Found Deceased Australia - Russell Hill, 74, & Carol Clay, 72, Wonnangatta Valley, 20 March 2020

[trujac]

Hiding in plain sight.

Totally consumed by the fire. Spontaneous combustion and whatever was left was taken away by animals.

Too awful to think about but if it was possible it might explain their disappearance.
Except that the experts would know if any human remain traces were found.

And, LE would have found animal hair/tracks and excrement, imo, if RH/CC remains were eaten/dragged away by carnivores.

 

[trujac]

For me, they have too many beautiful grandchildren to contemplate leaving this world by their own choice.

A close elderly family (husband and wife) committed suicide...leaving their only daughter devastated and without answers--my parents adopted her into our family.

 

[Orgona]

For me, they have too many beautiful grandchildren to contemplate leaving this world by their own choice.

Unfortunately people who are depressed can’t see the beauty of what others see. Many of them believes the world is better off without them. Or they believe everybody will get over it soon and don’t even come up in them they will be missed.
I lost a good friend to suicide. We had no idea he was struggling. Looked happy most of the time, was the life of any party. Just made his hobby into a carrier with great success. One day it seemed he arrived home but went out somewhere for a second. All belongings inclusive his phone were left in his study. Next day the family went into his study again to look for clues where he could be. And there they found a piece of paper fallen to the ground with the text: don’t let the children into the garden shed.
The moral of this is we just can’t think we know what goes on in other people’s head. Sometimes it’s a mistery. It doesn’t matter which plans they seemingly made for the future.

 

[SouthAussie]

Unfortunately people who are depressed can’t see the beauty of what others see. Many of them believes the world is better off without them. Or they believe everybody will get over it soon and don’t even come up in them they will be missed.
I lost a good friend to suicide. We had no idea he was struggling. Looked happy most of the time, was the life of any party. Just made his hobby into a carrier with great success. One day it seemed he arrived home but went out somewhere for a second. All belongings inclusive his phone were left in his study. Next day the family went into his study again to look for clues where he could be. And there they found a piece of paper fallen to the ground with the text: don’t let the children into the garden shed.
The moral of this is we just can’t think we know what goes on in other people’s head. Sometimes it’s a mistery. It doesn’t matter which plans they seemingly made for the future.

I understand. I have experience with a suicide also.
However, I can't see both of them doing this.

And I especially can't see them putting their families through a big unknown of what happened and where they might be. No note, no indications, nothing. That would be a very cruel way to treat their loved ones. imo

 

[TootsieFootsie]

I was just reading an earlier article that I must have missed and it said they had been friends for 50 years.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Family pleads for information surrounding missing pair Russell Hill and Carol Clay | The Warragul and Drouin Gazette
Posted on April 28, 2020 by editor

Drouin man Russell Hill has now been missing for over a month after setting off on a camping trip.

The family of missing Drouin man Russell Hill are pleading for anyone with information about his disappearance to come forward.
The 74-year-old grandfather left for a camping trip near Wonnangatta River on March 19 and has been missing for a month.
He is with long time friend Carol Clay, 73, of Pakenham.
As detectives from the Missing Persons Squad and Wellington Crime Investigation Unit last week appealed for community information, Mr Hill’s family said they were devastated.
“Russell is our brother, husband, dad and pa and Carol has been a friend of the family for a long time.
“It is devastating for our family that we don’t know what has happened to them both,” Mr Hill’s family said.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

IMO, closing on a house a week before something of a critical nature happens does not necessarily mean that the buying of a house had a set of future outcomes that did not include the possibility of suicide...people make decisions that aren't always readily apparent.

If they committed suicide, they would be close to the campsite. They might have walked into the bush, but probably their bodies would be discoverable. Sounds like LE did an exhaustive search and believe they are not in the valley.
There is no indication from family or friends that they were depressed, despite advancing age and its potential problems of health or finances.
However, one never knows whenever a body is not found. A double suicide, or murder suicide, really would be the worst of tragedies.

 

[bearbear]

quite often when people decide to disappear into bush or ocean they leave their belongings, phone, id etc, in their cars or with a pile of clothes shoes etc on the sand,
it would be interesting to know if items left in the locked vehicle were items of identification left for police etc
if they did have a pact they may not have gone far, also like someone else said, it would be interesting to see if theres any sight of them where russell camped the week before

 

[Orgona]

I understand. I have experience with a suicide also.
However, I can't see both of them doing this.

