Back to the Beginning: Where Might Kyron Be?

[orb4me]

JMO, flights, cruises are out, because there are just too many video cameras around both places. Selling this poor baby would be easy to do if you knew the right people. Where did stepmom get all her money to pay the attorney? Im sure she has more of that money. The child buyer paid 1/2 million for such a beautiful child? Do we know if the money was in a bank or was is it cash? Can the FBI order the attorneys checking account statements? No..surely she didnt walk into the attorneys office carring 350,000. Im really sure that the FBI knows where the money come from. If he is alive.

If his was killed, then was she a scuba diver? why was the sticker taken off the back window of that car? Can you leave the basement of the school directly to the parking lot? Why are we using 8:45 as the last time he was seen?

 

[mysteriew]

If I were going to mount a search, I would first do a search within one mile of the Horman home. Based on the statistics that if a female hides a body it will usually be found within a mile of the home. Then I would begin looking at other areas that were familiar to TH. Like previous residences, her parents homes and etc.

 

[LotsaLatte]

I am so glad this thread was started! I posted a thought that I had - very very late last night in another thread. I think this is a much more appropriate place for me to ask. I was wondering if anyone else thinks that this is possible or if I'm just really reaching here:

IF TH had to dispose of a body (even is she had help)
with her knowledge gained from CSI, etc., premeditation, careful planning, and her thinking that there was no way that anyone would even look at her as being anything less than the victim in this case (not a suspect) - would she dispose of his body in a place where it would "frame" someone else? I mean like an RSO, school employee, other Skyline parent, other family member, etc.

I hope that made sense? I'd love input on this idea.

 

[sarah7855]

OK. You are right.

From this site

Kids ages 5 - 7 can take a direct flight to a single destination but not connecting flights.

O/T-I cannot imagine that someone wouldn't pay for the employee to accompany the child! I paid for my grandson to have an employee when he was 15 and that was domestic! Seriously, I could not make the reservation without an employee. The airline site would not let me. But there were 2 changes in planes.

But I cannot imagine that anyone would put Kyron on a plane alone.

If someone would take him in the first place, I wouldn't put anything past them, honestly. But, as far as the plane possibility goes, you'd think that LE would have tracked something down by now if that were the case. At least have a lead or something, not be requesting surveillance videos from local grocery stores. Based on what we know (which admittedly isn't much), it seems this search is local. JMO.

 

[sarah7855]

I am so glad this thread was started! I posted a thought that I had - very very late last night in another thread. I think this is a much more appropriate place for me to ask. I was wondering if anyone else thinks that this is possible or if I'm just really reaching here:

IF TH had to dispose of a body (even is she had help)
with her knowledge gained from CSI, etc., premeditation, careful planning, and her thinking that there was no way that anyone would even look at her as being anything less than the victim in this case (not a suspect) - would she dispose of his body in a place where it would "frame" someone else? I mean like an RSO, school employee, other Skyline parent, other family member, etc.

I hope that made sense? I'd love input on this idea.

It did make sense

Actually, not a bad idea. Wow. CSI shirt and all...hmmm...something new to ponder. If she were to have set this up to "frame" someone, then she would feel pretty confident that even if he were found, that she wouldn't be suspected. Great point, thanks!!

 

[newone]

I don't know about Canada and an RV- but when you enter a country 'by sea' you need documentation for the vessel and passports for everyone onboard. But Coast Guard/Customs don't always board the vessel to check all passengers, and they definately don't always search the vessel. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. But it's very common for private vessels to be searched in high-drug traffic sea routes.
You'd be taking a chance...but then again, it happens all the time. And Kyron is small and would be easy to conceal.

I have a link to a story about an American who was ''shipwrecked'' on Vancouver Island not that long ago -- all vessels must report to Canadian authorities. This case is important for twofold reasons: #1 it is possible to land a craft without detection #2 it happens

http://www.kvoa.com/news/tucson-man-shipwrecked-at-sea/

 

[MysteryAddict]

Logie Trail is the legend. A road north of Logie Trail is where the guy said a white truck came out of.

Yes, BeanE, I think this was a good tip and that our poor Kyron had been
taken from the school by TH and disposed of quickly along one of those back
roads before 9:45.

I'm sure she wouldn't have driven around with a live Kyron while shopping
etc. before disposing of him. She had to have done it quickly and close to
to the school.

She could then go shopping and pinging here and there all over the place.

We don't know, though, if later she had second thoughts about the disposal location and in a panic called her friend Dede for help in moving the body to
a different place.

