Boulder Grand Jury Voted To Indict-Boulder Dailey Camera

[time]

So, what you are saying is that would have been too risky to dump the body in the woods somewhere, as in the Caylee Anthony case?

Is that right?

I thought my post was clear as is. This is not the Casey Anthony case, e.g., things are different.

 

[SweetT]

So, what you are saying is that would have been too risky to dump the body in the woods somewhere, as in the Caylee Anthony case?

Is that right?

Were there any woods around the Ramseys Home? In the middle of winter there are very few swamp spots and digging would be a non factor..as usually in December in Denver there is nothing but cold and snow. Not an easy place to hide a body really. Also neighbors would most likely be alerted to traffic in and out at such a late hour.

Why would the kidnapper not take the body with them? They had to have known prior to writing that ransom note that the body would be found and no money would be gained. Why would they even spend all that time to write a note? At the point that their ransom object was dead they would either give up on their plan and just leave, or there was another child still in the home..or they could have taken the dead child with them and the parents would not have known the child was not alive right? This to me does not make sense.

 

[UKGuy]

Never mind all that. Kindly answer the question put to you:

"Why would the Ramseys write a bogus ransom note then leave the body in the basement?"

BTW: I do not know this "Chris" of whom you speak.

Edmond.DantesIII,
You might be better to ask: Why would an intruder take the time to write such a ransom note, kidnap JonBenet, redress her, wrap her in a white blanket, then kill her and leave her in the basement, and then quietly exit the Ramsey premises without JonBenet?

.

 

[Edmond.DantesIII]

The obvious answer would be that they did not have the time..nor means without being noticed to take their daughter out of the house at such a late hour. Neighbors might notice them coming and going etc. It would also put DNA evidence in their vehicle. Keep it at home, write a note and hope for the best. JMO

So then why write a bogus ransom note at all?

Why not write a note claiming to be a "small foreign faction" of Islamic terrorists claiming to have killed JonBenet in retaliation for some insidious American foreign policy?

It simply does not make any sense whatsoever to write a bogus ransom note if you are not going to get rid of the body. Did either of the Ramseys strike you as being irretrievably stupid?

 

[txsvicki]

What if P thought she might be sent off in the plane with a big extra suitcase while John obeyed the ransom note, and didn't call the police.

 

[SunnieRN]

Time, just wanted to say 'hi'!! Nice to see you here!

 

[wengr]

"Why would the Ramseys write a bogus ransom note then leave the body in the basement?"

Your hypothetical question assumes that the prosecution is claiming that "the Ramsey's", plural, wrote the note, and that "the Ramsey's", plural "left the body in the basement".
You do not get to make assumptions, and then ask others to argue against them.

 

[SyraKelly]

I just thought of something reading SweetT post
If they killed JB & hid her,then wrote the RN..The FF had to know the R had other child
why didn't they replace your daughter to your son in the RN and try to get the 118,000
for B-they've already killed one child-why not kidnap the other for the ransom?
just thinking out loud!

 

[SweetT]

So then why write a bogus ransom note at all?

Why not write a note claiming to be a "small foreign faction" of Islamic terrorists claiming to have killed JonBenet in retaliation for some insidious American foreign policy?

It simply does not make any sense whatsoever to write a bogus ransom note if you are not going to get rid of the body. Did either of the Ramseys strike you as being irretrievably stupid?

Not stupid at all. In fact probably very smart folks. I would love to say that I believe there was a kidnapper who did this but I am skeptical to say the least. Why not write that they are a small foreign faction of Islamic terrorists? Probably because they could not then relate it back to something tied to Mr Ramseys work? IDK. I think they figured that with the body hid in the cellar or basement that it would be good enough to show that they did not know where she was at. I think getting rid of the body was the least of their worries at that time. There was a story to be made, a note to be written and no time to take the child outside to an undisclosed location. I think if time were not ticking against them then Yes she would have been taken out of the home. Why? I don't know why..but it seems they needed time to concoct a story, get their stories straight and then there was no time to go dumping a body some where. I think something terrible happened in that home and there was a cover up. I will entertain a kidnapper, but I cannot see how the circumstances make sense for a kidnapper scenario.

