Australia Australia - William Tyrrell Disappeared While Playing in Yard, Kendall (NSW), Sept 2014 #76

[Megnut]

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/william-tyrrells-foster-mum-blames-child-for-parents-violence-in-disturbing-tapes/news-story/8d80ce4ae61c633e860a2797aeefde74

“If I’m physically hurting children, how do you think that’s making me feel? Because the problem is, you push it and push it and push it. Someone snaps and they lose control. If you get violent, it’s because people lose control and they can’t stop”.

Is that what happened Sept 12 2014????

Embedded confession?

"LE is trying to break me."

Well.

Jmo

 

[SLouTh]

I thought that when I first read it. But when I re-read it, I don't think that is what it means. I think it means she has been accused of being a bad mother by another child who is not William.

This article gives a little more context.


On the recording, a loud thud can be heard before the child cries out and yells: "She kicked me!"

The woman tells the child she did so to prevent the child from kicking another child — which the child admitted they were going to do.

The child then tells the woman: "You're a bad mother."

More secret recordings played on third day of Tyrrell foster parents court hearing - ABC News

amp.abc.net.au

Yes you may be correct …. As the 7 article (linked above) goes on to say this …


“You break our hearts, you lose the only parents you’ve ever known, the only parents who have fought tooth and nail for you,” the foster mother was heard saying.

But like you, SA, when I first read it, I did think the younger child, but have added an edit now …

 

[k-mac]

This is terrible. So she had just found out that she was the number 1 POI in WT's disappearance either from a journo or by fronting the NSWCC where they let her know that they think she made WT disappear and then she has lost it and lashed out which is caught on a tap. As unacceptable and wrong as that is, please tell me anyone of you, that you have been in this position. I am wondering if this is being a little like SA suggested in another post, a form of not exactly entrapment, but police massaging the conditions to make things happen. Like the tail wagging the dog. My thoughts only.

Pushing someone to expose they are mentally unstable is that what you mean iiii's?

Thats what I am taking your post to mean.
I suspect this is what and how they surmise William got gone.
Proving and exposing FM is a loose cannon is not a bad thing in my book.
Not under the circumstances.

No doubt they have applied maximum pressure.
Shows her steely determination IMO
A force to be reckoned with. Scary if your a child in her care.

And that is where it aligns to William.

 

[Megnut]

I doubt LE had the staff to surveille 24/7. Is it possible that the abuse was reported, not when it occurred but when the audio was listened to? I don't know how wire-tapping and home bugging works, but I'm imagining sophisticated software programmed for key words that, once triggered, prompt LE to take a listen. Just like when LE is tailing a suspect, it's only in real time on TV. In the real word, the vehicle has a tracker and only upon review of the data is a route identified.

Once LE became aware of one episode of abuse, likely the whole of the recordings had to be turned over and dissected in entirety.

More and more, it's becoming obvious to me -- the ugly lengths the female caregiver (ugh) was willing to go to to have an outward appearance of perfection.

Did she feel the need to break Wm too?

jmo

 

[SouthAussie]

Agreed again, I heard threats but didn't hear of a face slap incident. We don't know if she cooled down not too long after incidents, this is the police evidence and what they want heard and I am guessing without much context. What we know is that they hadn't reached the threshold for another body to investigate for months and when they were charged FFC was charged with 2 assaults, the kicking which she admitted she had lost it and that she is not coping, there is insight to a degree around what is acceptable and what isn't. There is a lot of the child's reaction to not just the assaults but other measures the FFC came up with and her reactions to this, and conversations with 3rd parties about what she has done, which says to me that she is trying to be accountable somewhere while trying to figure out how manage this struggling child. IDK. I don't believe Ogilvie, I think he stayed on the taps until he got something on tape about WT. And if they did it's obviously not enough for the police to even charge her. I'm really swinging with this case.MOO

There is more context in this article. It is really hard to get context from some of the articles.
This part is in response to what you say about maybe trying to be accountable while trying to figure out how to manage the child.

The police would have heard this, too. They knew she wasn't coping with the child.


Later that same day, another recording heard the woman apologise to the child.

"I lost complete control and I need to apologise. I am sorry I did that," she said in the recording.

"There's a lot going on for me that you don't know about, a huge amount of pressure and your poking the bear is triggering me and I am right at the end of my coping. I need you to just stop."

The woman then tells the child physical violence is never acceptable and tells the child she loves them.

