Autopsy

[close_enough]

Hi Close_enough, I find it rather odd that she would sleep with those clothes on too. Maybe she was just getting ready for bed and had just taken off her socks. (sounds like Laci getting ready for bed) Can you imagine the shock when your husband is standing before you, ready to beat you to death or strangle you? How horrible.

yes it does, packer

 

[panthera]

Ya know, the more I think about this, the more I am totally convinced he (as in whoever committed this murder) HAD to have scratches, bruises, etc. There is no way, from the fight she put up, that he could escape with having some kinds of marks. NO WAY. I bet he has told his family that it was a fight gone bad and it was an accident. I wonder who all saw him in the first few days after the murder, besides immediate family?

And something else I have had on my mind all night - would it be worse to know, blow-by-blow, how your daughter was murdered (like Michelle's family knows) or wonder all your life how it happened (like Sharon Rocha)? Either way would be awful, but I have to wonder about that.

With the extent of Michelle's injuries it seems that the perp was definitely the one in control ~ he tries to strangle her, she fights him off slightly but he regains control with the weapon. He might have scratches on his hands from her nails and that could be where the blood spots come from that were found on the car. But for other injuries its possible she didn't have a chance to scratch his face or cause any really noticeable injuries.

I think it'd be worse not to even know where your (presumed dead) child is, like Natalee, or for Sharon Rocha only to wonder what Laci went through praying she didn't suffer.

 

[panthera]

Another good point as usual RC. Ok ladies we need to know what comes off or goes on first when you're getting dressed.

When I'm getting dressed my socks go on last. When I'm undressing my socks comes off last.

So RC you could very well be right.

It sure would help if we knew what she was wearing when her friend was over to watch Grey's Anatomy with her! The stomach contents and what she had on (not sleeping clothes) make me believe she had not gone to bed yet.

 

[raisincharlie]

It sure would help if we knew what she was wearing when her friend was over to watch Grey's Anatomy with her! The stomach contents and what she had on (not sleeping clothes) make me believe she had not gone to bed yet.

Panthera,

There is one poster over at CTV that I have followed very closely from the begining - no not RPD - this poster has not yet been wrong about anything they have posted. A second source has confirmed some of the things this poster slips in very quietly. Anyhow this poster has indicated that the clothes MY was found in were indeed the same as the ones she was wearing the evening before she was killed.

Why do I believe it - this same poster has in the past indicated that LE has surveilance tape of JY - this has been confirmed by an independent source as well. They also told me when the AR was coming out - they were off by one day...I'll just leave it at that and you can take it for what it is worth to you. JMO

 

[raisincharlie]

With the extent of Michelle's injuries it seems that the perp was definitely the one in control ~ he tries to strangle her, she fights him off slightly but he regains control with the weapon. He might have scratches on his hands from her nails and that could be where the blood spots come from that were found on the car. But for other injuries its possible she didn't have a chance to scratch his face or cause any really noticeable injuries.

I think it'd be worse not to even know where your (presumed dead) child is, like Natalee, or for Sharon Rocha only to wonder what Laci went through praying she didn't suffer.

Was he really trying to strangle her or just control her? Look at the size of JYs hands - he could have held her neck with one hand if she were pressed against something - the hyoid bone was not broken - he didn't try very hard to strangle her - she was tiny at 5'6 and 124 pounds compared to him IMO.

 

[panthera]

Panthera,

There is one poster over at CTV that I have followed very closely from the begining - no not RPD - this poster has not yet been wrong about anything they have posted. A second source has confirmed some of the things this poster slips in very quietly. Anyhow this poster has indicated that the clothes MY was found in were indeed the same as the ones she was wearing the evening before she was killed.

Why do I believe it - this same poster has in the past indicated that LE has surveilance tape of JY - this has been confirmed by an independent source as well. They also told me when the AR was coming out - they were off by one day...I'll just leave it at that and you can take it for what it is worth to you. JMO

Hi raisincharlie! and thanks for the confirmation which I believe since it's the only logical one. I don't even get dressed near the bed when I'm wearing black so unless these were a satin fabric such as pajamas she wouldn't have been sleeping in those pants! and the stomach contents negate the 'she was getting dressed in the morning' theory since the TOD was said to be before 6am.

 

[close_enough]

Panthera,

There is one poster over at CTV that I have followed very closely from the begining - no not RPD - this poster has not yet been wrong about anything they have posted. A second source has confirmed some of the things this poster slips in very quietly. Anyhow this poster has indicated that the clothes MY was found in were indeed the same as the ones she was wearing the evening before she was killed.

Why do I believe it - this same poster has in the past indicated that LE has surveilance tape of JY - this has been confirmed by an independent source as well. They also told me when the AR was coming out - they were off by one day...I'll just leave it at that and you can take it for what it is worth to you. JMO

cool RC

yeah, i don't think Michelle ever changed her clothes for bed...was possibly getting ready .... with what she had on fits with being at home that evening, watching TV....imo

 

[close_enough]

Was he really trying to strangle her or just control her? Look at the size of JYs hands - he could have held her neck with one hand if she were pressed against something - the hyoid bone was not broken - he didn't try very hard to strangle her - she was tiny at 5'6 and 124 pounds compared to him IMO.

control her...hold her while he grabs the murder weapon

 

[raisincharlie]

cool RC

yeah, i don't think Michelle ever changed her clothes for bed...was possibly getting ready .... with what she had on fits with being at home that evening, watching TV....imo

I sure wish we knew the time on the Handee Hugo gas receipt for 11/2 - it is equally possible this gas may have been purchased when he returned to Raleigh (kind of sounding like he showed up at home not long after the company left) as it is that it was purchased on his way out for his supposed business meeting earlier in the evening. JMO

 

[scandi]

I know which poster you're talking about Charlie and always love it when they show up, which isn't all that often!

