Found Deceased CA - Blaze Bernstein, 19, Lake Forest, 2 Jan 2018 #5 *Arrest*

[stlrfninca]

Does anyone have the article about SW leaving the HS early because he was angry at BB for outing him then? I may be mistaken but there was a comment there about that being the reason or related to the reason why they didn’t continue their friendship/relationship from that point on.

That timeline doesn't work. The "outing" occurred in June 2017 according to the OC Register article today

BB and SW haven't been in high school together for at least 2 or 3 years. They may or may not have had a relationship at that time. To my knowledge no actual verified reporting of why SW left OCSA without graduating exists, although there are unconfirmed rumors.

 

[ElementalLaura]

Why would Blaze 'out' SW? Isn't that mean, hateful and cruel? What if SW wasn't ready to be 'out', why would Blaze think this was okay? He took it upon himself to out another? That is NOT right. Not right at all. And what if SW is not gay?

If this did happen, then I understand it now. It's not right, but there is the cause of it.

There's going to be a few plot twists in this that go back several years. IMO.

 

[Busylady]

Think I will wait for the actual affidavit to be released, getting so confused on what is fact and what is rumor while reading this thread.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Just a thought, the weapon may not have been a knife.

Agree. If he had camping gear it might have been a hatchet.

 

[stlrfninca]

Think I will wait for the actual affidavit to be released, getting so confused on what is fact and what is rumor while reading this thread.

I hope we get it. Do you suppose it could be sealed like the last one?

 

[WestCoastLady]

( BBM )


I am so sorry to hear what happened to your father! This thread discussion must really be difficult for you now too.

Thanks for being here anyway, and for offering your help.

That takes a really special person, for sure...

Thanks. It was a LONG time ago (1973) but the memories never go away. I can imagine just a fraction of what BB's family is going through now....we didn't have to deal with SM and the internet back then....and my Dad's case was never solved....but it's all still surreal and life-changing in so many ways.


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[kkdj]

Is there another article somewhere? Because the OSR one linked does not say that.

Oh shoot! I can't find it.....know I read it, but not sure where. So, unless and until it can be linked I withdraw my statement as being fact.

 

[2Hope4]

From what I know so far, I don't think SW knew that BB had told others, or outed him. It is possible that after or during a sexual encounter, some mention was made such as "still going to deny you're gay?" Or other statements to the effect especially if SW has not had a MM sexual encounter before, but was experimenting himself. It does NOT give anyone the right to murder someone! So please do NOT think I'm trying to defend a murderer, I'm not.

Having NO perceived notions about either the victim or perp, I'm only trying to look at this from all sides. Looking at what we can learn from this tragedy.

"IF" BB did text those female friends as stated, and SW knew about it, I don't think BB would have wanted to be alone with him at night. It totally should have been SW's decision if he wanted to be in the open, or wanted to experiment, or wanted it to be unknown. I would think another gay would realize how important it is to allow a person to make that decision on their own. It's not anyone else's right. I would think BB would realize SW would be pissed about it. Especially if SW had said not to tell.

One theory, BB did tell others. Word got back to SW that BB had told. SW tells BB he is totally OK and relieved he has told others. BB or SW then says they want to meet up, and hook up. Only SW wasn't relieved, he was pissed.

There's several theories that could account for the level of rage to stab someone over 20 times. Just horrific! In this case, some theories might be taunting by the victim, not at all fearing it would cost him his life. Betrayal felt by the perp. Fear of those in the perp's family social circle learning he was bi or gay. Internal struggle with the perp and his feelings for the same sex. If SW isn't bi or gay, but was taunting BB by saying he wanted to hook up, etc. Then there may be a hate crime towards gays.

 

[Elle*Bee]

Why would Blaze 'out' SW? Isn't that mean, hateful and cruel? What if SW wasn't ready to be 'out', why would Blaze think this was okay? He took it upon himself to out another? That is NOT right. Not right at all. And what if SW is not gay?

If this did happen, then I understand it now. It's not right, but there is the cause of it.

We tend to sympathize with the victim (rightfully so, since no one deserves to be murdered). The problem is we tend to see the victims as angels and the perpetrators as evil. In my experience, it’s rarely so cut and dry. I’m not sure people are all good or all bad.

