW her money disappeared or at least that it did ....

We DO NOT KNOW if Marion is deceased or still alive or has since deceased .....

We need to find this out ...BUT HOW do we do this ?

The easy way is that he spills his guts ...

if he doesn't then what options do we have to trace her or track her down ?[/QUOTE]

OPTIONS: Giving RB a plea deal in return for leading them to Marion or her body and making restitution to Sally and Centrelink.

 

[Estelle]

Wouldn't it be great if the New lady boss Karen Webb Australian Police commissioner made a media announcement about Marion. and all police social media pages posted pics of him

The problem is that they cannot do that unless he is arrested.

 

[centred]

"It does seem that he went to greater lengths to cover his tracks with Marion than the other two women we've heard from."

This makes me think that he had to make sure that Marion met her demise. When they go over the places he visited and lived in the UK, it makes me suspect that they think that Marion may have met her demise there. Also Casselden was curious about those two days he thought RB could have remained in England after he put JO on the train. Did he visit where Marion was buried? Or did he go to see the hitman? The reason I say that is because if Marion died in England, RB or his wife could not have done it. He would have to have found a hitman to do it.

However, if Marion met her demise in Australia, RB and DH are my prime suspects especially when I heard when they bought and sold that car. Yes the car could have just been so that they could get around to the bank every day but also to do other things like hide a body then bury it. Then you sell the car and there is no trace to you (you hope).

When I first heard about the vehicle my immediate thought was maybe Marion bought the car
she certainly needed one because Sally had hers ....He ended up with it ..JMO

PS ..Maybe he even gave it back to her but it went missing a few months later

As for the rest I dunno that scenario sounds awfully messy and confusing and to be honest this bloke is NO genius , no matter what he might think or have others believe

A hit man or woman is a stretch for me. MOO

 

[TootsieFootsie]

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/n...ws-story/0fab1e0ac51bf7d643555b73d3c9f431?amp

Some rather large photos of RB and some interesting descriptions of him.

Not behind a paywall.

 

[Meligator]

Marion said they met at the arts center (or through a friend there?)— That might be closest to the truth.

He targeted JO b/c he knew her husband and knew they were just separated. He’s also mentioned books/book fairs on several occasions. It’s possible he knew FR from his bookstore and when he learned FR & MC separated he targeted a newly vulnerable MC (my theory). A similar (through a friend) connection could be how he targeted Marion. OR maybe he learned of her from a newspaper story of her teaching award and called her with an invented a story of having a mutual friend at the arts center. He could have easily called and said “ I knew your husband years ago. We met at a soccer clinic in Switzerland. Blah blah….

Anyhow, just saying I’d put the most “likely to be true” weight on something Marion said—Even if she didn’t give all the details.

I also think Marion was aware her decisions were impulsive and likely to be ridiculed by her family—this is my theory of why she kept it all secret.

 

[Carovb5]

Yes!! Such a shame. So he goes home for 2 months to sort out that all his lies match up??
Can't they just lock him up until then!
If he was my relative I would be getting the locks changed and throwing all his possessions out in the street!

Is it possible to

It did just cross my mind, maybe Casselden is also stalling?? Hoping they find more evidence to pin him down...

Maybe they need time to process the evidence they got from their testimonies (discrepancy, new info, ...) to build a better case when they ask the questions later? I think it's too bad they have to stop now, now he looks like he could have a nervous breakdown at any moment. BUT maybe their case will be stronger than ever if they process the information & maybe get new tips from around the world now the case is getting more and more notority...

 

[centred]

Marion said they met at the arts center (or through a friend there?)— That might be closest to the truth.

He targeted JO b/c he knew her husband and knew they were just separated. He’s also mentioned books/book fairs on several occasions. It’s possible he knew FR from his bookstore and when he learned FR & MC separated he targeted a newly vulnerable MC (my theory). A similar (through a friend) connection could be how he targeted Marion. OR maybe he learned of her from a newspaper story of her teaching award and called her with an invented a story of having a mutual friend at the arts center. He could have easily called and said “ I knew your husband years ago. We met at a soccer clinic in Switzerland. Blah blah….

