CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #4

[Trino]

Best interview I've seen. Sexual component? DNA to determine father of children. FBI profile. Recovery problems.

https://www.cbsnews.com/video/in-the-minds-of-criminals/

 

[margarita25]

My opinion on the border collie biting the child, it wouldn't surprise me if it was aggressive as a result of its experience and upbringing in the home, if the poor dog itself was abused and had to witness violence in the home, of course no way to prove this. Re the 2 malteses, while they are healthy, thank goodness, I'm not so sure that their care would have continued. Not to mention the 2 dogs abandoned in Texas, just left there (jerks), and the dead kitten in the dumpster. As I mentioned before Ariel Castro used the dogs to control the girls. All moo.

 

[georgiajean]

I really hope the police have already contacted the new owner who took pictures of the filthy and disturbing condition of one of the houses. I think one of the houses in Texas. Because I swear, I see what looks like a huge blood stain on the carpet in one of the pictures. I could be (and pray) I'm wrong. I actually don't know what a real blood stain would look like because thankfully I have never been in any situation where I have seen a lot of it. But to me, that red looks like blood. If it was from a kid...oh my God.

I believe it is a urine stain. if you had a flood of urine, as it sounds like there was, that urine would collect all the dirt and grime and feces in the rug, and bring it to wherever the urine pooled and dried. JMO

 

[margarita25]

The diaries also have sparked the interest of academics who research trauma and language. Writing in the journals was, quite possibly, what allowed the children to survive a life of fear, hunger and torture, said James Pennebaker, a renowned expert on using writing to heal from traumatic experiences.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/01/19/turpin-torture-diaries/1049928001/

The children’s stunted language skills might make the journals hard to decipher, he said. But this challenge also would be valuable in the study of communications barriers and the evolution of language.

"“There is a good chance that being able to write may have kept them sane,” Pennebaker said. “In an interesting way, this may have helped them come to terms with the bizarre world they lived in.”"

Snip

"But the unlikely existence of these journals creates a unique research tool that may allow academics to design therapies to help victims of torture, maltreatment and prolonged captivity, Pennbaker said."

 

[georgiajean]

I am concerned about the comments from a neighbor in Texas who said that the dumpster at the abandoned home smelled like death. I am afraid that whoever disposed of the contents assumed the smell was rotting food/meat, no one looked, and God only knows what could have been in there.

As an animal rescuer, I'm going to point out that if these people had been pursued for abandoning those animals, leaving them to die locked in that Texas house, it's possible that these children would not have suffered for another decade. Maybe the authorities didn't know, if the neighbors did not report it. This is why it is so important to report animal abuse and abandonment.

The ball was dropped when it came to obvious animal abandonment and abuse on at least one occasion, but I'm betting it was not the only time.

Further, whoever cleaned out that house should have notified authorities and they should have been tracked. It was clear every time they left a place that they were living in horrid conditions with children. There were several missed opportunities on that front as well.

So how many times did the system fail these kids? Count up every move where the homes looked practically condemnable, and every time they abandoned an animal.

When we entered a home like this because of an animal hoarding or abandonment issue, here was the protocol. Humane workers/animal control ask police to open the place and accompany them. Photos are taken. Animals removed. Home is reported to the health department. Owners or residents are tracked. Minors and disabled adults are checked on because obviously they had been living in terrible conditions.

It seems none of this happened. Assuming no one called animal control, then it becomes the responsibility of the bank or owners of the rented home, who must be aware of these living conditions, to notify the authorities.

Often in animal rescue I get a case where a street animal is near death and I wonder how many people turned a blind eye before someone finally called us. Many. Many, I tell you. They don't have to help, they just need to make a damned phone call. Yet they don't. And then I am left with a 2 1/2 pound adult cat who is missing a leg and an eye, and eventually dies in my arms with me weeping over the fact that her internal organs were too damaged for me to save her despite immediate vet care.

This is what happened to these kids. The very same thing. Now they have lost years and will suffer, and the kind hospital folks will continue to have secondary traumatic stress disorder.

