Found Deceased CA - Diem Le Nguyen, 50, Nighthawk Trail on Black Mountain, 23 June 2024

[tarabull]

Goal: Raise $30,000 to fund 6 educational projects in Vietnam, Cambodia, & Philippines servings underprivileged children.
*When: June 23, 2024 (8am-12pm)
*Where: Hilltop Community Park (to hike to Black Mt. Summit)​

All levels for all ages including pets.​

 

[AnyNameIWish]

I'm all for empathy, but there is no benefit in risking your own health! That makes no sense. The first thing I noticed was how hot her outfit would be on a summer hike. jmo

In terms of the long sleeves and long pants worn on such a hike in what is essentially desert like temperatures....

Part if this is embedded in Asian culture- Vietnam, China, Korea, Japan, Philippines (these are the cultures I am most familiar with).... even if you live in sunny SoCal, there is an aversion (especially in women) to get "tan"- So, wearing shorts and tank tops (which would be the inclination for some people doing such a hike) is kind of not a thing. I was talking to a female coworker and she had come back from a Hawaii vacation and was embarrassed to be so tan, she is usually quite fair and her family and friends were shaming her about it. I also grew up being told to always cover despite Japanese summers which are so sweltering, to stay fair and not get dark. My mom wears a special spf fabric sleeve on her left arm while driving in LA.

In this case, her clothing choice makes sense to me. In context of a San Diego heatwave which I know well, wearing this doing a hike, it absolutely does not make sense to me.


What time did the group get to the peak? I can't tell what time the livestream was..... And why did the rumor go around that she went on her own to the peak (when we know now that she was with a group?) You'd think sdpd would be sure to take a narrative from someone in charge of the hike?

 

[RickshawFan]

The Nighthawk trail is clearly getting hundreds of hikers or trail runners each day that the temperatures and weather allows. You wouldn't think you would need a buddy system, but this is probably exactly when a group leader would need one.

IMO it’s a leader responsibility on an organized hike. And it’s so easy to get mis-directed on a trail like that. I’ve done it before myself: accidentally gone down the wrong side of the mountain. And if there were trails that went around the mountain or were out-and-back from the summit, oh boy….
Because of the heat, there may not have been a lot of hikers there apart from the large group. But a leader should be checking that hikers have enough water.

 

[RickshawFan]

Yesterday evening, my teen son went on his usual walk, and after a while (with this story and others on my mind), I started to worry that he didn’t have enough water or that he would tire out from the extreme heat. So I drove out to where he was walking back. He was so annoyed at me for doing that, as teens sometimes are, lol. He told me that he had waited until a cooler part of the day and he knows how to be safe. I gave him an earful about how even capable people feel overwhelmed by the heat.

My thoughts are with Diem’s family as they navigate this sad loss.

Thanks for being a caring mom. Your son might remember this later, even if he’s mildly annoyed now.

 

[RickshawFan]

Family members describe Diem as very careful and say the route had been marked out with chalk.

Family reveals details on Black Mountain hiker presumed dead, Diem Le Nguyen

San Diego hiker Diem Le Nguyen is presumed dead after searchers found the body of a woman matching her description just after 9 a.m. on Monday. A family member spoke with NBC 7 on Monday about this mother of three.

www.nbcsandiego.com

It makes no sense for any authorities to be suggesting gradually acclimatizing to hikes in extreme heat. There’s no acclimatizing for heat wave temperatures. The human body simply can’t tolerate that level of heat.

 

[RickshawFan]

In terms of the long sleeves and long pants worn on such a hike in what is essentially desert like temperatures....

Part if this is embedded in Asian culture- Vietnam, China, Korea, Japan, Philippines (these are the cultures I am most familiar with).... even if you live in sunny SoCal, there is an aversion (especially in women) to get "tan"- So, wearing shorts and tank tops (which would be the inclination for some people doing such a hike) is kind of not a thing. I was talking to a female coworker and she had come back from a Hawaii vacation and was embarrassed to be so tan, she is usually quite fair and her family and friends were shaming her about it. I also grew up being told to always cover despite Japanese summers which are so sweltering, to stay fair and not get dark. My mom wears a special spf fabric sleeve on her left arm while driving in LA.

