CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #4

[artsy1]

WHAT WE KNOW AND DON'T KNOW (SUMMARIZED - LINKS FOUND ELSEWHERE IN THE THREADS):

What we know as fact:

• LE dispatched initial search time at 3:26 pm on Friday, July 12 per RT's 911 call - gave location as Kelbaker Rd/Hidden Hill Rd, according to dispatch records.
• RT had his truck and 5th wheel at the scene (call it camper, trailer, etc. - who cares - we spent many pages just talking about what it is) when LE arrived.
• LE and search teams spent 9 days searching for any sign of Barbara in the Mojave Desert.
• LE said no signs of Barbara were found from their searches.
• Barbara had plane/hotel reservations to fly to Hong Kong to visit her sick brother.
• Cellphone service in that part of the desert is spotty at best.
• Temperature was mid 90's to low 100's at the location.
• Barbara and Robert were residents of Bullhead City, Arizona, 2 hours away from where the search took place.
• Kelbaker Rd/Hidden Hill Rd. is approximately 2.2 miles north of the I-40.
• There is a gas staion/truck stop at the I-40 at exit 107 (Hi-Sierra Oasis).
  
• Most importantly, Barbara is still missing.

What we know from the VI and also RT's niece (not verified yet, I believe) - keep in mind that a lot of this information came from RT or his daughter to Barbara's brother, her niece and her nephew in Hong Kong (3rd party hearsay):

• Barbara does not own a cellphone.
• Barbara and RT married somewhere between 2005 and 2007.
• Barbara is known to walk in the desert in her bikini.
• Barbara and RT live in the desert, and enjoy being out in it.
• RT told the family he called 911 approximately 12 pm.
• Barbara is a strong person.
• Barbara loves her brother, and would have no reason to disappear and not visit him.
• RT told Barbara's family that he already cancelled her trip to Hong Kong within the first 3 days after she was missing.
• Barbara's family last had actual contact her on July 10, when she said she and RT were going camping for a few days.
• No particular camping destination was mentioned by RT.
• A neighbor's surveillance camera shows both RT and BT getting into the vehicle around 8:15 am. So the last time BT was seen by anyone other than RT would have been by that camera.

What RT said himself in interviews:

• RT claims LE told him he was DECEPTIVE on his polygraph (not that he failed it) - which LE won't confirm or deny.
• RT claims LE told him he is the "prime suspect" in her disappearance. (If he committed no crime, why would he be a "suspect".)
• RT claims that Barbara walked a little ways ahead of him back to the 5th wheel while he stopped to take a photograph.
• RT claims that Barbara was abducted, since not much time had passed since they split on the path.
• A reporter ASKS RT if he thinks Barbara could have been taken to Las Vegas. He replies that it's possible, and THEN asks people in Las Vegas to keep an eye out for her. (IIFC, the Las Vegas idea did NOT come out of RT's mouth first.

If anybody can think of what I missed, I will update this. We just seem to keep getting lost in here questioning the same things ad nauseum. Maybe we can move forward into other avenues of thought now to find Barbara.

#TEAMBARBARA


ETA: To add more info

 

[dms]

WHAT WE KNOW AND DON'T KNOW (SUMMARIZED - LINKS FOUND ELSEWHERE IN THE THREADS):

(rsbm) ...I LOVE this. I was just thinking that we should maintain an updated FAQ at the beginning of each thread, or even make a separate reference thread to refer to when the same issues are inevitably hashed out over and over again. I do understand that not everyone has the time or patience to read all the threads when a case is as fast-moving as this one, but it's indescribably frustrating when questions like "why wasn't Barbara carrying a cellphone?" and the inevitable responses come up twelve times over the course of a few threads. We know that the search function here is not always, well, functional; but if we could get into the habit of maintaining FAQs, that might ease the congestion of repetition a bit.

 

[Cherwell]

RT told the family he called 911 approximately 12 pm.

I think it's worth remembering that this comes from Barbara's niece in HK and it's her recollections and paraphrasing of what he said in the phone call.

