CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #3

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If your heart is set on creating your own blog, by all means please do. :)

I was thinking if we put it on WebSleuths, that everyone can help keep the information up to date so the burden does not fall to just one person.

Make sense?

I will create a thread shortly, and post the link for all when done.

Yes makes sense :) I will see what everyone thinks about the blog idea :) this is probably great as it is though :) thank you Breezy!


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I know it's hard to imagine how something like this happens, but it happens all the time. I'm basing this upon my personal experience living in apartment buildings and working in hotels.

People go to the wrong floor and try to enter the wrong room all the time.

One time I did it in an apartment building I had been living in for eight months! I came home from work, thought I was on my floor, and tried my key on a door I thought was my own apartment. The key didn't work, so I tried the door, and it opened right up, and I walked right into someone's apartment. Thankfully I walked right out before anyone saw me.

It happens. In this case, I believe that's exactly what happened, and it got her killed.
 
You count 7 pushes though right? All on different locations. Only 4 buttons light up. The first button she lights up is the 2nd one she presses. I don't think the quality of the video is too poor to see this. Use the full screen option on a computer monitor if you can't see.

Now let's say the buttons, 7, 4, M, and B were on. Then that would mean 10 was pressed but didn't stay on. So any way you look at it, grainy video or not, she was either on the 14th floor or the 10th floor.

But if you agree she pressed 7 times, then she must've been on the 14th floor.

This conclusion, of course, is only valid if the elevator buttons were all working.

Yes that's all well and good but you didn't answer my question.....why did B not light up?


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Elisa Lam Death: Friends Call Her Caring and Conscientious, Autopsy Result Inclusive
February 26, 2013 10:56 AM GM

snipped...After the autopsy, some media reports said that the LAPD has ruled out any possibility of foul play in Lam's death. However, the rumours have been denied by Alex Martinez, a LAPD public information officer.

He said "there's been no update," from investigators and the cause of death is not yet determined either.

"It just takes a while for coroners to do their thing." he added.


http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/439535/20130226/canadian-woman-elisa-lam-death-cecil-hotel.htm
 
I know it's hard to imagine how something like this happens, but it happens all the time. I'm basing this upon my personal experience living in apartment buildings and working in hotels.

People go to the wrong floor and try to enter the wrong room all the time.

One time I did it in an apartment building I had been living in for eight months! I came home from work, thought I was on my floor, and tried my key on a door I thought was my own apartment. The key didn't work, so I tried the door, and it opened right up, and I walked right into someone's apartment. Thankfully I walked right out before anyone saw me.

It happens. In this case, I believe that's exactly what happened, and it got her killed.

I am not doubting that this happens :)

But I am saying that even if it did happen to Elisa, and she tried to use her key card to open a standard keyed door, would she have really made that much noise? Surely she would have taken her key card out to insert, then realized there's nothing to insert in to?

Night sleuths :)


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The family might also be more trusting of the Chinese media, considering that is their heritage. Someone above mentioned that a friend of Elisa's uncle-in-law (I think???) said that he said she was found nude with all 4 limbs broken.

But like you said, take it with a grain of salt. If her limbs were indeed broken, why would the LAPD say they were leaning towards suicide (essentially)? Or are they trying to keep it discreet so that the perp doesn't flee?

And if so are we blowing I do them by discussing all this stuff?? Lol




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As a Chinese myself, not willing to say that but the fact is, sometime some small Chinese newspapers will report based on rumors
That news from canadian chinese cummunity http://www.iask.ca/news/canada/2013/0225/184670.html
was Originally copied from Mingpaotor another Chinese news(overseas).
Mingpao is well known newspaper in Hong Kong, and Mingpaotor is the overseas office of Mingpao.
but you can read from before, alot of fact that its stated are based on people without fullname, or people that is far from closely related person. However I will look into finding the live stream record it was talking about.

In additional, the photo Mr Yam taken on the 23 Feb
1361OW5ARP-351G.jpg
with the missing 15th floor button, which is same as the photo from taiwan apple daily, taken on the 23 Feb too.

