Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #62

[Green beans]

Regarding the car, Mazda had an upgrade to their software in 2018, for phone connectivity
I wonder if this revealed anything in the FGM car?

Mazda introduces update for older infotainment systems - LeftLaneNews

 

[Mrs G Norris]

I think one reason it was not credible was that , although he said he was absolutely certain it was William in the car in a Spiderman suit, he didn't call and report it for quite awhile. IIRC, he said he expected someone in LE to come and speak to him at some point. But they never did.

He had a female friend who was a police officer, I believe? And he knew where she hung out on some nights, so he called a lounge where her sister-in-law worked, or something like that, -----and he got her on the phone and said tell your sister I have a clue on the chid kidnapping for her.

I can't remember how long it took for him to eventually tell LE about the child in the speeding car---but I think maybe that is why they discounted it. If you really did see a kidnapped child being taken away by a speeding car, wouldn't you call 000 IMMEDIATELY????

I think he imagined the whole thing.

 

[The gavel]

There is no doubt that this investigation has been botched continually. It makes perfect sense that the police would now want everything to be checked off perfectly and fully transparent in front of the media as they zero in to charge and prosecute the murderer, IMO

 

[The gavel]

I don't see any evidence leading me to believe the 'know' anything for sure. They have a working theory based upon speculation. We know that because they have been saying as much. They said their 'theory' is he fell from the balcony. It is a theory, no confession or eye witness to the alleged event.

And they do not 'know' where the remains are. They searched the garage area, the garden, a nearby creek, and some nearby bush area---all based upon speculation of where the FM would hide him if she was the perpetrator. But it is not 100% certain.

The LE recently said specifically that their information is not speculative.

 

[Estelle]

Are you talking about the black eye before the final bio-parent visit? Do you remember at which point we learned about the alleged abuse of FD?

<DBM>

From In October 2015:

The twin cars (I'm going to paraphrase):

The whole time folks lived in Kendall, NEVER had there been cars parked on Ellendale Crescent. It struck her as "out of character" and "didn't make sense." People usually park in driveways. But, since "Kendall's not the city," she disregards the twin cars (she kicks herself for not writing down the number plates).

Later, WT disappears. FFC looked by swing set. Neighbour helped. Then she realised, "He's not on THIS ESTATE, I have to phone the police." (So, she's basically saying she had not gone to the riding school before she called). She modifies WT being gone for 15 - 20 minutes to "a very long time."

She continues to search. She flagged down Officer Chris Ralley in the area of the twin cars after the disappearance as he was driving up Benaroon Dr, not realised that was the area she saw them previously. The night of the sister pickup from airport jogged her memory. "When I remembered walking across the road to see Chris Ralley," that is when she realised those cars weren't there anymore. She then informed the command centre.

So, if I follow, when WT disappeared, she forgot about the twin cars. When she flagged down the officer during the search, she stood in the very area of the twin cars, but it still wasn't dawning on her. So, recalling the detail of flagging down Officer Rally made her recall a detail further back in her memory of noticing the twin cars when opening up the curtains/blinds at 7:30 AM. An inception?

And, yet no mention of the drive to the Riding School. A statement suggesting she remained on the estate pre-000 call.

***SPECULATION***
ETA: I also think accident was more likely, as if it was premeditated, FFC would have ironed out all these details much better beforehand.

BBM 1 No WT had the black eye. I was talking about FD and the recent alleged abuse of her because before that, I thought that MFC was probably innocent and was shocked to hear that he had also been accused of abuse.

BBM 2 FFC has done very well so far for seven years to hoodwink LE and the public as her descriptors are so flowery we get lost in what she is trying to say. It isn't always easy to separate the wheat from the chaff. IMO for her to get away with it for so long, there had to be some element of planning in it.

 

[Blues Clues]

So why hasn't it ever been included in any timelines?

Highly likely it is in the official police statement timeline which the public has never been privy to IMO

 

[bfew]

I just noticed, FF said he got FG the paper from town that day because she had asked him to. But in this photo she is sitting there reading the paper. Might be nothing.
I also compared it to another photo and the person in that chair is in completely different clothes.

It is nothing.
They look like exactly the same clothes to me.
Just the lighting/exposure looks different in the 2 photos.
Are you comparing the photos on a large high resolution monitor?

 

[The gavel]

As we all know, Hans Rupp ordered the searches of Spedding's properties primarily because ...

They had received a report that Spedding's vehicle was seen in the area at the time William disappeared
The record of FM's proven call to Spedding was (inexplicably, at the time) not found in his call log

No Cookies | Daily Telegraph

The sighting was erroneously reported. The witness didn't say they saw S.P's van, that saw a white van. This has been clarified.

The phone was sent to telecommunication experts. It was proven that the call wasn't logged on SP's phone because he was on the phone to somebody else at the time.

