Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #64

[vatzjr]

She herself admits it wasn't until late that day when she picked up her sister from the plane that she remembered seeing those cars. Then she said that she we t straight to police still searching and told them. I don t have the exact link but this has been widely discussed in FFC interviews

Yes, but some sources have her saying the airport trip was "that night," and other sources have the airport trip two days later.

@Oona points out that MFC didn't see these cars (windows rolled down, unattended) that, according to FFC, stuck out like a sore thumb, because no one ever parks on Benaroon Drive. I don't know when the female neighbour with the adjoining property below Nanna's left to do errands (I don't know if I'm allowed to use her name or initials), but if it was after the time FFC said hi to the kookaburras at about 7:30 AM, then she too missed those twin cars. They would have been in plain view as she left her home. Let's not forget the bingo-playing wife who would have left around the time WT disappeared (she would have had to if her husband or her was "responsible" for WT's death). She would have driven right passed those twin cars.

Let's not forget that the foster trip to Nanna's was a surprise and just planned a week or so before, and, up until the day before, they weren't even supposed to arrive until after WT's eventually disappeared. The only person we know who was informed about the earlier arrival was Nanna, as they were driving up. If these paedophile ring twin cars actually existed (which were parked counterintuitive to a fast getaway), never mind that only about five neighbours would have had the opportunity to notice foster family arriving at 9 - 9:30 PM the night before to alert the paedophile ring, so that they would be parked there the next morning bright and early whilst FFC said hi to the kookaburras. How many of these neighbours were even up at that hour the night before? How many of these homes were occupied by "dirty old men"? This is a neighbourhood where every single local child except for one 3-year-old were in school on that day, according to the grocery-shopping neighbour.

I mean, this theory is so preposterous, yet, judging by the investigation, it took precedence over all of the other theories outside of it being the foster family or the bingo-playing grandma accidentally running over William and her husband going, "Don't worry, honey, I'll take care of it, you go play bingo." So, the husband stores WT's body in their garage, goes over to Nanna's for a few minutes to see what all the fuss is about, and, then, whilst "looking" for WT, this 75-year-old man--who has 90 or so "unaccounted for" minutes--carries WT's body (adorned in a bright red and blue costume) undetected into the woods 45 minutes in/45 minutes out, all before his brother arrives at 1 PM. Yet, according to FFC, the lantana is too thick to get too far into the woods (I'm presuming deviating off of the fire road, because where else is he going to bury the body?).

Throw on top of that FFC's inconsistencies, as well as the lack of a liaison officer to prevent Jubelin from getting too attached to the fosters resulting in a compromised investigation (which is exactly what happened). This is an investigator who must have thought it was impossible for FFC to be a resourceful and calculating enough of a woman to conceal an accidental death of their foster child from her husband, because "I bugged them after I interrogated them separately and they didn't say anything incriminating on the car drive home." Nevermind that he didn't even bring Nanna back in before he cleared the fosters. You mean to tell me elderly husband of bingo player is capable of being this master criminal, but Nanna couldn't have possibly been negligent requiring her daughter to cover it up? There are some serious potential motives right there: 1) Protect my mother, 2) protect my parental rights over foster daughter 3) protect my marriage, 4) protect my reputation, and/or 5) protect my lifestyle.

Are there any other persons with motives as convincing as that? WITH opportunity?

We know the fosters too but they dont even have code names.

In the Lia Harris Where's William Tyrrell? podcast, they're called StaceyJane and Peter (thank you @JBowie ).

 

[JBowie]

The court case. Not sure why I am being challenged on this. Why would I lie? I like Lia Harris a lot, and her podcasts.

What date was that court case? I am interested to know.

 

[SouthAussie]

What date was that court case? I am interested to know.

The judge also gave William a pseudonym. Julian. But obviously no-one needs to use that. But it is what he used in the court case.

You can find the court case online.

imo

 

[canarybird]

I have been listening again to 'Nowhere Child', Caroline Overington's podcast for The Australian, and firstly, I want to point out how beautifully produced it is. The soundscape, the structure, her unique style of narration, and the interesting interview subjects paint a rich picture.

