Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sept 2014 - #25

[louisepiglet]

I noticed that a Kendall local who had been quoted several times in MSM about the events around the day WT had disappeared had inquired on facebook about how to help in the search for another male toddler the year before WT went missing. Although that child was found 15 hours after he went missing, I thought it should be looked at to see if there are any similarities to the cases to see if there might be a connection as the disappearances were only 18km apart and one of the search sites for WT, Middle Brother State Forest, lies between the 2 disappearance sites. My thinking is, has there been any previous cases in the area in recent times where a child has gone missing? Any information about Tyler's "wandering off" might give an indication of what might have happened to WT. In Tyler's case from what I understand, a ground search, Polair and dogs could not locate him by sunset the day he went missing, police called the search off til the next day however volunteers persisted and found him just after 1 am, soaking wet, covered from head to toe in cuts from scrub and very shaken up. From comments from his mother and in articles it was wondered if he would have lasted if people hadn't of kept looking. I am exploring if there are similarities in the wandering off theory and also the opportunistic abduction theory.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...sh-into-thin-air/story-e6frg6z6-1227308929078
How could toddler William Tyrrell simply vanish into thin air?

If someone took William, it is unlikely to have been their first offence, says Dr Michael Diamond, a forensic psychiatrist and criminal profiler. “You don’t just do this sort of crime for the first time,” he says. “You would have to overcome other experiential things that confront you if you are going to do something of that magnitude. Is it somebody who has access to a child, and thought about it and not done it because their contact is too obvious, and so it has been
a rehearsed and lived-in fantasy without the terrible outcome?” Diamond asks.

The above quote and quotes from Dr Sarah Yule make me wonder if WT's disappearance was a local and if Tyler Kennedy may have been a practice run. MOO

Great sleuthing

 

[Bohemian]

Can anyone remember if Azaria Chamberlain's bones were ever found after she was taken by a dingo?
I should imagine there are dingos roaming around that huge dense bushland surrounding fgm's property.
I wonder if William did wander into the bushland and got lost and maybe was dragged and taken by a dingo.
A friend of mine studies dingos and he has spotted some hanging around bushland that adjoins his property in a built up area in Nambour Qld...True story.

No Azaria's remains were never found. From memory, just items of her bloodstained clothing were discovered, neatly folded at the base of Uluru, some time after her disappearance.

Not sure about the chances of him being dragged away but it's possible that William's remains could have been scattered by dingo/domestic dog hybrids and/or other carnivores during the past two years or so.

 

[Bohemian]

I was wondering what would realistically happen to a preschooler's body if they were to die in the forest there. Would animals ravage it? Would it just decompose naturally? Would they be able to tell what had happened to him?

Yes, a child's remains would be scavenged by wildlife as well as going through the stages of decomposition. If there were signs of trauma, it would be possible to put together a theory as to how a child died.

 

[Bohemian]

Great sleuthing

Yes, a round of applause for the frogster. You might not say much but when you do you really hit the nail very squarely on the head.

 

[sosocurious]

was this other little boy tyler found on the mechanics property at 92 wharf rd johns river?
theres a big area of swampy land there, just looking at this because its quite similar to williams disappearance
https://www.domain.com.au/property-profile/92-wharf-road-johns-river-nsw-2443

A resident described the bushland as "hard searching area, because it's real thick", while the Johns River is a mere 100m from the workshop.
Recently by-passed by the new freeway, Johns River is sleepy township that sits on the edge of the 1300-hectare Johns River State Forest.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...e/news-story/45aa26e97732bdc8466eda2d715af18b

Just a 100 m from the river.
That's if you can believe all you read.

 

[bearbear]

A resident described the bushland as "hard searching area, because it's real thick", while the Johns River is a mere 100m from the workshop.
Recently by-passed by the new freeway, Johns River is sleepy township that sits on the edge of the 1300-hectare Johns River State Forest.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...e/news-story/45aa26e97732bdc8466eda2d715af18b

Just a 100 m from the river.
That's if you can believe all you read.

ok thanks, so lucky he was found alive, poor little boy must have been terrified! i read he was found by a teenage boy
police had been advised to call off the search until next day, for safety reasons, so luckily the volunteer searchers continued!
it would be interesting to know if any other young children have "disappeared" into the dense bushland around these areas within the last few years, the area seems rife with paedophiles and an ideal hunting ground?

 

[tiddles24]

Something that has stuck in the back of my mind from very early on in the threads here.

A truck driver stopped at a local servo....said he had called 000 on the first day because he saw a car on the side of a road and a "large woman acting suspiciously" and wondered if others had seen a car near or on a turn-off to MIDDLE BROTHER STATE FOREST....The car had "visible damage" to a bumper or its lights....could have happened while reversing hard on bush tracks.

I do remember police mentioning to be on the lookout for any car parts that may have come off a vehicle on the bush tracks around that area.