<modsnip>

Red herrings everywhere, IMO

 

[Estelle]

*if* the timeline we've been given is correct and *if* FGM and FD were even aware.

If FFC saw William had died from an accident when unsupervised, panicked, chucked him in the boot and then said she was going to drive to look for William, then stopped and placed him in some bracken, returned home, called police - FGM and FD would have been none the wiser.

IMO I have been speculating that FFC could have taken WT for a drive in FGM's car without telling FGM or FD and something happened on the way.

 

[Estelle]

I just noticed, FF said he got FG the paper from town that day because she had asked him to. But in this photo she is sitting there reading the paper. Might be nothing.

I also compared it to another photo and the person in that chair is in completely different clothes.

Good observation!

 

[Vern]

Most parents would have done this. My velcro baby slept next to me for 6 years, haha. The distinction is parent verus foster carer. I re-read our state guidelines last night and they very clearly state "a carer must never" which is why it raises eyebrows. That said, there may be no such rule in NSW.

Interesting; if there were such a rule for fosters, would that have been grounds for removing his sister from the home much sooner than seems to have occurred?

 

[Trmtrm2]

Are you talking about the black eye before the final bio-parent visit? Do you remember at which point we learned about the alleged abuse of FD?

<DBM>

From In October 2015:

The twin cars (I'm going to paraphrase):

The whole time folks lived in Kendall, NEVER had there been cars parked on Ellendale Crescent. It struck her as "out of character" and "didn't make sense." People usually park in driveways. But, since "Kendall's not the city," she disregards the twin cars (she kicks herself for not writing down the number plates).

Later, WT disappears. FFC looked by swing set. Neighbour helped. Then she realised, "He's not on THIS ESTATE, I have to phone the police." (So, she's basically saying she had not gone to the riding school before she called). She modifies WT being gone for 15 - 20 minutes to "a very long time."

She continues to search. She flagged down Officer Chris Ralley in the area of the twin cars after the disappearance as he was driving up Benaroon Dr, not realised that was the area she saw them previously. The night of the sister pickup from airport jogged her memory. "When I remembered walking across the road to see Chris Ralley," that is when she realised those cars weren't there anymore. She then informed the command centre.

So, if I follow, when WT disappeared, she forgot about the twin cars. When she flagged down the officer during the search, she stood in the very area of the twin cars, but it still wasn't dawning on her. So, recalling the detail of flagging down Officer Rally made her recall a detail further back in her memory of noticing the twin cars when opening up the curtains/blinds at 7:30 AM. An inception?

And, yet no mention of the drive to the Riding School. A statement suggesting she remained on the estate pre-000 call.

***SPECULATION***
ETA: I also think accident was more likely, as if it was premeditated, FFC would have ironed out all these details much better beforehand.

Ellendale Crescent.
The 000 call they asked the Cross st, its Ellendale crescent but she didn't know that she said its her mother's house she wouldn't know she seams to be trying to ask people, basically made a issue of it, I thought it was so odd especially when the 2nd last visit was a street Christmas party her perents lived there for quite some time,

So I just wanted to confirm was the cars that she decided on her drive to Port Macquarie airport were now on the street was in fact on Ellendale Crescent? The cross street that on the 000 she made a big issue of not knowing the name of?

Could this be a tractic that she didn't lie or make anything up, that no cars were on her mother's street but were on the cross street that she has no clue what the name is at a point in time were the children 2nd last visit was on the street for a Christmas st party and her mother is selling so wouldn't they maby hav looked at tiles and might be a time that they would know the side street name

I would love to see this 000 call on one of them crime shows every thing is so sus, you think it was important to say the foster child in my care has disappeared, you think it would be important to say she drove to the pony club and he wasn't there, I think its unusual to mention a frecle when parting the hair unless the child was dead and unidentifiable that they would only be able to identify by a frecle under his hair, if she didn't want the neighbours to know that she is fostering why be worried about that the child is missing the police should of been called before a drive to the pony club, I don't understand why FGM didn't take the initiative to make the 000 and say my daughter is driving to the pony club to look for her foster child that was only meters away

 

[Waverider]

I just noticed, FF said he got FG the paper from town that day because she had asked him to. But in this photo she is sitting there reading the paper. Might be nothing.

I also compared it to another photo and the person in that chair is in completely different clothes.

She is apparently reading an old local paper in the photos..

 

[Tigerlily75]

They may have a witness, but the witness did not see the FM kill him or bury him, apparently. The witness saw something else but we don't know what they are a witness to yet.

They did do similar things on their previous hunches so I don't know why this mission would be any different.

Regarding the last part, it’s a different team and a different lead investigator. That gives me hope they will solve this and that they mean what they say. Laidlaw is described as both accomplished and old school.

