Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #1

[SnooperDuper]

Sure, but AJ said DM was basically living at the hangar by then, so is AJ contradicting himself? Did DM stay at the hangar or was he infrequently at the hangar, showing up now and again? I still don't believe he was sleeping over at the Smich's. Thats just my opinion.

I don't either - I think he just drove there, visited, returned to the hangar. Look at how much driving these guys did the night TB was abducted and killed - they are regular highway cruisers. It is nothing for them to drive from city to city frequently enough to support close friendships.

 

[Tamarind]

And when Smich's lawyer asked Pamili ...

The caller gave his name twice, I dont think it sounds like he was trying to be evasive. He would have said it was Lucas or Stewie or something if he was evading the question. IMHO

 

[Tamarind]

Doesn't sound like DM is a 9 to 5 type of guy:



I also recall AJ saying he would have to wait for his SIL to show up to let him in the building, so I don't think DM was there regularly to let employees in.

But AJ said he was living there. That would indicate he was there early in the morning if nothing else IMO... when the Bate phone was in Oakville.

 

[swedie]

Do you still think a third person drove the Yukon? Or did they come back at some point to pick up the Yukon? I remember chatter about the Yukon being seen following the truck on video but am now wondering if Tim was gone so quickly that they came back within a few minutes and grabbed the Yukon....

I haven't thought there was a third person for a very long time. Once it was announced LE had arrested MS and there was no further suggestion from Det. K of a third suspect, I figured there was only DM and MS. They had parked the Yukon and walked. DM lied to TB to cover why they had arrived on foot.

I posted my theory in the wee hours of the morn yesterday what I believed happen. I'll shorten it here for you what I think happened. The three of them left Bosma's, the turned into the laneway where DM hid his Yukon, DM made up some excuse to pull in there (perhaps "relieve himself and MS joined him). DM hopped back into the driver's seat, MS opened the door on the Yukon, grabbed the gun giving it to DM and DM shot TB. MOO.

 

[Sillybilly]

Sure, but AJ said DM was basically living at the hangar by then, so is AJ contradicting himself? Did DM stay at the hangar or was he infrequently at the hangar, showing up now and again? I still don't believe he was sleeping over at the Smich's. Thats just my opinion.

AJ didnt' specify a date as to when DM started living at the hangar, and it wasn't clarified.

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 12:31 PM
Jennings says by that time Millard was living in the office area of the hangar. There was a shower, etc in there.

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 12:32 PM
Millard and Shane (his son in law) were in the office area of the hangar having a "heated discussion," on Friday when he got back from Home Depot, Jennings says.

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 12:33 PM
The two kept looking over at Jennings, he says. "I had this feeling that something's not right here," he says.

The impression I got was that DM started staying at the hangar after TB's disappearance. I could be wrong and it would be nice if someone could clear that up.

 

[SnooperDuper]

The caller gave his name twice, I dont think it sounds like he was trying to be evasive. He would have said it was Lucas or Stewie or something if he was evading the question. IMHO

He said it was Evan, and since we know it was DM, he was evading the question i.e., lying.

 

[Alethea Dice]

I don't either - I think he just drove there, visited, returned to the hangar. Look at how much driving these guys did the night TB was abducted and killed - they are regular highway cruisers. It is nothing for them to drive from city to city frequently enough to support close friendships.

Well, if he was with the phone, he was certainly an early riser that day then.

 

[SnooperDuper]

But AJ said he was living there. That would indicate he was there early in the morning if nothing else IMO... when the Bate phone was in Oakville.

DM was free to come and go any time he chose to do so. Why would he be confined to the hangar at that time? There's no reason why he had to be there, or to suspect he was there, if his phone was pinging elsewhere.

 

[Alderbrook]

Sure, but AJ said DM was basically living at the hangar by then, so is AJ contradicting himself? Did DM stay at the hangar or was he infrequently at the hangar, showing up now and again? I still don't believe he was sleeping over at the Smich's. Thats just my opinion.

Maybe DM was picking MS up for "work" in the morning and heading to the hanger. DM lived somewhere else too cause there's mention of a room mate so I'm guessing he lived in Etobicoke sometimes too


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[Ontario Mom]

The caller gave his name twice, I dont think it sounds like he was trying to be evasive. He would have said it was Lucas or Stewie or something if he was evading the question. IMHO

Have you ever had a conversation with a known liar? One that is a really bad liar? There are certain things they say, certain words they use, names they throw out, and most definite changes in tone of voice and inflection when they're lying about a detail.

sillybilly's full quote BBM:

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 10:43 AM
Dungey zeroing in on the mumbled name. “Only when it comes to his name -- only his name -- all of a sudden he lowers his voice and he mumbles it.” Dungey says. "Correct," Pamili says.