More secret recordings played on third day of Tyrrell foster parents court hearing - ABC News

amp.abc.net.au

.

 

[bearbear]

heard a snippet on the tv news tonight where fm had said she was going to leave her husband at one stage because she thought his punishment methods were too harsh?

 

[k-mac]

The woman then tells the child physical violence is never acceptable and tells the child she loves them.

More secret recordings played on third day of Tyrrell foster parents court hearing - ABC News

amp.abc.net.au

.

rsff
the good old ....I'll never do it again ..please forgive me..don't tell anyone...ssshhhh domestic violence routine

until next time. Because yet she does do it again...and again.

Alot to pile on a kid.

Not washing her clothes troubles me as to what other areas did FM invest sneaky cruelty to her.

 

[Awakening]

"Police Officers of the NSW Police Force are mandatory reporters. In the course of their duties, police officers, if they suspect a child or young person is at imminent risk of significant harm, are required to immediately phone the Child Protection Helpline"

Mandatory reporting - NSW Police Public Site

www.police.nsw.gov.au

I wonder if it was a police officer monitoring the surveillance or a clerk? Would a clerk be a mandated reporter if working for NSW police?

 

[kittythehare]

There is more context in this article. It is really hard to get context from some of the articles.
This part is in response to what you say about maybe trying to be accountable while trying to figure out how to manage the child.

The police would have heard this, too. They knew she wasn't coping with the child.


Later that same day, another recording heard the woman apologise to the child.

"I lost complete control and I need to apologise. I am sorry I did that," she said in the recording.

"There's a lot going on for me that you don't know about, a huge amount of pressure and your poking the bear is triggering me and I am right at the end of my coping. I need you to just stop."

The woman then tells the child physical violence is never acceptable and tells the child she loves them.

More secret recordings played on third day of Tyrrell foster parents court hearing - ABC News

amp.abc.net.au

.

Hell of an apology1

"There's a lot going on for me that you don't know about, a huge amount of pressure and your poking the bear is triggering me and I am right at the end of my coping. I need you to just stop."

The woman then tells the child physical violence is never acceptable and tells the child she loves them.

"I don't have to love you, but I do. Do you understand that?"

Seriously manipulative coercive behaviour

 

[Awakening]

Agreed again, I heard threats but didn't hear of a face slap incident. We don't know if she cooled down not too long after incidents, this is the police evidence and what they want heard and I am guessing without much context. What we know is that they hadn't reached the threshold for another body to investigate for months and when they were charged FFC was charged with 2 assaults, the kicking which she admitted she had lost it and that she is not coping, there is insight to a degree around what is acceptable and what isn't. There is a lot of the child's reaction to not just the assaults but other measures the FFC came up with and her reactions to this, and conversations with 3rd parties about what she has done, which says to me that she is trying to be accountable somewhere while trying to figure out how manage this struggling child. IDK. I don't believe Ogilvie, I think he stayed on the taps until he got something on tape about WT. And if they did it's obviously not enough for the police to even charge her. I'm really swinging with this case.MOO

Thanks, appreciate your insights as I haven’t paid much attention to it all lately. It would be good to have more context and I’m assuming the defence will have something to offer.

 

[SouthAussie]

I wonder if it was a police officer monitoring the surveillance or a clerk? Would a clerk be a mandated reporter if working for NSW police?

Yes.

And there is no way that officers were not listening to those tapes throughout the year. From at least Jan 2021 through Oct/Nov 2021. It was their covert operation.

imo

 

[SLouTh]

heard a snippet on the tv news tonight where fm had said she was going to leave her husband at one stage because she thought his punishment methods were too harsh?

Sadly Bear, perhaps it’s an entire vicious circle of domestic violence???

JMO

 

[Karin1974]

how should they collect evidence when they don't have what they need?

NSW police IMO have/are, tried/trying their hardest to get William justice.

Monday morning quarterbacking is easy pickings to throw shade at them.
Is it justified??

Personally I think it is unreasonable to do so.

It is pretty hard having to get down in the mud with critters without getting mud on you.
Very difficult position the police have been in. I don't think they took it lightly what was going on.
Was it enough to get some resolutions....Idont think so.
Thats why it continued until it was enough.