In this case, her clothing choice makes sense to me. In context of a San Diego heatwave which I know well, wearing this doing a hike, it absolutely does not make sense to me.


What time did the group get to the peak? I can't tell what time the livestream was..... And why did the rumor go around that she went on her own to the peak (when we know now that she was with a group?) You'd think sdpd would be sure to take a narrative from someone in charge of the hike?

I advocate wearing a long-sleeve loose safari, uv protectant, shirt over a tank. That type of shirt wicks sweat super fast. It is cooler than going without. I wear mine unbuttoned.

Diem’s two layers of bottoms—shorts and thick tights—would make you super hot, because thigh muscles produce a lot of heat. So, I would have done something differently there, but IMO getting lost and not carrying enough water were the main issues here.

On the group thing, I speculate she was in a cluster of a few friends who were part of a very large group. So, group within a group.

 

[RickshawFan]

Founder of the charity sponsoring the hike says they are experienced in doing these kinds of charity hikes and have plans and safety programs in place that include sweeps of the area.

Nonprofit founder reacts after body found in search of missing hiker

San Diego Police said a body believed to be a 50-year-old woman - Diem Nguyen - who went missing during a group hike on Black Mountain was found.

www.10news.com

I don't understand the sweep thing. After a count by the leader, and no laggards reported by the sweep, they would be calling 911 immediately if one person is missing. Especially in dangerous conditions.

The trail was likely marked with flour. After 100 people trampled on it twice, it might not have been visible on a dusty trail.

 

[RickshawFan]

They also might be smaller size bottles which are easier to carry, like 8 oz rather than the large 33.8 oz ( 1 L) bottles. TI dont think I've ever seen an event where they hand out the large 1 L bottles.

Both of these are commonly sold in stores and likely they are from Costco.

But you’d need to carry 16 8 oz bottles to take just a gallon of water! IMO that’s not happening. If I knew I'd need to carry at least 16 of those for a 4-hour hike in high heat, I’d stay home.

 

[RickshawFan]

Thank you*** @slowpoke

It seems they ALL made it to the top?? 200 people (why do original reports say 100?)


The inconsistency of this (100 vs 200, stated in the live feed linked at the article above) & the confusion for us - is she in the video? Which one is she? And the trail she took to descend and how it's possible she went completely in the other direction is definitely odd.

THANK YOU for clarifying. The entire group did make it up, or at the very least, the leader and at least 40 or 50 participants did. He states they do this hike during the summer in the heat on purpose, to empathize with the children in Southeast Asia who also walk to school in the hot sun. (I would not do this, but understand the idea of why.)

Walking to school through the rice paddies in Vietnam would not be at all comparable to a steep hike during a heat wave. This is so sad.

I wonder if participants were issued even sketch maps for the hike?

 

[Inthedetails]

In terms of the long sleeves and long pants worn on such a hike in what is essentially desert like temperatures....

Part if this is embedded in Asian culture- Vietnam, China, Korea, Japan, Philippines (these are the cultures I am most familiar with).... even if you live in sunny SoCal, there is an aversion (especially in women) to get "tan"- So, wearing shorts and tank tops (which would be the inclination for some people doing such a hike) is kind of not a thing. I was talking to a female coworker and she had come back from a Hawaii vacation and was embarrassed to be so tan, she is usually quite fair and her family and friends were shaming her about it. I also grew up being told to always cover despite Japanese summers which are so sweltering, to stay fair and not get dark. My mom wears a special spf fabric sleeve on her left arm while driving in LA.

In this case, her clothing choice makes sense to me. In context of a San Diego heatwave which I know well, wearing this doing a hike, it absolutely does not make sense to me.


What time did the group get to the peak? I can't tell what time the livestream was..... And why did the rumor go around that she went on her own to the peak (when we know now that she was with a group?) You'd think sdpd would be sure to take a narrative from someone in charge of the hike?

