Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #55

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Blues Clues said:
BBM

FFC saw the cars at approximately 7.30am and noticed they were still there around 9 or was it 9.30am.
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We don’t have info yet on how Ray Porter got to his dialysis appointment. If it was his car out the front of FGM’s, I guess it’s possible someone else borrowed his car? I’ve always thought it was bizarre that the owners of those cars never came forward.
 
Tinker Taylor said:
What about "red light" cameras? Maybe they are too recent?
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Tinker Taylor,

Do you mean that maybe Ray's car was snapped by red-light speed cameras instead of point-to-points? Maybe.

But one photo of Ray's car (from Daily Mail Australia) says in the top-left corner, under IR Image, "Location Pacific Highway Kew":

image.jpeg

There might once have been traffic-light cameras in Kew before the highway bypass, but now (at least according to NSW Speed Camera Locations - Google My Maps), there's only one red-light speed camera in the whole district and it's not in Kew or on the highway: see the camera symbol partly obscurring "Port Macquarie" on this map from an earlier post:

image.jpeg

It depends what the highway was like in 2014 though, I guess.
 
Tim N said:
if you read through this, the McCann abduction and the Beaumonts its disturbing how many 'like' people are living amongst us.
And in particular this group are very dangerous because they know each other and share their sicko interests.
Wiki state that 5% of the male adult population are pedophiles. Do the math..that's every 100 houses or so...1 per street almost.
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Hey Tim, as much as I agree with your comments, I cant’t bring myself to ‘like’ - as I’m sure you appreciate.

I’m grateful to hear more regularly of the Arrests in Aus of these deviates - I’m just waiting for the time when our Governing bodies get real in punishment / non-tolerance / for that matter, noticing & medically helping those pre-despised....

Again, IMO ... fixing stuff needs to start at Grass Roots - hope we eventually get a Gov. that understands that & strives to achieve that.

My heart breaks for all those who grieve by the hands of those should not have that freedom. ... .. and all those who do not yet have Answers. .. and I pray for those answers & for your peace. Grief is personal & individual. Bless You ..
 
Loxoli said:
We don’t have info yet on how Ray Porter got to his dialysis appointment. If it was his car out the front of FGM’s, I guess it’s possible someone else borrowed his car? I’ve always thought it was bizarre that the owners of those cars never came forward.
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The existence of those two cars has never been able to be confirmed by police, nor corroborated with anyone else also seeing them - which could explain why no one ever came forward?

If Ray Porter loaned his vehicle to someone else that day while he underwent hours of dialysis, the vehicle wasn't seen on camera. I wonder how many vehicles, if any, *were* seen on camera in the area that day, which have NOT yet been identified and for which no owner has turned up to say they were driving in the area? One might hope that there would be few if any, and of those, that police might broadcast the photos of those vehicles (but maybe about 5.5 years ago would have been best!)?
 
stormbird said:
Tinker Taylor,

Do you mean that maybe Ray's car was snapped by red-light speed cameras instead of point-to-points? Maybe.

But one photo of Ray's car (from Daily Mail Australia) says in the top-left corner, under IR Image, "Location Pacific Highway Kew":

View attachment 254992

There might once have been traffic-light cameras in Kew before the highway bypass, but now (at least according to NSW Speed Camera Locations - Google My Maps), there's only one red-light speed camera in the whole district and it's not in Kew or on the highway: see the camera symbol partly obscurring "Port Macquarie" on this map from an earlier post:

View attachment 254993

It depends what the highway was like in 2014 though, I guess.
Click to expand...


I wonder how many photos the camera takes as the car passes and if there is a photo that shows the driver.
 
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deugirtni said:
The existence of those two cars has never been able to be confirmed by police, nor corroborated with anyone else also seeing them - which could explain why no one ever came forward?

If Ray Porter loaned his vehicle to someone else that day while he underwent hours of dialysis, the vehicle wasn't seen on camera. I wonder how many vehicles, if any, *were* seen on camera in the area that day, which have NOT yet been identified and for which no owner has turned up to say they were driving in the area? One might hope that there would be few if any, and of those, that police might broadcast the photos of those vehicles (but maybe about 5.5 years ago would have been best!)?
Click to expand...


BBM: I believe the FM did see those cars that fateful morning .

After seeing & hearing her evidence she was very certain. I do believe her.

I don't think anyone will ever come forward for a reason.
 
From William Tyrrell abduction: Probe after dying man's confession | Daily Mail Online

Porter allegedly claimed he picked up William and his mate from behind the Kendall School and then drove the pair north 300 kilometres.

Porter had only ever spoken of two of his friends, one of them being his 'fishing buddy' Frank Abbott, the court heard.

So where does that leave the inquest?? Who actually is Ray Porter's 2nd friend????
Allegedly, we have heard of a "Phil" but nothing else so far......

And when did this alleged drive take place???? The next day???? Or that afternoon after dialysis?? or 2 days later when Porter's car was captured travelling both North and South at Port Macquarie?

Although I don't know how you could hide a child for 2 days when the whole town was searching for him?!

A recent document says in the two days after William vanished, Porter's car was recorded passing the Kew southbound camera on the morning of September 13, 2014, and the north- and south-bound cameras at Port Macquarie, the next day.

An undated police note signed by Detective Senior Constable Ari Barr said: 'Hospital records show that on the 12th September 2014, Porter was at dialysis at Port Macquarie Hospital between 9am and 3pm.