I knew someone my entire life who was kind and generous to many people. He did something horrible as an adult in his 50’s. What to do with that information? I don’t defend his actions and I believe he should absolutely be sentenced strongly (he was). Does that negate all the good he did prior? It’s complicated.

It appears that BB did something most of would not (immaturity perhaps?). It might have been the only time he did something like this (not keeping SW’s secret). My guess is that B.B. is a multidimensional, complicated human being. Most people are. I’m not blaming him. He absolutely did not deserve his fate.

 

[animlzrule]

I don't care if he told the whole world that SW was all of 2 inches - I still have no sympathy for SW.

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I don't either. We have plenty of evidence that SW is a reprehensible person, and that precedes anything that ever happened with BB.

 

[kkdj]

We tend to sympathize with the victim (rightfully so, since no one deserves to be murdered). The problem is we tend to see the victims as angels and the perpetrators as evil. In my experience, it’s rarely so cut and dry. I’m not sure people are all good or all bad.

I knew someone my entire life who was kind and generous to many people. He did something horrible as an adult in his 50’s. What to do with than information? I don’t defend his actions and I believe he should absolutely be sentenced strongly (he was). Does that negate all the good he did prior? It’s complicated.

It appears that BB did something most of would not (immaturity perhaps?). It might have been the only time he did something like this (not keeping SW’s secret). My guess is that B.B. is a multidimensional, complicated human being. Most people are. I’m not blaming him. He absolutely did not deserve his fate.

Blaze strikes me like someone who maybe wouldn't have taken SW's fears of being outed too seriously because I don't have the feeling Blaze thought it was anything needed to be hidden in his own life. Perhaps BB was even flattered by the attention and was kind of bragging to his friends. It might not have been anything knowingly mean. imo BB strikes me like an intelligent fun loving guy!

 

[DAnthrplgst]

I don't care if he told the whole world that SW was all of 2 inches - I still have no sympathy for SW.

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I disagree. I don't approve of what SW did but unless you're a man who was born and raised in the type of culture that SW was apparently raised in you can't understand what SW may have been feeling.
And if the reports are correct that Blaze outed SW, well, then, I've lost a lot of respect for Blaze. That is a cardinal sin among gay men, you DO NOT, EVER, under ANY circumstances out someone and if this was done to SW out of spite that makes it all the worse. I AM NOT saying that Blaze "deserved" anything that happened to him so don't interpret my words like that but I am saying that I can understand SW's anger, resentment and his feelings and if this report is true I have a great deal of sympathy for him.

I was outed once out of spite and while I didn't murder anyone I did deliver a solid thrashing, as our British friends might say, to the offender. Outing me in the way that person did could have gotten me seriously hurt or killed because he outed me to a group of good ol' redneck boys who lived in our dorm who after learning of my sexuality made it quite clear to me that I was an abomination, a mistake and a "vile sinner" and that the bible commands gay men to be stoned to death Two of them were expelled from the university the following year for posting KKK recruitment posters and applications to join the Klan in our dormitory common room. In the interests of full disclosure, I attended the Univ of Texas.

JMO

 

[DAnthrplgst]

I don't either. We have plenty of evidence that SW is a reprehensible person, and that precedes anything that ever happened with BB.

What evidence do we have that SW is a "reprehensible person"? Honestly asking because I've yet to see anything that would earn him that moniker.

 

[toevlugsoord]

What evidence do we have that SW is a "reprehensible person"? Honestly asking because I've yet to see anything that would earn him that moniker.

I'd think being accused of stabbing something to death would deem you as being reprehensible.

 

[Cora]

I don't either. We have plenty of evidence that SW is a reprehensible person, and that precedes anything that ever happened with BB.

Absolutely.

Even if BB did "out" SW...it was typical teenage drama. Most teens are still immature.

Most are not murderous. And that is the problem here.