That aside, I find it interesting in this episode of the Lia Harris podcast, at the time linked, that they mention most emergency calls about a missing person typically happen a couple of hours after the disappearance- and it was unusual that FFC's call was only 20 minutes, or thereabouts, later. I find THIS unusual in itself, as I feel like I would be on the phone to police within minutes! It's a noodle-scratcher for sure.
One Last Roar — Where's William Tyrrell? — Overcast

Edited as I miscredited the link.

 

[kels]

I have been reading the older threads, particularly #30 - #45 (I’m still going but try and keep up with the latest as well) and I agree it must feel weird to even discuss timelines and inconsistencies now. I understand the MFC and FFC were “cleared” and “ruled out” at the time and were not able to be discussed but I’ve noticed whenever posters had genuine queries about the timeline or events of that morning (eg. people were asking about the drive the FFC took and what car it was in and when it could have happened back in 2019 and people were also asking about the drive to the airport fairly early in too), these comments were either ignored or shut down pretty quickly. I don’t see why trying to clarify what actually happened that morning was such a big issue. It definitely must feel weird for you bearbear as I know you were around then. Glad to see you have kept an open mind

Ahh yes so so true, and it must be so good for some WS members to now be allowed to have these conversations as there has always been discrepancies and inconsistent retelling of what happened and when. Many of us didn't have the patience of some of the active members here and broke of into smaller sleuthing groups, particularly as ff were poi but because historically that hadn't been stated in the media their retelling of the events of that day couldn't be explored. I have to say thanks to those who kept the thread here active despite the restriction on topics for discussion jmo moo

 

[FromGermany1]

I might get in trouble for saying this, but has anyone noticed a play on words with some recent media headlines relating to the FC identities? Or is just me over thinking?

1 x seen, yes.

 

[winterberry]

I have been listening again to 'Nowhere Child', Caroline Overington's podcast for The Australian, and firstly, I want to point out how beautifully produced it is. The soundscape, the structure, her unique style of narration, and the interesting interview subjects paint a rich picture.

That aside, I find it interesting in this episode of the Lia Harris podcast, at the time linked, that they mention most emergency calls about a missing person typically happen a couple of hours after the disappearance- and it was unusual that FFC's call was only 20 minutes, or thereabouts, later. I find THIS unusual in itself, as I feel like I would be on the phone to police within minutes! It's a noodle-scratcher for sure.
One Last Roar — Where's William Tyrrell? — Overcast

Edited as I miscredited the link.

The comparison in timing of calling for missing persons is a logical fallacy of false equivalence and a lack of understanding of basic highschool level statistics.

The reason that most people wait longer to call for missing persons, is because the overwhelming majority of missing persons are teenagers. Parents of teens usually call around, wait for their teen to come home, even up to 24-48 hours because teens are notoriously unreliable.

So that means the average time people wait to call for missing persons blows right out.

People who have toddlers missing usually call within a much much shorter timeframe.

 

[JBowie]

That aside, I find it interesting in this episode, at the time linked, that they mention most emergency calls about a missing person typically happen a couple of hours after the disappearance- and it was unusual that FFC's call was only 20 minutes, or thereabouts, later. I find THIS unusual in itself, as I feel like I would be on the phone to police within minutes! It's a noodle-scratcher for sure.
One Last Roar — Where's William Tyrrell? — Overcast

I have numerous doubts about the FM's version of events. I have described it as a farrago of fact and fiction.

If I were in her shoes, having to reveal quite publicly that I failed to properly supervise a 3 year old, trusted to me as a foster carer, would be front of mind.

 

[Jaded325594]

I have been listening again to 'Nowhere Child', Caroline Overington's podcast for The Australian, and firstly, I want to point out how beautifully produced it is. The soundscape, the structure, her unique style of narration, and the interesting interview subjects paint a rich picture.