I think Dede needed immunity for a lot more than just being a stand-in for Th
at the gym.

 

[Oriah]

Yes, they can.


http://www.independenttraveler.com/resources/article.cfm?AID=203&category=21

Thank you for that link, RubyRed.

My intent in starting this thread was not to debate the who's or likelihood of what happened, because while we all have our doubts- we simply have nothing else at this point and LE is not releasing any info right now. So what's the harm in looking at where all of the possible scenarios could actually place Kyron physically on this earth- because I 100% guarantee he is somewhere.

The reasons why someone might put him on a plane, a train, an automobile, a boat- that doesn't matter. It's possible.

The reasons why someone would go through the trouble to sell him, to trade him, to murder him, to hide him- doesn't matter. It's possible.

So where are the locations those actions might put him??

Thanks again for the link- I have a bunch of maps and assorted other info that I need to get posted, just been busy working away......

 

[Oriah]

IMO, there is a specific reason why all of these outside agencies have been used in this case. Some of these agencies would be involved if they believed the child may be out of the country imo.

IMO

I agree. However, he's not on Interpol. Does he need to be and it just hasn't been pursued yet? Is there substantial evidence that places him in the USA and the USA alone? Portland, Seattle etc are very highly traveled internationally. Anyone know what evidence or lack there of it took to get Lindsey Baum on Interpol?

 

[cluciano63]

I know Desiree is in agony and torment but my fear is that the more she goes on saying that Kyron is "stashed" somewhere, the less people will be inclined to look for him in other states etc. and also the more inclined people might be to think this is just some big, messed-up custodial thing and not really a missing child, possibly taken by an abductor. I think that was a poor choice of wording on her part.

 

[newone]

as stupid as this might sound, I was wondering about a fishing connnection (i.e. San Juan Islands or Anacortes WA) that may have involved a private vessel.....I realize that Portland is somewhat landlocked but if he was handed off to someone maybe that person had a way of taking to any spot in the PNW where people are camped out for the summer?

 

[sorrell skye]

I did not fly with children either. When we go with the family, my kids do the grand kids, except one time when we took our grandson maybe 5 years ago. I paid for it and had to put his passport info in as well as his FF miles number, not mine, for him. I had to have notarized info ( I forget what, as well as his birth certificate with us).

For our last trip in December, I actually did part of my flight with credit card miles-the domestic part and had a travel agent (that's what it was with my credit card, I found ) who did all of the connecting flights -the entire flight.

But I have done my own flights in the past. I go International 2 times a year for many years. I do it on the net so I can connect all of the flights the way I want them. I do them directly on the airline websites.

And when I actually book the flight , they ask for your credit card and the passport info.

bbm

Was the notarized info a letter from the parents stating that you had their permission to travel with your grandchild? That's how it worked for my sister & her ex - when he traveled with their minor daughter overseas, he had to produce a notarized statement from the mother that gave him permission to travel abroad with their daughter (and vice-versa).

I've even heard of situations (from friends) in which the parents are married & one of the parents was traveling abroad with their children & they were required to produce a notarized document from the non-traveling parent giving permission to travel with their minor children.

It's done in order to prevent family abduction of the children.

 

[Oriah]

If someone would take him in the first place, I wouldn't put anything past them, honestly. But, as far as the plane possibility goes, you'd think that LE would have tracked something down by now if that were the case. At least have a lead or something, not be requesting surveillance videos from local grocery stores. Based on what we know (which admittedly isn't much), it seems this search is local. JMO.

I agree it seems the search is local. But we're not- we're the internet, we're everywhere, and we can go anywhere in the world without using resources that LE has to carefully allocate. So lets! No harm, no foul to my way of thinking.

For those who think Kyron is located within a 5 mile radius of Skyline....where? If you were driving around with a body you needed to dispose of, where would you go on a Friday morning at, say 10 am? Look at the roads and the traffic patterns. Look at how far you'd have to carry a body, albeit a small one. What would you do with your keys and your purse while you were doing so?

For those who think Salvie Island....where? If you drove out to Salvie, again, say 10am- 10:30 am on a Friday...which roads would you take. Where could you park and dump something in the water and not be noticed. Doesn't have to look like a body- even if it's contained somehow- people notice people dumping trash in waterways. So where would you pull over to do so? Where are the deep spots on Salvie? Would you slide it on from a bank? Drop off a boat? Again- where would you leave your car, your keys?