IMO - Respectfully, not by leaving children in an unsafe environment. Find your evidence elsewhere! I personally believe leaving those children there because you are hoping for more evidence is disgraceful! MOO

 

[k-mac]

IMO - Respectfully, not by leaving children in an unsafe environment. Find your evidence elsewhere! I personally believe leaving those children there because you are hoping for more evidence is disgraceful! MOO

The police deal with kids in endangered environments 24/7 365.
We can scream from the roof tops our quaterback mondays I am sure LE do it on the daily.

Personally I think whats happened in this case..
when it comes to the wealthy....good lawyers are abound and chomping at the bit.

Even what we have heard..is just that...heard. There is still alot of guess work attached to the recordings.
Plenty for a good defence lawyer to work with.
LE waited till they had enough to stick....and stick well.

I am told (by a detective) that police lias with their lawyers constantly before they pull the trigger...on anything.
All evidence has to pass the legal heads.
And thats just the way it is...and we need to be grateful that it is this way.

 

[bfew]

And a govt dept (DCJ) won't be suing a govt dept (NSWPOL) for accountability for their actions - or inactions.
That would be the State of NSW suing the State of NSW. (Seeing that the child was under the care of the Minister.)

So it will all remain hush-hush unless the Coroner makes a recommendation.

All remain hush-hush until the victim turn's 18 and possibly sues the State of NSW, refuses to settle the case out of court, then successfully takes the activist route from her personal experiences, or runs for NSW Parliament.

 

[JBowie]

They’re trying to trip me up on stuff,” [the FM] said. “They’re doing it because they f---ed it up.”

The foster mother added: “They cleared the guy ... they have nobody.”

Which 'guy' is she talking about?

 

[k-mac]

All remain hush-hush until the victim turn's 18 and possibly sues the State of NSW, refuses to settle the case out of court, then successfully takes the activist route from her personal experiences, or runs for NSW Parliament.

I don't mind if something wonderful happens for her.
She has been through more than any child should have to.

Not so long ago she told the inquest she was going to be a detective and help solve the mystery of her brother's disappearance.

“I hope this speech makes you solve the case,” she said in the recording, clearly and confidently.

“If it doesn’t, when I’m officially an adult I’ll be in the police force, a detective specifically, and I will find my brother and won’t give up until he’s found.”

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/william-tyrrell-sister-of-missing-boy-wants-to-become-a-detective-to-find-him/news-story/bb4bba787b47b1d27a83a4698c9112c5

 

[imstilla.grandma]

William Tyrrell’s foster mother was caught on secret police recordings complaining that detectives had “*advertiser censored**ed up” the investigation into the missing toddler and were now trying to trip her up.

In a bugged phone call to an unidentified person, the foster mother is heard saying: “I kicked (the child) this morning, I kicked her hard” and “I’m not coping.”

In that same conversation, she mentions that she was being “investigated” by police over William’s disappearance and commented: “They are trying to trip me up on stuff.”

She further added: “They’re doing it because they *advertiser censored**ed it up … They cleared the guy.”

For three days, Parramatta Local Court has heard covert recordings from inside William’s foster family’s home, including one where the woman can be heard kicking another child - who is not William - and smacking them with a wooden spoon.

Other tapes heard the womanthreatening to “slap” the child in the face and “throw” them around.

‘F***ed up’: Tyrrell’s foster mum’s secret police rant

William Tyrrell’s foster mum was caught on secret police recordings complaining that detectives had “*advertiser censored**ed up” the investigation into the missing toddler.

thewest.com.au

 

[SLouTh]

They’re trying to trip me up on stuff,” [the FM] said. “They’re doing it because they f---ed it up.”

The foster mother added: “They cleared the guy ... they have nobody.”

Which 'guy' is she talking about?

Educated guess she may be referring to PS ???? He made a few phone calls in that time period ……. But JMO


'They cleared a guy on a telephone call after William went missing, she said in a taped recording on October 20, 2021.

The foster mother was speaking at a time when she had already appeared before the NSW Crime Commission to be questioned in a clandestine hearing into what she and the foster father knew about William's disappearance.

William Tyrrell's foster mum says police botched missing toddler case

William Tyrrell's foster mother has claimed she was under scrutiny the disappearance of her missing toddler foster son because police had botched up investigations into the boy.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[JBowie]

Educated guess she may be referring to PS ???? He made a few phone calls in that time period ……. But JMO

Interesting. Of course PS was GJ's prime suspect in the end and I guess, given his 'professional' closeness to her, he would have made that known to the FM.

I'd love to know who she was talking to on the other end of that phone call.