CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #3

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OCSlacker said:
Spoke to a friend that lived in a hotel this past year for a # of months. He said each week they moved him to a different room. He had to check out then check back in and would get a different room each time. Only the long term (meaning in residence more than 5 years) were able to keep their rooms and not have to check out. Some sort of agreement management was unable to break when they purchased the hotel a number of years before. Anyway, they used regular keys and yes it was a problem for him as well. He would come home at times and find the place ransacked or the TV on and the bed messed up. So I can see this being an issue at the Cecil as well.

Not sure if it has anything to do with EL but I can see using a known empty room. I think I may have stated before that it was one theory. And although I can understand the need to hide a body on the roof to get some distance from the crime, if the room wasn't booked why not just leave the body there. Say under the bed. Avoid the trouble of climbing up with a body and the water tanks. The only thing that would force someone to move the body in that case might be if they stayed in that room recently..
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That and water washes away DNA. Not to mention allows more time for decomposition which also destroys evidence.
 
LI-LI said:
This is something I want to point out. The reason she had no glasses on was because she was asleep and then woke up for dream walking. You don't wear your glasses when you go to bed do you? I really don't think anyone would take off their glasses going to places that they have no experience with (especially during midnight).

Also she might had a habit of dream walking, LAPD might want to check out the tapes during the period of her stay to see if she was like that previously and probably to see whether she had been to 14th floor before or knew anyone there by just scanning through the tapes again.
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If she was sleep walking would she put her shoes on though? or zip up a sweat shirt over her T-Shirt?


For myself I'm still not sold on her being in any state, sleep, manic or otherwise while on the elevator.

I hate writing narratives with no concrete evidence but i do wonder why we have this video to see. why was it released when certainly a couple of video captures would have served the police departments need to give the public a view of her that evening. What are they expecting to gain from the public having access to this.

Just to let everyone know I'm no conspiracy theorist...lol So don't take me asking that the wrong way, I'm not saying the police have some dark motive for releasing the video but I do wonder what they expected to gain from it's release
 
LI-LI said:
This is something I want to point out. The reason she had no glasses on was because she was asleep and then woke up for dream walking. You don't wear your glasses when you go to bed do you? I really don't think anyone would take off their glasses going to places that they have no experience with (especially during midnight).

Also she might had a habit of dream walking, LAPD might want to check out the tapes during the period of her stay to see if she was like that previously and probably to see whether she had been to 14th floor before or knew anyone there by just scanning through the tapes again.
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She was missing her glasses. But she was wearing shoes. And a zip-up hoodie. Couldn't tell you whether she had a bra on too. Most women don't sleep in their bras though and it's a pretty intricate thing to put on if asleep (probably not impossible, just difficult). More difficult than glasses at any rate. But while I accept sleeping in bicycle shorts and a t-shirt, not sure anyone would sleep in a hooded sweatshirt. I know I couldn't do it. The darn hood would get in the way of a relaxing sleep I think. Course, if you're taking a heavy hypnotic, it doesn't matter what you wear. But I also don't think you'd wake up or...sleep...up? Looking quite as fresh as Elisa does here.

Really, aside from no glasses, she looks quite pretty put together. Her hair isn't tangled, the hooded sweatshirt is zipped naturally (not really wrinkled, no weird sleeves, it's not turned inside out).

I do know people do amazing things while sleepwalking, especially on hypnotic-type drugs, I just don't know if I believe she "properly" dressed all the way aside from her glasses, brushed hair, etc., and only then went on to do decidedly strange things in the elevators. Just my thoughts!

One thing I am still curious about is the laundry facilities at the Cecil/Stay. Given the length of Elisa's travels, budget, and going solo, I know she'd make heavy use of the laundry, especially on the last night of her stay. I really would like to know which floor they are located on and how secure they are.
 
I think the "smile" while "hiding" at around 30 seconds has been created by manipulating the image. Look closely and you can see pretty clearly how the image breaks up to create the smile.

