AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #22

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iSleuth said:
Now for some really interesting reading, if you haven't done so yet I highly recommend reading @twitter search BringIsaHome...check out---> followers and followees

notice anything?

:hills:
Click to expand...

??? Can you be more specific?
 
iSleuth said:
Now for some really interesting reading, if you haven't done so yet I highly recommend reading @twitter search BringIsaHome...check out---> followers and followees

notice anything?

:hills:
Click to expand...

Twitter baffles me. What should we be looking for/at?!?
 
iSleuth said:
Now for some really interesting reading, if you haven't done so yet I highly recommend reading @twitter search BringIsaHome...check out---> followers and followees

notice anything?

:hills:
Click to expand...

I don't do Facebook or Twitter, so you'll have to provide additional info if the site is public. Thanks.
 
oceanblueeyes said:
I know this is not popular opinion but I never go by statistics when neither the child nor the perp has been found and the case isnt resolved. Until those two events happens there is no way to know what statistical group Isa is in.

Marlene Lamar never joined in on the actual searches either and LE will ask the family members to not join in the actual searches for their loved ones and they have good reasons for not wanting them to do so. She did as the Celis family is doing and is making sure fliers are passed out and put up in businesses and every area the owners of the property will let them put one up. I also believe a fund was set up for the Lamar family to aide them in putting up fliers and whatever else they thought was necessary.

I am under the impression Marc's team is still in CA looking for Sierra's remains. From what some locals have said a lot of the property is privately owned and there are also historial things that cant be disturbed. Tim Miller would only come in if he had permission from TPD to come in. He always makes sure they are on board and are ok with it when he comes to search any area.

IMO
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I agree with you ocean and tho, there definitely are cases where we have been on opposing sides of the fence.. or one of us on the fence and the others feet firmly planted on one side or the other.. even in those cases I have always read your posts and respected your point of view.. even more so than respecting your point of view about any specific case above all i respect your kind and patient replies that many a time were a rebuttal of an opposite opinion than what is/was my own.. i admire your patience and kindness that are always present in your posts(even when there at times has only been yourself that was still standing firm on what you believe to be most likely to have occurred to a particular victim.. and that being the minority or unpopular opinion or stance)..even then when the snark is at peaked levels you still remain patient and kind and if nothing else just reiterating why it is that you are of the particular opinion about the case.. i believe sometimes your ability to remain steadfast, yet patient and kind is unfortunately mistaken as shark.. i know ill admit years ago that I at one point had mistaken your patience and kindness as passive aggressive snark:blushing: but after having posted alongside of you for several years i quickly realized that it never was anything but you firmly standing your ground and at risk of being a broken record.. well.. when all else failed you would just patiently reiterated why it is you were at that particular conclusion at that present time in a case..

No matter how many times your opinion may be drawn into question as to how/why your firm stance is what it is.. your kind soul replies with exactly what are the issues, details, evidence, or lack thereof that had led you to form your opinion.. i appreciate that and its definitely NOT due to the fact that we happen to be of similar opinions on aspects of our little Isabel's case.. because just over the course of these last few months in following Sierra LaMar 's case you and I could have not been on more opposite ends of the spectrum as far as our opinion as to who was the likely perp responsible for Sierra's abduction/murder(also on total opposite ends of the spectrum in the Shacknai case) ..but in the Lamar case while i was very very disliking of Marlene LaMar and felt she was a pathetic liar that not necessarily was responsible for her daughters disappearance but was very much responsible for turning a blind eye and after the fact continuing to turn a blind eye that i personally believed was hindering her daughters case being resolved and finding her youngest daughter and bringing her home.. and i was very vocal about my opinions(as I'm known to be:blushing: )

But all along you were kind and patient with my ranting and raving so to speak about Sierra's mother and tho, you strongly felt that i was wrong you still always replied with patience and kindness reiterating to me and others why it is that you felt this mother was an absolute innocent victim who did not deserve the harsh criticism she was being dealt(especially here at WS and specifically by me, myself) .. tho, i thought you were just wanting to see "the good in everyone" and were failing to see the signs that i felt so very sure that Marlene was displaying.. even tho, i still always read your posts and appreciated them as we'll as noted your continued patience..

So, as we all now know I could not have been more wrong about what it is that i saw in Marlene.. I can/will always immediately admit when I have absolutely barked up the wrong tree and was even waaaaaaay off base as I obviously was in sierra's case.. i was absolutely wrong.. wrong.. wrong! ..and have tried to atleast step back and reevaluate the entire case along with Marlene deameanors to see what i could take away and learn from my being wrong.. i now strongly believe that i allowed my personal dislike for Marlene to possibly cloud my judgement along with a history of other parental involvement in missing children cases ..these two combined over shadowed everything IMO and had me totally missing the mark where Marlene is concerned..