A kidnapper who wanted money from taking a child would not leave the child in the home even if they had killed the child..otherwise it negates the reason for the ransom note. If the kidnapper was betting on the child not being found before getting their ransom then why no call at 10 AM or earlier from the kidnapper? Answer me these if you will.

 

[SweetT]

I just thought of something reading SweetT post
If they killed JB & hid her,then wrote the RN..The FF had to know the R had other child
why didn't they replace your daughter to your son in the RN and try to get the 118,000
for B-they've already killed one child-why not kidnap the other for the ransom?
just thinking out loud!

Good question.

 

[Edmond.DantesIII]

Your hypothetical question assumes that the prosecution is claiming that "the Ramsey's", plural, wrote the note, and that "the Ramsey's", plural "left the body in the basement".
You do not get to make assumptions, and then ask others to argue against them.

I get to make any assumptions I wish since it is I who am asking the question.

However, if it will evoke an answer from you:

"Why would either or both of the Ramseys have written a bogus ransom note then left the body in the basement?"

 

[UKGuy]

I just thought of something reading SweetT post
If they killed JB & hid her,then wrote the RN..The FF had to know the R had other child
why didn't they replace your daughter to your son in the RN and try to get the 118,000
for B-they've already killed one child-why not kidnap the other for the ransom?
just thinking out loud!

SyraKelly,
Like oops, we made mistake? Lets write another ransom note, yeah lets go for it, and we will up the ransom demand.

You are obviously in the wrong day job.



.

 

[BOESP]

Never mind all that. Kindly answer the question put to you:

"Why would the Ramseys write a bogus ransom note then leave the body in the basement?"

BTW: I do not know this "Chris" of whom you speak.

I'm not a mind reader. You need to ask John Ramsey that question.

 

[wengr]

I get to make any assumptions I wish since it is I who am asking the question.

However, if it will evoke an answer from you:

"Why would either or both of the Ramseys have written a bogus ransom note then left the body in the basement?"

You initiated a hypothetical question that you stated would be asked by the defense at trial. Asked of whom you do not say. However, as why it was done goes to motive which is not required to be shown by the prosecutor, it is quite possible that the question would go unanswered.

 

[SyraKelly]

SyraKelly,
Like oops, we made mistake? Lets write another ransom note, yeah lets go for it, and we will up the ransom demand.

You are obviously in the wrong day job.



.

Well-I guess I'll go get the want ads-lol

 

[SweetT]

Pretty High winds that day in Denver area
"In 1996…another round of high winds developed over portions of the Front Range foothills during the morning hours. Several wind gusts from 70 to 100 mph were reported at Wondervu southwest of Boulder. West-northwest winds gusted to 38 mph at Denver International Airport."
Christmas day..

 

[OpenMind4U]

I'm sorry, but it is not enough to know the facts of this case inside and out. You have to comprehend them. UK's inability to reply to the straight question put to him with a straight answer is not telling of expertise. Indeed, it is telling of gross ignorance, regardless of how many years he has been here.

First of all, even in the court of LAW, the above behavior among the officers of the court would be prohibited/punished by the judge. So, please compose yourself, councelor!!!!

Now, let's go back to your original question, sir. Why write bogus ransom note but leave body in basement?

Your question postulates two things which contradicts each other:

1. The ransom note was bogus
By admitting the invalidity of the ransom note (aka 'bogus', no kidnapping, no ransom pay-off attempt) - the action of 'leaving body in basement' has no connection with the bogus direction/instruction. Hence, your question is INVALID and outside of the scope of this court procedure.

2. The ransom note PRESUMED to be bogus
By presuming the validity of ransom note to be 'bogus', the councelor implies the possibility of ransom note to be NOT bogus. Meaning, the note represents the true intentional correspondence to avoid the killing in exchange for money. In this case, the person(s) who received this note should follow the instruction to NOT call the police in attempt to save the life of his/her daughter. The action of ignoring the instruction by accused parties (Mr. and Mrs. Ramsey) indicates:
a) defendants do NOT believe in validity of the ransom note or
b) defendants do NOT care to save life of their daughter.
Therefore, (a) argument brings us back to #1 postulate and (b) argument has the answer to 'why leave body in basement'.

