Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #62

[Tigerlily75]

It seems as though this highly skilled investigator is working from facts only which is why there's progress.

As opposed to Jubelin who went on wild goose chases following the wrong suspects.

I think sometimes people forget that the statements by FM are not facts. If you ignore everything she said including all of the information about where the FD and FGM were at the time, and her timeline, it's easier to see that there was motive, opportunity and 1.5 hours to kill and place a body without any witnesses. At least. IMO

BBM

YES

 

[The gavel]

My ramblimg thoughts.... FFC has been named as the single POI, MFC may or may not have been aware. If he wasn't, considering the super close relationship he had with William, you would expect him to turn on her pretty quickly. It's interesting that they were photographed together last week.

If she's been able to manipulate LE, the public, etc. Doesn't seem like a stretch that she has manipulated him also.
IMO he seems very honest in his interviews.

 

[Trmtrm2]

Just having a look at other cases with foster children in NSW

This foster mother name is also suppressed

it appears the foster mother was angry after the nature of the care wasn't what she is hoping for

Im assuming that it is possible for foster mothers to allegedly kill foster children when things aren't going as planned

Foster mum who 'brutally killed infant son' granted bail

When the foster mother took care of the child, she was hoping to have him in a long-term placement, but was angered when she was notified of the “temporary” nature of the placement in the weeks before his death.

 

[Trmtrm2]

How soon after did WT's sister give her first account of events? That day? Days later?

And Nana? That day?

Do we have records of either's first account of that day's events?

I think the account is that the plump blonde woman was in her 20s or 30s, if I'm not mistaken.

Im sure everyones statements were quite a few days later it would be great is someone can list the dates, would be great to hav every different date listed of the foster mothers different statements, im just thinking the guy could of got the description of the driver wrong as they were speeding and he was looking at the child not being in the car seat would be hard to hav gotten every detail correct

 

[Trmtrm2]

Totally agree. The freckle isn’t a distinguishing feature for the purposes of finding a child who’s wandered off and from a distance would help police differentiating him from other children.

Secondly, you’d mention a drive to the pony club in the 000 call if that had happened. She ONLY mentions having looked up and down benaroon dr.

Thirdly, she essentially waited an hour to call 000 to report a missing 3yo. But initially claimed it was 5mins - maybe 10-15.

Im sure the drive to the pony club was before the 000 call can anyone confirm or is it unknown when the pony club drive was

 

[Jaded325594]

Just having a look at other cases with foster children in NSW

This foster mother name is also suppressed

it appears the foster mother was angry after the nature of the care wasn't what she is hoping for

Im assuming that it is possible for foster mothers to allegedly kill foster children when things aren't going as planned

Foster mum who 'brutally killed infant son' granted bail

When the foster mother took care of the child, she was hoping to have him in a long-term placement, but was angered when she was notified of the “temporary” nature of the placement in the weeks before his death.

Oh god. That is horrific.

 

[Lunarmoth]

She was reading an older paper. My mom does that all the time.

Do you have the source that lets us know she was reading an older paper?
I've been looking for a confirmation of that, but I just keep turning up with dead ends outside of these threads. Was it in the inquest that it was mentioned it was an older paper and not that days?

Edit: It's not unusual to read an older paper ofc, but because MFC says he was going to pick one up for her and it is part of his alibi, I've assumed the police have determined that's an older paper in the photo. But just can't find the confirmation anywhere which is frustrating haha

 

[DDDddd]

Totally agree. The freckle isn’t a distinguishing feature for the purposes of finding a child who’s wandered off and from a distance would help police differentiating him from other children.

Secondly, you’d mention a drive to the pony club in the 000 call if that had happened. She ONLY mentions having looked up and down benaroon dr.

Thirdly, she essentially waited an hour to call 000 to report a missing 3yo. But initially claimed it was 5mins - maybe 10-15.

I'm prepared to give some room on the cross street and distinguishing features issues. I've lived in my current house for 5 years and have no idea what the closest cross streets are and would sound like a real numpty in a high pressure situation if asked.

If a police officer asked me for distinguishing features I'd talk freckles on toes or scars on stomachs or stupid things like that, because I'm a literal person and those are the marks that would identify them from other little kids. If they asked what they looked like/what they were wearing I'd give much more useful information (red spiderman suit, blue sandles, dark hair for eg.).

 

[Mrs G Norris]

If she's been able to manipulate LE, the public, etc. Doesn't seem like a stretch that she has manipulated him also.
IMO he seems very honest in his interviews.

If she has done this, then I think he hasn't known, it would explain why the bugs came up clean, because she was lying to him also and keeping up the charade.