I am now very sorry for my extremely harsh criticism i had for this victim, Marlene and tho, she may not be someone who in real life i would befriend or "like" and could easily find issues in her parenting skills or lack thereof that i do not personally agree with.. but the fact remains that i was very wrong and she in no way whatsoever deserved the harsh criticism that i was selfishly doling out onto her from my comfortable armchair sleuth position several thousand miles away..

Anyhoo my intent was not to drone on but rather to say that in all cases that i follow along side you(ones where we agree and ones where we STRONGLY DISAGREE). that I greatly appreciate you, your posts, and your patient and kind nature that beam through your words on the screen of my phone or tablet or laptop.. i think your one smart cookie, with years of experience and wisdom that I look up to and learn from.. and altogether you're one helluva woman that id be proud to call a friend in real life..

Thanks ocean for your patience and kindness that you show all of us no matter what side of the fence or end of the spectrum we may happen to be on.. :hug:
 
oceanblueeyes said:
... A large part of the donated monies is going to increase the reward for information concerning Isa's whereabouts.

It seems simple to me...those that have a problem with the fund will not give anyway and will not be involved in any monies given...Some of the ones that do actually give may care...

IMO
Click to expand...

Respectfully <snipped>.

If and/or when Isabel's parents are cleared of any involvement in their daughter's disappearance, I would be happy to make a generous contribution to the Bring Isa Home fund. There are probably other 'Sleuthers who will do likewise when they are certain that Becky and Sergio are not in any way responsible for Isabel's disappearance.

And, yes, I would specify that my donation be used for the Reward fund so that whoever is responsible for Isabel's disappearance is eventually brought to justice. :moo:
 
I'm sorry I haven't had time to catch up today, but I will try to post this link. Since I haven't been here very long, I'm still unsure which websites can be used and which are unacceptable here. This link doesn't come up ***********, so hopefully it's OK.

A financially motivated hoax has seemed reasonable to me since I first heard the lack of urgency or fear in Sergio and Becky's voices (especially after researching financials at the Recorder's office).

In trying to catch up, I noticed several early comments about a hoax. Some still seem to believe that this could be a possibility.

I don't know if any of you have listened to the internet radio interview with Sergio and Becky from early May. It's on blogtalkradio, so I'm not sure if it's allowed on Websleuths. The SC/BC interview portion starts at 73:00 minutes. It's a very long program which includes almost an hour on the Bring Isa Home song creation and promotion (after the Celis interview).

IMO this interview supports concern about the family's focus on fundraising. The family interview is fairly confusing but talks primarily about donations.

Sergio spends time talking about all the worldwide attention, his daughter's face on billboards, how well the purple bracelets are doing, etc. Becky talks about how to donate nationwide through Wells Fargo and online at the BringIsaHome and the TMC websites. She also mentions an election coming up and says she hopes politicians will get involved (I'm not sure what she means by that).

I still don't hear concern about their daughter. IMO they sound relaxed. They don't really give the impression of being very "private" people. I don't know, maybe they were more comfortable doing a phone interview than TV. This was taped right after the Today show appearance.

Maybe I missed it, but I've tried to search back and haven't found this interview linked here. I just noticed it a few days ago at another blog. It definitely gives another glimpse into the way SC and BC think, and the importance of fundraising. It does show that Sergio's focus on worldwide attention (previous mention of 9/11) was not just an isolated slip of the tongue on the Today Show.

Even if it was mentioned here three weeks ago, it might still be good to revisit the interview now (after the CPS involvement, 911 tape release, and doc dump). I think many people noticed different aspects of the Today show interview, when we re-watched it recently.

The radio show is called "Solutions Now" and is apparently hosted by Denise Newton and Skyler Jett. I don't guess this is really MSM, but these are SC's and BC's words. We have heard so little from them that any additional insight seems important. I assume that LE found the interview interesting. If this link isn't acceptable you can still Google and find the interview.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/soluti...8/judge-judys-bailiff-meet-petri-hawkins-byrd

One other quick point:

After listening to the interview, I called the TMC donation site to try to find out more about the Isa fund. I asked if their Isa fund is tax deductible, if they give receipts for tax purposes, and if they are affilliated with BringIsaHome.

It may depend on who you talk to, but this person seemed to say that they don't consider the fund to be tax deductible. She said it's up to the individual whether they try to deduct, but TMC doesn't give tax receipts.

She said they established the fund to help out, because Isa's mom works there, and the donations go into a fund for the family.

She did say that they were not affiliated with BringIsaHome.

