Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #16

[MrsThreadgoode]

I've expanded my timeline to include as many texts and other evidence as I could find going back to February 9, 2012. Nearly 225 rows were added today.

Some interesting points:

• On April 15, 2012, Millard texted Smich, "five fingered you some practice ammo", which was followed by a conversation about .380 vs 9 mm ammo. This implies that a gun was intended to be used by Smich since Millard got the ammo for him.
• On May 28, 2012, in the midst of Millard getting Schlatman to build a homemade incinerator, Millard texted Smich, "we go [to] incinerator, cool?" And Smich replied, "Yo I'm down bro." This suggests that the incinerator had some importance to both of them.
• On July 7, 2012, just a few days after Laura Babcock is alleged to have been murdered, Smich wrote rap lyrics about his "380 is no stranger, when I'm angered you're in danger." The jury in this trial cannot speculate on Babcock, but the rap lyrics on their own tie Smich to the same type of gun that was allegedly used to kill Bosma.
• On August 20, 2012, during a text conversation about prepping for their missions, Smich stated that he was going to see Isho the following day. The context suggests that seeing Isho had some relation to the mission prep, and based on other evidence Isho is known to have supplied gun(s) and ammo in this case.
• On September 5, 2012, Millard texted Smich about getting together and moving the BBQ back into the barn. Later that evening, they took a video of the incinerator hitched up to the Yukon in the Millardair hangar. With no questions from Smich about moving the BBQ together, one might speculate that they had recently used it for something (sinister or not). At the very least, it shows that Smich had a prior association with the incinerator, and that he knew very well what "BBQ" meant.
• On September 12, Millard and Isho discussed a 380 gun and Isho said it was possible he could get it by the weekend. This is 7 months after DM had already acquired a 380 from Isho. Then on September 22, Millard sent Noudga a photo (different from the February 2014 photo) of a gun resembling a Walther PPK. This is strong evidence of a second gun IMO.

This is but some of the evidence tying Smich to the murder tools (incinerator, gun, ammo, etc.) in this case. His prior association with these things, combined with the very close, intimate and trusting relationship between him and Millard, makes me pretty sure that he must have had some involvement in planning the murder of May 6, 2013. Now add in the following:

• His love of "search and destroy"
• His photos of the sausages and fireside furniture
• His violent messages to Millard a few weeks before Bosma ("they should have called me MERK...no fun and games til someone's hurt")
• His references to "fireworks" in the days before Bosma's murder

At this point, I'm almost convinced that he's aware of a murder about to take place. Now add in:

• His apparent willingness to help clean up after the murder
• His celebratory mood in the truck with Meneses
• His never going to the police
• His never showing any sign of panic until he knew the police were onto him
• His own testimony, which given the timing could have been formulated to fit the evidence, yet it still contains many holes and directly contradicts several other witnesses' testimony, many of whom did not have an incentive to lie about those facts in this case.

My personal verdict? Smich is guilty as charged.

I agree with all of these points. And a huge Thank You for updating the timeline!!! I am off to read it again.


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[NashBridges2]

Leaving premeditation aside (although, IMO, there is overwhelming evidence proving both defendants guilty of that beyond a reasonable doubt), is there anyone who can honestly say that Tim was ever free to leave that vehicle when he left with DM and MS that night?

It is a fact that DM and MS had at least one loaded gun in their possession. Whether to steal a truck and/or murder, both criminal actions, it is so obvious that they never intended to let Tim go ... He was without a doubt forcibly confined.

I am sure that there are many people who will be able to express this much better than I am able to do.

MOO


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This, exactly. If Tim was not offered the chance to get out, walk away and hand over the truck, then I believe he was forcibly confined as well.

 

[Errrr]

Because it's something that people choose to do and there is a forum to do it in and it is thought provoking to hear what other people think.

By that, I meant juries. We here do not decide anything.

 

[CJPRINCESS]

There does seem to be a lot of glow on the back of TB s truck.

This pic an the side pic are why I think Fraser is correct that MS and DM "repositioned TB'S body". Don't believe washing the truck made that big of a mess in and on the bed box.

 

[MrsThreadgoode]

I'm actually rather confused about these texts/pics. I know they were brought up but then never mentioned again and never released as evidence photos like all the others. Can someone point me to the day/article where this was first mentioned in court?

Going by billandrew's terrific timeline, it was introduced by Harrison on Day 37 of the trial.


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[NashBridges2]

One more thing that actually speaks volumes to me, Mark Smich never once spoke to police, or came clean to police even after he was arrested. He waited in jail for 3 years and listened to all the evidence, before spinning a tale that suited his needs. An innocent man, would have started singing long before now and telling the cops what happened, especially if he was really innocent.

 

[serenitynow123]

There does seem to be a lot of glow on the back of TB s truck.

I think the white spray paint was to be used by MS to repaint the inside of the trailer after the truck was removed.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I've expanded my timeline to include as many texts and other evidence as I could find going back to February 9, 2012. Nearly 225 rows were added today.

