AZ - Timothy Romans, 39, & Vincent Romero, 29, slain, St Johns, 5 Nov 2008 - #2

[Tricia]

Please continue here.......

 

[chiperoni]

I can buy it too. That is extraordinary for an eight year old to keep a log of his number of hits.
There are also so many unanswered questions especially about the renter Timothy Romans?
What is his reputation with people who have socialized with him? He didn't have negative feedback in the newspapers, but what about his peers and people who grew up with him?
Timothy lived in the house so was he involved in the disciplining the boy or an innocent by-stander. The boy loved his father but what was his relationship with Timothy? Were Timothy and the father close friends? Not to speak ill of a victim but we need to know more about him. He could have just been in the wrong place at the wrong time "a witness" or was he more involved with the boy than we know. Either way the more light we shed on this will give us a better picture of the child.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

So many things do not add up to me. First I cant see a child that had a murderous rage like this just patiently waiting until the 1,000th spanking. I just don't see them that patient.

If he just scribbled some numbers on a piece of paper how do we even know they are true? I just think this boy is very unique somehow and set this entire thing up from beginning of devising the notes to the end. He even seemed to know he would go to juvie already. Does he see juvie as not all that bad or long? All children know about child abuse and some children are known to threaten to false report their parents for it even if they aren't guilty.

He said he stayed in trouble a lot because he lied about things. That gives me great pause, is this another wild tale? A 1,000 seems to be a number a child would think is huge.

I still do not feel a strict parent equals abuse. There simply is no handbook given out when it comes to raising children. I think it all depends on the child and their personality and demeanor as to what discipline is necessary.

And I don't agree that spankings aren't necessary at times when it comes to bringing papers home. We have no idea how long they had tried to cajole or reason with him to bring his homework home without any results. This may have gone on week after week and he still didn't do as they had asked of him. Some children are just more unruly than others and requires more discipline.

There still has to be much we don't know about this boy if his own grandmother says he is capable of murder at 8 years old.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I can buy it too. That is extraordinary for an eight year old to keep a log of his number of hits.
There are also so many unanswered questions especially about the renter Timothy Romans?
What is his reputation with people who have socialized with him? He didn't have negative feedback in the newspapers, but what about his peers and people who grew up with him?
Timothy lived in the house so was he involved in the disciplining the boy or an innocent by-stander. The boy loved his father but what was his relationship with Timothy? Were Timothy and the father close friends? Not to speak ill of a victim but we need to know more about him. He could have just been in the wrong place at the wrong time "a witness" or was he more involved with the boy than we know. Either way the more light we shed on this will give us a better picture of the child.

It doesn't seem to fit with what has been released. Like Romero's funeral, hundreds attended Romans funeral as well.

http://www.azfamily.com/news/homepa...-local-news-111408-romans-wake.1b30dc409.html

I just keep thinking about the confession and how calm and cool this boy was as he weaved lie after lie without blinking an eye.

He seems to be very adept at making up outlandish stories.

imoo

 

[Hailiejade77]

I still am not going to throw this child under the bus until I know more facts. I just don't know yet. jmo

 

[Shock]

• The victims' co-workers, friends and family told detectives that the two men recently had been involved in minor disputes with colleagues at a nearby power plant and with men at a local bar.


• Police in San Carlos, where Romans grew up, told St. Johns investigators that he had a prior drug arrest and was suspected of minor drug dealing. Friends of Romans told St. Johns police that he was getting a divorce.

Juvenile-booking records show the 8-year-old had no history of psychiatric care and was not on any medications. They list the boy at 4 feet tall, and 65 pounds.

 

[Trino]

So many things do not add up to me. First I cant see a child that had a murderous rage like this just patiently waiting until the 1,000th spanking. I just don't see them that patient.

If he just scribbled some numbers on a piece of paper how do we even know they are true? I just think this boy is very unique somehow and set this entire thing up from beginning of devising the notes to the end. He even seemed to know he would go to juvie already. Does he see juvie as not all that bad or long? All children know about child abuse and some children are known to threaten to false report their parents for it even if they aren't guilty.

He said he stayed in trouble a lot because he lied about things. That gives me great pause, is this another wild tale? A 1,000 seems to be a number a child would think is huge.

I still do not feel a strict parent equals abuse. There simply is no handbook given out when it comes to raising children. I think it all depends on the child and their personality and demeanor as to what discipline is necessary.

And I don't agree that spankings aren't necessary at times when it comes to bringing papers home. We have no idea how long they had tried to cajole or reason with him to bring his homework home without any results. This may have gone on week after week and he still didn't do as they had asked of him. Some children are just more unruly than others and requires more discipline.

There still has to be much we don't know about this boy if his own grandmother says he is capable of murder at 8 years old.

I agree with everything you've stated, especially patiently waiting until he reached 1,000. I don't think a 3rd grader has discipline enough to make such a list. How long did he keep this list? Months? Years?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

• The victims' co-workers, friends and family told detectives that the two men recently had been involved in minor disputes with colleagues at a nearby power plant and with men at a local bar.


• Police in San Carlos, where Romans grew up, told St. Johns investigators that he had a prior drug arrest and was suspected of minor drug dealing. Friends of Romans told St. Johns police that he was getting a divorce.