This is not what I expected. I thought we assumed that BringIsaHome was getting a tax deductible status from TMC. But I haven't been able to find it stated anywhere that BringIsaHome donations are tax deductible and now I don't know about the TMC fund. Has anyone else found actual documentation of tax deductible status for the donations?

I ended up confused, but I didn't want to call back and ask TMC to repeat their answers. Maybe others can call TMC and see if they get different information.

I just saw another comment about donations going to increase the available reward. IMO the TMC fund and the BringIsaHome fund are supposed to be for the family and to help in their search. The actual reward is through donations to 88-crime which is completely separate and controlled by Pima County.
 
kat77 said:
I'm sorry I haven't had time to catch up today, but I will try to post this link. Since I haven't been here very long, I'm still unsure which websites can be used and which are unacceptable here. This link doesn't come up ***********, so hopefully it's OK.

A financially motivated hoax has seemed reasonable to me since I first heard the lack of urgency or fear in Sergio and Becky's voices (especially after researching financials at the Recorder's office).

In trying to catch up, I noticed several early comments about a hoax. Some still seem to believe that this could be a possibility.

I don't know if any of you have listened to the internet radio interview with Sergio and Becky from early May. It's on blogtalkradio, so I'm not sure if it's allowed on Websleuths. The SC/BC interview portion starts at 73:00 minutes. It's a very long program which includes almost an hour on the Bring Isa Home song creation and promotion (after the Celis interview).

IMO this interview supports concern about the family's focus on fundraising. The family interview is fairly confusing but talks primarily about donations.

Sergio spends time talking about all the worldwide attention, his daughter's face on billboards, how well the purple bracelets are doing, etc. Becky talks about how to donate nationwide through Wells Fargo and online at the BringIsaHome and the TMC websites. She also mentions an election coming up and says she hopes politicians will get involved (I'm not sure what she means by that).

I still don't hear concern about their daughter. IMO they sound relaxed. They don't really give the impression of being very "private" people. I don't know, maybe they were more comfortable doing a phone interview than TV. This was taped right after the Today show appearance.

Maybe I missed it, but I've tried to search back and haven't found this interview linked here. I just noticed it a few days ago at another blog. It definitely gives another glimpse into the way SC and BC think, and the importance of fundraising. It does show that Sergio's focus on worldwide attention (previous mention of 9/11) was not just an isolated slip of the tongue on the Today Show.

Even if it was mentioned here three weeks ago, it might still be good to revisit the interview now (after the CPS involvement, 911 tape release, and doc dump). I think many people noticed different aspects of the Today show interview, when we re-watched it recently.

The radio show is called "Solutions Now" and is apparently hosted by Denise Newton and Skyler Jett. I don't guess this is really MSM, but these are SC's and BC's words. We have heard so little from them that any additional insight seems important. I assume that LE found the interview interesting. If this link isn't acceptable you can still Google and find the interview.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/soluti...8/judge-judys-bailiff-meet-petri-hawkins-byrd

One other quick point:

After listening to the interview, I called the TMC donation site to try to find out more about the Isa fund. I asked if their Isa fund is tax deductible, if they give receipts for tax purposes, and if they are affilliated with BringIsaHome.

It may depend on who you talk to, but this person seemed to say that they don't consider the fund to be tax deductible. She said it's up to the individual whether they try to deduct, but TMC doesn't give tax receipts.

She said they established the fund to help out, because Isa's mom works there, and the donations go into a fund for the family.

She did say that they were not affiliated with BringIsaHome.

This is not what I expected. I thought we assumed that BringIsaHome was getting a tax deductible status from TMC. But I haven't been able to find it stated anywhere that BringIsaHome donations are tax deductible and now I don't know about the TMC fund. Has anyone else found actual documentation of tax deductible status for the donations?

I ended up confused, but I didn't want to call back and ask TMC to repeat their answers. Maybe others can call TMC and see if they get different information.

I just saw another comment about donations going to increase the available reward. IMO the TMC fund and the BringIsaHome fund are supposed to be for the family and to help in their search. The actual reward is through donations to 88-crime which is completely separate and controlled by Pima County.
Click to expand...

:goodpost:

I think the blogtalkradio show should be ok to post - it is Becky and Sergio on the show and they sounded way more comfortable in their speaking on this show than in other tv interviews we have seen. IMO

You are right - I do not hear one bit of concern for their missing child. It is odd.

ETA:
I also wonder how they knew about this radio show and why they chose to call into it. Who was the woman who was plugging all the ways to donate?
 