Some interesting points:

• On April 15, 2012, Millard texted Smich, "five fingered you some practice ammo", which was followed by a conversation about .380 vs 9 mm ammo. This implies that a gun was intended to be used by Smich since Millard got the ammo for him.
• On May 28, 2012, in the midst of Millard getting Schlatman to build a homemade incinerator, Millard texted Smich, "we go [to] incinerator, cool?" And Smich replied, "Yo I'm down bro." This suggests that the incinerator had some importance to both of them.
• On July 7, 2012, just a few days after Laura Babcock is alleged to have been murdered, Smich wrote rap lyrics about his "380 is no stranger, when I'm angered you're in danger." The jury in this trial cannot speculate on Babcock, but the rap lyrics on their own tie Smich to the same type of gun that was allegedly used to kill Bosma.
• On August 20, 2012, during a text conversation about prepping for their missions, Smich stated that he was going to see Isho the following day. The context suggests that seeing Isho had some relation to the mission prep, and based on other evidence Isho is known to have supplied gun(s) and ammo in this case.
• On September 5, 2012, Millard texted Smich about getting together and moving the BBQ back into the barn. Later that evening, they took a video of the incinerator hitched up to the Yukon in the Millardair hangar. With no questions from Smich about moving the BBQ together, one might speculate that they had recently used it for something (sinister or not). At the very least, it shows that Smich had a prior association with the incinerator, and that he knew very well what "BBQ" meant.
• On September 12, Millard and Isho discussed a 380 gun and Isho said it was possible he could get it by the weekend. This is 7 months after DM had already acquired a 380 from Isho. Then on September 22, Millard sent Noudga a photo (different from the February 2014 photo) of a gun resembling a Walther PPK. This is strong evidence of a second gun IMO.

This is but some of the evidence tying Smich to the murder tools (incinerator, gun, ammo, etc.) in this case. His prior association with these things, combined with the very close, intimate and trusting relationship between him and Millard, makes me pretty sure that he must have had some involvement in planning the murder of May 6, 2013. Now add in the following:

• His love of "search and destroy"
• His photos of the sausages and fireside furniture
• His violent messages to Millard a few weeks before Bosma ("they should have called me MERK...no fun and games til someone's hurt")
• His references to "fireworks" in the days before Bosma's murder

At this point, I'm almost convinced that he's aware of a murder about to take place. Now add in:

• His apparent willingness to help clean up after the murder
• His celebratory mood in the truck with Meneses
• His never going to the police
• His never showing any sign of panic until he knew the police were onto him
• His own testimony, which given the timing could have been formulated to fit the evidence, yet it still contains many holes and directly contradicts several other witnesses' testimony, many of whom did not have an incentive to lie about those facts in this case.

My personal verdict? Smich is guilty as charged.

Exactly what I was looking for. Thank you. :clap:

 

[Ontario Mom]

For me? First I took the idea of 'poor Mark' (duped by Millard) and his testimony out of the whole issue
reasons?
1. Self-serving testimony that revealed little or no new info on how HE was guilty (that wasn't already backed up by other evidence)
2. memory was VERY selective and not usually forthcoming (pretty good at remembering details from past (eg. employment, employer, what Marlene had with her when she left home) but recalls very little that has to do with the crime that hasn't already been evidenced in the trial...doesn't even want to guess how long the spade was (used to bury the gun)..or what Millards last convo with him was when heat was closing in)

so then I have Millard (guilty via soooo much evidence) and a second guy who is with him
I looked at:
1. The texts between them....they were obviously close buds...talked a lot about a lot including the BBQ...what strikes me especially is how the tone or friendliness doesn't change at all through the whole thing...He still asks Millard to chill with him after the murder.
2. This second individual claims to have NO IDEA about a gun or the possibility of violence on this mission...and yet he his able to change the licence plate, drive to the farm, cut bloody carpet and seatbelts with a bum shoulder, wash all the blood from the truck and do this knowing a human being who he was sitting with a few hours ago...whose wife he met in the driveway was just brutally murdered and burned...I find this so incredibly unbelievable...that he just 'went along'.

I picture an unknowing petty thief/artist in that situation, and I can see him freaking out...swearing at Millard...or in shock, unable to even function...but after presumably seeing his first murdered human being, his hands don't shake while changing the licence plate, or driving to the farm, or closing the gate or cleaning up the blood and truck and remains. He doesn't feel queasy at the sight of Tim's blood or his body, he goes home afterwards and sleeps (no waking up in a cold sweat, no nightmares...just sleep) and in the days that follow, he reaches out to Millard...asks for updates...prepares for the wedding...unbelievable behaviour for someone who had NO IDEA any violence was going to happen that night and witnessed all that he had. If it's denial, you don't ask for updates....if it's fear, you don't initiate conversations..if it's planned, you do both.
3. His own gf, who knew him very well...who would presumably know if he was faking (with him 24/7), testifies that this man was happy and said the mission went well.