If William was taken from the back of fgm's home the abductor could have just picked him up, put him in the car and driven the back way along the bush tracks and would have been missed by all the road blocks and all the other searches...MOO

 

[sosocurious]

ok thanks, so lucky he was found alive, poor little boy must have been terrified! i read he was found by a teenage boy
police had been advised to call off the search until next day, for safety reasons, so luckily the volunteer searchers continued!
it would be interesting to know if any other young children have "disappeared" into the dense bushland around these areas within the last few years, the area seems rife with paedophiles and an ideal hunting ground?

It would be very interesting to know bear.
It seems very odd that a search for a little bloke would cease overnight and for safety reasons...what
I am not sure about the 100m to the Johns river...haha
Maybe the Stewarts River

 

[ozazure]

Something that has stuck in the back of my mind from very early on in the threads here.

A truck driver stopped at a local servo....said he had called 000 on the first day because he saw a car on the side of a road and a "large woman acting suspiciously" and wondered if others had seen a car near or on a turn-off to MIDDLE BROTHER STATE FOREST....The car had "visible damage" to a bumper or its lights....could have happened while reversing hard on bush tracks.

I do remember police mentioning to be on the lookout for any car parts that may have come off a vehicle on the bush tracks around that area.

If William was taken from the back of fgm's home the abductor could have just picked him up, put him in the car and driven the back way along the bush tracks and would have been missed by all the road blocks and all the other searches...MOO

Yes if you are trying to rapidly do a u-turn on a gravel road lined by trees, you might over accelerate and and hit a tree ... we drive offroad on a property in a forest and the trees never look much worse for wear after a bump so it could be overlooked in a search unless it was by someone particularly cluey like an Aboriginal tracker.

Speaking of which, I just googled to see if they used the expertise of such a person. Jake Cassar, would be interested to hear his thoughts.

 

[tiddles24]

I still get a feeling that the foster family were followed from Sydney to Kendall.

Who knows, perhaps someone DID have an inkling that this is where William would be on that precise date 12/9/2014.
Perhaps the house where the foster family lived in Sydney was not in an environment from which an abduction would have been feasible.

Perhaps it was just a matter of time to lay in wait for the next time the foster family went up to Kendall and sitting there waiting for the kids to start running around the house..MOO

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I still get a feeling that the foster family were followed from Sydney to Kendall.

Who knows, perhaps someone DID have an inkling that this is where William would be on that precise date 12/9/2014.
Perhaps the house where the foster family lived in Sydney was not in an environment from which an abduction would have been feasible.

Perhaps it was just a matter of time to lay in wait for the next time the foster family went up to Kendall and sitting there waiting for the kids to start running around the house..MOO

2 cars for abducting 2 children? :thinking:

 

[Warshawski]

Something that has stuck in the back of my mind from very early on in the threads here.

A truck driver stopped at a local servo....said he had called 000 on the first day because he saw a car on the side of a road and a "large woman acting suspiciously" and wondered if others had seen a car near or on a turn-off to MIDDLE BROTHER STATE FOREST....The car had "visible damage" to a bumper or its lights....could have happened while reversing hard on bush tracks.

I do remember police mentioning to be on the lookout for any car parts that may have come off a vehicle on the bush tracks around that area.

If William was taken from the back of fgm's home the abductor could have just picked him up, put him in the car and driven the back way along the bush tracks and would have been missed by all the road blocks and all the other searches...MOO

I keep thinking about this too Tiddles...and even though we haven't heard details of the car other than the damage it displayed, I am sure a truckie would have been right on to colour, make & model of that vehicle and would have given all those details in his report ( I just hope it as thoroughly followed up & investigated.) BTW, how would ou physically describe KL ?

 

[Bohemian]

I keep thinking about this too Tiddles...and even though we haven't heard details of the car other than the damage it displayed, I am sure a truckie would have been right on to colour, make & model of that vehicle and would have given all those details in his report ( I just hope it as thoroughly followed up & investigated.) BTW, how would ou physically describe KL?

Exactly IYKWIM

 

[tiddles24]

Sorry about all the posts, folks...just cant get Willliam off my mind and have done many rounds in my head > lost in the bush > abduction by someone known > abduction by someone unknown etc. which brings me back to two key concepts LOCAL and ABDUCTION.

I do know that some paedophiles or abductors etc. start SOMEWHERE ONE DAY...It may well not have been a known sex offender...it may well have been someone who has never done anything like this before...it may have been someone who appears perfectly "normal" to everyone and has never had to be suspected by anyone...maybe some fresh bizarrely coincidental set of circumstances and opportunity that has enabled someone to slip through this "tangled web" somehow.

William could have already been "spirited away" by a person and whoever did this would not necessarily have been able to preempt what immediate actions would occur upon him being noticed missing by his family.

It's something about the location...something about him being at Kendall at that particular moment in time.

Could William have been hiding in dad's car when he went to make that facetime call and got out of the car when noone was looking and got lost at that point?

William may have been watched from an adjoining property and someone from somehere could have called him over and lured him into a house or into the confines of another property...I just feel that a small child in that geographical location could disappear from view more swiftly that way than by means of bundling him into a car.