End of rant.

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Very very sobering point you have brought up. Why weren't these things followed up on? It is unfathomable to me, especially seeing it laid out as you did. It is clear that we, as a society and as smaller communities, have some work to do.

 

[verbonica]

I'm really thinking that someone in the media misunderstood something and is jumping the gun about plans to already place the kids in foster care. It's way too soon. The way medical experts were describing in interviews how precarious the "refeeding" process is in a case of severe starvation and malnourishment like this, I just don't think 1 week in a hospital is nearly enough time. From what I read, they can't do it too fast because otherwise the patient can actually go into shock and DIE. It hasn't even been a week since the kids were rescued. They were bringing them back slowly with IV fluids, then gradually solid food. They have to very slowly increase the calorie intake. And considering how weak the kids must have been and muscle wasting, they probably couldn't even walk right. So even when the nutrition is stabilized and their digestive system starts working again, they would likely need physical therapy to even walk right. A neurologist would have to evaluate how severe the neuropathy is. All of this takes time. And there are 13 kids. In 1 week? There's just no way.

I'm betting that someone misheard something. Maybe the kids are showing some improvement and they're being moved to a different area of the hospital? Maybe they think that they might be able to be moved to another facility for physical rehabilitation? My impression from everything I heard about the kids when they were found, and from what doctors were saying is that they were in very severe condition and some were close to death. They seemed especially worried about the 29 year old girl. I fully expected them to be in the hospital for WEEKS. Plural.

It must be very difficult for the medical personnel to treat them. I can imagine that being stuck with needles, hooked up to IVs and having measured nutrition (although all are direly necessary for now) could feel like more of being chained up and deprived and tortured. I hope that they are able to understand what is being done to help them? I read where someone said that they are grateful for all of the help they are getting. What a huge, complicated undertaking it is to care for them.

 

[margarita25]

The diaries also have sparked the interest of academics who research trauma and language. Writing in the journals was, quite possibly, what allowed the children to survive a life of fear, hunger and torture, said James Pennebaker, a renowned expert on using writing to heal from traumatic experiences.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/01/19/turpin-torture-diaries/1049928001/

The children’s stunted language skills might make the journals hard to decipher, he said. But this challenge also would be valuable in the study of communications barriers and the evolution of language.

"From a research perspective, the only writings that could even loosely compare to the children’s journals would come from prison inmates or the famous diary of Anne Frank, a Jewish teenager who chronicled her life as she hid from the Nazis during World War II, Pennebaker said.

“Anne Frank lived in an insane world, but her family life was remarkably normal,” Pennebaker said. “This is the exact opposite.”"

 

[DakotaMayi]

Also, we don't know that they didn't try to tell people multiple times. Not all have been able to be interviewed yet, IIRC. And the oldest is in bad shape. They could have told people and not been believed. They could have tried to tell people, been caught, and severely punished for it.

Remember, AFAIK, we only know about the Texas escape where the cop brought them back from neighbors. This tells me that the children haven't yet even begun to tell about all the escape attempts yet.

This would not be something investigators are focusing on at the moment for various reasons. Think about it. This is one of the worst things to ask them right now if they want to gain trust because it implies that maybe they didn't try before.

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Especially considering at least one relative, a grandparent, has stated they don't believe it.

 

[margarita25]

The diaries also have sparked the interest of academics who research trauma and language. Writing in the journals was, quite possibly, what allowed the children to survive a life of fear, hunger and torture, said James Pennebaker, a renowned expert on using writing to heal from traumatic experiences.


https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/01/19/turpin-torture-diaries/1049928001/


The children’s stunted language skills might make the journals hard to decipher, he said. But this challenge also would be valuable in the study of communications barriers and the evolution of language.

"Research into the journals likely will have to wait until the Turpins' criminal case is resolved, and only if the writings are released to academics, Pennebaker said.

In the meantime, the journals will also have tremendous value for the criminal investigation, even though they may not be admissable as evidence in a courtroom, said Laurie Levenson, a criminal law expert at Loyola Law School in Los Angeles.