Juvenile-booking records show the 8-year-old had no history of psychiatric care and was not on any medications. They list the boy at 4 feet tall, and 65 pounds.

We had already heard about the dispute Vincent had with a female coworker over some forklift keys. It is on the Apache Co. Courthouse website. Police said they checked the coworkers out. I believe I read that Romans was a construction foreman at the power plant. I seem to recall that VR was also a construction supervisor of some sort.

What link is that information from Shock?

I don't think the size has anything to do with crime. He sure was very capable of using a youth model 22 rifle.

imoo

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Hi
I'm not going to give up on him either.Something led up to this.I guess the thing that bothers me is he did seem unemotional during the interview.But if he was abused he probably would act that way.

suzanne

 

[Shock]

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2008/11/27/20081127stjohns1127.html


The kid could not have shot these men that many times in the chest with the .22 single shot rifle. I still say a semi-automatic .22 was used (by someone) for the frontal body shots.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Hi
One thing that bothered me was if I remember correctly it says in the transcripts one of the police officers were asked did you take(Mr Romans)pulse. The officer answers no.But he checked his leg.He said it was warm.I'm thinking he must not have been dead long.I wonder how long his dad had been dead?I'm curious of what the ME will say.

suzanne

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Hi
Quote from the newspaper article
However, the seized evidence includes a spelling worksheet with blood on it and another sheet of paper labeled, "Story (boy's first name) the Family."

I'm curious where they found this spelling worksheet with blood on it.

suzanne

 

[Bobbisangel]

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2008/11/27/20081127stjohns1127.html


The kid could not have shot these men that many times in the chest with the .22 single shot rifle. I still say a semi-automatic .22 was used (by someone) for the frontal body shots.

Why do you think that wouldn't be possible? I know nothing about guns but couldn't the first shot have incapacitated (sp) the men so that they couldn't have gotten up? Or so that they couldn't have fought back?

 

[Trino]

Why do you think that wouldn't be possible? I know nothing about guns but couldn't the first shot have incapacitated (sp) the men so that they couldn't have gotten up? Or so that they couldn't have fought back?

There has been no indication of any other weapon than the boy's .22, so it certainly seems you are correct.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2008/11/27/20081127stjohns1127.html


The kid could not have shot these men that many times in the chest with the .22 single shot rifle. I still say a semi-automatic .22 was used (by someone) for the frontal body shots.

It sure sounds consistent to me, Shock. The neighbors said they heard a POP then a DELAY....then a POP and then a DELAY each time. Four shots heard. These would have to be the shots fired out into the open area and not the ones fired into Romero who was inside the home up on the stairwell by a hallway.

imoo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Why do you think that wouldn't be possible? I know nothing about guns but couldn't the first shot have incapacitated (sp) the men so that they couldn't have gotten up? Or so that they couldn't have fought back?

You are absolutely right, Bobbi. What must be considered is this weapon was fired within a short distance into the two men. Anytime that happens the shots sustained are much more traumatic and life threatening than if they had been fired hundreds of yards away at the victims. A 22 rifle bullet can travel up to a mile. It is a long range weapon. Fired this closely it becomes much more lethal with each hit.

imoo

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Hi
Quote
These would have to be the shots fired out into the open area and not the ones fired into Romero who was inside the home up on the stairwell by a hallway.

Are these the shots the little boy said he fired at the car they never checked for.

suzanne

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Hi
Quote
These would have to be the shots fired out into the open area and not the ones fired into Romero who was inside the home up on the stairwell by a hallway.

Are these the shots the little boy said he fired at the car they never checked for.

suzanne

I thought he said he fired ONCE at the vehicle?

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Hi
All I rememember is he siad he fired at the car.I don't think he said how many times.If I remember correctly the police officer in the transcripts was asked did you check for the car.He said no.I think he said we only had a discription of a white car.

suzanne

 

[fran]

So now we find out that these two men had recently been in a dispute with 'coworkers and someone in a local bar.' Also that one (previously) had a drug problem AND was going through a divorce (with the person he was alleged to be talking to just prior to his death). Now we have grandparents say they 'thought' the boy did it?

How were these grandparents related? ie the bio mom's parents? the step mom's parents? the bio dad's parents?

Who, what, when, where were these recent 'arguments' with others?

I would like to know more details about the boarders relationship with his wife. I would also like to know IF the boarder had a life insurance policy, etc.

I have two grandsons, one being eight, the other twelve. While both of these boys are extremely smart, I still can't see them plotting and carrying out this crime (on their own). I've raised six children and not ONE of them would have been capable of plotting such a diabolical scheme. Not ONE. (on their own!)

The fact that the boy mentioned 'juvie' doesn't mean a thing to me. SOMEONE may have already discussed that with the boy prior to the murders.

I'm still not ready to throw this boy under the bus for this crime. Something isn't right here. I just can't put my finger on it........

I need to know a LOT more! I HOPE LE isn't ready to throw away the key here. That's too easy, IMO. MUCH too easy............

JMHO
fran

PS.....I don't know if anyone else would agree with me, but the boy having a ledger and 'story' about this? Doesn't this sound a little bit too perfect? I know we're constantly amazed at the stupidity of criminals, but............this is TOO coincidental, IMHO......fran