I might add that something that did surprise me was to hear how many locals were on the scene so quickly searching...it was a Friday and it was not yet school holidays...40 houses in the street...are many of these people normally home during the day?

 

[bearbear]

i cant find the newspaper article only this mention of it on this crime discussion site......

There was a comment that someone talked to an interstate truck driver at a servo who said he saw "a large woman acting suspiciously" by a car on the side of the road the first day. He reckoned he called 000 but they weren't interested because they were sure William just wandered off. I hope the guy's not in W.A or something now with no idea that now they do want reports of suspicious activity.......

http://mydeathspace.com/vb/showthre...ma-s-Front-Verandah-Mid-North-Coast-NSW/page2

 

[bearbear]

not really relevant here, but this is a repeat screening on abctv now about foster homes and how much money companies are making from fostering
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2016/11/14/4572365.htm

 

[Warshawski]

Sorry about all the posts, folks...just cant get Willliam off my mind and have done many rounds in my head > lost in the bush > abduction by someone known > abduction by someone unknown etc. which brings me back to two key concepts LOCAL and ABDUCTION.

I do know that some paedophiles or abductors etc. start SOMEWHERE ONE DAY...It may well not have been a known sex offender...it may well have been someone who has never done anything like this before...it may have been someone who appears perfectly "normal" to everyone and has never had to be suspected by anyone...maybe some fresh bizarrely coincidental set of circumstances and opportunity that has enabled someone to slip through this "tangled web" somehow.

William could have already been "spirited away" by a person and whoever did this would not necessarily have been able to preempt what immediate actions would occur upon him being noticed missing by his family.

It's something about the location...something about him being at Kendall at that particular moment in time.

Could William have been hiding in dad's car when he went to make that facetime call and got out of the car when noone was looking and got lost at that point?

William may have been watched from an adjoining property and someone from somehere could have called him over and lured him into a house or into the confines of another property...I just feel that a small child in that geographical location could disappear from view more swiftly that way than by means of bundling him into a car.

I might add that something that did surprise me was to hear how many locals were on the scene so quickly searching...it was a Friday and it was not yet school holidays...40 houses in the street...are many of these people normally home during the day?

I just thought perhaps a lot of retirees, also this news would travel fast...IMO, there are 2 types of people in the world, those who want to help & nuture kids, and those who don't belong here

 

[Wexford]

I keep thinking about this too Tiddles...and even though we haven't heard details of the car other than the damage it displayed, I am sure a truckie would have been right on to colour, make & model of that vehicle and would have given all those details in his report ( I just hope it as thoroughly followed up & investigated.) BTW, how would ou physically describe KL ?

BBM
Or possibly MS, or DJ.....not NC though. I guess it depends on your definition of large. Some would call large a person of big stature whereas some might say large rather than chubby or overweight.

 

[ozazure]

I still get a feeling that the foster family were followed from Sydney to Kendall.

Who knows, perhaps someone DID have an inkling that this is where William would be on that precise date 12/9/2014.
Perhaps the house where the foster family lived in Sydney was not in an environment from which an abduction would have been feasible.

Perhaps it was just a matter of time to lay in wait for the next time the foster family went up to Kendall and sitting there waiting for the kids to start running around the house..MOO

This seems pretty likely to me as well. Like people who are followed home after they withdraw money at an ATM or via EFTPOS at the shops, you and your money are the target, the perp is looking for the most favourable spot, away from witnesses, but when you don't have a car or house door between you and them.

There is an excellent chance that William was the least supervised in Kendall than anywhere else. The family home may be fenced in and they played only in the backyard. CCTV around. When they took them shopping or to McDonalds they keep a close eye on the kids, there are witnesses, CCTV, traffic etc to contend with. Daycare is locked down. Scooping him or his sister or both from playing outside or even getting into the Kendall house with the open gardens and places to hide vehicles and lack of witnesses is way more preferable.

It seems more probable to me that intent took the perp to the perfect spot, rather than the perfect spot creating the intent.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

This seems pretty likely to me as well. Like people who are followed home after they withdraw money at an ATM or via EFTPOS at the shops, you and your money are the target, the perp is looking for the most favourable spot, away from witnesses, but when you don't have a car or house door between you and them.

There is an excellent chance that William was the least supervised in Kendall than anywhere else. The family home may be fenced in and they played only in the backyard. CCTV around. When they took them shopping or to McDonalds they keep a close eye on the kids, there are witnesses, CCTV, traffic etc to contend with. Daycare is locked down. Scooping him or his sister or both from playing outside or even getting into the Kendall house with the open gardens and places to hide vehicles and lack of witnesses is way more preferable.

It seems more probable to me that intent took the perp to the perfect spot, rather than the perfect spot creating the intent.

I could even imagine WT's parents were warned before. When WT's FF returned from near Kew he immediately was very very frightened and weeping searched for William, not only then but for days and in the neighbourhood again and again. For me this points to his shock maybe to have been warned and now indeed found the little boy abducted. He couldn't believe it and he obviously wouldn't believe it. - IMO My feeling only.