AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #6

[mum]

How did LE track EJ in Florida so fast? Did they already know she took a bus? I was wondering because it states on here http://www.tempe.gov/Police/EI/Gabriel Johnson Update.htm
that they didn't find the car for quite a few days later. If they had known she had taken a bus, and they had known she had a car, wouldn't they have looked around the bus station and found the car sooner?

 

[txsvicki]

I'm really worried that Gabriel was murdered. Anyone who would even threaten to kill a baby and cut up their clothes and bedding is very unstable. For the car seat to still be in the car is very ominous. I think that someone would have come forward by now if the baby was turned over to them. The Smith's don't really have much to tell and as usual they are just someone to use so that tv shows can sensationalize their episodes a bit more.

 

[dnrslucky1]

How did LE track EJ in Florida so fast? Did they already know she took a bus? I was wondering because it states on here http://www.tempe.gov/Police/EI/Gabriel Johnson Update.htm
that they didn't find the car for quite a few days later. If they had known she had taken a bus, and they had known she had a car, wouldn't they have looked around the bus station and found the car sooner?

I have often wondered why it took so long to locate the car. How they found Elizabeth so quick all the way in Florida is another good question.

 

[A_Closer_Look]

I agree with an earlier theory that EJ was tracked to the Florida hostel via the IP that she used to update her Myspace. It makes sense to me.

 

[Prof]

Prof (and I think Marigold was looking for this too), I'd posted that Tammi asked Janet from Nashville to call Eliz on Dec 26 or Dec 27. I just looked it up to confirm it. Please note that this also includes the date Eliz told Tammi about the 'underground' - Dec 26.

"

TAMMI SMITH: She told me, I believe it was the day before that Sunday that she had found a domestic violence -- she didn`t tell me a name. She just said that that was her plan to go there and they would take care of everything because that was our last plea to come back. I had a friend in Nashville that works with attorneys call her and plea to her to come back here to Arizona to court on Monday. I had my attorney call her and plea to her to come back here and go to court on that Monday, so -- yes.

CASAREZ: So you say that she said to you the Saturday before the Sunday -- so you`re saying -- the Sunday of the 27th, she left...

TAMMI SMITH: Right.

CASAREZ: ... San Antonio. So she was in San Antonio when she told you she had found an underground domestic violence shelter, a place to go?

TAMMI SMITH: Right."

Here is the link http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/08/ng.01.html

As Mark Klaas astutely questioned in this same show,
" Well, I mean, you know, there are inconsistencies that are even showing this evening, Jean. On the posting on Facebook it`s dated the 23rd of December, yet she told you just a few minutes ago that the first time the word "underground" was mentioned was on the 26th of December."

So, I guess I was hoping there was another report of when TS had her adoption friend call EJ. If it was before EJ left AZ maybe the advice given was different than what TS asserts. IMO we simply do not know. Why did TS not ask her lawyer or adoption friend to call EJ on the 23rd instead of gracing her journey with prayers?

In addition, my original point was that TS asking people help her convince EJ to come back is at least something that would make her look like she had good intentions, so why not add that nugget in all of her previous interviews? -before she was named a POI? before the FBI had to uncover it?

Why did we not see any evidence of her intentions posted? Why do we only find out of TS attempts to get EJ come back in her backpeddling explanations, after her previous posts and statements are discovered?

IDK I was just pondering, and looking for some reliable sources in this case. IMO Gabe could have been found before he disappeared, if TS could have reported EJ leaving AZ as soon as she knew EJ left AZ, at least as far back as Dec 23rd.

If she really wanted Logan to know anything of her intentions, why did she not call him or message him or post to his FB page?

 

[smart blonde]

I just don't see Elizabeth sitting silent in jail for this long if she could lead the authorities to a live baby Gabriel.

I believe, as I stated once before, that she is remaining silent for the same reason Casey stayed silent about Caylee.

The FBI and four states have been looking for this 8 month old baby round the clock- and as far as I can tell, are no closer to finding him than the day he was reported missing.

