Brooke Bennett, 12 years old Randolph VT #20

[ZOOL]

Thanks, Texas48 --

I'm going to go away for awhile now, and look into the subject matter of the hacking that has been taking place over the course of the past week.

I'll be back. Hopefully VTNance, will be too.

Reading through the subthreads on AFFIDAVITS and PHOTOS and FAMILY TREES and BRECKENRIDGE is interesting reading too.

 

[becca]

This case is just so gut wrenching and heart breaking that emotions are very raw. It disturbed me to the point of having to walk away from it for awhile. When I did decide to come back to read threads about Brooke's murder there seemed to be many posts that were leaning towards blaming the victims. Usually that doesn't happen here at Websleuths and it sickened me!!!

I'm not pointing any fingers at you, You just happened to post about it now.

Personally, I am sick of the victims being targeted. The victims have suffered horribly ending with the murder of a beautiful young 12 year old. Not sure why things seem so different here at Websleuths the past week or so, but I hope it stops!!

Which was the point of my little rant on the last thread. We never re victimize the victims. The family is part of that too. They are victims of a system and a parent that didn't think. These mothers do not get a free pass, but the children didn't have a choice in this.
I swore I wouldn't post on this case again, but its a bit hard not to when the subject is victims.
Philamena was trying to make a point about that. We do not make the victims , victims again. To discuss certain things does that. For long time posters here it makes them angry, they are all about the victims getting justice not wondering if a 12 yr old was sexually active. The mere thought of that put a lot of us in a tail spin.
The subject has no bearing on the case,any more than saying a girl got raped because she wore a short skirt. Or better yet a rape victims sexual history.... its not brought up. Has nothing to do with the crime at hand.
sorry for another rant, but it makes my blood boil... victims are victims... we need to keep that in mind.

 

[Cornflower]

These mothers do not get a free pass, but the children didn't have a choice in this.

When I joined this community I was very pleased to notice that people treat eachother nicely and write about this case very professionally. I understand that there are lots of things that are very hard to talk about. However I´ve been a bit surprised about the turn that the conversations have taken. I don´t see a point in identifying people from the funeralphotos, if someone could explaine why that is relevant to the case I´d be happy to know.
My strong oppinion is that ALL the children here are victims. All of them.
JMO.

 

[twinkiesmom]

How dare people HERE question if Brooke was sexually active.
Wt is wrong with people? She was only12 years old.

Incest is a crime in which silence leads to death and more victims. Light needs to be shined in dark corners in this case. Brooke can not be hurt by our questions.

If Brooke was sexually active at 12...it would make prior abuse almost a certainty given the family structure (close contact with two pedophiles).

 

[ZOOL]

becca,

You may find "The Problem Of Evil: Comprehending the Incomprehensible", Wednesday's (7/9) editorial in the Vermont Valley News daily a worthwhile read.

zool

 

[becca]

becca,

You may find "The Problem Of Evil: Comprehending the Incomprehensible", Wednesday's (7/9) editorial in the Vermont Valley News daily a worthwhile read.

zool

Thank you for the link, it was interesting. I still think that without all the facts we are so easily led down the rumor path. We must wait until we know the facts before we can discuss if this then that... otherwise we are just blowing in the wind. and using bandwidth for idle gossip.
To fully understand evil one must be on a first name basis with it.

 

[Tom'sGirl]

This is on the front page of my newspaper today.
http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/...13/NEWS01/80712014&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL

Respectfully,
dark_shadows

Dearest d_s, I was so glad you posted the photo, I have it with the photo caption but with the time difference didn't get it posted.

I know some guys may have a few things around one's desk if your kids make them, but SnowMen, Teddy, and an Angel or whatever makes me wonder what they represent?

 

[Native New Yorker]

As far as I am concerned, the only pix that we should be interested are those of the monsters...so that we can put a face to evil. The victims ( of which there are many), well, I do not see the point in trying to ID their pix.

As to the issue of sexual abuse prior to the murder, VT Nance, I hope you come back.
Some of you have things ( in my opinion) bassackwards!
When a child is sexually active ( thinking of AR here) dollars to donuts, there has been molestation! The molestation almost always causes sexual acting out, to coin a clinical phrase.
I think that any interest expressed here as far as the victim's sexual activity was strictly about motive ( being part of their sick system, perhaps, and then wanting out) or being molested and threatening to tell.
It is a totally FALSE analogy to liken this to accusing a rape victim of wearing a short skirt!
No child wants to be molested, but once they are, it impacts their lives in EVERY way, most apparently in sexual ways.
The only gossipy thing I have seen on these boards has been the attempts to ID funeral pix...and even that I liken to rubbernecking at a car crash...just a side of human nature that is not so noble, but certainly not cruel!
You cannot take sexual activity out of the equation with these families. Like it or not, they were all living in a cesspool with two perverts. Bound to be repercussions, which damaged probably all the children in those families, one fatally.