There is lots of other evidences, but I guess those are the ones that come first to my mind. There is (outside the juryroom) the knowledge that there is enough evidence against him for LB's murder to bring him to trial...this tells me that this is not the first heinous violent crime he has ever been exposed to...the gun was bought for a purpose and while there was a time when I wondered if he truly was innocent in knowing about the murder/burning, for me I just go back to those evidences and there is not a reasonable doubt in my mind that he is guilty of 1st degree

Well stated. Thank you very much. :tyou:

 

[Ontario Mom]

Going by billandrew's terrific timeline, it was introduced by Harrison on Day 37 of the trial.


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Excellent - thank you.

Looking at it in context with the other texts/conversations each of them were having it's rather interesting:

May 2 ?? Smich texts Millard: "me and Marlena gonna have a couple drinks tonight..."
May 2 ?? Smich texts Millard: "oh wanna come by and run some missions with me while her and her friend pierce each other?" (MS PLANNING A MISSION FOR MAY 2)
May 2 ?? Millard texts Smich: "at dinner w my mom."
May 2 ?? Smich texts Millard: "Ok it's fireworks tomoro night." (MS CHANGES HIS MISSION PLANS FOR MAY 3RD - ACCORDING TO DM'S PLANS)
May 3 ?? Lisa Williams (Millardair bookkeeper) speaks with Millard at hangar, hears of plan to return to Baja.
May 3 ?? Millard asks Schlatman if the junk forklift mast/forks are working.
May 3 ?? Smich messages Millard: "Can marlena reach and chill with pedo while we do our thing?" (THIS IS THE MS PLANNED MISSION HE WANTED TO DO ON THE 2ND)
May 3 ?? Smich sends Millard photos of a log bench, some tree stump stools, and sausages in a frying pan. (NO CONTEXT - NO COMMENT FROM DM)
May 3 ?? Smich messages Millard: "Can u bring me gloves and tape and maybe an orange guy?" (INDICATING MS NEEDED GLOVES, TAPE & OXY FOR WHATEVER THE PLAN WAS)
May 3 ?? Millard texts Smich that he just finished a 6 hour meeting at the hangar. (DM UNAVAILABLE FOR THE MAY 3RD MISSION?)
May 3 ?? Smich asks Millard to come scope something out. (INDICATES A SENSE OF URGENCY ON MS PART)
May 3 ?? Smich messages Millard: "Yo holla tomoro when you back from toronto. There's a bunch. Missions and more." (INDICATES AGAIN, URGENCY ON MS PART - HE REALLY WANTED DM TO SEE SOMETHING)
May 3 ?? Smich messages Millard: "I thought it was fireworks tonight but it's not yet." (CHANGE OF PLANS AGAIN)

Thoughts?

 

[Just4TB]

Was reviewing Billandrew's timeline (thanks for this resource!!)
One thing that really jumped out - again. SS trading in his phone on May 7th

While he didn't participate in the actual murder, I believe he was "in" on the dirty secret.
IMO, SS has way more involvement in this whole situation than he wants people to believe. He knew it was TB truck, knew TB was murdered, and who murdered TB.

 

[ArianeEmory]

JMO, but I've always felt the May 3 texts were out of context/not related to the truck "mission", if only because I don't think they had a specific truck picked out at that point? And because it sounds like this was some side plan of Mark's.

 

[CJPRINCESS]

They are an exhibit -- #144.

Thanks, off to look for it.

Has anyone found that exhibit #144 pictures of the fireside furniture and sausages yet?

 

[serenitynow123]

Was reviewing Billandrew's timeline (thanks for this resource!!)
One thing that really jumped out - again. SS trading in his phone on May 7th

While he didn't participate in the actual murder, I believe he was "in" on the dirty secret.
IMO, SS has way more involvement in this whole situation than he wants people to believe. He knew it was TB truck, knew TB was murdered, and who murdered TB.

I agree. It became very obvious to me during Crown's cross examination just how involved SS was. I dont understand why he wasn't charged with something in connection to the murder of TB.

 

[canadiangirl]

I agree. It became very obvious to me during Crown's cross examination just how involved SS was. I dont understand why he wasn't charged with something in connection to the murder of TB.

Because he wasn't the guy who went along for the ride it would seem. Only that guy got nailed. MOO

 

[serenitynow123]

Because he wasn't the guy who went along for the ride it would seem. Only that guy got nailed. MOO

CN was also charged.

 

[canadiangirl]

CN was also charged.

She hid physical evidence and according to police was helping him escape? I can't wait to hear her trial.

http://m.thespec.com/news-story/446...used-bosma-killer-allegedly-helped-him-escape

 

[Dutchman]

I don t believe they were released to the media, out of respect for the family. Jmo

 

[canadiangirl]

I don t believe they were released to the media, out of respect for the family. Jmo

I don't understand that at all. They aren't gruesome pictures if it's simply a frying pan with sausages. I've seen some pretty disturbing things released in this trial. I wouldn't think that was one of them.

 

[canadiangirl]

CN was also charged.

Also her charges were after the fact. Sorry I wasn't clear but we were discussing premeditation and knowledge of a murder... In which case some have stated they think SS knew more.