Investigators who are attempting to interview the children, a delicate process, could start with the journals, asking about entries that imply abuse, Levenson said. Additionally, if either of the parents were to testify in their own defense, prosecutors could use the journals to cross-examine them.

And finally, if any of the children testify, they could use the journals to refresh their memory on witness stand, much the way a police officer reviews a report before testifying about an old crime, she said.

“You can’t cross examine a journal, you have to cross examine the children, but they are a still a good starting point," Levenson said. "And frankly, they may be enough to persuade a defendant that they don’t want to go through a long trial here.”"

 

[georgiajean]

I'm not sure if this would be productive. They are not all children. Adopt an adult?

The first consideration is their physical well-being and in some cases physical therapy. Each of the siblings would have different needs and physician appointments.

The next consideration is mental needs of each sibling, plus therapy. Again, lots of appointments and needs.

Then, the most difficult thing is integration into the world of 2018, education of each sibling, and for the adults finding a job and becoming self-supporting. Because of their confinement, some of the siblings may be mentally or cognitively impaired. Integration will be a difficult task. They also, IMO, need separation to develop as individuals.

I am thinking that eventual adoption of all would be a positive, because it would mean the biological extended family would not be able to get their hands on them? I have heard of adults being adopted before. Here is a neat article about it, and the why. https://www.today.com/parents/picking-your-parents-adult-adoption-creates-new-bond-2D80555492 "“No matter how old you are,” Johnson said, “you never lose the desire for a family.”"

 

[enelram]

And I can see LT, in the rush of new baby, being domestic for a short time until she "burned out" on it. so the house may have been clean for the first year or so.

Which brings me to another point that has been mulling in my mind. I believe these survivors dealt with a lot of yoyo parenting. Hot and cold. One minute, all lovey and perfect, the next minute monsters. I suspect they never knew what they were going to get. "Hey, let's go to Disneyland! Everyone take showers! Here's your clean new outfit! Oh boy, aren't we one biig happy family?" And the next minute they are getting chained to their beds for daring to look sideways at someone during their outing, or eating one almond more than allowed or washing their wrist. That flip flopping would be, in some ways, worse than constant monster. Little bit of hope that it will get better....hope smashed.....little hope...hope smashed. Whoever works with them will need to know a lot about learned helplessness/hopelessness, and external/internal locus of control. It will be a very very long recovery, and most difficult for the older survivors, IMO.

Bingo! Yo Yo parenting- never heard that term but IME, abusive parents can be exactly like that.
Something else that I think is hard for most people to understand is that abusive, neglectful parents are hyper cautious
of when and how to project their real treatment of the kids. There's that PUBLIC BEHAVIOR and their PRIVATE
BEHAVIOR when no one is looking. Night and Day difference. So much of their lives revolves around the secrecy
of their family dynamics. The parents are fully aware of the difference between right and wrong which is why they hide
the aborrhent, abusive treatment. Great way to screw kids minds up royally right? This is one reason abused children
will forever have a hard time with trusting others. No one really ever knows what goes on BEHIND CLOSED DOORS.

 

[Errrr]

I am concerned about the comments from a neighbor in Texas who said that the dumpster at the abandoned home smelled like death. I am afraid that whoever disposed of the contents assumed the smell was rotting food/meat, no one looked, and God only knows what could have been in there.

As an animal rescuer, I'm going to point out that if these people had been pursued for abandoning those animals, leaving them to die locked in that Texas house, it's possible that these children would not have suffered for another decade. Maybe the authorities didn't know, if the neighbors did not report it. This is why it is so important to report animal abuse and abandonment.

The ball was dropped when it came to obvious animal abandonment and abuse on at least one occasion, but I'm betting it was not the only time.

Further, whoever cleaned out that house should have notified authorities and they should have been tracked. It was clear every time they left a place that they were living in horrid conditions with children. There were several missed opportunities on that front as well.

So how many times did the system fail these kids? Count up every move where the homes looked practically condemnable, and every time they abandoned an animal.