It has thrown many off here it makes her look playful etc.

Thoughts?
 
OCSlacker said:
Thanks for posting this video. Since I've joined I've had a # of different takes on this video. When I just watched it again it kinda clicked. I have yet to see confirmation that she is booked into a room on the 4th floor.

I believe one of two things could have happened once she left that area. She was grabbed by someone on the way to wherever she was heading or someone gained access to her room.

SMeinzer -can you remember if you passed a kitchen while you were on the 15th floor? Do you know which floor the Stay lounge is on and which floor the kitchens are on for Stay? Thanks in advance?
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This video was taken the last day anyone had seen her, but many hours could have passed before she ever met her killer - or initiated her suicide. It may have absolutely nothing to do with the events that led to her ultimate demise.
 
Chorley8 said:
I think the "smile" while "hiding" at around 30 seconds has been created by manipulating the image. Look closely and you can see pretty clearly how the image breaks up to create the smile.

It has thrown many off here it makes her look playful etc.

Thoughts?
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I don't think so

Why would somebody manipulate the footage?
What would be gained from that?

If they could or had a reason to do so then we can assume they are hiding something and if they have the access to the video to manipulate it why not just destroy it?
 
This is my interpretation of what was going on with Elisa. It is the only one I could think of that is consistent with all her actions, gestures and expressions in the video.

I hope you read with an open mind and do not jump to conclusions before reaching the end.

As to what caused the state of mind she was in, it could be drug-induced hallucination or some other things. If you like to know more about ambien-induced sleepwalking, ThinkHard posted an excellent description in post #29 of thread #1.

To me, far from trying to get away quickly, she was actually expecting "people" to join her in the elevator. I place people in inverted commas because we cannot see what she was seeing in her mind. So all my references to people or persons are what I think she was experiencing.

These are the reasons why I am saying those who believe she was trying to escape got it wrong:

Look at the body language - the casual way she entered the elevator, the roundabout swing of the arm instead of hitting the buttons straight, and pausing a second or two to peer at the panel before meticulously pressing each button one by one. Short-sighted yes, but why waste precious time if rushing to escape?

And on her re-entry, why go through the same buttons in the same sequence 3 more times if the first 2 times already did not work? Why not try pressing the other buttons to see if they could get the elevator moving?

So, she was not trying to get away as quickly as possible. On the contrary, my theory is that she pressed the floor buttons for other people whom she was expecting to join her in the elevator. She pressed the Door Hold button to keep the door open for them. And she was expecting 4 of them.

My first thought was that the 4 of them were adults. But I could not tie this with the rest of the video, especially the hand gesture part, until I read a psychic's reading that she was looking for something low because of the way she first stooped to look outside.

Then it dawned on me that she was waiting not for 4 adults but for 4 little children, and then the whole video made sense. She pressed the 4 floors for them and waited for them to show up. They didn't. She thought they were cheekily playing hide-n-seek with her. So she responded playfully in kind, just like how a 20+ age babysitter would play with her young wards.

(She pressed 6 buttons in total and they were for floors 14, 10, 7, 4, M and Door Hold. The 14th floor was where she was on so it was redundant, leaving floors 10, 7, 4 and M for the 4 kids.)

Failing to see the children, she stood outside waiting a long while and they still did not show up. Bewildered, with hands placed on head, she came back in wondering if she had pressed the button sequence correctly. She redid the sequence 3 times to be sure (indicative of a code or a ritual, or of the 4 floors for the 4 children), and then walked out seemingly assured again. (Look closely at all her body language clues and facial expression.)

This time the children appeared on her right and she was immediately relieved to see them, placing a hand to her chest and flashing a smile. She looked towards them and patted each of them as they entered the elevator one by one (a total of 4 pats). Note how the patting motion moved towards the elevator, as if she was placing her hand on the child's head or shoulder as the child entered the elevator.

(As for the splayed hands, they can be explained as exaggerated gestures caused by drug-induced hallucinations, much like a normally shy person talking loudly and uninhibitedly under the influence of alcohol.)

