Found Deceased Australia - Samuel Thompson, 22, Albion, Qld, 7 March 2017 *Arrests* #4

[Drb]

It is even difficult for those that kill while under the influence of drugs or alcohol to use that as a defense from what i have read.

I think we will all have to wait for the trial and course of events to be released. IMHO I think this may be a little different given that he may be mentally scarred by where he has been etc. It may also be different if he was still on the government watch list. Personally, I know things are distorted while under the influence of any substance when you have PTSD. Some drink to forget but it doesn't always work. Some keep using/drinking to make it stop but it never seems to. They also become abusive,aggressive and the things they come out with bear no relevance on the moment they are in.
This is just my experience with it. No 2 cases are the same depending on their traumatic events.

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[Drb]

I don't know if any of that previous stuff about AD going overseas will be admissable at a trial though? I remember in Tostee's murder trial that none of his previous behaviours came into his murder trial. His trial was in Qld. too. It will probably only be any evidence pertaining to ST's murder case and for the state to prove intent IMO.

Who knows. Tostee was classified as Autistic. He also kept flouting the laws with his fake id racket, high speed chase etc. He seems to enjoy the spot light going on what he posts and ends up in the Daily Mail for saying stupid stuff all the time.
He also didn't say a word in court, exercising his right to remain silent ans got off because of his recording.

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[Karinna]

I think we will all have to wait for the trial and course of events to be released. IMHO I think this may be a little different given that he may be mentally scarred by where he has been etc. It may also be different if he was still on the government watch list. Personally, I know things are distorted while under the influence of any substance when you have PTSD. Some drink to forget but it doesn't always work. Some keep using/drinking to make it stop but it never seems to. They also become abusive,aggressive and the things they come out with bear no relevance on the moment they are in.
This is just my experience with it. No 2 cases are the same depending on their traumatic events.

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(quote)
If there is a verdict of "not guilty by reason of mental illness", the court may order that the person be detained in such place and in such manner as the court thinks fit until released by due process of law. The person may not be released until the court is satisfied on the balance of probabilities that the safety of the person or public will not be seriously endangered by the person's release.
https://www.armstronglegal.com.au/criminal-law/defences/complete-defences-to-murder

 

[Drb]

(quote)
If there is a verdict of "not guilty by reason of mental illness", the court may order that the person be detained in such place and in such manner as the court thinks fit until released by due process of law. The person may not be released until the court is satisfied on the balance of probabilities that the safety of the person or public will not be seriously endangered by the person's release.
https://www.armstronglegal.com.au/criminal-law/defences/complete-defences-to-murder

It is not uncommon for people to be held in mental care facilities due to impairment.

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[SouthAussie]

It is not uncommon for people to be held in mental care facilities due to impairment.

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Is this your opinion Drb? Or do you have some links to provide us with further information about your statement?
As I find this an interesting statement to make.

Is it about people who are found not guilty due to mental impairment? In which case it would make sense.

Or is it about people who are under the influence of drugs or alcohol? As you were speaking of before.

 

[Drb]

Is this your opinion Drb? Or do you have some links to provide us with further information about your statement?
As I find this an interesting statement to make.

Is it about people who are found not guilty due to mental impairment? In which case it would make sense.

Or is it about people who are under the influence of drugs or alcohol? As you were speaking of before.

To clarify I meant found not guilty
http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2017-...raina-thaiday-slay-8-kids/8492742?pfmredir=sm

Although in saying that according to Christine Smyth of Qld law society, she says it is rare due to strict criteria to be found not guilty due to unsound mind.

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[SouthAussie]

To clarify I meant found not guilty
http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2017-...raina-thaiday-slay-8-kids/8492742?pfmredir=sm

Although in saying that according to Christine Smyth of Qld law society, she says it is rare due to strict criteria to be found not guilty due to unsound mind.

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Okay, thanks.

I think that is what the Mental Health Court is for. To determine their mental health (if there is said to be an issue) and take appropriate action there, before - or instead of - any criminal trial.


The Mental Health Court decides the state of mind of people charged with criminal offences.
The court decides whether an alleged offender was of unsound mind when they committed an offence and whether they are fit for trial.
http://www.courts.qld.gov.au/courts/mental-health-court

 

[Drb]

Okay, thanks.

I think that is what the Mental Health Court is for. To determine their mental health (if there is said to be an issue) and take appropriate action there, before - or instead of - any criminal trial.


The Mental Health Court decides the state of mind of people charged with criminal offences.
The court decides whether an alleged offender was of unsound mind when they committed an offence and whether they are fit for trial.
http://www.courts.qld.gov.au/courts/mental-health-court

Yes,article states Raine went through the mental health court.

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[Karinna]

Okay, thanks.

I think that is what the Mental Health Court is for. To determine their mental health (if there is said to be an issue) and take appropriate action there, before - or instead of - any criminal trial.


The Mental Health Court decides the state of mind of people charged with criminal offences.
The court decides whether an alleged offender was of unsound mind when they committed an offence and whether they are fit for trial.
http://www.courts.qld.gov.au/courts/mental-health-court

Exactly.

 

[JLZ]

The Mental Health Court can determine whether a person is mentally fit/unfit for trial. That is different from being tried and found not guilty by reason of insanity. If the person is unfit to be tried, he or she may well recover in due course sufficiently to be fit to plead, and then a trial can take place. What happens to the person in the meantime I'm not sure. But if a person is tried and found not guilty due to insanity (or whatever they call it now), they are locked up indefinitely. There's no guarantee they'll ever get out. It's basically being in a gaol with specialised mental health care, and no release or eligible-for-parole date.