 

[Detective Willy]

There was a Daily Mail headline last week about the "96 minutes" that hold the answer to Williams disappearance. I don't understand where they get 96 minutes from?

9.37am famous picture of William in Spiderman outfit on FGM verandah.
10.56am FM call to 000 to report William missing.

This is only 79 minutes and during these 79 minutes the following supposedly happened. Here is my best attempt at a possible timeline:

9.37am famous picture of William in Spiderman outfit on FGM verandah.
William and his sister finish drawing/playing on Verandah. Can we estimate this time as 9.45am?
William puts his shoes on?
William and his sister ride bikes out the front of FGM house on Bennaroon Drive.
William and his sister finish riding bikes and return to house. Can we estimate 10.00am?
William was encouraged to climb tree but was scared etc?
William is roaring around the house playing Daddy Tiger jumping out of his skin?
FM makes a cup of tea and suddenly realises that she cant hear William any more.
FM and FGM look for William in the yard and cant find him.
FM gets into FGM car and drives down to current search site near riding school. Can we estimate this is at 10.20am?
FM gets back to FGM house at approx. 10.30am? FGM and Williams sister wait at home during FM car search?
FF arrives back at FGM house to discover William missing at approx. 10.35am?
FF, FM and FGM search for William for approx. 20 minutes
10.56am FM call to 000 to report William missing.

William must have been missing for a minimum 30 minutes and a maximum 50-60 minutes when the 000 call is made.

Police must have strong belief that something is suspicious with the drive that FM took in FGM car. Otherwise they believe the window was bigger and something is not right with the timestamp on the camera? If this is the case then the FF leaving house for at least 90 minutes takes on a lot more significance IMO?

Please feel free to correct anything in my timeline if wrong.

 

[Random-me]

Do you have the source that lets us know she was reading an older paper?
I've been looking for a confirmation of that, but I just keep turning up with dead ends outside of these threads. Was it in the inquest that it was mentioned it was an older paper and not that days?

Edit: It's not unusual to read an older paper ofc, but because MFC says he was going to pick one up for her and it is part of his alibi, I've assumed the police have determined that's an older paper in the photo. But just can't find the confirmation anywhere which is frustrating haha

She is reading the local paper they throw on your driveway. He was picking up the big paper

 

[Random-me]

I'm prepared to give some room on the cross street and distinguishing features issues. I've lived in my current house for 5 years and have no idea what the closest cross streets are and would sound like a real numpty in a high pressure situation if asked.

.

im a landmark's person, not street names

 

[Trmtrm2]

There was a Daily Mail headline last week about the "96 minutes" that hold the answer to Williams disappearance. I don't understand where they get 96 minutes from?

9.37am famous picture of William in Spiderman outfit on FGM verandah.
10.56am FM call to 000 to report William missing.

This is only 79 minutes and during these 79 minutes the following supposedly happened. Here is my best attempt at a possible timeline:

9.37am famous picture of William in Spiderman outfit on FGM verandah.
William and his sister finish drawing/playing on Verandah. Can we estimate this time as 9.45am?
William puts his shoes on?
William and his sister ride bikes out the front of FGM house on Bennaroon Drive.
William and his sister finish riding bikes and return to house. Can we estimate 10.00am?
William was encouraged to climb tree but was scared etc?
William is roaring around the house playing Daddy Tiger jumping out of his skin?
FM makes a cup of tea and suddenly realises that she cant hear William any more.
FM and FGM look for William in the yard and cant find him.
FM gets into FGM car and drives down to current search site near riding school. Can we estimate this is at 10.20am?
FM gets back to FGM house at approx. 10.30am? FGM and Williams sister wait at home during FM car search?
FF arrives back at FGM house to discover William missing at approx. 10.35am?
FF, FM and FGM search for William for approx. 20 minutes
10.56am FM call to 000 to report William missing.

William must have been missing for a minimum 30 minutes and a maximum 50-60 minutes when the 000 call is made.

Police must have strong belief that something is suspicious with the drive that FM took in FGM car. Otherwise they believe the window was bigger and something is not right with the timestamp on the camera? If this is the case then the FF leaving house for at least 90 minutes takes on a lot more significance IMO?

Please feel free to correct anything in my timeline if wrong.

Though I would add the cuppa tea was warm after first police arrived i wonder if that mug she said she takes it in was left inside or outdoors

 

[katydid23]

Do you have the source that lets us know she was reading an older paper?
I've been looking for a confirmation of that, but I just keep turning up with dead ends outside of these threads. Was it in the inquest that it was mentioned it was an older paper and not that days?