It shouldn't be regarded as a verbatim account. She didn't know at the time that she would be asked to repeat everything he said, and it's possible that she misheard or misremembered some elements.

 

[MsBetsy]

No one said she "should" have had a phone. Just said it sure would have helped her in this situation, maybe saved her life.

It's really hard to say whether it would have helped her or not. Apparently the service was not very good or reliable in that area.
Anyway it's not a factor in this case, since we know she did not have one. Imo

 

[artsy1]

I think it's worth remembering that this comes from Robert's niece in HK and it's her recollections and paraphrasing of what he said in the phone call.

It shouldn't be regarded as a verbatim account. She didn't know at the time that she would be asked to repeat everything he said, and it's possible that she misheard or misremembered some elements.

From Barbara's niece, yes.

 

[MsBetsy]

I think it's worth remembering that this comes from Robert's niece in HK and it's her recollections and paraphrasing of what he said in the phone call.

It shouldn't be regarded as a verbatim account. She didn't know at the time that she would be asked to repeat everything he said, and it's possible that she misheard or misremembered some elements.

I think it was her nephew ( the VI) who said he thought another family member had said that he called around noon.
He also said his memory was not so great, so he wasn't sure.
I wish we had verification, but all we really have is an opinion so we can't really rely on that. Imo

 

[artsy1]

I think it was her nephew ( the VI) who said he thought another family member had said that he called around noon.
He also said his memory was not so great, so he wasn't sure.
I wish we had verification, but all we really have is an opinion so we can't really rely on that. Imo

I agree. That's why I didn't put it under known facts.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I think it was her nephew ( the VI) who said he thought another family member had said that he called around noon.
He also said his memory was not so great, so he wasn't sure.
I wish we had verification, but all we really have is an opinion so we can't really rely on that. Imo

The search for 69-year-old Barbara Thomas is continuing In the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden Hills near ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

This bulletin states they were hiking at 2.30pm

 

[10ofRods]

Thank you so much, artsy1 .

I think it's important to mention (under what the VI said) that no particular camping destination was mentioned by RT. He says a neighbor's surveillance camera shows both RT and BT getting into the vehicle around 8:15 am. So the last time BT was seen by anyone other than RT would have been by that camera.

It was approximately 104 degrees that day (based on nearby weather data) but Inside Edition reports it as "in the 90's." So perhaps we should say mid 90's to low 100's. It had not yet gotten to the 110+ level.

Husband of Woman Who Vanished During Mojave Desert Hike: 'I Just Want Her Back'

Other facts: Barbara and Robert were residents of Bullhead City, Arizona, 2 hours away from where the search took place (just off I-40 - in case truckers and others want to know).

 

[MsBetsy]

The search for 69-year-old Barbara Thomas is continuing In the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden Hills near ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

This bulletin states they were hiking at 2.30pm

Right. That's why it would be so important to verify the 911 call at noon.
To me the discrepancy would be huge, if there was one. It would indicate a 2 1/2 hour difference.

That still does not verify that Robert told his family that he called at noon. It only tells us when the actual call was made. Imo

 

[artsy1]

The search for 69-year-old Barbara Thomas is continuing In the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden Hills near ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

This bulletin states they were hiking at 2.30pm

Yes, based on what RT told LE.

 

[gitana1]

Ha! The trial by media going on all over the country. And no, it’s not just my personal belief, it’s a real problem that causes courts needing to move trials across county’s and unfair trials to occur that have resulted in innocent people being accused of crimes.

I see you’re being facetious.

It's actually not a real problem. Courts move trials to different counties or venues precisely so defendants get fair trials. Court's bend over backwards to ensure that defendants rights are upheld. Even at the expense of victims. At least among the majority demographic. Failure to do so gives grounds for appeal.

Does that mean that travesties of justice don't occur? Or that innocent people aren't wrongly convicted? No. But with the majority demographic that is less likely to occur.

We have freedom of the press in this nation protected by the constitution. That's important. But ever since the Richard Jewell fiasco, the media is pretty cautious about wrongfully labeling someone a suspect.