Anyhow, just saying I’d put the most “likely to be true” weight on something Marion said—Even if she didn’t give all the details.

I also think Marion was aware her decisions were impulsive and likely to be ridiculed by her family—this is my theory of why she kept it all secret.

OOps sorry This is my reasoning why i have always thought Marion did disappear herself awhile after she returned out of shame

 

[Estelle]

hen did the first bank withdrawals begin?

When I first heard about the vehicle my immediate thought was maybe Marion bought the car
she certainly needed one because Sally had hers ....He ended up with it ..JMO

PS ..Maybe he even gave it back to her but it went missing a few months later

As for the rest I dunno that scenario sounds awfully messy and confusing and to be honest this bloke is NO genius , no matter what he might think or have others believe

A hit man or woman is a stretch for me. MOO

RB returned on 31st July, 1997,
Marion returned (if she did) on 2nd August, 1997,
I keep wondering how they met up again.
RB and DH bought the car in August but what date? 9 days after he returned?
Did DH or RB volunteer the information about buying a car or was Registration checked by police?
I guess RB could have helped Marion to buy the car .
When did the first bank withdrawals begin?
The bank transfer was done in October, 1997
RB and DH sold the car in November, 1997

ALL IMO

 

[Meligator]

If he regularly killed his victims there would likely be a long list of missing/dead women. I really don’t think killing was part of his normal fraud behavior. I also think he’s pretty comfortable lying his way out of things—opposed to taking more extreme measures to cover his tracks. He could be responsible for Marion’s death — I don’t know— but I don’t think there is anything to suggest he was a serial killer.

Also, did anyone catch him saying he learned in the brief of evidence that Marion stayed a week in a hotel in Brisbane (i think he said Brisbane). So police know something about Marion’s actions after she returned. Probably stayed a week at hotel. Then realized it would take longer to get her money out. Bought a car (about a week after her return), rented a place in Byron bay together and continued to take out money. RB must get busy with some other con between mid Sept and mid Oct. (or waiting on sally to deposit money from sale of car). Then mid October takes final 80k and puts it in his safety envelope. Honestly, I’d guess he just left Marion high and dry in Byron Bay ( police did suggest starting their search in Byron Bay— I doubt this statement was coincidental).

At this point, Marion was already hiding the fact she was even in AU and in a relationship. Now she has to face the option of telling her family she’d been lying to them and conned out of everything. I think she couldn’t face the humiliation.

 

[MrsWattle]

Has anyone worked out where the cafe was in Sydney?

 

[centred]

If he regularly killed his victims there would likely be a long list of missing/dead women. I really don’t think killing was part of his normal fraud behavior. I also think he’s pretty comfortable lying his way out of things—opposed to taking more extreme measures to cover his tracks. He could be responsible for Marion’s death — I don’t know— but I don’t think there is anything to suggest he was a serial killer.

Also, did anyone catch him saying he learned in the brief of evidence that Marion stayed a week in a hotel in Brisbane (i think he said Brisbane). So police know something about Marion’s actions after she returned. Probably stayed a week at hotel. Then realized it would take longer to get her money out. Bought a car (about a week after her return), rented a place in Byron bay together and continued to take out money. RB must get busy with some other con between mid Sept and mid Oct. (or waiting on sally to deposit money from sale of car). Then mid October takes final 80k and puts it in his safety envelope. Honestly, I’d guess he just left Marion high and dry in Byron Bay ( police did suggest starting their search in Byron Bay— I doubt this statement was coincidental).

At this point, Marion was already hiding the fact she was even in AU and in a relationship. Now she has to face the option of telling her family she’d been lying to them and conned out of everything. I think she couldn’t face the humiliation.

I Have seen it this way too , all along ...

 

[centred]

I see this too[/QUOTClose enough to my take IMO

 

[Lord Peter Flimsy]

The one thing that has stood out to me this week is the way he talks about Monique, all the other woman he could not care less about but so many times he commented how smart and clever she is. I get the feeling he really liked her and the fantasy he most likely created in his head. I would love to have read her police statement.

The only time he perks up and becomes more animated is when Monique is mentioned (that intelligent lady) but the mood soon changes when the real FR is mentioned to him. There is resentment & contempt in his tone then.