24 Feb uschinapress.com reporter said that Elevator #1 was frozen (the one Elisa's video captured , and with working "Door Hold" and missing 15th floor button)


http://www.mingpaotor.com/htm/News/20130225/tab1.htm?m=0

English Translated (I did the translation myself, since google translate wasn't making it right, but my translation skill isn't great too, so please ask me if you don't understand anything)
Elisa Lam Bizarre Death case hotel, with more Chinese community investigation
加拿大家园 iask.ca 2013-02-25 08:26 来源: 明报 作者:
Source: mingpao (Chinese Newspaper)
Author: (unstated)

Cecil hotel, down town Los Angeles become so well known to the public after the death case of Elisa Lam. Beside one of our informant Mr.V, there are other “community investigation” put in to the hotel, and live stream online the actual status inside the hotel, hoping to solve the puzzle of internet users, and found out the truth of the death of Elisa Lam. In the other hand, a colleague of Elisa family member spoke, family and friend of Elisa have already arrived Los Angeles for funeral and ceremonies. On the day which Elisa missing, US Police have informed that “Better wish we can find the body”
Chinese youth from Gansu Province, China who living in LA, 5pm the day before yesterday, together with a Thai youth and two other friends, successfully checked in to the Cecil Hotel, and get to the 14th floor where suspecting to be where Elisa’s Room located during her stay, and Live Stream online the whole investigation. He stated that the hotel has not been suspended, and still available for staying, but the price already went up from $55 to $65-$90. And the Café on the first floor and convenient store have been closed, without any stock of food.

Chines Youth checked in 14th floor Live Stream
Mr Yam emphasize the site, there is no surveillance camera in hallway outside the guestroom. He stated there are two elevators in this hotel, and confirmed that there is “door hold” button, which can keep the door of elevator open. He stated that the elevator that Elisa used, the door hold button is functioning, but the door hold button in the other elevators is not functioning. And the 15th floor button in the elevator that Elisa used is already removed.
Mr Yam requested to hotel the day before yesterday, he will need to use the toilet, at the beginning the security stated that there is no toilet in this hotel, but assigned a steward to clean up the toilet for 2 minutes, and stated that there is problem with the water system. Mr. Yam stated that during flushing, smells with rotten together with disinfectant, and therefore no willing to use the tap for hand washing. The smell from the water disappeared yesterday, and there are two Mexican securities left in the hotel.
Other than that, a female claim that she is colleague of Elisa’s uncle (colleague of Elisa’s mother’s sister’s husband), stated that Elisa’s uncle already went to LA to attend Elisa’s funeral and ceremonies. She stated that Elisa’s family was informed by the US Police on the day they notify the missing of Elisa. She also disclose that Elisa was discovered naked with 4 broken limbs, the lid is locked from outside after body was dropped into the tank.

Holding of Elisa Lam Room key, Police locked suspect on hotel staff
According US Media, Canadian Chinese University student bizarre death case (in Chinese this can also meaning murder) LA Police have locked suspect on one of the hotel staff
According CNN, LA Times reporting, Police believe that one of the hotel staff is very suspicion. At the same time, Los Angeles coroner believes the Elisa death time was on the 1st of Feb (the day after her missing) without injury [Noted this is contradicting with what stated by the colleague of Elisa], and her death possible caused by alcohol or drug. More importantly, Media disclosed that, on the 14th Feb the water quality examined “everything is normal”, if this test is trustful, this could mean the mystery killer have hidden the body for almost half of a month, and dropped the body secretly after the water was tested.

According reported, Forensic will coordinate Toxicology Testing to the body of Elisa, hoping to justify the fact that if she was affected by alcohol or drug during her death, but the report will need 6-8 weeks.
Police already locked on a staff in the hotel as the most suspicion suspect, Media did not disclosed the name of the staff, but an informant who understand the hotel status stated, the reason police locked on that staff, is because during Elisa stay in the hotel, he was the one get hold of Elisa’s room key, theoretically he could enter to Elisa’s Room any time he wanted, with a lot of chance of crime. LA Police interviewed many staff of the hotel after the incident, after a series of investigation, and finally locked on that staff of being most suspicious.

According to the hotel, the tank with Elisa body located in the rooftop (in chinese it stated top floor) and the rooftop area is a controlled area, only two door can enter this area, one of the door is locked and typical people will not able to in and out that door easily, and only staff could get hold of that key. The other door is a fire escape that connected with security alarm; any forceful entry will activate the alarm.

If the killer doesn’t understand the hotel area, is will be difficult to drop Elisa’s body into the tank.
 
