Australia - Warriena Wright, 26, dies in balcony fall, Surfers Paradise, Aug 2014 #8

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Thankyou Sleep & Makara for doing the tweets....We would be lost without you....:tyou::takeabow:
 
Minutes after a woman fell to her death from a Gold Coast apartment, firefighters were called to a “gas hazard” at the same building.Police say the woman fell from a unit on the 13th floor of a block on Wahroonga Place, Surfers Paradise, about 2.30am (AEST) on Friday.
They are reportedly investigating whether a man was in the apartment when the woman fell.
Firefighters were called to a “gas hazard” at the same block 15 minutes after the incident.
A Queensland Fire and Rescue Service spokeswoman says its crews carried out atmospheric testing.
“But that matter is now in the hands of police,” she said.
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http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/state/qld/2014/08/08/gold-coast-balcony-death/
 
Dogface said:
Slightly OT. Can someone explain to me why, in this case where GT is accused of murder, his image and stuff is printed, but then in the Khandalyce Pearce case, her alleged killer is given a certain degree of anonymity?
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Don't really know but I an guessing because the accused is in prison. Maybe a bit harder for media to obtain pic's.
imo
 
Dogface said:
Slightly OT. Can someone explain to me why, in this case where GT is accused of murder, his image and stuff is printed, but then in the Khandalyce Pearce case, her alleged killer is given a certain degree of anonymity?
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SA law. The 'suppression state'.
 
Well I must say this has been an interesting thread from a personal perspective. I've been accused of being an "insider" for/with the defence due to predicting the defence argument with "alarming accuracy" all the way down to someone who has nothing of value to add :thinking:

FWIW, I don't claim to be a legal professional and I don't claim not to be a legal professional. I get many things right and I get some things demonstrably wrong. Nevertheless I remain respectful to ALL members of the forum, even if their views are in conflict with my own (which is more than I can say for some active participants, from both sides). Any information (outside of a personal opinion) is either accompanied by a relevant source or is readily obtained by a quick search by anyone who wishes to delve any deeper.

I've been where Elde Fruit has been, with one (ex) moderator in particular waging a personal vendetta with every post I made greeted with a very bold cut and pasted "you need to be a verified expert to post information of that nature", even if it was something as innocuous as "excellent post, I agree" or something along those lines. It got to the point where I posted a link, as required by the rules, only to have that link modsnipped and I was later banned for not providing a link! Thankfully I've been granted a degree of leeway since those inauspicious beginnings.

I post here on Websleuths because I enjoy discussing/debating legal matters with everyone, regardless of whether they have an opposing point of view. There are precious few forums of this nature, at least with a membership size of any note. I like to encourage people to think outside the box, consider opposing points of view and, to some degree, educate people on various areas of the legal process where I can (with the appropriate references of course!). I don't want anyone to take what I say as gospel, people are free to take on board what I say and they are equally free to completely ignore it if they so choose. Nevertheless I'll continue to opine on various matters as I genuinely enjoy the robust discussion (minus the personal attacks that pop up from time to time) and it's my hope that some members find my input of some interest, even if it doesn't sway their position :)

And now I realise that the post I was replying to has been deleted and I look like I'm talking to myself, d'oh!
 
Perhaps what GT had in his hand was used to start a gas leak. MOO
 
Justice Byrne this morning told the jury the burden of proving the crime rested solely with the crown, and the defence had to prove nothing, let alone Tostee's innocence.

"You may only draw an inference of guilt if it so overcomes any other possible inference as to leave no reasonable doubt in your minds," he said.

"If you are left with a reasonable doubt about guilt your duty is to acquit, that is to find the accused not guilty.

"If you are not left with any such doubt, your duty is to convict, that is find him guilty.He urged the jury to treat "context evidence", such as CCTV of Tostee leaving his apartment via his basement or wandering the streets alone afterwards, with caution.