Was Porter dropped off and picked up at the hospital as he had loaned his car that day??

Porter's car wasn't picked up by highway cameras between his Wauchope home and the hospital that critical day. But detectives suggested Porter had likely just used an alternative route, the Oxley Highway, to attend his clinic.

I had though Porter was living as a caretaker of the Kendall Showgrounds in Sept 2014?? No longer in Wauchope??
Happy to be incorrect on that ...

Data and photographs from Roads and Maritime Services cameras indicate that Porter's white stationwagon traveled around the region over several days that month.

And where does this leave Porter's Statement to the Nurse ?? True or false ???

I had hope that this was the "break' that Police needed .......
ALL IMO........

And the revised edition www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8504793/Video-William-Tyrrell-person-Paul-Savage-plucked-secret-camera-tree.html
 
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Blues Clues said:
I wonder how many photos the camera takes as the car passes and if there is a photo that shows the driver.
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I would like to know this too!

I do think the Coroner has released the photo of Ray Porter's car for a reason ....... Perhaps it will jog someone's memory?
Its a shame they have only shown the car from a "head on" angle so far ........ and interestingly they haven't obscured the number plate.....

As Porter only died in 2019, I hope the Police have the car and were able to forensically test it.....
 
Tinker Taylor said:
Wow, he had the camera for 6 weeks!! Then only gave it to them when they came to the house to interview him! No wonder Jubelin was suspicious of him. Good luck with trying to sue the Police for harassment <modsnip>
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Tinker Taylor,

I don't understand why it would be the responsibility of a target person to return a camera when they find it's been spying on them. IMO the police are lucky it was returned in one piece instead of smashed to bits.

How was PS supposed to know the camera belonged to police, by the way? Did it have "NEW SOUTH WALES POLICE FORCE" printed on the side?
 
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stormbird said:
Tinker Taylor,

I don't understand why it would be the responsibility of a target person to return a camera when they find it's been spying on them. IMO the police are lucky it was returned in one piece instead of smashed to bits.

How was PS supposed to know the camera belonged to police, by the way? Did it have "NEW SOUTH WALES POLICE FORCE" printed on the side?
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If he didn't know it belonged to the police, why would he have given it to them when they called to his house? Anyone could have left it there.

Why would he presume he was a "target" if he found it in the bush?

Quote from the article:

"The veteran homicide cop then turned to the pensioner and said: 'OK then, let's talk about the camera'.

'The camera that, uh, I handed to police?' Mr Savage asked.

The pensioner told detectives it had been found by his daughter and he 'thought it was (switched) off'.

Mr Savage said he thought he had kept it inside at his home for about a week and that he had planned to hand it over to police.

The detectives corrected him: it had taken him five weeks to cough it up. He had only surrendered it to officers the next time officers had visited his home.

Mr Savage said: ' I didn't get it any more thought. It's a camera sittin' up in the bush. God knows how ... long it had been there.'

Mr Jubelin said Mr Savage had constantly seen police exploring the bush, and had spoken to officers himself, but he still took the camera down without telling detectives.

'But no, you took the camera off and hung onto it and only gave it back when police were, turned up looking for it.'

Mr Savage replied: 'They didn't turn up looking for it ... he (the police officer) was as surprised as blazers when I gave it to him.

Mr Jubelin accused Mr Savage of being 'flippant' toward the investigation, which Mr Savage denied."
 
drsleuth said:
BBM: I believe the FM did see those cars that fateful morning .

After seeing & hearing her evidence she was very certain. I do believe her.

I don't think anyone will ever come forward for a reason.
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drsleuth,

I accept what you're saying and this is just my opinion: I think it's always possible that FFC and every other witness could be convinced their memory is accurate even when at times it isn't. (I'm not accusing, just suggesting this is always a possibility in testimony about anything.) A faulty recollection wouldn't mean the person is making up a story or constructing a lie, it could just be due to the capacity of brains and memories to sometimes be unreliable without telling us so. My opinion only.
 
stormbird said:
drsleuth,

I accept what you're saying and this is just my opinion: I think it's always possible that FFC and every other witness could be convinced their memory is accurate even when at times it isn't. (I'm not accusing, just suggesting this is always a possibility in testimony about anything.) A faulty recollection wouldn't mean the person is making up a story or constructing a lie, it could just be due to the capacity of brains and memories to sometimes be unreliable without telling us so. My opinion only.
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How does a person remember something that 'wasn't there'? More likely to not remember something that was there. imo

Her memory of those two cars jogged into action within a relatively short time of William going missing.
 
Morrisa said:
Video of William Tyrrell person of interest Paul Savage plucked secret camera from a tree | Daily Mail Online
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Thanks Marissa. .. without a doubt PS is an interesting character & no wonder the Police / Jubelin’s interest.

Also is most interesting to me this statement from later in the article:

An undated police note signed by Detective Senior Constable Ari Barr said: 'Hospital records show that on the 12th September 2014, Porter was at dialysis at Port Macquarie Hospital between 9am and 3pm.

IMO ‘between 9 - 3’ doesn’t cover his whereabouts for all those 6 hours, just the allocated availability.
Dialysis sessions are usually around 4 hrs, some shorter. So plenty of time to meet his mate behind the School early afternoon.
 
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