William Tyrrell search: The safe pair of hands entrusted with investigation

 

[Tigerlily75]

Listening again to the first 3 mins of attached video clip ( from 2019 ) with CO…
Still find it strange that this account seems to have just faded away…
Also would be quite perplexing to think what it was all about ..if present line of enquiry turns out to have credibility…

A forensic psychologist spoke on this at the inquest: (also spoke about FM and the two cars):

The expert was also questioned about Ronald Chapman’s account of seeing William dressed in a Spider-Man suit being driven past his home on 12 September.

The Kendall resident told the inquest in March 2020 that he was “sure” the boy he saw in the back of a Toyota LandCruiser was William.

Paterson said Chapman’s retelling of the memory changed over time, with an initial mention of a cape not appearing later and the latter accounts told with more confidence and accuracy about key events.

The memory expert said it could be the case Chapman was incorporating “post-event information”, such as news reports, in his memory reconstruction. She said her evidence assumed Chapman and the foster mother were giving accounts in good faith.

“There are ways that people can report information that is not true but they are not lying,” Paterson said.

William Tyrrell's foster mother could have created false memory about parked cars, inquest told

 

[Waverider]

Ellendale Crescent.
The 000 call they asked the Cross st, its Ellendale crescent but she didn't know that she said its her mother's house she wouldn't know she seams to be trying to ask people, basically made a issue of it, I thought it was so odd especially when the 2nd last visit was a street Christmas party her perents lived there for quite some time,

So I just wanted to confirm was the cars that she decided on her drive to Port Macquarie airport were now on the street was in fact on Ellendale Crescent? The cross street that on the 000 she made a big issue of not knowing the name of?

Could this be a tractic that she didn't lie or make anything up, that no cars were on her mother's street but were on the cross street that she has no clue what the name is at a point in time were the children 2nd last visit was on the street for a Christmas st party and her mother is selling so wouldn't they maby hav looked at tiles and might be a time that they would know the side street name

I would love to see this 000 call on one of them crime shows every thing is so sus, you think it was important to say the foster child in my care has disappeared, you think it would be important to say she drove to the pony club and he wasn't there, I think its unusual to mention a frecle when parting the hair unless the child was dead and unidentifiable that they would only be able to identify by a frecle under his hair, if she didn't want the neighbours to know that she is fostering why be worried about that the child is missing the police should of been called before a drive to the pony club, I don't understand why FGM didn't take the initiative to make the 000 and say my daughter is driving to the pony club to look for her foster child that was only meters away

Totally agree. The freckle isn’t a distinguishing feature for the purposes of finding a child who’s wandered off and from a distance would help police differentiating him from other children.

Secondly, you’d mention a drive to the pony club in the 000 call if that had happened. She ONLY mentions having looked up and down benaroon dr.

Thirdly, she essentially waited an hour to call 000 to report a missing 3yo. But initially claimed it was 5mins - maybe 10-15.

 

[Jaded325594]

IMO if the MFC is innocent, and their marriage is not so good now, whether he could be the new witness to protect himself. The only problem I have with this is that he has also allegedly
abused the FD. Maybe that was past abuse and now he has seen the light and come forward.

My ramblimg thoughts.... FFC has been named as the single POI, MFC may or may not have been aware. If he wasn't, considering the super close relationship he had with William, you would expect him to turn on her pretty quickly. It's interesting that they were photographed together last week.

 

[The gavel]

Regarding the last part, it’s a different team and a different lead investigator. That gives me hope they will solve this and that they mean what they say. Laidlaw is described as both accomplished and old school.

William Tyrrell search: The safe pair of hands entrusted with investigation

It seems as though this highly skilled investigator is working from facts only which is why there's progress.

As opposed to Jubelin who went on wild goose chases following the wrong suspects.

I think sometimes people forget that the statements by FM are not facts. If you ignore everything she said including all of the information about where the FD and FGM were at the time, and her timeline, it's easier to see that there was motive, opportunity and 1.5 hours to kill and place a body without any witnesses. At least. IMO

 

[Waverider]

Australia - Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #40

A truck driver said they saw a plump blonde woman standing near a parked car in the relevant location? (This is the second reference to a plump blonde woman, if the account by the man who saw the two cars drive past with William in the back of the first one is credible also).

Who is this lady?

Was FFC ever blonde? Could this be the truck driver that FFC waved to and tried to claim he would think she'd pulled over but she hadn't (pre-empting his version and claiming her head was stuck out of the car). Why was she later seen with William in the back of the car?

I wonder what the FGM looks like?

 

[vatzjr]

How soon after did WT's sister give her first account of events? That day? Days later?

And Nana? That day?

Do we have records of either's first account of that day's events?

<modsnip>