"It would be wrong for you to use any of the evidence of what the accused did over this period as advancing the prosecution case on murder or manslaughter.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-10-17/gable-tostee-trial-supreme-court-jury-retire-verdict/7938430
 
JCB said:
Well I must say this has been an interesting thread from a personal perspective. I've been accused of being an "insider" for/with the defence due to predicting the defence argument with "alarming accuracy" all the way down to someone who has nothing of value to add :thinking:
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BBM.
Aww, what a mean thing to say! And absolutely not true, JCB. In fact quite the opposite, imo.
 
"It would be wrong for you to use any of the evidence ... as a base for the prosecution for murder," Justice Byrne said.

Justice Byrne quoted Hollywood director Billy Wilder to warn the jury "hindsight is always twenty-twenty".

He said they must not judge Mr Tostee's actions on that fatal night if he had the benefit of safety and time to make decisions.

The court has heard the jury can only find Mr Tostee guilty of murder if they are satisfied beyond reasonable doubt he had the intention to cause her grievous bodily harm, which the prosecution alleges happened when he choked her for up to 45 seconds.

A guilty verdict of manslaughter is also available to the jury if they find he unlawfully killed Ms Wright but did not have the intention to cause her GBH.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...awyer-doesnt-prove-guilt-20161017-gs3x3x.html
 
possumheart said:
Gosh! You would think I had never had a Kiwi friend! Did it also occur to you that Rrie's biorhythms would still be two hours in front of QLD, hence not feeling like eating when Tostee did, YES, even after two weeks in Queensland. See, I am not a stranger to Kiwis, nor travel, nor homesickness.
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I'm getting the impression I've offended you and for that, I'm sorry you and others don't like what I had to say. All good. At the end of the day, it's irrelevant either way because as we know, Hypothermia was not what caused Warriena's death.

Sure, Warriena's eating habits would differ greatly while holidaying in the Gold Coast however, it's always sensible to eat if you're going to drink. And that's all I'll say about that. :)
 
Here is my analysis of Tostee's statement he released on social media (my comments are in red)

-I am not an expert, this is all IMO only. Whilst I have skills and experience I've used, it's still just a layman's analysis
-Like most people here, I only have access to mainly social media writing examples. He may write significantly differently in other contexts but I doubt it
-I just have to say IMO he has poor sentence structure and flow of ideas when writing :thinking:

**I am cutting and pasting from Word so I may need to edit once I post this** Edit: amazing it worked!!!

_______

Regarding the balcony tragedy



This is not addressed to any one audience but I figured that being a long term member here I would post it here in public for anyone to read in its entirety.

I think it's time I spoke out about the events that have happened over the last few months. Those aware will know I am referring to the tragic death of Warriena Wright. So far I've been silent about the whole thing which has left my hands tied while so many misconceptions and untruths are being circulated in the media and in the public. This has been extraordinarily difficult, and I have grown to believe my silence may have done more harm than good.

So now you can hear it from me.
BBM - There’s a certain element of control-seeking here – using ‘so’ suggests to me that he is indicating that what he has to say is important and should be listened to…because it is coming from him.

First off let me say that the death of Warriena was the most tragic and distressing event I have ever experienced. Knowing I was the last person to be with her, it has left me permanently scarred and not a day passes that I don't wish I could go back in time and prevent it. For at least a week after it happened I was so overwhelmed I was unable to laugh or even crack a smile. I broke down in tears several times a day, or whenever I saw her picture in the news. I never expected I would ever experience something like this, nor did I have any idea how much it would affect me. Even though I had only known her for a night I was horrified that this had happened to her. I would never wish for it to happen to anybody.

BBM – reflections on self, not unexpected given the situation but important in context IMO. Note that his FIRST reflection is about how Warriena’s death HAS IMPACTED HIMSELF AND HIS LIFE. Very specific examples given of just HOW it has impacted his life – almost overkill, like the more specific he is, the more truthful and empathy/sympathy-seeking it will be. Ties to the idea of trying to imitate social skills and behaviour – IMO someone might describe that they were distressed by an event, but to then go on to provide very specific examples? Trying to convince the reader he really WAS SO OVERWHELMED.