That all makes sense about the clothing, and I appreciate the explanation. Thanks.

jmo

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

Wearing dark clothing in hot weather is perhaps not the most sensible choice, but I see nothing strange about wearing long trousers and sleeves. I don't tan; I burn, really badly and quickly. I have to stay covered in sunny weather. Usually I wear a special spf sun shirt similar to this one:

Quarter Zip Hooded Top UPF50+ Active Collection

Lightweight, moisture wicking and super comfortable; our new UPF50+ Men's Active Quarter Zip Hooded Top features updated thumbholes and new design lines for an improved fit. Our odour resistant Active Solbari® fabric wicks moisture away from the body for quick-dry performance whilst protecting...

www.solbari.co.uk

 

[slowpoke]

SFGate article:
SDPD began receiving reports of sightings that helped pinpoint the search area, which helped in locating her body.
She had gone off the trail, but was close to a street.
San Diego County Office of the Medical Examiner confirmed to SFGATE that the body found belonged to Le Nguyen.
SFGate article

This is a CBS8 SanDiego short video, with the organizer of the hike speaking:
CBS8SanDiego short video

 

[RickshawFan]

Wearing dark clothing in hot weather is perhaps not the most sensible choice, but I see nothing strange about wearing long trousers and sleeves. I don't tan; I burn, really badly and quickly. I have to stay covered in sunny weather. Usually I wear a special spf sun shirt similar to this one:

Quarter Zip Hooded Top UPF50+ Active Collection

Lightweight, moisture wicking and super comfortable; our new UPF50+ Men's Active Quarter Zip Hooded Top features updated thumbholes and new design lines for an improved fit. Our odour resistant Active Solbari® fabric wicks moisture away from the body for quick-dry performance whilst protecting...

www.solbari.co.uk

You can get super high quality of one of those for quite a bit less in the US (e.g. Patagonia or Outdoor Research). They’re a good alternative to safari shirts I mentioned. Both types are often used for hiking in exposed areas these days.

 

[RickshawFan]

In terms of the long sleeves and long pants worn on such a hike in what is essentially desert like temperatures....

Part if this is embedded in Asian culture- Vietnam, China, Korea, Japan, Philippines (these are the cultures I am most familiar with).... even if you live in sunny SoCal, there is an aversion (especially in women) to get "tan"- So, wearing shorts and tank tops (which would be the inclination for some people doing such a hike) is kind of not a thing. I was talking to a female coworker and she had come back from a Hawaii vacation and was embarrassed to be so tan, she is usually quite fair and her family and friends were shaming her about it. I also grew up being told to always cover despite Japanese summers which are so sweltering, to stay fair and not get dark. My mom wears a special spf fabric sleeve on her left arm while driving in LA.

In this case, her clothing choice makes sense to me. In context of a San Diego heatwave which I know well, wearing this doing a hike, it absolutely does not make sense to me.


What time did the group get to the peak? I can't tell what time the livestream was..... And why did the rumor go around that she went on her own to the peak (when we know now that she was with a group?) You'd think sdpd would be sure to take a narrative from someone in charge of the hike?

These days, I recommend long pants and long-sleeved shirts for anyone in hikes like those, regardless of culture or ethnicity. High UPF is important.

 

[clorenc]

I would never choose to do a hike like Black Mountain, with absolutely no shade, in the summer. I’m a redhead and burn immediately, no matter how often I reapply sunscreen. The hike looks dreary, and I’d be effing miserable.

That being said, sometimes I need to do trail work or fire clearance and have no choice but to be in full sun. So long-sleeve button-up shirts and pants are essential to me — not just for the sun but also for poison oak, ticks, and scratches from brush.

Unfortunately, Diem’s clothing didn’t look particularly lightweight or wicking. I get panic attacks when it’s too hot, like it’s suffocating me . . . I can’t imagine the overwhelming discomfort, terror, and desperation Diem felt. I hope delirium tempered that some.

Such a somber reminder to carry waterwaterwaterwaterwater everywhere I go — in my pack, my car, my pocket, my purse. Not just for myself, but for anyone else I might encounter.

I wish everyone had been better prepared and more aware. And I hope she died doing something she loved, for a cause she deeply supported.

 

[Herat]

You can get super high quality of one of those for quite a bit less in the US (e.g. Patagonia or Outdoor Research). They’re a good alternative to safari shirts I mentioned. Both types are often used for hiking in exposed areas these days.

The one shirt I always carry for traveling or outdoor activities is the Columbia Sportswear Bahama II Shirt, long sleeved. They also make a short sleeved one, but long sleeves are better sun protection. They did make a version in very light cotton at one time that was also great. They are cut generously, so they have that billow factor. I prefer light colors.

