CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #4

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We know what you meant OCS, but strictly for the record 1/26 - 1/27

Shall I serve coffee and cookies, or should we all take a nice refreshing nap ;)

Ahhh yes, perhaps a nap is in order for me.. overtired at the moment and yet still too restless to sleep.. Need to edit that mistake :doh: Thanks for bringing it to my attention.. :)
 
There's also this part:


So apparently, she's done nothing crazy except lay in bed excessively when she's depressed. She has episodes of hypomania, so maybe she was more sociable than usual which put her at greater risk to be taken advantage of. But it doesn't appear she was suicidal, or would do dumb things like hide in a water tank she couldn't get out of. Or see ghosts. Or dead people.

I+see+Dead+People+1.jpg

I agree. I don't think she was suicidal and coming from a science background (Neuropsychology) I can say I don't go in for paranormal theories! Though I do enjoy paranormal movies like anyone :)

My concerns with the meds are:
- she started only in May 2012, could have taken a while to have adverse effects
- once people are one these pills, a sudden stoppage can be far worse than never having taken them before-it can induce psychosis that had never previously occurred
- mixing with alcohol could be problematic, if she was socializing there

She was on a lot of pills, really. Some she had been on 2 years, Adderall was new. If she had been taking these correctly, hypomania should have been under control...

Thats why it seems to me that the elevator behaviour was a result of having lost them or having been mugged of them, and she was overwhelmed by withdrawal and stress.
 
In fact, my earlier posts were maintaining the same position you are ... that the classic drowning position is "face down". I also linked to the same forensic article you did through google books. I then found the ARC Lifeguarding Manual that I previously linked to which had reference to a drowning "victim" being either face down or face up ... they were not talking about someone "struggling and near drowning". The specific headings are:

- Distressed Swimmer
- Drowning Victim - Active
- Drowning Victim - Passive

specifically "Drowning Victim - Passive ... face up or face down in water, submerged".

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...sBU-0D&sig=AHIEtbScyjmE2PPpTeGHHVDX2M7qD4nMSg

It's not about me substantiating or refuting my own position and/or yours. It is something that might be worthy of consideration that appears to be somewhat at odds to our established belief.

I agree and did not intend my reply as any sort of challenge. I tried to search for your original post because I wanted to be able to access exactly source you used. I realize that I did not have enough context now; I did wasn't aware that you had already compared sources. Sorry to offend! :blushing:

There is so much WAG (wild *** guessing) going on that I think it more productive to focus on what can be substantiated as viable over rumor or hearsay. This was my only intention.

Now, I am intrigued as to what "face up" entails. Also wonder if water was too cold for her body to float to the top.

Thanks for your link!
 
Beginnings of a time line of known aspects in this case. Everything below is from media sources quoting the police

Arrived in LA Jan. 26th via LAPD

Checked in to Cecil Hotel Jan 28th, checkout scheduled for Feb 1st via LAPD

What are some more basic questions we need to fill in the blanks?

Thanks for this. Is there no record of where she stayed in LA on jan 26 and jan 27? Anyone know? I haven't come across it...
 
@Conductor ... oh, no offence taken (we're a crusty bunch, lol)

Actually, check out OCSlacker's post on previous page ... that link gives an explanation to the face up

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8958184&postcount=412"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #4[/ame]


Possibly even Elisa's dimunitive stature is the cause. Dunno ... if we did, we'd all be medical examiners.
 
Where did they say this?

I can't find it right now, but I remember some reporter saying that the police believe that her body may have been hidden for as long as 2-weeks before being placed in the tank. Still looking for it.
 
Thanks for this. Is there no record of where she stayed in LA on jan 26 and jan 27? Anyone know? I haven't come across it...

nothing that seems solid, just speculation type of stuff which I'm trying to avoid, there's wealth of speculation...lol But I'd like to keep this as close to actual facts as we can.

I also want to add time of leaving Vancouver, time in Toronto then San Diego but have come up short on that so far. I'll keep digging
 
Thanks for this. Is there no record of where she stayed in LA on jan 26 and jan 27? Anyone know? I haven't come across it...

I don't believe we've ever known where she stayed those 2 days, but it is believed to have been San Diego, because she was only at the Cecil for 4 nites which would be the nites of the 28th through 31st.
 
nothing that seems solid, just speculation type of stuff which I'm trying to avoid, there's wealth of speculation...lol But I'd like to keep this as close to actual facts as we can.

I also want to add time of leaving Vancouver, time in Toronto then San Diego but have come up short on that so far. I'll keep digging

Saw this last week. It's dated January 18th. I know I've read that she was in Toronto but can't remember the dates. Is that the trip she took in December perhaps?