While I have not had the chance to meet or speak to Warriena's family, it pains me to think of the loss and suffering they must be experiencing.
Warriena’s family were an afterthought….only AFTER considering how much his life has been impacted did he reflect on Warriena’s family.

BBM – it pains me….again about how HE is impacted. Not just that they are suffering, but their suffering pains ME.

The media has been absolutely disgraceful in its handling of this. From day one all they cared about was having a story. They don't care about the truth or right or wrong. They have no respect for the dignity of the people involved. A young woman had died and they needed a villain. My silence only fuelled peoples' imagination, and the media did everything they could to exploit that, including lying and misleading. They did everything they could to establish me as an evil monster, a portrayal which could not be further from the truth.


BBM – not entirely a biggie and does seem logical to a sense if he did feel victimised by the press, but he is creating an ‘I am the victim’ narrative.

My night with Warriena was intended to be relaxed and fun. She was on holidays and we decided to meet up for drinks after matching and chatting on Tinder. At first we got along great but as the night continued her behaviour became strange and she became increasingly aggressive. I'm not sure whether she found it amusing but it was getting out of hand. She kept hitting me, taunting me, throwing my stuff around and trashing my apartment. For the last couple of hours with her most of my efforts were spent trying to placate her in the hope that she would calm down. I have always been happy to have girls stay overnight but eventually her behaviour became too overbearing and I decided I wanted her to leave. I tried to make her leave but instead of leaving she grabbed a nearby metal object and tried to swing it at me. This is where the alleged “choking” sounds began. I never deliberately choked her or put my hands around her neck, all I did was try to remove the weapon from her. If I wanted to choke her out then it probably wouldn't have been hard, but I did not do that as I did not want to hurt her. A less forgiving man could have quite conceivably exercised less restraint and retaliated violently. I did what I did to prevent further physical conflict and de-escalate the situation as best as I could.


BBM – I believe this was a very purposeful choice of words – ‘my night with Warriena’ – personalise her, make it appear I saw her as the person she was.

BBM – dramatisation (‘trashing’)

BBM – ‘most of my efforts’ – narrative suggesting his actions were only every intended to/were helpful to the situation that was unfolding

BBM – ‘I have always been happy to have girls stay overnight…..’ – he is the decision-maker, I decide when girls can stay and I decide when they must leave. Also a slight touch of narcissism – i.e. girls would WANT to stay with me, but it will ultimately be my decision whether they do.

BBM – ‘nearby metal object’ – odd shift from detailed, specific use of language to a broad description – distancing IMO (why?)

BBM – ‘all I did was try to remove the weapon from her’ – HOW? Another example of a shift from use of specific language to broad – distancing

BBM – ‘if I wanted to choke her out…..’ – narcissistic tendencies and demonstrative way of describing his capacity and capability of being in control

BBM – ‘but I did not do that as I did not want to hurt her. A less forgiving man ….’ – IMO he is adding to the narrative that he is a man totally in control at all times, and he can choose his actions thoughtfully and consciously. But the biggie here…’a less forgiving man’…comparing himself to other men, he is dominant (alpha male language). THEY wouldn’t have handled her, but I did, whilst retaining my cool and staying in control.

The “bad girl” comment was me frustratingly trying to tell her that I already tried to make her leave in response to her claiming she wanted to go home. In the heat of the moment and given the fact that I had been drinking all night, eloquence was not my first priority.

BBM – ‘frustratingly’ – reemphasising that Warriena was testing his perceived sense of control of the situation (and maybe of her).

BBM – ‘eloquence was not my first priority’ – IMO an attempt at wit – an interesting choice of words, bit of an intellectual undertone.