Edit: It's not unusual to read an older paper ofc, but because MFC says he was going to pick one up for her and it is part of his alibi, I've assumed the police have determined that's an older paper in the photo. But just can't find the confirmation anywhere which is frustrating haha

I only read that on here, someone said it was a different paper--a weekly paper---not the same one that he was buying. But I have no links for confirmation.

 

[Green beans]

POI says “she has nothing to hide” whilst in hiding under DOCS anonymity.
The internet has been wiped of her presence.
she’s been accommodated during court sessions to keep her face / image unknown. FF, foster daughter & other details are still available on the internet in some form, this is a red flag to me. Praying william is found and given love and the dignity he deserves.

 

[iiiii's]

There was a Daily Mail headline last week about the "96 minutes" that hold the answer to Williams disappearance. I don't understand where they get 96 minutes from?

9.37am famous picture of William in Spiderman outfit on FGM verandah.
10.56am FM call to 000 to report William missing.

This is only 79 minutes and during these 79 minutes the following supposedly happened. Here is my best attempt at a possible timeline:

9.37am famous picture of William in Spiderman outfit on FGM verandah.
William and his sister finish drawing/playing on Verandah. Can we estimate this time as 9.45am?
William puts his shoes on?
William and his sister ride bikes out the front of FGM house on Bennaroon Drive.
William and his sister finish riding bikes and return to house. Can we estimate 10.00am?
William was encouraged to climb tree but was scared etc?
William is roaring around the house playing Daddy Tiger jumping out of his skin?
FM makes a cup of tea and suddenly realises that she cant hear William any more.
FM and FGM look for William in the yard and cant find him.
FM gets into FGM car and drives down to current search site near riding school. Can we estimate this is at 10.20am?
FM gets back to FGM house at approx. 10.30am? FGM and Williams sister wait at home during FM car search?
FF arrives back at FGM house to discover William missing at approx. 10.35am?
FF, FM and FGM search for William for approx. 20 minutes
10.56am FM call to 000 to report William missing.

William must have been missing for a minimum 30 minutes and a maximum 50-60 minutes when the 000 call is made.

Police must have strong belief that something is suspicious with the drive that FM took in FGM car. Otherwise they believe the window was bigger and something is not right with the timestamp on the camera? If this is the case then the FF leaving house for at least 90 minutes takes on a lot more significance IMO?

Please feel free to correct anything in my timeline if wrong.

of course i don't know but my guess is that the timeline either end at 10.35am when mFC (because he isn't a POI) returns or 10.40am when FFC 1st makes contact with AMS because she is the 1st point of contact outside of the household, so that would stretch the timeline back to starting at either 8.59 - 9.04 am. MOO

 

[katydid23]

It seems as though this highly skilled investigator is working from facts only which is why there's progress.

As opposed to Jubelin who went on wild goose chases following the wrong suspects.

I think sometimes people forget that the statements by FM are not facts. If you ignore everything she said including all of the information about where the FD and FGM were at the time, and her timeline, it's easier to see that there was motive, opportunity and 1.5 hours to kill and place a body without any witnesses. At least. IMO

What motive did she have to kill a 3 yr old?

 

[The gavel]

What motive did she have to kill a 3 yr old?

IMO, she didn't want him but didn't want to lose her FD. She didn't want him, but didn't want to lose her husband who was extremely close to him.

She didn't want to be micromanaged by the foster system, but knew the BF would fight adoption.
IMO

 

[Trmtrm2]

What motive did she have to kill a 3 yr old?

If the sister is able to be adoptable as long as WT can be adopted with her as a sibling unit, its looks like the BM didn't want WT to be adopted out, maby BM lost rights to decide with the sister, but still in a position with WT, if it was a situation that WT was deceased then the adoption process may proceed with the sister, im guessing because he is still a missing person and missing in their care that the sister hasn't been able to be adopted yet
Only the slavos, the department, the foster family and their lawyers know that status of how an adoption can process with this group of children, if it was a situation that you can't adopt the sister because of WT and his BM to me thats great enough motivate but im only speculating

 

[Lunarmoth]

She is reading the local paper they throw on your driveway. He was picking up the big paper

So, I've lived in Western Australia all my life, and I work in media. Here in WA, only the "big paper" or "The West Australian/Sunday Times" has permission to be thrown onto people's driveways. Both PMP and Salmat, who are the distributors of local newspapers here in Western Australia and I believe Australia wide, require all local newspaper be delivered with the circulars straight into the letterbox. This is because of CALMs management laws regarding fire safety and environmental protection. If you're not in an area that gets weekly circular deliveries (which is a lot of the rural towns here in WA, at least in my experience working with local media) you have to pick it up from the town news agents.

This is why I'd really like to find some actual confirmation on that paper beyond speculation or well educated guesses.