Sergio seems to have an inflated view of this case's notoriety. He likes to focus on the worldwide attention, but besides The Daily Mail and maybe some media in Mexico, how much international attention has there really been? There's a minuscule percentage of non-Americans who know about this case. They have their own cases to worry about. But why does worldwide coverage even matter? So if Isabel was kidnapped and taken to Mongolia, everyone there could recognize her? It seems that Sergio is fascinated by the perceived worldwide attention. After all, the more people that know your name (or your daughter's name), the more famous you/she is. Why so much focus on the entire world instead of on Arizona or the United States? Especially when international attention is almost non-existant?

It seems he got a little taste of "fame" and it went to his head.
 
Azcrabcakes said:
That is already not a rare occurrence in AZ. Since the bodies were found in the back seat and floorboard, and no dead driver or front seat passengers, my husband and I think the bodies were dead, and were about to be dumped in the desert. In the last few months I have read of two occasions of abandoned semi's of dead bodies found in Mexico, along with dead bodies piled up in public. Why would it NOT happen here in AZ? It is so easy to cross the border...
Click to expand...

Turns out this is a family, the Butwins, from the Phoenix area who had been reported missing. It appears they were going through a bitter divorce.

Sometimes I feel we are starting to feel that all these point to cartel activity. I think most are, but we are starting to be quick to point to the cartel. Even the dumb sheriff of Pinal County made the claim before knowing the facts. Sickening the fear they are generating in our community!


http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/story/1...psies-fail-to-id-5-burned-bodies-in-az-desert

http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/story/1...cartel-to-five-bodies-found-in-burned-out-car
 
Knox said:
http://twitter.com/#!/BringIsaHome

No account is necessary to view it, BDE ...
Click to expand...

Does anyone else find it interesting that it is stated in this article that:

"Investigators collected samples of what appeared to be blood on the missing girl's bedroom floor and on other items, and Villasenor says TPD is doing forensic tests on those items."

I do not recall reading/hearing that there was blood on other items as well as on the floor.
 
Kat77,
That's the right interview, listening now, I just don't know what to say. ~shaking head~
 
kat77 said:
After listening to the interview, I called the TMC donation site to try to find out more about the Isa fund.... I asked if their Isa fund is tax deductible, if they give receipts for tax purposes, and if they are affilliated with BringIsaHome. It may depend on who you talk to, but this person seemed to say that they don't consider the fund to be tax deductible. She said it's up to the individual whether they try to deduct, but TMC doesn't give tax receipts.
Click to expand...

Kat, great find!

Hmmmm, not tax-deductible?? Must be a for-profit arrangement. :what:
 
Lark2 said:
Kat, great find!

Hmmmm, not tax-deductible?? Must be a for-profit arrangement. :what:
Click to expand...

On the bringisahome.com "donations" page, it says that donations can be made at wells Fargo, and the deposit slip "can be used for your taxes."
 
oceanblueeyes said:
The Celis' arent in control of this fund anyway are they? Maybe those that are thinks this is what they need to do. A large part of the donated monies is going to increase the reward for information concerning Isa's whereabouts.

As far as funds set up that seems to happen in about every case we see where someone is missing whether it is a child or an adult.

I dont have any need to know why or how the money is being spent. Personally, I have given to many funds over the years setup for missing people (adults and children) and even gave to children who had one of their parents murdered by the other parent.

I give the money because I want to and what the family does with it is no concern to me. I dont even care if the family takes the money I sent and goes out and has a nice dinner with their family. Once I give it ....it no longer is my money.

It seems simple to me...those that have a problem with the fund will not give anyway and will not be involved in any monies given. Some of the ones that do actually give may care but I am not one of those. I never expect a spreadsheet or PL statement. We dont file a long form on our taxes so I dont even keep the receipt for the funds that I have given.

IMO
Click to expand...

BBM

That's how I feel too, oceanblueeyes. If you are suspicious of the parents, I guess don't give, it's your choice. BUT, like you, once I give someone money, it is theirs to do with as they wish. Just like if I give someone begging for change or holding a sign (will work for food) $10 or $20- I HOPE that person uses it for food, but if they use it for booze or whatever, oh well, that is their choice. If I was concerned about it I wouldn't give it.
 
IMO This radio interview from four weeks ago, when Isa had been missing two weeks, sounds much like the other two interviews of the parents.
IMO those who think the parents are responsible will hear one thing, while others who may doubt the parents' involvement in the disappearance will hear something else. I heard concern for Isa throughout this interview. Both parents speak about bringing Isa home throughout the interview, IMO.
 
Okay, I'll say it, Where's the fear? Where's the sorrow? I do not hear it in their interviews, esp this interview. It's like the interview is for donations and trying to make Isa a world sensation. They sure have let everyone know where to put donations, but we still know very little about Isabel. Not one time did they talk to Isabel in it, just in case...
 
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