The struggle took place about 2-3 metres away from the rear glass doors that lead to my balcony. My front door was about 10m away, and has an automatic closer and lock which I would have had to flick then hold open while trying to force her out. This would have been much more difficult and wasn't really an option. Putting her outdoors would have meant I could separate her from me and keep an eye on her through the glass doors until she either calmed down or I called someone like security or police to take her away. Never in my wildest imagination did I expect what happened next.

BBM – ‘and keep an eye on her’ – I am not sure what to make of this but it is significant. Is he saying that he did keep an eye on her, thereby seeing her go over, or is he attempting to show that he had care and due regard for her and isolating her on the balcony didn’t mean he wasn’t still looking out for her wellbeing.

BBM – ‘never in my wildest imagination’ – adding to the narrative that what happened next was totally unexpected, unbelievable

My balcony was an outdoor living area in itself and a defining feature of the apartment, about 3.5x5.5m in size with spectacular views. It was not small or claustrophobic nor was it inherently dangerous. I have had countless guests in that apartment and previous high rise apartments who I have enjoyed relaxing with out on the balcony. Here are a couple of pictures of my apartment and outdoor area:


BBM – ‘defining feature of the apartment….’ – reads like a real estate ad. IMO he is taking the opportunity to embrace his sense of achievement, show off his worth. Brings to mind the peacock….

BBM – ‘nor was it inherently dangerous…’ – well this one jumped out. He has stated that the APARTMENT was not inherently dangerous. IMO it is what is NOT said here. Well, the apartment wasn’t dangerous in and of itself, but…..


After shutting the door I turned my back and retreated, and literally about 10 seconds later when I turned around and looked through the glass I only briefly for a fraction of a second saw Warriena on the other side of the railing before she disappeared out of view. She never tried to get back in, bang on the door or even cry out to me or anyone else. She climbed over without any warning. I was too far away to react. At the time I couldn't tell if she had fallen or climbed down to another floor. All I knew was that she was no longer there. How could anybody possibly expect someone to fall to their death within seconds of being on a balcony without any warning? It is not as if I locked her there and left her for hours. I was in disbelief.


BBM – ‘after shutting the door I turned my back….about 10 seconds later when I turned around..’ – INTERESTING! So earlier he stated how his intention was to keep an eye on her, now he states that that was in fact incorrect. IMO if he was already thinking that he might need to keep an eye on her (was worried about her state, etc) would he not think that those first few seconds/minutes may be a crucial time to do just that, keep an eye on her?
BBM - ‘I only briefly for a fraction of a second..’ – why not just say briefly OR fraction of a second? IMO he is adding to the narrative that in that moment he was helpless, there was no chance he could have prevented what was unfolding.

BBM – ‘She never tried to get back in, bank on the door or even cry out to me or anyone else’ – Shifting the blame – she should have done more to keep herself safe on the balcony. (Keep in mind the reference to crying out – she had just spent how long crying out before he shut that door, and we have been provided evidence that she did cry out for help)

BBM – ‘At the time I couldn’t tell if she had fallen or climbed down to another floor’. VERY INTERESTING!
Andsee below BBM – ‘in case she had fallen and someone saw me standing near the edge’ – so his immediate response to Warriena disappearing was self-concern and self-preservation. I won’t go any further there or I will say something I shouldn’t…

Trying to keep my composure as much as possible I quickly realised that it would be extremely foolish to go back out on the balcony in case she had indeed fallen and someone saw me standing near the edge. The only sensible thing I could think to do at the time was call my lawyer, who would know what to do. Of course, the call didn't go through.


BBM – ‘of course, the call didn’t go through’ – IMO he is showing frustration, exasperation, that his lawyer didn’t answer. Narcissism – that his lawyer didn’t answer HIS call hints at incompetence

I did not “flee” the scene as it has been claimed. I went downstairs to see if I could find out what happened. When I reached the lobby I saw flashing emergency lights coming from outside. At this point it dawned on me that something serious had happened. I was terrified, exhausted, intoxicated, and quite disorientated and all I wanted to do was get advice. I knew if I walked into police I could have been held under suspicion without legal representation, a situation nobody would want to be in. I resorted to leaving the building and calling my Dad.