 

[Native New Yorker]

Dark shadows, thank you for posting that pic of RG. For putting a face to evil.

I agree with ...we all know what that sicko was doing online.....very disturbing!

 

[CarpeDiem]

I know some guys may have a few things around one's desk if your kids make them, but SnowMen, Teddy, and an Angel or whatever makes me wonder what they represent?

Christmas. I think the pic was taken at Christmas time.

 

[IMBY]

I honestly don't believe that anyone's intent here is to "re-victimize" the victims. Everyone here has shown (rightfully) nothing but compassion and sympathy for them.

In a previous post I talked about the rampant speculation (which I dislike) aspect of this forum, and about hypothesizing.

People are trying to understand WHY Brooke was "targeted" and the events that led to her kidnapping and death.

We certainly don't have all of the facts in this case.

Per the affidavit, we know that AR said that there were three other girls "enrolled" in Breckenridge.
She also said "the first who 'does it' lives and the second gets her throat cut".

Of course you may disagree, but how does questioning anyone's potential previous involvement in Breckenridge not have a bearing on the case?

By considering all of the possibilities, perhaps it would increase understanding (and yes, intellectual growth). Perceptions are tricky... I did not see ANYONE "blaming the victims" in any way, shape, manner or form.

But on the other hand, the idea of considering some questions/hypotheses "taboo" with regard to discovering facts that may possibly speak DIRECTLY to motive and/or opportunity seems a little misguided if not counterproductive. IMHO.

If you think that Brooke's "history" (if any) is not being looked into by LE, I think you are mistaken.

As I said in another post, however, whether or not a public forum is the place to discuss these things is debatable... I'm fairly certain that there are people lurking/reading this forum that know things pertaining to this case that have not yet been revealed, and may be equally upset by some of the misinformation presented here.

I, for one, appreciate any discussion---

My 2¢

Edit:
While I was typing, twinkiesmom put it much more succinctly:

Incest is a crime in which silence leads to death and more victims. Light needs to be shined in dark corners in this case. Brooke can not be hurt by our questions.

If Brooke was sexually active at 12...it would make prior abuse almost a certainty given the family structure (close contact with two pedophiles).

 

[texas48]

As far as I am concerned, the only pix that we should be interested are those of the monsters...so that we can put a face to evil. The victims ( of which there are many), well, I do not see the point in trying to ID their pix.

As to the issue of sexual abuse prior to the murder, VT Nance, I hope you come back.
Some of you have things ( in my opinion) bassackwards!
When a child is sexually active ( thinking of AR here) dollars to donuts, there has been molestation! The molestation almost always causes sexual acting out, to coin a clinical phrase.
I think that any interest expressed here as far as the victim's sexual activity was strictly about motive ( being part of their sick system, perhaps, and then wanting out) or being molested and threatening to tell.
It is a totally FALSE analogy to liken this to accusing a rape victim of wearing a short skirt!
No child wants to be molested, but once they are, it impacts their lives in EVERY way, most apparently in sexual ways.
The only gossipy thing I have seen on these boards has been the attempts to ID funeral pix...and even that I liken to rubbernecking at a car crash...just a side of human nature that is not so noble, but certainly not cruel!
You cannot take sexual activity out of the equation with these families. Like it or not, they werrkere all living in a cesspool with two perverts. Bound to be repercussions, which damaged probably all the children in those families, one fatally.

Thanks Native New Yorker. You said this well. Bassackwards is a good ole Texas word and you used it perfectly. We need all the posters, so, come on back. I always need your words of wisdom and your help, especially with that darn ole alert button....

 

[Taximom]

observe the lower, far left corner of the family-Gagnon photo: a teddy bear....
uke:

Did he live by himself when this photo was taken?

 

[Native New Yorker]

Thanks, Texas....I have not left the board...and do not plan to...
I wonder where I done picked up a Texas expression? I learned it from my father, who was a Brooklyn boy....he must have learned it in the Army....

Imby, and twinkiesmom, I totally agree with what you both said....