 

[Prof]

I'm really worried that Gabriel was murdered. Anyone who would even threaten to kill a baby and cut up their clothes and bedding is very unstable. For the car seat to still be in the car is very ominous. I think that someone would have come forward by now if the baby was turned over to them. The Smith's don't really have much to tell and as usual they are just someone to use so that tv shows can sensationalize their episodes a bit more.

It might be a stretch, but if Gabe was put on a plane there would not be a need for a carseat?--also if anyone was thinking of covering tracks and leaving behind as much evidence as possible that either could be identified or tie Gabe's whereabouts to another location?

Perhaps the people EJ dealt with in SA were experienced in these types of abductions/adoptions and perhaps they even brought new clothes to take Gabe away in? IDK just pondering in my desperate hope that Gabe is alive

 

[smart blonde]

There have to be tens of thousands of garbage dumpsters between Tempe, Az and San Antonio, Tx.

Tens of thousands of dumpsters, heading off to hundreds of landfills, in all different directions.

 

[allaster]

I feel her silence speaks volumes.

 

[mum]

[/SIZE]

Here is the link http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/08/ng.01.html

As Mark Klaas astutely questioned in this same show,
" Well, I mean, you know, there are inconsistencies that are even showing this evening, Jean. On the posting on Facebook it`s dated the 23rd of December, yet she told you just a few minutes ago that the first time the word "underground" was mentioned was on the 26th of December."

So, I guess I was hoping there was another report of when TS had her adoption friend call EJ. If it was before EJ left AZ maybe the advice given was different than what TS asserts. IMO we simply do not know. Why did TS not ask her lawyer or adoption friend to call EJ on the 23rd instead of gracing her journey with prayers?

In addition, my original point was that TS asking people help her convince EJ to come back is at least something that would make her look like she had good intentions, so why not add that nugget in all of her previous interviews? -before she was named a POI? before the FBI had to uncover it?

Why did we not see any evidence of her intentions posted? Why do we only find out of TS attempts to get EJ come back in her backpeddling explanations, after her previous posts and statements are discovered?

IDK I was just pondering, and looking for some reliable sources in this case. IMO Gabe could have been found before he disappeared, if TS could have reported EJ leaving AZ as soon as she knew EJ left AZ, at least as far back as Dec 23rd.

If she really wanted Logan to know anything of her intentions, why did she not call him or message him or post to his FB page?

Tammi Peters Smith Hi Janet, how are you doing?? Looks like your doing great! Are you still working on adoptions?
October 15, 2009 at 10:57am · See Wall-to-Wall

 

[Prof]

I just don't see Elizabeth sitting silent in jail for this long if she could lead the authorities to a live baby Gabriel.

I believe, as I stated once before, that she is remaining silent for the same reason Casey stayed silent about Caylee.

The FBI and four states have been looking for this 8 month old baby round the clock- and as far as I can tell, are no closer to finding him than the day he was reported missing.

I guess I am giving it the benefit of the doubt -up until a day ago she did not have a lawyer, and I know the judge advised her not to speak until she had a lawyer

IMO the video of her first court appearance in AZ demonstrated an EJ that wanted to talk; she had a difficult time controlling herself, and the last thing she asked was "WHEN do I get a lawyer"

Holding out hope here

 

[what about this?]

I think the parts where TS inserts herself into the phone interview with Elizabeth are important. Tammi makes sure to say that she tried to get Elizabeth to come back and that Logan pushed her over the edge. Nothing is said about the events when Elizabeth left Arizona, who may have helped her make that decision, and conversation that took place from Tempe to SA. Sometimes it is more important what people don't mention as opposed to what they do mention. Tammi was desperate to bring out certain statements on the phone. She never once asked anything about why Elizabeth left in the first place, I believe because she didn't want to risk EJ blurting out her involvement.

If Tammi had nothing to do with what happened in SA (and I'm not sure she didn't), I still believe she played a vital role in getting Elizabeth to run to Texas. If there are inconsistencies in the polygraph, I wonder if they center on TS's involvement in the beginning of EJ's departure and trip.

BBM

LOL - Kind of like balloon boy!