It's easy for readers to say what they would have done given hindsight, but it is impossible to know how you would react if you weren't there.

While I was waiting to meet my Dad I bought a slice of pizza to curb my hunger and anxiety. It was the most convenient thing I could find at that hour. Anyone familiar with the area will know that there are pizza venues that sell slices over the counter on every corner. The suggestion that I casually or leisurely indulged in a meal is absolutely outrageous. I was anything but casual. I had to eat because I was hungry, anxious, and intoxicated, and a slice of pizza was the easiest meal I could find.

As soon as I was able to obtain legal advice and representation I presented myself to the police who examined me later that day. I didn't go home, I didn't sleep, I didn't even shower until that evening when I was released. That night, the police seized my phone and my parents' phones, where they found the recording. While I did not expect them to seize it, it is completely untrue that I tried to delete it, as it proved what happened.


BBM – ‘I didn’t go home, I didn’t sleep…..’ – adding to the narrative of his suffering – reminding the reader that he experienced adverse consequences because of what happened

By friday night, the media frenzy was in full swing, and they had already picked me as the villain.

Over the next week I was overwhelmed with attacks and accusations on all fronts. I was extremely distressed about Warriena's death while facing ruthless media accusations, lies, defamation and character assassination all while my hands were tied in my attempt to remain silent. Everything I said was twisted against me.

One week later I was awoken by detectives while I was asleep at my parents' home, arrested and charged with murder. I was shocked. Without trial I was sent to prison where I had to stay while refusing to discuss my matter and being subject to threats, persistent questions and suspicion from other inmates, and eventually physical assault (being punched in the face for refusing to talk) for at least two weeks until my initial bail hearing where the police version of the transcript, and the admission that I was not on the balcony finally emerged. The hearing was adjourned and I spent a total of a bit over 3 months in custody until I was, thankfully, granted bail. The waiting, not knowing, and the prospect of spending the next 2-3 years in jail for something I did not do and which I would never dream of, was the most stressful period I have been through. I suffered almost daily headaches, anxiety, and insomnia.

BBM – more specific examples of the suffering he is experiencing. In fact, the whole paragraph is seeking sympathy/empathy. Not entirely unexpected if someone was trying to show themselves in a better light, but just overkill. SO MUCH DETAIL compared to how much of this statement is about the victim, Warriena (regardless of his role/or lack of in her death)

Being granted bail was an enormous relief, but I am facing a difficult road ahead. I have numerous restrictions, reporting conditions, and a 9pm-5am curfew.

Not only have the facts been grossly misrepresented, the media has also vilified me to the point that my character and image has been destroyed beyond repair. Even many of those level headed enough to look objectively at the facts and understand that I am innocent still succumb to the media portrayal of me as a creepy, disrespectful, or otherwise unsavoury character. I have read so many things that I can't believe are supposedly about me. I have read that I have followed girls to their cars at night, or that I hung around in clubs preying on drunk girls while sober myself - things which are completely untrue. I have read that I used a telescope and a drone to spy on girls. I owned a telescope and a $100 drone which I occasionally used not to spy on anyone, but for simple leisure purposes. I have lived in high rises with spectacular views so naturally I bought a telescope. It's no different to owning a pair of binoculars.

BBM – ‘but I am facing a difficult road ahead’. Immediately brought back memories of GBC – ‘I was hurt a little bit but I’m ok’. Tostee uses more direct language in seeking sympathy than GBC in these statements, but they are ultimately seeking the same thing – sympathy.
The rest of the above paragraph is odd – lots of examples of what he ISN’T, and very much a narrative of a misunderstood person. Yet if this paragraph was held up against his social media posts, it would be like they were describing two totally different people. And the author of both this statement and the social media posts are the same person.