 

[SouthAussie]

The Mental Health Court can determine whether a person is mentally fit/unfit for trial. That is different from being tried and found not guilty by reason of insanity. If the person is unfit to be tried, he or she may well recover in due course sufficiently to be fit to plead, and then a trial can take place. What happens to the person in the meantime I'm not sure. But if a person is tried and found not guilty due to insanity (or whatever they call it now), they are locked up indefinitely. There's no guarantee they'll ever get out. It's basically being in a gaol with specialised mental health care, and no release or eligible-for-parole date.

If they are found to be mentally not fit for trial, they are deemed to be forensic patients.


There is a whole lot about it under Forensic Mental Health Care in this report.

3.69 People who have been charged with indictable offences, especially offences involving serious violence, and who have been found not fit for trial or acquitted on grounds of mental impairment, are likely to be ordered to be treated in a secure facility. Traditionally such people are categorised as 'forensic patients'.

http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary...ate/Former_Committees/mentalhealth/report/c13

 

[Gecko100]

As previously discussed those photos were taken after being hel in custody for a week in Germany, an international flight to Melbourne , a red eye flight to Brisbane and 3 hours of questioning by the feds at 3 am. I think none of us would be looking spritely after that sort of ordeal.
Yes I agree about the PTSD. I followed his journey in Kurdistan and know him through my son and sadly watched the" life" drain from his eyes over time.

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Yes I agree that his incarceration etc. wouldn't help, but he looks so very disconnected and emotionless. I have PTSD too, maybe I just recognise it. Some time ago an ambulance driver with PTSD killed 2 prostitutes in Hendra which is an area very local to ST PTSD made no difference to the outcome he was adjudicated guilty. Iv'e.followed this case from day one, I must have missed the conversation about the eyes, probably bored you all to sleep. zzzzzzz sorry.


https://www.google.com.au/search?q=...me..69i57.47888j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#.
hmmm not sure that looks right.

 

[Drb]

Yes I agree that his incarceration etc. wouldn't help, but he looks so very disconnected and emotionless. I have PTSD too, maybe I just recognise it. Some time ago an ambulance driver with PTSD killed 2 prostitutes in Hendra which is an area very local to ST PTSD made no difference to the outcome he was adjudicated guilty. Iv'e.followed this case from day one, I must have missed the conversation about the eyes, probably bored you all to sleep. zzzzzzz sorry.


https://www.google.com.au/search?q=...me..69i57.47888j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#.
hmmm not sure that looks right.

Ptsd is such a complex issue. Alot of people don't recognise it in themselves especially if they have never served in ADF or EMS. Alot (and i was one) don't realise it can come from other traumatic events. When I was being councelled after my armed hold up they never labelled it, it was just described to me. I hope Ash got the help he would have needed when he returned but alot of young guys sadly tend to lean on the "she'll be right mate" attitude especially if he sees or thinks his mates are doing fine with out treatment themselves. Alot of them had been there for 3 or more tours. This is just my observation over time.

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[Drb]

Yes I agree that his incarceration etc. wouldn't help, but he looks so very disconnected and emotionless. I have PTSD too, maybe I just recognise it. Some time ago an ambulance driver with PTSD killed 2 prostitutes in Hendra which is an area very local to ST PTSD made no difference to the outcome he was adjudicated guilty. Iv'e.followed this case from day one, I must have missed the conversation about the eyes, probably bored you all to sleep. zzzzzzz sorry.


https://www.google.com.au/search?q=...me..69i57.47888j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#.
hmmm not sure that looks right.

The article also states he had previous convictions, including workcover fraud. You have to wonder if that was linked to his "alleged PTSD claims"(qutoed from article). He may have been tired of picking up prostitutes and reviving them or whatever and that triggered off his inner serial killer.
Interesting that this was also Deep Water Bend though...

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[slinkyminx73]

Also noticed in the news today, some young dude being arrested etc for dealing in Byron Bay.
For anyone not familiar with the area it is "high risk" and not too far from where ST car was found.
IMO it's possible ST could have been a POI similarly but it got out of control?
Just my thought for today [emoji4][emoji4]

http://www.news.com.au/national/nsw...y/news-story/bf22d16da4b63969f855b935b517a7be



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[Drb]

Also noticed in the news today, some young dude being arrested etc for dealing in Byron Bay.
For anyone not familiar with the area it is "high risk" and not too far from where ST car was found.
IMO it's possible ST could have been a POI similarly but it got out of control?
Just my thought for today [emoji4][emoji4]

http://www.news.com.au/national/nsw...y/news-story/bf22d16da4b63969f855b935b517a7be



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Anything is possible and nothing surprises me anymore..

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[Horror]

Just popping in to say Sam and his family are still in my thoughts


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[matey]

OFF TOPIC...
I have pm'd Makara about starting a thread for Cassie Sainsbury, the Aussie girl caught with 5.8 kgs of cocaine in Columbian jail...

Other sleuthers have requested this from one of the Mods as well...
Her case is becoming more interesting by the day...

Also, Schapelle Corby is being released in Bali this Saturday...
One is being released...the other is awaiting sentence.

 

[Drb]

OFF TOPIC...
I have pm'd Makara about starting a thread for Cassie Sainsbury, the Aussie girl caught with 5.8 kgs of cocaine in Columbian jail...

Other sleuthers have requested this from one of the Mods as well...
Her case is becoming more interesting by the day...

Also, Schapelle Corby is being released in Bali this Saturday...
One is being released...the other is awaiting sentence.

Itll be interesting to see what else comes out of Cassies story

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[matey]

A thread has been opened for Cassie Sainsbury...