SMeinzer, not sure if you've been asked already but can you confirm if the Stay floors are orange wall just off the elevator or is there a mural of some sort off of those floors when exiting the elevator? I know the halls appear orange but the only video of the stay floors I've found do not show orange walls directly opposite the elevator bank.. Thanks

I'm pretty sure that all the stay floors are different colors. I do not remember seeing a mural. The 4th floor was a blueish grey color and the floors below that we're different as well. I think floor 2 was bright yellow but I'm still not totally sure which floors are "stay" and which were Cecil. It appears that stay can put people anywhere they want but have certain floors they "manage"
 
Hi Guys,
I'm new here. But found this with recent pics and videos from inside Cecil.
the videos are pics are taken within the last few days.

http://tieba.baidu.com/p/2179533681?see_lz=1&pn=1

(sorry i'm at work and i can't really translate the sites, but if you link on the link, it will have pictures of inside the hotel and also links to videos that they've posted showing the door hold button, elevator and also the floors.)

If there are any Chinese readers here, maybe they can help translating some of the posts there.

Hope that helps.
 
Hi Guys,
I'm new here. But found this with recent pics and videos from inside Cecil.
the videos are pics are taken within the last few days.

http://tieba.baidu.com/p/2179533681?see_lz=1&pn=1

(sorry i'm at work and i can't really translate the sites, but if you link on the link, it will have pictures of inside the hotel and also links to videos that they've posted showing the door hold button, elevator and also the floors.)

If there are any Chinese readers here, maybe they can help translating some of the posts there.

Hope that helps.


There some interesting videos linked there, along with some men pressing the various buttons. Am I the only one who finds it strange this story fell out of the American news so quickly? I heard about it once on CNN but that was it.
 
Yes that's all well and good but you didn't answer my question.....why did B not light up?

I saw your theory on the lighting on the 14 button.. I think we can all agree what buttons are in the middle row based on the picture.

Knowing that she used the middle row and knowing that the floors are three apart down that row.. it only makes sense in the following scenario..

She hits 7 buttons..

14 (doesn't light, shes on it), 10 (lights), 7 (lights), 4 (lights), M (lights), B (does not light, possibly because this floor is off limits at night, IE: a floor where workout facilities are etc..), and door hold (which is why doors stay open).

So watch from 2:58 on in the video.. this is where the door first closes and the elevator makes it's trip. We see the door close.. open up on another similar looking floor.. close again and open on another floor.

Time the trips between the door opening and closing..

Both trips were roughly 11-12 seconds.. so it would stand to reason..

We start on 14..

We go 14->12->11->10 Stop.. 11-12 seconds.

And then 10->09->08->07 Stop.. 11-12 seconds.

Time it in the video and it makes perfect sense.. at least to me.

EDIT: The point here is we know she used the middle row.. so, technically there is no other way the floors could coincide timewise like this if she was on a floor from another row.. there would be an extra floor to go down from which would take more than 1 second.. IMO.
 
I edited my post above. Maybe access to B is only activated during working hours. There's no point in guests going to the basement right?

In the video, can you see that there are two buttons below that don't light up? I count 7 pushes - off, on, on, on, on, off, off = 14, 10, 7, 4, M, B, DH. Regardless of what other people say, or the color of the wall, there is direct proof in the video that she is on the 14th floor.

BBM -- on the Cecil's website, it says there is a "24 Hour Self-Service Laundry Facility". Does anyone know if it's located in the basement?

Not that I think EL was trying to get down there at the time.
 
Hi Guys,
I'm new here. But found this with recent pics and videos from inside Cecil.
the videos are pics are taken within the last few days.

http://tieba.baidu.com/p/2179533681?see_lz=1&pn=1

(sorry i'm at work and i can't really translate the sites, but if you link on the link, it will have pictures of inside the hotel and also links to videos that they've posted showing the door hold button, elevator and also the floors.)

If there are any Chinese readers here, maybe they can help translating some of the posts there.

Hope that helps.
This looks like the source of the news of mingpao. Mr.Yam
Im reading the website now. I will translate interesting post that i come across
 
A photo of the workout facilities.. being that a treadmill on a floor above anything would be very loud.. I would imagine it is most likely in the basement and that it wouldn't be available at 2am. We should try to confirm this.