For those who think close by the Horman residence....where? Where on the property could you bury, sink, or otherwise hide a body where animals, searchers, or nature would not reveal it? Are there sinkholes? What's the soil like out there? Undergrowth?

Just looking for some ideas here.... TIA.

 

[Oriah]

bbm

Was the notarized info a letter from the parents stating that you had their permission to travel with your grandchild? That's how it worked for my sister & her ex - when he traveled with their minor daughter overseas, he had to produce a notarized statement from the mother that gave him permission to travel abroad with their daughter.

I've even heard of cases (from friends) in which the parents are married & one of the parents was traveling abroad with their children & they were required to produce a notarized document from the non-traveling parent giving permission to travel with their minor children.

It's done in order to prevent family abduction of the children.

I've heard of cases like this from friends as well, sorrell skye.
Yet international familial (and stranger) abductions do occur with some frequency.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100729/wl_uk_afp/britainchildrenabductionsfco_20100729091201

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-10792704

Just a couple of current articles re: Great Britain. But the US is no different.

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/cac/family.htm

 

[Oriah]

If I were going to mount a search, I would first do a search within one mile of the Horman home. Based on the statistics that if a female hides a body it will usually be found within a mile of the home. Then I would begin looking at other areas that were familiar to TH. Like previous residences, her parents homes and etc.

Places that might be familiar to the person who took Kyron.....what did the Hormans do besides what we already know? Did they camp? Ski? Hunt? Fish? Rent cabins for weekends? If so- where?

 

[liz b.]

IMO, there is a specific reason why all of these outside agencies have been used in this case. Some of these agencies would be involved if they believed the child may be out of the country imo.

IMO

"These outside agencies have been used " .... isn't it S.O.P. to check all exits from the country in missing children cases ? Airports, seaports ? Also, the State Dept. will do a passport search .....

All JMO

 

[Oriah]

"These outside agencies have been used " .... isn't it S.O.P. to check all exits from the country in missing children cases ? Airports, seaports ? Also, the State Dept. will do a passport search .....

All JMO

Yes, I certainly hope it is, and I hope the FBI did. But I doubt it happened any earlier than 48 hours into Kyron's missing date. The search efforts were initially contained around the school.
And there are ways to leave the country- either with a false passport, a passport in someone elses name, or no passport at all....

 

[mydailyopinions]

Sadly, I don't think he is very far...
Right now, I regretfully feel that Kyron is waiting for his own meter reader to stumble upon him..

 

[wenwe4]

bbm

Was the notarized info a letter from the parents stating that you had their permission to travel with your grandchild? That's how it worked for my sister & her ex - when he traveled with their minor daughter overseas, he had to produce a notarized statement from the mother that gave him permission to travel abroad with their daughter (and vice-versa).

I've even heard of situations (from friends) in which the parents are married & one of the parents was traveling abroad with their children & they were required to produce a notarized document from the non-traveling parent giving permission to travel with their minor children.

It's done in order to prevent family abduction of the children.

Years ago, before the required passport, I took my daughters to Mexico for a vacation. Since neither of their Father's accompanied me, I had to have notarized statements from both of their Father's to allow me to take my own children into Mexico. However a few years later, I took them both to Victoria, BC, and I didn't even bring their birth certs or any documentation for my kids. We arrived via ferry (with our car) out of Washington State and stayed for 3 days. I understand that now with the new laws, you must have an enhanced driver's license or a dl and passport for adults to cross into Canada. (not sure about children)

 

[sorrell skye]

Years ago, before the required passport, I took my daughters to Mexico for a vacation. Since neither of their Father's accompanied me, I had to have notarized statements from both of their Father's to allow me to take my own children into Mexico. However a few years later, I took them both to Victoria, BC, and I didn't even bring their birth certs or any documentation for my kids. We arrived via ferry (with our car) out of Washington State and stayed for 3 days. I understand that now with the new laws, you must have an enhanced driver's license or a dl and passport for adults to cross into Canada. (not sure about children)

Yes, pre-911 it was somewhat easier for US citizens to cross the border into Mexico & Canada & back again. I believe the new laws that require a passport for all travelers or the enhanced DL that you mentioned (if traveling by land or sea from the US to Mexico & Canada) went into effect in the past couple of years.

Years ago, I went to & from Canada at least once a year with my kids & was waved thru customs sometimes without even being required to stop @ the gate. I haven't been across the border since the new laws were implemented, so I don't know how stringent the customs agents are about checking everyone entering. I've only read about the new requirements.

Maybe some posters who have driven across or taken a boat can share their recent experiences?