Australia - Russell Hill & Carol Clay Murdered While Camping - Wonnangatta Valley, 2020 #8

[TootsieFootsie]

Dermot Dann headed off to Africa and Daniel Porceddu went and completed an ultra-marathon run.

Haha, good on Daniel Porceddu.

Take that Dermot Dann

 

[discostu]

I totally agree with you, from what I know. Which is why I don't understand why some portions of that (2nd) interview were disallowed by Croucher.

The appeal judges actually cited precedent for overriding Croucher where they overrode him. They said that (named) precedent still applied.

Anyway, I will drop it now. I feel that I am going in circles.
And the accused has been convicted.

Aah, I see what you mean. I think in that case the judge decided that the way they went about getting him to talk was unethical. From what I understood he felt that police hadn’t honoured Lynn’s request to not answer their questions by keeping trying for so long and using (what he viewed as) manipulative tactics to eventually get him to speak.

It’s a shame they weren’t able to use stuff that would have shown the jury an alternative to the defence claim that Lynn had answered everything truthfully. It seems wrong to me too.

I’m thankful they got to guilty even without it though.

 

[Cliff Hardy]

It’s a shame they weren’t able to use stuff that would have shown the jury an alternative to the defence claim that Lynn had answered everything truthfully. It seems wrong to me too.

A shame, yes but I guess it could be argued the police would never have gotten those answers out of Lynn if they had followed the rule book.

The Yanks handle this type of scenario the same way but instead call it the 'Exclusionary Rule' and sometimes refer to it, rather quaintly, as 'The Fruit of the Poisonous Tree.'

It could have been worse. If Lynn had confessed under those circumstances, his confession could have been ruled inadmissible.

 

[JBowie]

Thank goodness this one wasn't a judge-alone trial.

Very good point given what we now know.

 

[JBowie]

Had Lynn gotten away with this, he'd have written the copybook for future murderers, IMO.

 

[Cedars]

Had Lynn gotten away with this, he'd have written the copybook for future murderers, IMO.

With a chapter called 'Make sure your victim's phone is turned off'.

 

[Cliff Hardy]

Had Lynn gotten away with this, he'd have written the copybook for future murderers, IMO.

His macabre shenanigans he may yet drive changes to the law. Lawyer Justin Quill made comments about that possibility here :

‎The Missing Campers Trial: Where to Now? on Apple Podcasts

‎Show The Missing Campers Trial, Ep Where to Now? - 25 June 2024

podcasts.apple.com

Quill questioning whether the law should provide an accused with the presumption of innocence if the accused purposefully destroys all the evidence.

 

[wallyworld]

Did anyone else pick up on this from the secret police recordings of GL and the connection to comments made by Russell Hill's wife?

“They’re sitting on a beach in f--king Queensland. Nudist beach. Butt naked. Playing on his f--king drone. Running up and down the beach. Taking pictures of the young people. Who’s got the biggest dick?” he said to himself. (Greg Lynn)

To add to that, comments made by Russell Hill's wife:

She said she did not know the specifics of his condition, but one reason he was taken to hospital was a “very enlarged penis”.
“It wouldn’t go down, and that was part of the depression, actually,” Mrs Hill said.

Greg Lynn told police he thought the pair were “trying to have fun in bed” before the fatal incident, a jury has been told.

Campers’ ‘fun in bed’ before deaths​

A former Jetstar captain accused of killing two campers told police he believed the pair were “trying to have fun in bed” before the fatal incident, a jury has heard.​

IMO I find it interesting Gl's comments about them "trying to have fun in bed" - "who's got the biggest dick" and the fact that Russell Hill had an enlarged penis rather interesting or is is purely coincidental?

Did he in fact ambush them while they were in their tent?

 

[KathPlumber]

When Gary Jubelin recorded his interviews with Paul Savage as part of the William Tyrell investigation, it cost him his career.

Yeah, it’s not a great look, is it. I noticed the police officer in question had actually had a demotion of some kind in her title.

Jubelin did it repeatedly though, and then intimidated the younger officer who was in charge of typing them up into transcripts so there were a few layers there also.

 

[KathPlumber]

Did anyone else pick up on this from the secret police recordings of GL and the connection to comments made by Russell Hill's wife?

“They’re sitting on a beach in f--king Queensland. Nudist beach. Butt naked. Playing on his f--king drone. Running up and down the beach. Taking pictures of the young people. Who’s got the biggest dick?” he said to himself. (Greg Lynn)

To add to that, comments made by Russell Hill's wife:

She said she did not know the specifics of his condition, but one reason he was taken to hospital was a “very enlarged penis”.
“It wouldn’t go down, and that was part of the depression, actually,” Mrs Hill said.

Greg Lynn told police he thought the pair were “trying to have fun in bed” before the fatal incident, a jury has been told.

Campers’ ‘fun in bed’ before deaths​

A former Jetstar captain accused of killing two campers told police he believed the pair were “trying to have fun in bed” before the fatal incident, a jury has heard.​

IMO I find it interesting Gl's comments about them "trying to have fun in bed" - "who's got the biggest dick" and the fact that Russell Hill had an enlarged penis rather interesting or is is purely coincidental?

Did he in fact ambush them while they were in their tent?

I noticed this too. without context it’s impossible to know what the heck he was talking about. Was he saying that everyone’s looking for them in the bush when they’ve probably run off to a nudist beach? Who talks to themselves like that?!