Classic liar speech pattern. 1 thing purposely off. A name, a time, a date, a location... whatever. Everything else in the same tone but that 1 detail raises a red flag. It wasn't the listener misunderstanding, it was the caller being purposefully misleading.

 

[Alethea Dice]

AJ didnt' specify a date as to when DM started living at the hangar, and it wasn't clarified.



The impression I got was that DM started staying at the hangar after TB's disappearance. I could be wrong and it would be nice if someone could clear that up.

Monday night, he was apparently at the hangar, but not getting much sleep. Tuesday night we don't know. Wednesday night, according to his Maple Gate neighbours, he was working at the house for a while at least. Thursday night he was up all night again moving trucks and incinerators around. Friday night he was in jail.

When he says "by that time", the impression I get is that he was already living there by the time any of this happened.

JMO

 

[Tamarind]

DM was free to come and go any time he chose to do so. Why would he be confined to the hangar at that time? There's no reason why he had to be there, or to suspect he was there, if his phone was pinging elsewhere.

I don't understand this post, can you clarify it a bit please?

 

[Alethea Dice]

DM was free to come and go any time he chose to do so. Why would he be confined to the hangar at that time? There's no reason why he had to be there, or to suspect he was there, if his phone was pinging elsewhere.

But his phone apparently wasn't pinging anywhere that morning.

 

[Sillybilly]

So by this standard, if DM bought the gun but MS used it to kill someone, DM wouldn't be guilty. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

Wouldn't be guilty in THAT scenario, but in the actual case at hand, it wouldn't make any difference who owned the gun or whether DM was the shooter. If it is found that DM did the forcible confinement, he would be found guilty of first degree murder.

 

[Tamarind]

Have you ever had a conversation with a known liar? One that is a really bad liar? There are certain things they say, certain words they use, names they throw out, and most definite changes in tone of voice and inflection when they're lying about a detail.

Actually yes I have. I am quite the expert on pathological liars. There is often no change in tone. Sometimes they are very convincing. I don't detect any pathological lying so far by DM. He is coming across to me as being quite open and honest.

Classic liar speech pattern. 1 thing purposely off. A name, a time, a date, a location... whatever. Everything else in the same tone but that 1 detail raises a red flag. It wasn't the listener misunderstanding, it was the caller being purposefully misleading.

The listeners themselves said they either didn't get it or weren't sure what was said. It was the listener that was not sure IMO. No date , no time, no location appears to be off to me. Am I missing something ? TIA

 

[Sillybilly]

Monday night, he was apparently at the hangar, but not getting much sleep. Tuesday night we don't know. Wednesday night, according to his Maple Gate neighbours, he was working at the house for a while at least. Thursday night he was up all night again moving trucks and incinerators around. Friday night he was in jail.

When he says "by that time", the impression I get is that he was already living there by the time any of this happened.

JMO

Yes, and he had told his roommate (presumably Maple Gate) that he had stolen a truck, so that could not have been before May 7 (unless it was another time, another truck )

 

[Sillybilly]

Not to mention, how ballsy is that to tell your roomie you've stolen a truck when half the country is on the lookout for Tim and his stolen truck?

 

[Juballee]

And one of those witnesses although he didn't understand his name, can identify him in court and in a line up.

So far the only two witnesses who have identified DM in court have been the police officers who went to meet DM at the hanger. Neither SB or her tenant was asked if the man they saw that night was in the courtroom, same with the two other truck sellers. We have not heard that anyone has picked DM out of a lineup yet, either, what I recall. The one who was both picked out of a line up by Igor and who conceded that he was present was MS. Which is, funny, when you think about it, because MS is the one who Igor said tried to stay behind him and out of his direct view, and DM was the one he was sitting with in the front seat and talking with for almost an hour.

 

[Alethea Dice]

Yes, and he had told his roommate that he had stolen a truck, so that could not have been before May 7 (unless it was another time, another truck )

Maybe on Wednesday when they were working at the house. Looking forward to finding out who the roommate was.

 

[Tamarind]

Wouldn't be guilty in THAT scenario, but in the actual case at hand, it wouldn't make any difference who owned the gun or whether DM was the shooter. If it is found that DM did the forcible confinement, he would be found guilty of first degree murder.

Lets say the rear seat passenger shot the front seat passenger when the car was moving or when the car was stopped without giving notice to the driver (whoever that is at the time) of what he was about to do. How would anyone know whether or not the driver had locked the doors? The actions of the rear seat passenger would not be dependent upon the front seat passenger. The rear seat passenger has his own mind, even if he is out of it at the time IMO.

If a third party has now either got into the truck or approached the truck from either side ( and the drivers window is either down or original driver has left the scene) and shot the passenger. How could forcible confinement be proven ? I think the forcible confinement charge is on shaky ground IMO.