When we entered a home like this because of an animal hoarding or abandonment issue, here was the protocol. Humane workers/animal control ask police to open the place and accompany them. Photos are taken. Animals removed. Home is reported to the health department. Owners or residents are tracked. Minors and disabled adults are checked on because obviously they had been living in terrible conditions.

It seems none of this happened. Assuming no one called animal control, then it becomes the responsibility of the bank or owners of the rented home, who must be aware of these living conditions, to notify the authorities.

Often in animal rescue I get a case where a street animal is near death and I wonder how many people turned a blind eye before someone finally called us. Many. Many, I tell you. They don't have to help, they just need to make a damned phone call. Yet they don't. And then I am left with a 2 1/2 pound adult cat who is missing a leg and an eye, and eventually dies in my arms with me weeping over the fact that her internal organs were too damaged for me to save her despite immediate vet care.

This is what happened to these kids. The very same thing. Now they have lost years and will suffer, and the kind hospital folks will continue to have secondary traumatic stress disorder.

End of rant.

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The stench is typical of hoarders. These people seemed to be shopaholic hoarders. He made good money but they blew so much on junk they had nothing left for their kids. They seem focussed on acquisition rather than maintenance of what they have.
I guess the yearly baths coincided with the Facebook photo ops. I also wonder if the children that tried to escape most got the worst of the abuse, which explains why some were chained and near starving while others not so much.

 

[margarita25]

PHOTOS: Inside the Texas home where Perris siblings lived years ago


http://abc7.com/inside-the-tx-home-where-perris-siblings-lived-years-ago/2969034/#gallery-2


The current owner of the Turpins' former Texas home bought the foreclosed property about 18 years ago and took photos of the condition of the structure, he told ABC News.

"The images appear to show carpets and walls covered in large stains. The owner, who wishes to remain anonymous, said he was certain feces were smeared all over the walls of every room at the time that he bought the home."

 

[Ct92404]

Trino,

I think only 7 of them are "adults." 6 were minors. I could be wrong about that number, but I thought that's what I read.

And yes, I'm putting that in quotes because, as I said I feel they are only "adults" in a CHRONOLOGICAL sense of the term. As I said, these kids have been so horribly tortured and stunted their entire lives that in every other way, they are still children. They will need to be taught how to manage daily routines that all of us take for granted. Bathing, eating normal meals, brushing their teeth, choosing their own clothes and dressing. I would not be surprised if they are extremely apprehensive about bathing, because subconsciously they might still fear punishment.

So for a time, I really feel like they do in fact need to be treated like children. I'm not saying to patronize or humiliate them, but they need to be treated gently and given some kind of motherly and fatherly care that they were NEVER given in their lives. After the horror they suffered for decades, what is wrong with that??? Why the h*ll can't they just be kids for a little while in their lives for once?

I'm sorry if I sound a bit mad here, but in your last two posts you seemed to complain about them being called "kids" or "children" and it almost sounds as if they just need some life coaching and bam now they can be fully functioning adults punching a time clock and living independently in a house with a white picket fence and 2 cars. I know that's not what you meant, but it almost sounded that way.

So, no, I'm going to call them all CHILDREN. After what they've been through, I really don't give a flying fig (censoring myself) if they are over 18.

I'm sorry. This just really upset me. I've personally seen and known young adults who were in very bad situations and yes I would say abused...and they didn't get the help they needed. "oh well, they're over 18, they're adults. They're not kids. Who cares." Well, not everyone magically becomes a capable adult just because it turns 12:01 AM on their birthday.

I'm praying for all these KIDS.

 

[margarita25]

Looks like feces, blood, urine.......that’s my guess

If blood, that's quite a bit of blood...

 

[arkansasmimi]

Depending on what you believe from DT's parents, they visited in Ca. either 4,5, or 6 yrs. ago and stayed for 5 days
according to them. I would suspect DT,LT and kids and DT's parents stayed at some motel/hotel near Disney.