I have a feeling there might be something underway not to release the autopsy photos to the public, even though that is unusual in NC. The report is out and the photos still can't be seen. Bet JY's attny is working overtime on this! You can imagine how traumatic they must be.

 

[Taximom]

One thing keeps going through my mind. I'm assuming the strangulation was supposed to work, on the part of the murderer. Since it wasn't working (bet she fought back hard) the murderer had to quickly find something in the bedroom to stop her from fighting back and to kill her with. So whatever that was had to be in the bedroom. So far the flashlight or small heavier (brass?) lamp base sound like the most convenient things to reach for that might be in a bedroom.

Sorry for thinking out loud. Since I read the autopsy report I can't get over the amount of rage involved here for what was supposedly "the perfect couple".

Can you even imagine seeing your husband with his hands around your neck, trying to kill you?

 

[Taximom]

Was he really trying to strangle her or just control her? Look at the size of JYs hands - he could have held her neck with one hand if she were pressed against something - the hyoid bone was not broken - he didn't try very hard to strangle her - she was tiny at 5'6 and 124 pounds compared to him IMO.

Oh, I just saw this and close's response. That's a good point too. One hand (left) on her neck holding her down, and his right hand with the murder weapon hitting the left side of her head over and over and over and over again.

 

[raisincharlie]

I know which poster you're talking about Charlie and always love it when they show up, which isn't all that often!

I have a feeling there might be something underway not to release the autopsy photos to the public, even though that is unusual in NC. The report is out and the photos still can't be seen. Bet JY's attny is working overtime on this! You can imagine how traumatic they must be.

Scandi,

I don't know how the ME's office can believe for a minute it is a sound practice to allow any Tom Dick or Harry in to see autopsy photos. I'm sure this comes more from the legislative branch but IMO it is crazy. I can understand family members, LE, medical practitioners, jurors, and so on but the general public who most likely understands as little as I do - I can see no meaning to be found in these photos. I think it is morally reprehensible and irresponsible - JMO.

I don't think this autopsy report provides any of the extreme details in reality (nothing compared to the Pamela Vitale AR). I think those details are seperated into other reports for the express purpose of keeping that information from the public. A good move I think.

 

[close_enough]

One thing keeps going through my mind. I'm assuming the strangulation was supposed to work, on the part of the murderer. Since it wasn't working (bet she fought back hard) the murderer had to quickly find something in the bedroom to stop her from fighting back and to kill her with. So whatever that was had to be in the bedroom. So far the flashlight or small heavier (brass?) lamp base sound like the most convenient things to reach for that might be in a bedroom.
Sorry for thinking out loud. Since I read the autopsy report I can't get over the amount of rage involved here for what was supposedly "the perfect couple".

Can you even imagine seeing your husband with his hands around your neck, trying to kill you?

yes TM....makes perfect sense to me...

& no, i can't even imagine

 

[panthera]

Oh, I just saw this and close's response. That's a good point too. One hand (left) on her neck holding her down, and his right hand with the murder weapon hitting the left side of her head over and over and over and over again.

That is absolutely sickening to think of but it's not beyond belief. :furious:

 

[close_enough]

I sure wish we knew the time on the Handee Hugo gas receipt for 11/2 - it is equally possible this gas may have been purchased when he returned to Raleigh (kind of sounding like he showed up at home not long after the company left) as it is that it was purchased on his way out for his supposed business meeting earlier in the evening. JMO

yeah, the gas receipt dated 11/2....would be good to know

 

[LvsAMystry]

Oh, I just saw this and close's response. That's a good point too. One hand (left) on her neck holding her down, and his right hand with the murder weapon hitting the left side of her head over and over and over and over again.

This is what I think also. I don't think he had to reach for a weapon though, I believe the item in his right hand, a flashlight, may have become a weapon when her struggles were more intense than he expected. What better item to carry with you while skulking about in the middle of the night. It probably wasn't intended to be a weapon, but quickly became one.

 

[scandi]

I thought the AR would be much more detailed as well. Dr Baden said it was a thorough report, and I had to chuckle at him before I scratched my finger on my brow!

That new sorority sister that is posting says it is a positive fact Mm and JY were in Denver at the same time. That's it, a coincidence? She doesn't think so but knows nothing more than that. I'm tending to believe she is a valid poster from the way she states things.

 

[panthera]

This is what I think also. I don't think he had to reach for a weapon though, I believe the item in his right hand, a flashlight, may have become a weapon when her struggles were more intense than he expected. What better item to carry with you while skulking about in the middle of the night. It probably wasn't intended to be a weapon, but quickly became one.

I hadn't thought of that but if he'd entered the dark downstairs part of the house he might just have had the flashlight with him. It is so disgusting to think of what happened to this beautiful woman and the rage and hatred that ended her life.

 

[WhiteWolf]

i went back & looked also CP....these don't look quite like the 'injuries' that Kathleen Peterson had on the back of her head....these don't appear to be nearly as elongated as KP's were.....the one's here on MY seem almost crescent shaped, & then some don't.....hmmm

eta...does anyone else see the crescent shape in some of these injuries??...or is it just me?

i know one on the arm was noted "crescent" in the report....it was 1" long

A heavy flashlight like a Maglight brand could leave crescent shaped and elongated wounds if the flashlight was gripped at the lightbulb end and the handle used as the club. Police hold their flashlights with this grip so it can double as a club. Which direction does the open part of the crescent go in the drawing?

Edited to add: Do the crescents look like they clould come from some sort of hammer? The elongated wounds could be from an bad aim where the handle hit?