Next, she turned towards someone on her front left and seemed to be relating or reporting with much joy what she had just accomplished, while counting out with her hands the 4 children or the 4 floors that she had pressed the elevator buttons for. Her bouncing or skipping motions were manifestations of the joy she was feeling.

(Yes, she counted 4, not 3. Counts 1 and 2 are subtly in close succession between 2:12 to 2:14. Watch that segment again.)

Finally, she paused for a few seconds as though she was listening to some instructions or waiting to follow behind the other person. Note that she did not step directly towards the left but her right foot stepped forward first towards the center of the corridor. The left foot then stepped forward to directly in front of the right foot. She then made an abrupt turn to the left causing the right foot to cross the front of the left foot in such a way that the final thing we see of her was her left heel.

So, does the above make sense? Well, it may not make 100% sense to us, but to her in the whatever state of mind she was in, it could be what she was going through. Of course, I admit that it is all highly speculative but it is the only explanation I could find that is consistent with all her gestures and expressions in the video.

There are one or two unanswered questions. Firstly, why was she on the 14th floor? I don't think any of us can answer that until and if we can get to see the video of how she got there in the first place. Secondly, how did she end up in the water tank? This we will have to wait for the conclusion of the police investigation. But what if there was no foul play? Then you might want to read my post #534 on the startling discovery I made when I googled the elevator button numbers 14, 10, 7 and 4 just to see whether they could mean anything.

Thank you for reading and keeping an open mind.
 
noodled1 said:
If she was sleep walking would she put her shoes on though? or zip up a sweat shirt over her T-Shirt?


For myself I'm still not sold on her being in any state, sleep, manic or otherwise while on the elevator.

I hate writing narratives with no concrete evidence but i do wonder why we have this video to see. why was it released when certainly a couple of video captures would have served the police departments need to give the public a view of her that evening. What are they expecting to gain from the public having access to this.

Just to let everyone know I'm no conspiracy theorist...lol So don't take me asking that the wrong way, I'm not saying the police have some dark motive for releasing the video but I do wonder what they expected to gain from it's release
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I'm not saying Elisa was or wasn't on anything because none of us know...but if she was sleepwalking, and was sleepwalking due to a sleeping medication such as ambien, she would be completely able to dress herself, and put on flip flops.
People have been known to drive their car while "sleep walking" on ambien. Again I'm not saying this was the case with her or not, only pointing out it is possible to have been sleep walking in this state and put on shoes and sweatshirt.

But I agree with other posters who say they don't believe she was drunk or on drugs (illegal/street) or in a state of psychosis....I don't see any of that on the tape.

Her perception of reality at times does seem slightly altered, and IF her mind is affected by any medication that is causing this, my best guess is an ambien like drug. Just my opinion.
 
I am still thinking if there is some kind of a kitchen or a guestroom on each floor. Which is located in that direction where Elisa disappeared. Take a look at "Cecil hotel tour" between 2:52-3:03: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bY2kiP8FVOY"]Cecil hotel tour - YouTube[/ame]
 
She may have been wearing contacts. Elisa posted about being an insomniac often, she may have just been wandering around the hotel at that hour. Could she have been wearing the purple shirt underneath the hooded sweatshirt? That's one possibility. I find the comment from the former resident on the LA Times article to be the most telling, if it's true.

There is no evil cult! Only a god damn sex offender on the 10th floor who calls himself Alvin Taylor and his adopted son Aiden who is a definitely a manipulative criminal who will do anything for money and who I also suspect in this case with Elisa... I'm speaking out about this because I honestly do believe that he is still trying to find me and I honestly do believe that her death is involved with him."
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Alvin may be lying about this "adopted son." The way some folks say they have a "cousin."
 
ThinkHard said:
Her perception of reality at times does seem slightly altered, and IF her mind is affected by any medication that is causing this, my best guess is an ambien like drug. Just my opinion.
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Thanks I have no experience with this so it's good info

The one thing we do know about this crazy case is that when the tox screens come back we'll be able to answer the was she taking any meds question.