I am just reading through, but I still think the similarities in the baby's name and TPS' biological daughter is not a coincidence -- I think the airport story is absolute crap. I believe that the Smiths met Elizabeth before she gave birth. JMO

 

[smart blonde]

When Elizabeth contacted Logan and told him she had killed Gabriel, and put his dead, blue body in a baby/diaper bag in a dumpster, I don't think she was taunting him... I think she was bragging.

 

[fay]

This case and the way it's being handled by LE is puzzling at best. There are several things that are and aren't going on that seem out of the ordinary for a missing child search.
*If LE knows Gabriel is alive, whats taking so long to bring him home?
*If the baby is deceased where is the search for the body in all the locations that mom was, like here in S Fl. No news here on the case.
*Who is Elizabeths lawyer and why no statement whether they are refusing or co-operating with LE.
* Inconclusive poly is not the same as truthful, why not another poly, like yesterday.
*Who is the Smiths atty?
*Reward? Why not.
*With so many players, why isn't someone telling the truth? They got to know the hammers gonna fall at some point.
*When are the cops going to tell the Smiths enough is enough and question them in an interrogation room for about 12 hours. What makes them so special?
I think this case is really making me angry. This is almost as bad as the Anthony case, but at least there there was evidence as to the manner of disappearance.
There are a whole more questions than answers.

 

[forthelost]

Good point, would they cover formula then? And if baby is covered by WIC, is mom automatically covered too?

It's intended to cover both. Formula is covered in most cases, especially when the baby needs a specific kind of formula. But cheese/peanut butter/juice/milk may not be covered. Once again, it's about what the mother and child may need.

 

[January.]

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/2581663/missing_baby_gabriel_johnson_tammi.html?cat=41


Tammi is writing a book called The Silenced?

We actually covered that in the first thread for Gabriel. Glad to see the reporters are finally catching up to us :crazy:

 

[smart blonde]

I guess I am giving it the benefit of the doubt -up until a day ago she did not have a lawyer, and I know the judge advised her not to speak until she had a lawyer

IMO the video of her first court appearance in AZ demonstrated an EJ that wanted to talk; she had a difficult time controlling herself, and the last thing she asked was "WHEN do I get a lawyer"

Holding out hope here

The thing is, in my opinion, by the time she had made that court appearence in Arizona, she had more than likely already been questioned by the FBI.

If this 23 year old young woman wouldn't give up the information for the FBI, I believe it is because she knows little Gabriel is no longer alive.

 

[SusanB]

How did LE track EJ in Florida so fast? Did they already know she took a bus? I was wondering because it states on here http://www.tempe.gov/Police/EI/Gabriel Johnson Update.htm
that they didn't find the car for quite a few days later. If they had known she had taken a bus, and they had known she had a car, wouldn't they have looked around the bus station and found the car sooner?

Apparently, after Logan received the ominous text saying she killed the baby, he called LE and they tracked her to where she was located by that.

 

[CHICANA]

Good thinking! I believe you have to sign the WIC coupons and sometimes show ID. The ID thing depends on the store. If the store is used to the coupons there is usually no problem just signing and going straight through.

AND.... I'm thinking that some states now have WIC cards that are very similar to debit cards. They are scanned and the items are deducted... I need to look that one up but I swear I just saw a lady use a WIC debit type card the other day.... Hmmmmmm....

Salem

I'm pretty sure that you can only use WIC in the state where it's issued.

 

[smart blonde]

I'm really worried that Gabriel was murdered. Anyone who would even threaten to kill a baby and cut up their clothes and bedding is very unstable. For the car seat to still be in the car is very ominous. I think that someone would have come forward by now if the baby was turned over to them. The Smith's don't really have much to tell and as usual they are just someone to use so that tv shows can sensationalize their episodes a bit more.

I agree 100% with txsvicki's post above.

Believe me, I would love for Gabriel to be found safe and alive, just like everybody else. My heart is aching for this baby.

I just feel the most obvious (in my mind), and most simple explanation as to what happened to Gabriel is that he was murdered by his mother.