A possibility on the basement button not lighting during the video.

005.jpg
 
Hi all-- been following and reading for a little while-- back in thread 1, I had posted some info about a missing cell phone from Jan 27th from Elisa's tumblr. I hadn't provided a link, as I'd misunderstood the rules, but after re-reading, I think it's safe to do so. So, for context, here it is. Mods, please let me know if this is out of bounds.

This post is from Jan 27 (though may have been queued)-- check out the tags on the right hand side of the page, and you'll see her note that the phone wasn't even hers, and was a blackberry.

http://nouvelle-nouveau.tumblr.com/post/41596157293/more-the-speakeasy-was-awesome-except-i-lost
 
You've explained why a water tank would make a good hiding place, I don't think anyone was debating that.

What I was asking or should I say questioning is th idea that someone unfamiliar with the hotel would think of the water tanks as a hiding place for a dead body.

And in my opinion this case speaks to someone who was familiar with the hotel, not a random guest.

Additionalg the idea that she ODed and someone freaked so they hid her in a water tank. No way I don't buy that either. Sorry.

I don't mean to sound skeptical but I think
Your theory doesn't sound as strong to
Me, as it does to you.

But if we all thought the same way we wouldn't get anywhere.

We all have our own ideas :) I present mine for debate. If you disagree plz tell me why ;)

Why the water tank?? Well the roof seems like a good choice doesn't it? When you get to the roof and you see a huge water tank don't you think the thought might cross someone's mind? Even the mind of someone unfamiliar with the building?

You don't buy that she OD'd and the person could have freaked out? why not?

A bad mix of drugs would explain not being able to rule homicide as the cause. Especially if the perp drugged her and with what we know about her use of medications already. Plus what if we include that she was drinking? We all know that spells trouble to begin with.

What's so hard to believe?

I believe strongly in my theory. However I know that it's all speculation and there's nothing to say that I'm right. Again it's just a theory.
 
We all have our own ideas :) I present mine for debate. If you disagree plz tell me why ;)

Why the water tank?? Well the roof seems like a good choice doesn't it? When you get to the roof and you see a huge water tank don't you think the thought might cross someone's mind? Even the mind of someone unfamiliar with the building?

You don't buy that she OD'd and the person could have freaked out? why not?

A bad mix of drugs would explain not being able to rule homicide as the cause. Especially if the perp drugged her and with what we know about her use of medications already. Plus what if we include that she was drinking? We all know that spells trouble to begin with.

What's so hard to believe?

I believe strongly in my theory. However I know that it's all speculation and there's nothing to say that I'm right. Again it's just a theory.

You asked for an opinion on your "theory".. and I would actually call it a hypothesis. You only offer conjecture with no real evidence.

Maybe include some information or evidence to support the ideas you present and then that can be debated?
 
This looks like the source of the news of mingpao. Mr.Yam
Im reading the website now. I will translate interesting post that i come across


5b50bade9c82d158f6eab79.jpg

Mr. Yam photo of the 14th floor wall opposite elevators
 
Then you'll need to elaborate how Elisa Lam would even bother to look up the water tanks, climb up the 10ft water tank and then wiggle herself inside that small hatch hole on the top.

Where did she find a ladder to climb up it? Did she scale up the ladder from the maintenance room next to those 4 water tanks, jump down and landed on the water tanks, while being nude and drowned herself?



6a00d8341c630a53ef017d412a7a8d970c-640wi


6a00d8341c630a53ef017d4132cece970c-640wi

You misunderstand me. <modsnip>

All I suggested was that her death was her own doing. Her death. I in no way believe Elisa put herself in that tank.

In case you're just confused my suggestion was that it could be possible if she was drinking, the mix of booze and pills caused her to die. See what I mean? That is common. That's why they say don't drink if you're on medication. Now I suggest what if she happen to die while in the room of another patron?

Would that cause the patron to hide the body in fear of being accused of murder? Most likely not. That's why I think it's more probably a drug he slipped her mixed with her meds that killed her. But I pose the thought anywy.

<modsnip>

<MODSNIP>
 
You asked for an opinion on your "theory".. and I would actually call it a hypothesis. You only offer conjecture with no real evidence.

Maybe include some information or evidence to support the ideas you present and then that can be debated?

Evidence of what? That mixing alcohol and pills is a bad idea?
 
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