This was on her Tumblr

I just got my flightbook’d

Vancouver: Jan 18 - 22, San Diego: Jan 22 - 27

and the rest is to be written…

tThis was posted 1 month ago
zThis has been tagged with #caliblah
 
Haven't had a chance to read through everything posted today. Not sure if this link has been posted but thought it might help.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2005/09/dead_mans_float.html
Thank you! :bowdown: I've been looking for that article in my bookmarks.

Since arms, legs, and the head can only drape forward from the body, corpses tend to rotate such that the torso floats facedown, with arms and legs hanging beneath it. Most dead bodies float this way, but there are exceptions. The smaller the limbs, the more likely a corpse will float facing up—short arms and legs create less drag.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2005/09/dead_mans_float.html

It's unusual for a body to float in the supine position, but it does sometimes occur in the case of children and adults of small stature.


To add to the reading list, an excellent article on drowning investigations can be found in the FBI publication archives. To read the pdf, follow the link and select February 2006. The article begins on pdf page 15.

http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/law-enforcement-bulletin/archive
 
I'd suggest taking the stairs, but then there's that stair scene (at the company) in the Grudge. :notgood:

I'm not going to watch it because I don't feel like not being able to sleep tonight ;) But there are lots of elevator scenes in Asian movies. As far as I remember, the Japanese version of the Grudge, and maybe the Ring, had elevator scenes, too.
 
Did you notice a break in the Tumblr postings on Feb 1? There's a section just for Feb 1 (minus one Feb 1 repost.) Then Feb continues in a separate section, with one Feb 1 repost, then reposts up to Feb 18th. Then the single Feb 27th repost.

Not understanding Tumblr, I'm wondering why most of Feb 1 would be separated from the rest of Feb?


While posts in Tumblr can certainly be queued, I still want to discuss this a bit more as the frequency between posts are quite strange. If you look at her posting frequency, it seems that up until last week the posts were queued to post basically daily. I'm attaching screenshots of how the Tumblr queue works. Basically you can pick the number of posts you want to queue up each day. It appears that she didn't use the queue system here for this latest post because several days have gone by before the previous posts, whereas for those actually in the queue at least 1 post would queue up each day. It looks like if she did post this herself before she died, it would have to be via an exact schedule, which I also show a screenshot of how scheduling in Tumblr works. You can schedule at an exact day and time. But it seems like strange behavior that she would be basically queueing up posts at least once a day up until 1 week ago, and suddenly a week later a new post pops up. It's definitely possible that she manually scheduled this one but there must still be something about this post that makes her schedule it almost a month later and that itself is very interesting.

I think it might be worthwhile to check with someone that works in Tumblr on when exactly her last login/request was to the Tumblr server, and check the IP address of that last login/request since this could potentially be very important evidence.
 
Just from experience, I know some meds can really mess with your vision. I tried various meds for nerve pain, and they had me try some anti-spasmodic drugs as well as various muscle relaxers and I had some really negative experiences with impaired vision and had to stop taking them. Anyway, there are likely other meds with the same side effect.
 
Did you notice a break in the Tumblr postings on Feb 1? There's a section just for Feb 1 (minus one Feb 1 repost.) Then Feb continues in a separate section, with one Feb 1 repost, then reposts up to Feb 18th. Then the single Feb 27th repost.

Not understanding Tumblr, I'm wondering why most of Feb 1 would be separated from the rest of Feb?

I don't get how it works at all! There's a new re-post now on tumblr!
 
Hmmm the sister pictured in the facebook page pic does not look like the same girl in the background of the family's pic at the LA news conference Look closely Are my eyes playing tricks on me? :banghead: http://bc.ctvnews.ca/concern-grows-for-vancouver-woman-missing-in-l-a-1.1145813
Looks like the same person to me.

I have hung out with her (Elisa's sister) through mutual friends a couple times before, and the graduation picture is more how I remember her...but she was probably dressed down for the news conference, because who can bother to put on makeup when your sister....oh man... *heart breaks all over again for the family*
 
I don't get how it works at all! There's a new re-post now on tumblr!
Looks like she reblogged it from a friend who posted it on Jan 15th.

Not sure what the date significance is (it might have just been something as arbitrary as, "Mar 1st sounds far enough in the future to post this").

Interesting how all three of the non-typical-queue posts have a theme of alienation.

I wonder if there's any more left to come. It must be somewhat spooky/sad for her friends to see her on their feed like this. :(
 
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