Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #64

[Green beans]

If you have been summonsed and you don't attend court or apply to the coroner for a video link, the coroner may issue a warrant to arrest and order that person be brought to the Court.

I can’t see why the coroner would exempt the fm & FD from the inquest for re-questioning their accounts for the day William went missing. I actually can’t think of a reason she would. It’s in her interests to do just this.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Murder of Reyna Marroquín - Wikipedia.

They were able to do precisely with the above although this murder involved a 55 gallon drum - incredibly it was still traceable 36 years after its manufacture.

I love investigative work like this .. so impressive when from a few fibres they can trace something all the way back to a POI.

 

[vatzjr]

Maybe it has already been said, but I'd also like emphasise the conflation of facts and fiction in order to tell an untrue story allows the storyteller to draw on actual facts to "legitimise" the overall story, bolstering their confidence. FFC provides an exceptional amount of detail pre-WT's disappearance.

I'm so drawn to the point in the story where WT walks away from the decking whilst roaring. I believe that happened. Seem like after that he either 1) was kidnapped, 2) climbed onto the verandah and suffered a fatal fall, or 3) reprimanded for wandering off which was met with a fatal outcome.

The cars were not parked on Ellendale Cre.

Thank you for that correction. I had been visually struggling with the layout of FFGM house, especially with the bend in Benaroon, along with the way Google Maps distorts the visuals of the house. All the while, I missed that there are other properties between 48 Benaroon and Ellendale Crescent! Doh! My apologies to everyone, as I have been repeating this mistake endlessly.

Given that, it makes it even stranger that the kidnappers who planned on taking WT that morning or "Those who knew what happened to WT according to FFC" would park their cars UP Benaroon Dr, rather than DOWN, the path of least resistance.

Nowhere Child Episode 2 (@9:33):

"Benaroon Drive ... turns into a steep, gravel track ... it's not easy to get up there. We gave it a go in a little hatchback. And tore the bottom of the car off."

Presuming the kidnappers wouldn't add considerably more time to their getaway by taking such a rustic path slowing them down and possibly causing vehicular damage, their parking choice still added extra time to their getaway by requiring both cars to have to turn around to exit towards Batar Creek Road after taking WT.

Also strange that FFC wouldn't crosscheck the latest whereabouts of those abnormally parked cars on Benaroon Drive (which she noticed at two different times that morning) just a few steps away after making eye contact with old-timey beer belly man in his late 50s who had just pulled in and backed out of the Miller's driveway in a greenish/grey vehicle that may have looked more gunmetal grey from a distance.

 

[winterberry]

Given that, it makes it even stranger that the kidnappers who planned on taking WT that morning or "Those who knew what happened to WT according to FFC" would park their cars UP Benaroon Dr, rather than DOWN.

Nowhere Child Episode 2 (@9:33):

"Benaroon Drive ... turns into a steep, gravel track ... it's not easy to get up there. We gave it a go in a little hatchback. And tore the bottom of the car off."

Presuming the kidnappers wouldn't add considerably more time to their getaway by taking such a rustic path slowing them down, their parking choice still added extra time to their getaway by requiring both cars to have to turn around to exit down the path of least resistance towards Batar Creek Road after taking WT.

Also strange that FFC wouldn't crosscheck the latest whereabouts of those abnormally parked cars on Benaroon Drive just a few steps away after making eye contact with old-timey beer belly man in his late 50s.

Wow, good point.

 

[winterberry]

20.12.2015: Foster Mother says William’s sister may have been the only witness to abduction and that she knows a “bad person took William”.

William Tyrrell’s doomed life

If FM is responsible for his disappearance, what a disgusting thing to say to his sister to terrify her for life.

 

[FromGermany1]

I'm just catching up .......



I read that yesterday, very much "food for thought"



Yes they are, I take my hat of to people who want to care for kids when they come to them with sooooooo much trauma.



Yep it was



Yep , she was on the deck still drawing etc



I agree & RC saw these cars @ 10:45 ( from memory, I don't have my notes with me atm ) , he remembers looking at the clock on the way to his porch.



She was on the deck



Ps's wife

What has she gotten wrong? Link?