It is a fact that -DT parents visited and they went to Disneyland, those are most of the Disneyland photos we see. There are a photo with grandparents, another with Turpin family and either extended family or friends. Grandparents photo was posted on Oct 30, 2011. Photos public were recycled so except for ones from with infant and Grandparents hard to date others. But 2011 seems to be legitimate date when -DT parents visited, and being a yr after moved to CA.

 

[osu]

Vmmking, I forgot all about that neighbor saying the dumpster "smelled of death." I am feeling physically ill right now. At the time I heard the neighbor say that in the video, I got chills and thought it was very ominous. I'm getting confused now between the two houses in Texas. They lived in Forth Worth first I think, and then lived in Rio Vista, before moving to California. I know the garbage dumpster was in Rio Vista. But I don't remember if the pictures with the creepy stains on the floor were at THAT house or the one in Fort Worth.

If the red stain and the dumpster are both from the same house...oh God, I think it seems at least one kid we don't know about may not have made it out of there alive. I pray all this grisly speculation is wrong. Maybe the parents got tipsy one night listening to an Elvis record and spilled wine on the carpet. Maybe the smell in the dumpster was just rotten food or at worst a dead animal (still sad, but not as horrific as a dead KID!) I hope I'm wrong. But it's very ominous, and I hope the police are looking into it.

IIRC, didn’t that same neighbor (Ashley?) say that after the Turpin’s had moved away from the TX home and they went over to check out the house, 2 dogs ran out the back door (after being in there for 2 weeks) and a kitten was found in the dumpster that smelled of death?

But what really haunts me about that same interview was when she said that “they continued to hear whimperings coming from the dumpster.”



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[Shelby2]

Honestly, I find this strange. It's one thing to volunteer to be a foster family for the children, but to volunteer to adopt all of them this soon seems irresponsible.

It's so soon in the process that the evaluations they've had are likely not completely accurate as to their needs. The kids are still in shock, they've rarely interacted with outsiders, and clearly haven't had even the most basic "home training" so to speak.

To me it seems like a group home situation where there is a round-the-clock staff would be wise. 3-4 adults during the day to help the children with basic activities of daily living, helping them learn routines, have the beginnings of some school lessons, learning how to do chores, supervising their eating and nutritional needs, etc.

It's going to take a long time for any of them to feel secure about there always being enough food. Some of them will probably overeat at meals and hoard food due to their fears, and it will take an expert to help them with just this by itself.

Then there should be 1-2 adults there awake at night in case the children awaken with nightmares or have any other issues. Now that they are being exposed to the outside world, it's likely they'll all start falling victim to the myriad of viruses most people experience as children, and with their weakened immune systems due to malnutrition it will be important to monitor them carefully.

It's extremely difficult for two adults to care for a large family of their own, let alone a large family such as this one with so many problems and fears. I just think it's really unwise to place them with only 1-2 adults at this stage.

I am concerned about they're health, mainly refeeding syndrome, which can be fatal. It has to be done slowly... I'm not a medical expert but it is something to think about.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2440847/

 

[georgiajean]

IIRC, didn’t that same neighbor (Ashley?) say that after the Turpin’s had moved away from the TX home and they went over to check out the house, 2 dogs ran out the back door (after being in there for 2 weeks) and a kitten was found in the dumpster?
But what really haunts me about that interview was when she said “they continued to hear whimpering coming from the dumpster.”


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I remember it as "continued to hear whimpering on the property but could never find where it was coming from"?

 

[margarita25]

She seems to be reliving the fantasy of being young. It's the typical thing of planning the perfect wedding and having a baby. So she seems obsessed with that kind of young high school fantasy and is repeating the best parts of this fantasy - the wedding, the pregnancy, and becoming a mother.

It's over and over again in a continuous loop.

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(Ugh, sooo creepy...O/T, there's this movie with Faye Dunaway where's she's a loon, for some reason I've been reminded of it a few times here, and it's actually not Mommy Dearest that I'm thinking of...gah nevermind I pulled up the movie list and didn't see it, must be another actress, I'll think of it in a second hopefully and add as an eta fwiw.)