The floor is yours, councelor.:great:

 

[Edmond.DantesIII]

Not stupid at all. In fact probably very smart folks.

I'm sorry, but writing a bogus ransom note and leaving the body in the basement would be about as stupid as stupid gets. That you might not think it is a hallmark of intelligence is... well...

I would love to say that I believe there was a kidnapper who did this but I am skeptical to say the least.

Obviously, there was not a kidnapper, for if there had been they would have taken JonBenet with them.

Why not write that they are a small foreign faction of Islamic terrorists? Probably because they could not then relate it back to something tied to Mr Ramseys work?

Oh?... And why is that?

IDK. I think they figured that with the body hid in the cellar or basement that it would be good enough to show that they did not know where she was at.

??????????????????????

I think getting rid of the body was the least of their worries at that time. There was a story to be made, a note to be written and no time to take the child outside to an undisclosed location.

Actually, they had all night to get rid of the body.

Why? I don't know why..

Sorry, but you have to know why, or at least be able to provide some sort of reasonable explanation. The Ramseys were intelligent, educated people, not schizophrenic simpletons. You have to be able to answer this question soundly before you can make a formidable indictment against them.

 

[dodie20]

As the cliche goes, any prosecutor worth his salt can get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich. Hunter would have been massacred at trial and he knew it.

Why?

Not only because the Ramseys would have brought in a team of ace defense attorneys but because the real evidence in this case points towards the Ramseys NOT being guilty.

If you do not think so then I challenge you to answer the first question which the Ramseys defense team would have asked at trial:

"Why in the world would either or both of the Ramseys have written a bogus ransom note then left the body in the basement?"

Well, if I was on a jury and was asked that question, here is what I might think. Only 1 R committed the murder and the same R wrote the note. It's logical to think that a parent who could torture and murder a child so viciously, wouldn't have a problem disposing of the body. IMO, PR had every intention of disposing of the body, but JR, on his own, 'found' her and brought her up...therefore nixing PR's plans. IMO, he knew from past experience with PR, where JB's body might be hidden, and again IMO, this may be what the jury was thinking when they chose to indict him also. He knew about past abuse and ignored it. Also, think about this...that note was in PR's handwriting, and those were her words. Expert after expert agree on this, and as far as I know, she was never eliminated as the author by even 1 expert. If a jury accepted that she wrote that note, and I believe they would have, their next response would have been an incredulous, 'why in the world would PR write the note, if she didn't murder her daughter?" So, in summary, 1. PR acted alone and then wrote the note with the intention of disposing of the body later, 2. JR finding the body thwarted her plans, 3. PR wrote the note, so whether it was bogus or not, is beside the point. Writing it, is what points to her guilt, not wondering what her plans were for the body. All moo

 

[SweetT]

I'm sorry, but writing a bogus ransom note and leaving the body in the basement would be about as stupid as stupid gets. That you might not think it is a hallmark of intelligence is... well...



Obviously, there was not a kidnapper, for if there had been they would have taken JonBenet with them.




Oh?... And why is that?




??????????????????????



Actually, they had all night to get rid of the body.



Sorry, but you have to know why, or at least be able to provide some sort of reasonable explanation. The Ramseys were intelligent, educated people, not schizophrenic simpletons. You have to be able to answer this question soundly before you can make a formidable indictment against them.

Unfortunately, or fortunately I am not privy to the information given to the Grand Jury, nor the testimony given. But I do believe that if these folks thought there was enough evidence to indict then I have to believe that they had some pretty compelling info.

If you don't believe there was a kidnapper then what do you believe?
Just the ransom note itself seemed to be something that would have taken quite a bit of time. You say they had all night. Perhaps they did, but covering a murder can be quite a task and one night can go pretty quickly if it was not planned ahead. I would say time would go by pretty quickly if you are desperate to cover something up and have to make things mesh. Panicking and probably not thinking straight in an emergency situation can make even the smartest people look pretty stupid in retrospect.