That aside, I find it interesting in this episode of the Lia Harris podcast, at the time linked, that they mention most emergency calls about a missing person typically happen a couple of hours after the disappearance- and it was unusual that FFC's call was only 20 minutes, or thereabouts, later. I find THIS unusual in itself, as I feel like I would be on the phone to police within minutes! It's a noodle-scratcher for sure.
One Last Roar — Where's William Tyrrell? — Overcast

Edited as I miscredited the link.

Yes! Noted this as well and thought the same. I can't imagine waiting hours when it involves a toddler.

 

[SouthAussie]

@JBowie

William’s story starts 10 years ago, when his father met a girl. In 2010, they had a daughter. Three months later, that child — a girl called Lindsay in court documents — was taken into state care. What was the issue?
Australia - Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #42

 

[Tench]

The court case. Not sure why I am being challenged on this. Why would I lie? I like Lia Harris a lot, and her podcasts.

I believe that Brereton J applied the pseudonyms “Julian” and “Sarah”.

 

[sniffsniffcough]

On Wednesday, William’s biological mother said her torment began long before her son’s disappearance.

“It’s been years actually. Can you imagine what I’ve been through? I’m a mess, how do you think I’m doing?” she said.

When asked about revelations of a new suspect on the drawing boards of detectives, William’s mother said she had been concerned about those caring for him “from the start”.

“He had bruises on (him) at a young age when I’d go to visit and they said it was because (he was) learning to walk,’’ she said. “You really think he fell off a balcony?”

The mother has been supported by close friends in recent days as she deals with the return of her son’s disappearance to the headlines.

No Cookies | Daily Telegraph

I cannot begin to imagine the heartache and emotional turmoil William and his sisters biological family and extended family have been forced to endure. Now compounded by recent NSWPOL AVO application and assault allegation that is said to involve William's sister who was in out of home care with the FFC/MFC until recent times.

 

[JBowie]

@JBowie

William’s story starts 10 years ago, when his father met a girl. In 2010, they had a daughter. Three months later, that child — a girl called Lindsay in court documents — was taken into state care. What was the issue?
Australia - Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #42

I asked for a date, and there it is.

 

[FromGermany1]

She herself admits it wasn't until late that day when she picked up her sister from the plane that she remembered seeing those cars. Then she said that she we t straight to police still searching and told them. I don t have the exact link but this has been widely discussed in FFC interviews

My thought at the time: it might have been an advice by her sister.

 

[JBowie]

Now compounded by recent NSWPOL AVO application and assault allegation that is said to involve William's sister who was in out of home care with the FFC/MFC until recent times.

My sympathy lies with "Lindsay" who I guess is now in yet another foster home. Poor kid probably doesn't know who to trust anymore.

 

[winterberry]

My sympathy lies with "Lindsay" who I guess is now in yet another foster home. Poor kid probably doesn't know who to trust anymore.

Mine too. She's lost two families, and her brother is likely dead, and where is she now? Uprooted from her school and social group? Poor darling child.

 

[k-mac]

Yes, but some sources have her saying the airport trip was "that night," and other sources have the airport trip two days later.

@Oona points out that MFC didn't see these cars (windows rolled down, unattended) that, according to FFC, stuck out like a sore thumb, because no one ever parks on Benaroon Drive. I don't know when the female neighbour with the adjoining property below Nanna's left to do errands (I don't know if I'm allowed to use her name or initials), but if it was after the time FFC said hi to the kookaburras at about 7:30 AM, then she too missed those twin cars. They would have been in plain view as she left her home. Let's not forget the bingo-playing wife who would have left around the time WT disappeared (she would have had to if her husband or her was "responsible" for WT's death). She would have driven right passed those twin cars.

Let's not forget that the foster trip to Nanna's was a surprise and just planned a week or so before, and, up until the day before, they weren't even supposed to arrive until after WT's eventually disappeared. The only person we know who was informed about the earlier arrival was Nanna, as they were driving up. If these paedophile ring twin cars actually existed (which were parked counterintuitive to a fast getaway), never mind that only about five neighbours would have had the opportunity to notice foster family arriving at 9 - 9:30 PM the night before to alert the paedophile ring, so that they would be parked there the next morning bright and early whilst FFC said hi to the kookaburras. How many of these neighbours were even up at that hour the night before? How many of these homes were occupied by "dirty old men"? This is a neighbourhood where every single local child except for one 3-year-old were in school on that day, according to the grocery-shopping neighbour.