(continued in next post)

It has been claimed that I was on Tinder “looking for love” the night after Warriena died – another vicious lie. I downloaded the app on a replacement phone in order to deactivate my account. I did not speak to anybody on Tinder after Warriena's death, and the last thing on my mind was finding a date. I did not go out to socialise even once in that week following.


BBM – Another interesting statement – social norms dictate that it would not be expected that he would go out to socialise after Warriena’s death. But the limiting time period is very odd – 1 week?

The media has fabricated stories about me having cameras to film “homemade *advertiser censored*" – a lie which was confirmed by the head detective to be “outrageous”. Seehttp://www.goldcoastbulletin.com.au/...-1227022231772

I had two security cameras in my previous apartment (one looking at the front door and one looking at the living room) which were solely for security purposes, and came in handy for example when I was able to retrieve my wallet from a girl who stole it.

I regularly made audio recordings of my drunk nights on the town in case something happened. I kept them for myself but didn't need to listen to them 99% of the time. It's so easy to do using a smartphone and comes at such a small cost, and sometimes the recordings have been invaluable.


BBM – 2 things from this paragraph. It hints at living ‘after the moment’ rather than ‘in the moment’. Reflecting back on his experiences and (mis)adventures. Suggesting insight would only come by self-analysis after the fact. And this analysis is supported by his social media posts seeking input from others to help him understand his experiences.

2[SUP]nd[/SUP] thing – the last sentence seems to speak very directly to the reader – why WOULDN’T you be doing this too?
I may have my eccentricities, and I may have had my fair share of drunk nights out on the town. Nobody who knows me would agree with the media's portrayal of me or describe me as a bad or violent person.

BBM – this is a very certain statement to make. Nobody WHO KNOWS ME. Maybe an unconscious recognition that some may agree with the media’s portrayal or describe him as bad/violent, BUT THEY DON’T KNOW ME.

Most of my posts on here, especially those detailing my Tinder interactions, have been for entertainment purposes and do not truly represent who I am, so it is massively unfair for the media to paint a picture of me based on a few of the 5000+ posts they have carefully picked.

BBM – whether for entertainment purposes or not, his social media posts were, in his own words, accounts of his life. But he is saying they don’t TRULY represent who he is. So are they lies, half-truths, or full-truths but just not representative of the kind of person he is? Given the amount of time he invested on social media (at his own admission), that is a lot of misrepresentation. Yes, there are lots of people that misrepresent themselves on social media. But what I am not clear on is he admitting he lied in his forum posts, or did he tell the truth but the PURPOSE was for entertainment only? Very confusing…

I have had minor encounters with the law in the past, including throwing an egg at someone, being involved in a small homemade fake ID racket among me and my friends when we were 18 and a few drink driving incidents. I'm not defending these actions but they were not of a malicious nature, and I am currently undergoing treatment for my binge drinking issues. It has been reported that I supposedly assaulted and abused a police officer earlier in the year – also a fabrication. The charge was obstruct police and public nuisance for failing to withdraw $10 quickly enough to pay for a rickshaw. I actually had my phone recording during this incident too – have a listen for yourself.

BBM – the first sentence – downplays the more serious charges he has faced by using seemingly minor incidents via deflection. IMO painting the picture that yes, he has been in trouble previously, but nothing serious, nothing to see here.



Currently I am living at my parents' home, settling in. Everything has changed profoundly and I have a long road ahead of me.

I know my lawyers might crucify me for writing this but I feel that I needed to speak out as I have had no voice so far and have sustained so much abuse having my hands tied. I am not afraid of the truth. I know I am innocent, I will be fighting the charge and I want to thank those who have understood and supported me. I look forward to this matter being resolved so that everyone involved can achieve closure.

BBM – another reference to the negative consequences HE is experiencing. No reference to his parents who have provided a home for him to live in, and no further reference to Warriena and her loved ones.
Gable
 
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