And I especially can't see them putting their families through a big unknown of what happened and where they might be. No note, no indications, nothing. That would be a very cruel way to treat their loved ones. imo

I respect your opinion. However, IMO if people would believe it‘s cruel on their family to kill themselves they wouldn’t go through with it. Those who think that way are the ones who decide to stay alive IMO.

But anyway it’s a moot point in this case as we have no idea what happened.

I still can see all of the below:

- They got lost and both died somewhere really remote together, bodies remain hidden in the vastness of nature

- One of them had an accident and couldn’t carry the other one to safety so decided to stay there to prevent him/her having to die there alone and ultimately both succumbed to the elements

- One had an accident and the other went for help but got lost and both have died

- They had physical and/or mental problems and as they were longtime friends they confided in each other, and decided to end it together to won’t be a burden to their loved ones and to stop the pain. Maybe they gave each other strength to go through with it.

- Maybe one of them decided to take the other one with them to death because of unreciprocated feelings. Or because the feeling was mutual, but they couldn’t be together because of shame and/or guilt

-Maybe they ventured deep into the wilderness and saw something they shouldn’t have and were killed because of it and their killer buried the body’s somewhere

- Or were killed because of someone wanted the drone and they would not give it to them and hid or buried their body somewhere

-Or met some crazy person who killed them just because he could and hid their body off the beaten path

This case remains a mistery to me.

 

[neesaki]

She just bought a new house. She wasn’t in on any suicide pact.

Not to mention , if he was dead he couldn’t fly his new drone.

 

[SouthAussie]

I respect your opinion. However, IMO if people would believe it‘s cruel on their family to kill themselves they wouldn’t go through with it.
<RSBM>

Thank you. Though my point was that I think it would be cruel to commit suicide and not have anyone know that is what you did.

 

[trujac]

I just can't really believe the suicide theory. I am nearly as old as Carol, and "I've got a lot of living to do"! So many more places to go, things to do, new things to learn, people to meet, music to make, friends to help, books to read, puzzles to solve, grandkid's things to watch, chocolates to eat, etc, etc. Yes, I've got my share of aches and pains - who hasn't? Russell is not much older, but much is being made of his "health problems", including his heart. All his problems are no doubt being medicated and monitored, and he hopefully has many years ahead of him. So, I may be wrong, but I don't believe they suicided.

Yes, I agree with your comments...I am 66, and have had family and friends who suddenly dropped out (died) or decided to drop out due to age related infirmities...life and its exigencies can change in a flash of a moment--being highly fit physically and mentally throughout one's life is no guarantee that things will hum along that way until someone passes from natural causes.

 

[trujac]

Statistically most people who commit suicide don't leave notes...

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2017-03-psychology-professor-co-authors-exploring-suicide.html
Are certain groups of people more likely to leave suicide notes?
Most Who Die by Suicide Leave No Notes | MedPage Today
Differences Between Suicide Victims Who Leave Notes and Those Who Do Not: A 2-year Study in Greece - PubMed

 

[ktime70]

Update: I've read and reread a lot of articles, and the information about Button Man telling police he saw the missing pair at Dry River Creek Track isn't there now. I think it's been removed, perhaps because it was an error. I don't think I imagined it, but regard it that way if you will unless it comes up again.

you didn't imagine it. I read it as well. around the same time (maybe or maybe not the same article) I read that he had also seen and described the missing hiker from a year or so ago. At the time I thought it odd that he seems to be the last person to see all these people alive.

 

[bearbear]

was that the same article where the man stated the woman stood out because she looked very glamorous or something?

 

[JLZ]

was that the same article where the man stated the woman stood out because she looked very glamorous or something?

At a guess, no. Certainly not in the same context. I mean it wasn't said that the Button Man gave a personal description of either. I wondered whether he only claimed to see their car and tent.

 

[Kemug]

maybe a reason for frequent trips, could they have been planning to buy a remote property together in the area, they obviously love it there?

That sounds possible to me - are there any properties for sale around there?

 

[TootsieFootsie]

One comment was that the woman was wearing lipstick. I must be out of the ordinary but even if I was just camping which I have been, I always wore lipstick. Would have felt naked without it
I didn't think of it as being "glamourous".

was that the same article where the man stated the woman stood out because she looked very glamorous or something?

 

[bearbear]

One comment was that the woman was wearing lipstick. I must be out of the ordinary but even if I was just camping which I have been, I always wore lipstick. Would have felt naked without it
I didn't think of it as being "glamourous".

haha! yes, me too! and jewellery!

 

[ktime70]

was that the same article where the man stated the woman stood out because she looked very glamorous or something?

No, he didn't give a description of Mr Hill or Mrs Clay.