 

[LI_Mom]

I need to say something. I found this post incredibly mean. I am not a gossip monger and yes I do have children. And I know from them, and from being involved with their school, that there are sad and terrible things that go on with a lot of children, in Brook's age group and all age groups. It is heartbreaking. I asked some questions about some strange things in the evidence and what they might mean. That is was "sleuths" do. Brooke for much of her life was around two men who are now up on federal charges for child *advertiser censored*. It isn't a gigantic stretch of the imagination to wonder if this may have affected her life previous to the murder. I didn't ask that question to be salacious but because I want to find out the truth about the criminals that took Brooke's life.

If we are not allowed to question the evidence and discuss what it may mean, this board is pointless. For you to suggest that I brought up these questions just to be mean or gossipy is just disgusting.

I think a big problem with discussing this case is that we have some very basic facts but even those are just snippets of a very large picture.

Trying to fill in the blanks leads to all kinds of speculation about all the people who definitely were or might have been involved.

There has been next to NO new info released since the arrests.... coverage of the funeral doesn't give us any new insight into the case.... of course it led to more speculation.

 

[Hailiejade77]

I think a big problem with discussing this case is that we have some very basic facts but even those are just snippets of a very large picture.

Trying to fill in the blanks leads to all kinds of speculation about all the people who definitely were or might have been involved.

There has been next to NO new info released since the arrests.... coverage of the funeral doesn't give us any new insight into the case.... of course it led to more speculation.

I think you hit the nail on the head!
I think everyone has been so heartbroken about this case and we just want to see justice and figure out WHY this happened to this precious little girl!

 

[nanandjim]

Dearest d_s, I was so glad you posted the photo, I have it with the photo caption but with the time difference didn't get it posted.

I know some guys may have a few things around one's desk if your kids make them, but SnowMen, Teddy, and an Angel or whatever makes me wonder what they represent?

Once again, this is an old photo, IMO. He is wearing the same glasses as in the other two photos. It may have been taken five years ago, but looks can change a lot in five years...Believe me...It has unfortunately happened to me.

 

[SuziQ]

I'm a bit confused on the apartment thing. Am I to understand that Ray rented an apartment in addition to a room at KG's house? Can someone clear that up for me?

http://www.rutlandherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080712/NEWS04/807120353/1004/NEWS03

(snip)
That San Antonio landfill may be the dumping site for trash from a local apartment rented by Raymond Gagnon, Bennett's former stepfather who is facing charges in Alabama for possession of child *advertiser censored*.

The 40-year-old Gagnon allegedly instructed his landlord last month to throw away a safe containing a computer stored at his apartment that police say contained volumes of child *advertiser censored*, including sexual photos of an underage female witness involved in Bennett's disappearance.

"We are working to locate a hard drive or laptop computer that was disposed of at the instruction of Mr. Gagnon," Vasys said early Friday afternoon. "Based on information we have received, this landfill is the dumping site for trash from his apartment."

 

[DianeB]

Thanks v. much for posting this photo, dark_shadows.

The first thing that struck me was the presence of the case full of DVD's and the hookup between the computer and the TV monitor.

 

[fran]

I just posted this on the Amber Alert thread, this shows what the lack of communication was here in Vermont.

We do not have billboards here.
Video at link.



http://www.wcax.com/global/story.asp?s=8662622




Burlington, Vermont - July 11, 2008
It's construction season in Vermont-- and if you didn't know it-- all you'd have to do is read the electronic billboards... billboards that should have been displaying an Amber Alert when Brooke Bennett went missing two weeks ago.
"They just didn't contact us. If we'd been contacted, we would have put our system in place," said John Zicconi of the Vt. Agency of Transportation.
Vt. State police say they forgot to contact the Agency of Transportation.



More at link.


Respectfully,
dark_shadows

Thank you for this link and article DS.

How sad that they didn't do it right, the Amber Alert. But, I don't think, in this case, it would have made any difference. Brooke may have already been dead and no one saw her leave with the accused kidnapper anyway, except AR.

It's better that they realize their flaw now and correct it, because next time, it MAY make a difference.

FWIW, the very first Amber Alert in California, right after it became law, positively saved the lives of TWO young teenagers who'd been kidnapped and abused. He was actually in the process of attempting to kill them when LE swooped in, literally, and saved their lives. It was a road worker, who'd seen the Amber Alert, notified LE that he'd seen them turn down a small country road, in the middle of nowhere.

Thank you for all the hard work you've done on this case, DS. It's sincerely appreciated by many of us, who are watching the case but not necessarily posting now as we're waiting for some 'new facts' to come out.

JMHO
fran