Tea had been made, they we're on the deck


Yep seen plenty of black eyes that were not NAI's



No there is not

There is no public access from Ellendale cres to the cemetery according to evidence from JO who lives to the Rt at the top of Ellendae Cre, he stated that he went & searched the cemetery & was asked what route he took & he said it joins his neighbour's property who lives opposite him & that it goes diagonally across my place, had no track , had to go thru bush. He searched thru to Albert St



Yes they can, under certain certificates given by the coroner


Are you really suggesting & saying that the FFC buried William with his Opa, in his grave?? How would that be possible & no one raised any suspicions


Or hidden?


The photos were taken before the cups of tea


Maybe because William had them on?

The sister being on the deck and drawing some pics for "Opa", before or after tea:
-During this same time, I remember, that the girl had to visit the bathroom. As far as I remember, someone allegedly went with her, but it was never quite clear, if FFC or FGM did it. It has to fit into the timeline also, although we don't know, whether true or not.
-.-.-
Just found that, didn't remember it:
2019
Dog's grave dug up during William Tyrrell search | The New Daily

What I wanted to say about grave and burying something in the existing grave, I can't now and have to search a link first. Story around AJ, our long forgotten suspect.

 

[FromGermany1]

20.12.2015: Foster Mother says William’s sister may have been the only witness to abduction and that she knows a “bad person took William”.

William Tyrrell’s doomed life

If FM is responsible for his disappearance, what a disgusting thing to say to his sister to terrify her for life.

FFC didn't commit to a gender at all, maybe clever.

 

[Deleted member 161976]

I wonder why she didn’t take the family car. If MFC had just arrived back, would that car have blocked FGM’s in? Just pondering.

Not sure why she didn't take the family car.MFC drove into the driveway. That car was brand new and a big one so maybe FFC hadn't drove it before and the FGM car was just easier as it was smaller. Just a guess though

 

[Deleted member 161976]

I don't think that what she said at the inquest is in doubt, some are concerned about what she told police on the day he disappeared.

The question I was answering was if FFC had drove to the riding school before calling LE, or after LE arrived. What she told LE on the day is a different matter.

 

[drsleuth]

No Cookies | Herald Sun

Off-the-record assurances that police “know who dunnit” but “just can’t prove it” because of (insert excuse) are sometimes right. But this supposed inside information can also be wishful thinking, desperation, vindictiveness, boastfulness, bigotry or tunnel vision.

 

[k-mac]

I wonder why she didn’t take the family car. If MFC had just arrived back, would that car have blocked FGM’s in? Just pondering.

Not sure why she didn't take the family car.MFC drove into the driveway. That car was brand new and a big one so maybe FFC hadn't drove it before and the FGM car was just easier as it was smaller. Just a guess though

Occam razor would suggest the FGM car was taken because the FFC car wasnt there at the time of necessity.

Its a discrepency IMO
Can't tie that detail up in a bow. ..That dog just don't hunt.

moo

 

[winterberry]

No Cookies | Herald Sun

Off-the-record assurances that police “know who dunnit” but “just can’t prove it” because of (insert excuse) are sometimes right. But this supposed inside information can also be wishful thinking, desperation, vindictiveness, boastfulness, bigotry or tunnel vision.

Sounds a lot like how Jubelin handled this case.

 

[k-mac]

No Cookies | Herald Sun

Off-the-record assurances that police “know who dunnit” but “just can’t prove it” because of (insert excuse) are sometimes right. But this supposed inside information can also be wishful thinking, desperation, vindictiveness, boastfulness, bigotry or tunnel vision.

wow
Well is there anything wrong with them exhausting a line of inquiry?
Especially if it was unsatisfactory conclusions the first time?
The most obvious line of inquiry of all?

Do we actually want to find William?


We can't sit in the fairy garden, block our ears and sing kumbaya because we think the POI is nice and those nasty policemen are saying bad things.

Its just not how it goes.

moo

 

[Angeline]

The description was a 'PLUMP woman with a blonde bun piled on top of her head.....I don't think there is any way to make that fit FM's description.

And does it make sense that FM had a living 3 yr old in her car ? Do we really think she kidnapped a living breathing boy and drove to the bush and murdered him that morning?

I have wondered about this. One theory I thought of was that WT could have been rushed to hospital in the car and he didn't survive. Maybe he swallowed someone's pills or had a snake bite. I know that doesn't fit in in with the current search area though. Just trying to think of all possibilities.

 

[katydid23]

I don't think William is wearing a bike helmet in this photograph and the photograph was released by NSWPOL (logo in bottom left-side viewable in link). Obviously an adult was with William at the time! I wonder why NSWPOL chose this particular photo to release?