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[PaulR]

I disagree. I don't approve of what SW did but unless you're a man who was born and raised in the type of culture that SW was apparently raised in you can't understand what SW may have been feeling.
And if the reports are correct that Blaze outed SW, well, then, I've lost a lot of respect for Blaze. That is a cardinal sin among gay men, you DO NOT, EVER, under ANY circumstances out someone and if this was done to SW out of spite that makes it all the worse. I AM NOT saying that Blaze "deserved" anything that happened to him so don't interpret my words like that but I am saying that I can understand SW's anger, resentment and his feelings and if this report is true I have a great deal of sympathy for him.

I was outed once out of spite and while I didn't murder anyone I did deliver a solid thrashing, as our British friends might say, to the offender. Outing me in the way that person did could have gotten me seriously hurt or killed because he outed me to a group of good ol' redneck boys who lived in our dorm who after learning of my sexuality made it quite clear to me that I was an abomination, a mistake and a "vile sinner" and that the bible commands gay men to be stoned to death Two of them were expelled from the university the following year for posting KKK recruitment posters and applications to join the Klan in our dormitory common room. In the interests of full disclosure, I attended the Univ of Texas.

JMO

I'm really sorry that someone betrayed the trust you place in them.

 

[pamelado2]

That latest article doesn't say anything about outing SW:

"In one conversation, Bernstein wrote that Woodward was about to “hit on me” and “he made me promise not to tell anyone … but I have texted every one, uh oh.”"

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[ElementalLaura]

We tend to sympathize with the victim (rightfully so, since no one deserves to be murdered). The problem is we tend to see the victims as angels and the perpetrators as evil. In my experience, it’s rarely so cut and dry. I’m not sure people are all good or all bad.

I knew someone my entire life who was kind and generous to many people. He did something horrible as an adult in his 50’s. What to do with that information? I don’t defend his actions and I believe he should absolutely be sentenced strongly (he was). Does that negate all the good he did prior? It’s complicated.

It appears that BB did something most of would not (immaturity perhaps?). It might have been the only time he did something like this (not keeping SW’s secret). My guess is that B.B. is a multidimensional, complicated human being. Most people are. I’m not blaming him. He absolutely did not deserve his fate.

THIS. And much more will come out in coming days. We're going to have to keep in mind that only one young man is here to tell us his perspective.

There are scenarios that would make me sympathize with why Blaze may have texted some people (we know only of two? female friends) about this even thought it wasn't the right thing to do. Let's remember that Blaze was not a self-assured Ivy League gourmand five years ago. He was a skinny little kid worried about whether his family and friends would still love and accept him when he came out.

 

[kkdj]

I disagree. I don't approve of what SW did but unless you're a man who was born and raised in the type of culture that SW was apparently raised in you can't understand what SW may have been feeling.
And if the reports are correct that Blaze outed SW, well, then, I've lost a lot of respect for Blaze. That is a cardinal sin among gay men, you DO NOT, EVER, under ANY circumstances out someone and if this was done to SW out of spite that makes it all the worse. I AM NOT saying that Blaze "deserved" anything that happened to him so don't interpret my words like that but I am saying that I can understand SW's anger, resentment and his feelings and if this report is true I have a great deal of sympathy for him.

I was outed once out of spite and while I didn't murder anyone I did deliver a solid thrashing, as our British friends might say, to the offender. Outing me in the way that person did could have gotten me seriously hurt or killed because he outed me to a group of good ol' redneck boys who lived in our dorm who after learning of my sexuality made it quite clear to me that I was an abomination, a mistake and a "vile sinner" and that the bible commands gay men to be stoned to death Two of them were expelled from the university the following year for posting KKK recruitment posters and applications to join the Klan in our dormitory common room. In the interests of full disclosure, I attended the Univ of Texas.

JMO

I'm so sad to hear of some of your sufferings. Society is much more accepting now and well should be. Nowadays, those good 'ol redneck boys would be held accountable for their terrible behavior towards you. I'm sorry you had to go thru that.

 

[ElementalLaura]

That latest article doesn't say anything about outing SW:

"In one conversation, Bernstein wrote that Woodward was about to “hit on me” and “he made me promise not to tell anyone … but I have texted every one, uh oh.”"

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I think sharing exactly what is quoted there would be considered 'outing' these days, given the reach of cell phones and social media. IMO. It may only be among their peer group, but that would probably be the group that matters to SW.