 

[artsy1]

Thanks, 10 of rods. I also included the fact there's a gas station/truck stop just down I-40.

 

[10ofRods]

The search for 69-year-old Barbara Thomas is continuing In the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden Hills near ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

This bulletin states they were hiking at 2.30pm

Yes, but those bulletins get a few facts wrong. They were not 20 miles north as originally stated and the Needles Division's own dispatches state that (so whoever wrote the summary for the Sheriff got some things wrong, pretty common).

So...the time detail is still troubling. If the call came in at 3:26 pm and the team got there "two hours later" (RT's version) then the team arrived on July 12 at about 5:30 and searched until dark (complete dark would be 4 hours later). That would be day 1 of the search. Day 9 would then be July 19. Search was called off (with searchers in the area on) July 21. In terms of full 24 hour periods, it was a 10 day search (and that's how local TV described it). That's a really long search. By July 17, it had gotten significantly hotter.

All of this is relevant to the time issue (and it is at variance, a little, from what RT apparently told Dbdb).

If true that they finished their hike around 2:30 (and started it when? 1:30? noon? - it was only 2 miles according to RT), then what did they do all morning? I hope LE is contacting grocery stores and gas stations...

 

[Nerissa]

curious as to the neighbor's surveillance camera being able to detail what BT was wearing....

Now, even if she wasn't leaving the house in a bikini, doesn't mean she wasn't wearing one under, say shorts & a tank top, just for instance. Many bikini bathing suit tops have ties that would be somewhat obvious, not like a bra at all. Also: it's black, so even if wearing a tank top: if the top isn't also very dark color, might be able to tell if whatever is under her shirt is dark/black.

Would also like to know if surveillance shows whether she was wearing the red cap

 

[LietKynes]

Yes, based on what RT told LE.

BBM
Ita.

A lot is hinging on RT's 'say so'.

He could be a bit more helpful ; imo, to let LE know any place they may have stopped that morning before the hike.
Did they stop at a diner for breakfast, for example ?
If I were RT, I'd go over every second of that day to LE.
And it wouldn't be difficult, as something traumatic stays in your mind with a clarity that other non-emergency events do not.

I wish LE would let us know if she was seen on surveillance cams near to where she went missing.
Something, anything.

 

[Cherwell]

From Barbara's niece, yes.

Thank you, yes of course. Corrected!

 

[LietKynes]

All of this is relevant to the time issue (and it is at variance, a little, from what RT apparently told Dbdb).

If true that they finished their hike around 2:30 (and started it when? 1:30? noon? - it was only 2 miles according to RT), then what did they do all morning? I hope LE is contacting grocery stores and gas stations...

Snipped for brevity
Bolding mine

Yes, they left the house around 8:15, give or take.
Then what ?
Breakfast anywhere ?

I'd imagine bathroom breaks, as you wouldn't want to fill up your camper/5th wheel porta-potty if you didn't have to.

Have LE looked at all of the sec. cams on the highways where they might have driven ?
But back to my earlier post -- hasn't RT gone over every minute of that day to LE -- incl. rest/snack stops ?

 

[MsBetsy]

From Barbara's niece, yes.

Where are the statements from Barbaras niece? Is she the VI's sister? I have not seen any information from her at all.
Has she stated anything different than the VI or is he relaying the information he got from her? If so then she may have gotten the info from some one else and passed it on to him which may result in even more misinformation. Imo

 

[Cherwell]

curious as to the neighbor's surveillance camera being able to detail what BT was wearing....

Now, even if she wasn't leaving the house in a bikini, doesn't mean she wasn't wearing one under, say shorts & a tank top, just for instance. Many bikini bathing suit tops have ties that would be somewhat obvious, not like a bra at all. Also: it's black, so even if wearing a tank top: if the top isn't also very dark color, might be able to tell if whatever is under her shirt is dark/black.

Would also like to know if surveillance shows whether she was wearing the red cap

Not sure that it matters. They were going away for a few days, she would have other clothes packed. She could have changed any article of her clothing after they left home.