I mean, this theory is so preposterous, yet, judging by the investigation, it took precedence over all of the other theories outside of it being the foster family or the bingo-playing grandma accidentally running over William and her husband going, "Don't worry, honey, I'll take care of it, you go play bingo." So, the husband stores WT's body in their garage, goes over to Nanna's for a few minutes to see what all the fuss is about, and, then, whilst "looking" for WT, this 75-year-old man--who has 90 or so "unaccounted for" minutes--carries WT's body (adorned in a bright red and blue costume) undetected into the woods 45 minutes in/45 minutes out, all before his brother arrives at 1 PM. Yet, according to FFC, the lantana is too thick to get too far into the woods (I'm presuming deviating off of the fire road, because where else is he going to bury the body?).

Throw on top of that FFC's inconsistencies, as well as the lack of a liaison officer to prevent Jubelin from getting too attached to the fosters resulting in a compromised investigation (which is exactly what happened). This is an investigator who must have thought it was impossible for FFC to be a resourceful and calculating enough of a woman to conceal an accidental death of their foster child from her husband, because "I bugged them after I interrogated them separately and they didn't say anything incriminating on the car drive home." Nevermind that he didn't even bring Nanna back in before he cleared the fosters. You mean to tell me elderly husband of bingo player is capable of being this master criminal, but Nanna couldn't have possibly been negligent requiring her daughter to cover it up? There are some serious potential motives right there: 1) Protect my mother, 2) protect my parental rights over foster daughter 3) protect my marriage, 4) protect my reputation, and/or 5) protect my lifestyle.

Are there any other persons with motives as convincing as that? WITH opportunity?

In the Lia Harris Where's William Tyrrell? podcast, they're called StaceyJane and Peter (thank you @JBowie ).

So much to unpack in your very detailed post vatzjr!
thank you for sharing it.

Such a valid point to the pedo ring theory, which hung its hat on knowing william was coming....

He had actually disappeared before his planned ETA at Kendall.

moo

 

[Green beans]

William deserves to be found.

so wait, was it the night of picking her sister up from the airport she ran to officers stationed outside to tell them about the two oddly parked cars, and the next day she made a statement that didn’t include these odd cars?

 

[HilaryHormone]

The comparison in timing of calling for missing persons is a logical fallacy of false equivalence and a lack of understanding of basic highschool level statistics.

The reason that most people wait longer to call for missing persons, is because the overwhelming majority of missing persons are teenagers. Parents of teens usually call around, wait for their teen to come home, even up to 24-48 hours because teens are notoriously unreliable.

So that means the average time people wait to call for missing persons blows right out.

People who have toddlers missing usually call within a much much shorter timeframe.

Where the toddler is also a looked after child, that timeframe should be be even shorter. I do think 20 minutes is a reasonable amount of time to look around for a child, who could have been hiding or wandered further down the estate.

Now that I’m thinking on it, I’m surprised there was no mention of William’s looked after status in the initial emergency call. I appreciate that LE responded very quickly anyway; However that pertinent information would have been useful for the call handle.

I have numerous doubts about the FM's version of events. I have described it as a farrago of fact and fiction.

If I were in her shoes, having to reveal quite publicly that I failed to properly supervise a 3 year old, trusted to me as a foster carer, would be front of mind.

That’s what gets me tbh. The apparent lack of guilt the average person would feel at at merely losing sight of a child. It would be a valid emotion and understandable emotion to express.

I do think William has been unsupervised, therefore missing, for longer than has been claimed. I’m just not sure there was a planned, calculated murder committed by people who cared about him and who have continued to keep his case in the public eye.

 

[JBowie]

I do think William has been unsupervised, therefore missing, for longer than has been claimed. I’m just not sure there was a planned, calculated murder committed by people who cared about him and who have continued to keep his case in the public eye.

My strong hunch is that an accident has occurred which has been covered up.