William Tyrrell: Inside privileged life of foster mother, why she hates Spiderman photo | Daily Mail Online

View attachment 324156

Did WT have training wheels on the bike at this time. It seems like it, the way he is looking up and smiling at the camera. If he wasn't on training wheels I don't think he could be going slow enough to look away from the road and smile that way.

If he did have training wheels still on, then a helmet would not be as necessary, imo.

 

[winterberry]

No Cookies | Herald Sun

Off-the-record assurances that police “know who dunnit” but “just can’t prove it” because of (insert excuse) are sometimes right. But this supposed inside information can also be wishful thinking, desperation, vindictiveness, boastfulness, bigotry or tunnel vision.

Oh wow, didn't realise they were actually talking about Jubelin.

The first thing that (now former) lead investigator Gary Jubelin had to do was to eliminate William’s network of biological and foster relatives.

Jubelin, responding to a thinly veiled swipe from former colleagues last week, is adamant he put William’s foster parents through the wringer.

Clearly returning fire to the NSW police chief, a steely Jubelin insisted he used every legal tactic in the interrogator’s handbook to shake any inconsistencies in the foster parents’ story.

He said he “ambushed” the couple with a sudden series of accusatory questions designed to shock them into an admission or a slip-up if they were hiding anything. He then interviewed them formally and bugged their car to see what they said in private.

After Jubelin was convinced the family members were not lying, his crew cranked up the investigation into “persons of interest” who might have entered the street at the moment the little boy wandered into the front garden.

Police routinely exploit it by using the media not only to appeal for witnesses and information but to put pressure on potential suspects.

There’s nothing wrong with that – until there is. The result, at least in the Tyrrell case, is likely to be defamation suits.

If there’s a lesson in the Tyrrell affair for police, the public and the media elsewhere, it’s about the danger of jumping to conclusions, of embracing theories and repeating them until they assume the veneer of fact.

No Cookies | Herald Sun

 

[winterberry]

On Wednesday, William’s biological mother said her torment began long before her son’s disappearance.

“It’s been years actually. Can you imagine what I’ve been through? I’m a mess, how do you think I’m doing?” she said.

When asked about revelations of a new suspect on the drawing boards of detectives, William’s mother said she had been concerned about those caring for him “from the start”.

“He had bruises on (him) at a young age when I’d go to visit and they said it was because (he was) learning to walk,’’ she said. “You really think he fell off a balcony?”

The mother has been supported by close friends in recent days as she deals with the return of her son’s disappearance to the headlines.

No Cookies | Daily Telegraph

 

[JBowie]

Different story if they are watching tv in a safe lounge room or in their bedroom playing, but a toddler wandering outside on that property with no gates, high verandahs, gardening tools, wild animals, holes, snakes, neighbours with pools, two nearby roads is inexplicable.

Yep and I get the feeling that she went inside the house expecting Nana, who was reading a newspaper, to be watching the kids. I don't think she really knows what time William took off.

 

[Waverider]

I don't think William is wearing a bike helmet in this photograph and the photograph was released by NSWPOL (logo in bottom left-side viewable in link). Obviously an adult was with William at the time! I wonder why NSWPOL chose this particular photo to release?

William Tyrrell: Inside privileged life of foster mother, why she hates Spiderman photo | Daily Mail Online

View attachment 324156

Also fascinating from the article posted is this. I mean, I always suspected this was their motivation for their names being suppressed. But, clearly at this point it has nothing to do with William’s status as a foster child, so why is this continuing??

“The foster parents fought hard to keep their names suppressed from the media.

“According to NSW Supreme Court documents in the case brought by children's advocate Allanna Smith against FACS, the foster parents feared they would be identified and this would bring further harassment of themselves, their family and friends.”

 

[HilaryHormone]

Yes Waverider, but what I am trying to emphasize is that FFC has said he was wearing shoes because of bindi, dog poo etc; but if LE was able to take photos of the shoes still sitting at the sliding door when they arrived, then ......when all is said and done..... just another instance of inconsistency in her statements.
Just saying ...... if they actually have enough evidence to arrest and charge FFC as a POI, part of her defence may be incapacity to accurately remember things!!! MOO

Where is it stated LE have photos of William’s shoes still on scene when they arrived? The photos of William barefoot on the deck with his shoes behind him at the door are before he disappeared. They don’t prove or disprove FFC’s statement that he put them on before playing on the grass. IMO.


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