Maybe I’m different but if I ever talk to myself aloud it’s like,hurey up and don’t forget to buy milk

 

[TootsieFootsie]

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/police-courts-victoria/playing-with-his-fking-drone-what-lynn-said-on-secret-police-bugs-revealed/news-story/054016e35e97c8aff46ca97d70baa9a3?amp

In another of the talking to himself parts he mentions "little old people who looked at him like" the rest was not audible.
I think he may have been somewhat paranoid.

 

[KathPlumber]

I totally agree with you, from what I know. Which is why I don't understand why some portions of that (2nd) interview were disallowed by Croucher.

The appeal judges actually cited precedent for overriding Croucher where they overrode him. They said that (named) precedent still applied.

Anyway, I will drop it now. I feel that I am going in circles.
And the accused has been convicted.

Oh, I got you now! Sorry. Was it ruled out for other evidentiary reasons, then? There are so many rules of evidence with so many caveats and I can’t remember them all.

it’s weird that they were allowed to suppress that he didn’t answer questions for 2 days given that Defence put forward an argument that he gave a full account and answered questions honestly etc and it would seem to me Pros could rebut that as character evidence by saying “only after he stonewalled them for 2 days.” But maybe they didn’t push it, in case Pros. continued pushing on the grounds that the police were unethical and they whole thing should go.

 

[changintimes]

Russell Hill, or anybody else for that matter, could only have pulled the trigger if they had first inserted their finger inside the trigger guard and off course the weapon would only have gone off if someone, Lynn claims it was Hill, had first manually loaded the magazine, racked the bolt-action and then kocked it before releasing the safety mechanism.

As for Hill carrying the drone in his left hand in the picture, we can't see what he might be carrying in his right hand. He could be carrying a bucket of cement for all we know. Perhaps he has his car keys in his right hand and is about to put the drone into his car? Getting really pedantic, the picture doesn't even prove Hill has a right hand.

Without trying to rain on your parade, in evidence, Lynn said "Hill advanced towards me with a knife in his right hand.”

And didn't Lynn also say that Hill had his left hand clenched . If that is correct to me that says Hill was readying himself to punch Lynn with his left hand. That then implies to the way I see this, that Hill was left handed. PS a couple of Hill mates said to media reps that Hill had been involved in fights in the past IMO after reading articles a long-time ago.

 

[changintimes]

Russell Hill, or anybody else for that matter, could only have pulled the trigger if they had first inserted their finger inside the trigger guard and off course the weapon would only have gone off if someone, Lynn claims it was Hill, had first manually loaded the magazine, racked the bolt-action and then kocked it before releasing the safety mechanism.

As for Hill carrying the drone in his left hand in the picture, we can't see what he might be carrying in his right hand. He could be carrying a bucket of cement for all we know. Perhaps he has his car keys in his right hand and is about to put the drone into his car? Getting really pedantic, the picture doesn't even prove Hill has a right hand.

Without trying to rain on your parade, in evidence, Lynn said "Hill advanced towards me with a knife in his right hand.”

Manually loading the magazine is just pushing it into its slot place if it was already preloaded with ammo isn't it? Racked the bolt action is just pulling the bolt back like you would do with lots of shotguns is that correct? then kocked it. Then all is left is to press the safety switch button which would be near the trigger and then pull the trigger. It seems like a complicated process but it is not that complicated at all for anyone that has an inkling of experience with shotguns which I consider RH had pretty good sound all round knowledge being a well founded country boy at heart. IMO

 

[wallyworld]

I noticed this too. without context it’s impossible to know what the heck he was talking about. Was he saying that everyone’s looking for them in the bush when they’ve probably run off to a nudist beach? Who talks to themselves like that?!

Maybe I’m different but if I ever talk to myself aloud it’s like,hurey up and don’t forget to buy milk

it was the biggest dick comment that intrigued me, given Mrs Hills disclosure of the enlarged penis issue that RH suffered.
Did GL see RH naked?

 

[JudgeJudi]

Thank goodness this one wasn't a judge-alone trial.

You always have a chance of getting off scot-free with a jury if you're guilty, but if I was innocent of a crime I'd opt for a judge only trial.

 

[wallyworld]

Oh, I got you now! Sorry. Was it ruled out for other evidentiary reasons, then? There are so many rules of evidence with so many caveats and I can’t remember them all.

it’s weird that they were allowed to suppress that he didn’t answer questions for 2 days given that Defence put forward an argument that he gave a full account and answered questions honestly etc and it would seem to me Pros could rebut that as character evidence by saying “only after he stonewalled them for 2 days.” But maybe they didn’t push it, in case Pros. continued pushing on the grounds that the police were unethical and they whole thing should go.

yes from all accounts it appeared that GL was compliant and honest when taken in for questioning, hence giving him some credibility

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Re the comments about having fun in bed.
I get an image of a man being a peeping tom.

What he said gives me a creepy feeling.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Former Jetstar pilot performed lewd act caught on wire taps

Former Jetstar pilot Greg Lynn was caught on secret police wiretaps performing a lewd act while at the wheel of the Nissan Patrol he used to hide the bodies of two elderly campers.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Gregory Lynn: Cops who wiretapped ex-Jetstar pilot's car will never forget the disgusting act they heard him performing

 

[wallyworld]

Manually loading the magazine is just pushing it into its slot place if it was already preloaded with ammo isn't it? Racked the bolt action is just pulling the bolt back like you would do with lots of shotguns is that correct? then kocked it. Then all is left is to press the safety switch button which would be near the trigger and then pull the trigger. It seems like a complicated process but it is not that complicated at all for anyone that has an inkling of experience with shotguns which I consider RH had pretty good sound all round knowledge being a well founded country boy at heart. IMO

In my experience of growing up in the country, not all country boys have a knowledge of guns. I would be interested to hear what RH's family know of his gun knowledge.