We probably still won't know what happened but it will be another scrap of information
 
Chorley8 said:
I think the "smile" while "hiding" at around 30 seconds has been created by manipulating the image. Look closely and you can see pretty clearly how the image breaks up to create the smile.

It has thrown many off here it makes her look playful etc.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

To be honest I've watched this video many times, and I still cannot understand how anyway sees her as smiling or being playful at any point in the video.

Maybe its me, and I'm way off, and Im missing it. But when I read posts commenting on her playfulness, cutesy ness, playing hide and seek....I try to watch again but I'm just left scratching my head and thinking I don't see it, not even a little bit.

She also didn't look scared. With the exception of hiding in the corner briefly, but it seems whatever scared her passed, because I don't see fear at any other point in the video.

I know some people also think its obvious she's getting in the elevator to try to get away from someone, but nothing in her initial body language looks to me like someone who is trying to flee anything.

The stairs also look very open, not like creepy hotel stairs that are in an isolated part behind doors, if she was in a hurry I'd think she'd take the stairs. It's not like she could be cornered or trapped on them as they are not isolated.

Frustrated, confused, yup those make sense to me, as far as her actions in the video.

But I just don't see playful not at all.
 
Chorley8 said:
I think the "smile" while "hiding" at around 30 seconds has been created by manipulating the image. Look closely and you can see pretty clearly how the image breaks up to create the smile.

It has thrown many off here it makes her look playful etc.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Completely agree, it looks like the video is distorted and she isn't smiling.
 
skyfitsheaven said:
She may have been wearing contacts. Elisa posted about being an insomniac often, she may have just been wandering around the hotel at that hour. Could she have been wearing the purple shirt underneath the hooded sweatshirt? That's one possibility. I find the comment from the former resident on the LA Times article to be the most telling, if it's true.



Alvin may be lying about this "adopted son." The way some folks say they have a "cousin."
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Then why she had to stoop down to look carefully at the panel for her floor if she had contacts.

Name a situation that you do not wear glasses other than showering and sleeping. I can't think of any at this point.
 
ThinkHard said:
To be honest I've watched this video many times, and I still cannot understand how anyway sees her as smiling or being playful at any point in the video.

Maybe its me, and I'm way off, and Im missing it. But when I read posts commenting on her playfulness, cutesy ness, playing hide and seek....I try to watch again but I'm just left scratching my head and thinking I don't see it, not even a little bit.

She also didn't look scared. With the exception of hiding in the corner briefly, but it seems whatever scared her passed, because I don't see fear at any other point in the video.

I know some people also think its obvious she's getting in the elevator to try to get away from someone, but nothing in her initial body language looks to me like someone who is trying to flee anything.

The stairs also look very open, not like creepy hotel stairs that are in an isolated part behind doors, if she was in a hurry I'd think she'd take the stairs. It's not like she could be cornered or trapped on them as they are not isolated.

Frustrated, confused, yup those make sense to me, as far as her actions in the video.

But I just don't see playful not at all.
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OMG, everybody seems to be seeing different things from the video. This is no good. :(
 
Borris said:
This video was taken the last day anyone had seen her, but many hours could have passed before she ever met her killer - or initiated her suicide. It may have absolutely nothing to do with the events that led to her ultimate demise.
Click to expand...


I agree, I'm leaning toward the fact that it doesn't have anything to do with her death other than perhaps she was grabbed while in route to wherever she was going when she left the elevator or perhaps someone saw which room she came out of or went into and later found a way in himself. Although she may have been spotted leaving her room earlier in her stay and someone noticed she was alone or it could be an employee that knew she was booked in her room alone. In any regard I highly doubt it should be considered abnormal that she left the room without glasses and was on a floor other then the Stay floors. We don't know which floor she booked on and can name a # of reasons why she wouldn't need glasses..
 
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