Men’s PFG Bahama™ II Long Sleeve Shirt | Columbia Sportswear

This bestselling PFG shirt keeps you cool and protected from the sun for more time on the water.

www.columbia.com

Women’s PFG Bahama™ Long Sleeve Shirt | Columbia Sportswear

A technical shirt for the sportswoman, this vented fishing top blocks UV rays and dries fast.

www.columbia.com

 

[Essbee]

I just don't know what to say about how irresponsible this seems.

I completely disagree. There was a 50K (30 MILE!) running race on the same exact trails only 24 hours earlier. It is the Black Mountain Trail Race, if you are interested. If anything, I was wondering whether she followed some of the chalk marks and arrows from that race instead of the one she intended. That race DOES include the Road Runner loop and almost every trail on the moutain. I ran all of these trails just 4 weeks ago, including the Road Runner loop. It is completely normal to be running and hiking this area throughout the summer. I wouldn't do it in long pants and long sleeves, however, and I would probably avoid 11AM to 3PM. Otherwise, no issue.

 

[Essbee]

From the 10news link

Nonprofit founder reacts after body found in search of missing hiker

San Diego Police said a body believed to be a 50-year-old woman - Diem Nguyen - who went missing during a group hike on Black Mountain was found.

www.10news.com

".... his non-profit organized the hike, said they do fundraising hikes like these all the time, which include safety briefings, having people hike and mark the trail and sweepers checking for the last person off the trail."

Clearly, this last part did not happen. No one checked for the last person off the trail and were keeping count to make sure no one was astray. Given, these are grown adults so you can't force people to stay with you.

Were there signed waivers? How is this a fundraiser? To go hiking as a group? Is it like a "walk a thon" where you donate to your friends? To do what is essentially an urban hike?

She also has 3 grown children. Sympathies and thoughts go out to them....

[Mod Snip}

By my personal knowledge of these trails, I think she came down about 1 mile and the missed a turn back toward Hilltop Park. It's easy to do. That's how she ended up on Roadrunner Loop. When you are on Roadrunner Loop it is easy to not be able to tell where you are. When I went running on Roadrunner Loop on May 23 with my friend, I would have thought we were heading west, but viewing my GPS map afterwards, it was actually south. This is the part of the park that is rarely used. ON the other hand, the main trail to the peak is steady/busy all the time. It's rare to go more than about 5 minutes without seeing people pass by.

I also resent the fact that someone above implied that those of us citizens who were searching impaired the official search teams. There was a helicopter flying overhead for HOURS, ASKING for people to look for this woman and to report her if seen. That's what made me leave my house and head to a smaller trailhead to search. I was out there for almost 2 hours -- approx 4 to 6 PM, and during that time I saw about 8 citizens and only 4 sheriff SAR on the ground.
This was on an obscure part of the mountain, NOT where she should have been. There were ZERO dogs in that area, at that time. The sheriff SAR people were all together, also way overdressed for the heat in full body armor, moving slowly, and honestly I think we ordinary citizens covered a lot more ground than they were covering at that point. Those of us who live nearby and run/hike these trails all the time probably knew the lay of the land and the network of trails better than they do.

 

[AnyNameIWish]

<modsnip>

By my personal knowledge of these trails, I think she came down about 1 mile and the missed a turn back toward Hilltop Park. It's easy to do. That's how she ended up on Roadrunner Loop. When you are on Roadrunner Loop it is easy to not be able to tell where you are. When I went running on Roadrunner Loop on May 23 with my friend, I would have thought we were heading west, but viewing my GPS map afterwards, it was actually south. This is the part of the park that is rarely used. ON the other hand, the main trail to the peak is steady/busy all the time. It's rare to go more than about 5 minutes without seeing people pass by.

I also resent the fact that someone above implied that those of us citizens who were searching impaired the official search teams. There was a helicopter flying overhead for HOURS, ASKING for people to look for this woman and to report her if seen. That's what made me leave my house and head to a smaller trailhead to search. I was out there for almost 2 hours -- approx 4 to 6 PM, and during that time I saw about 8 citizens and only 4 sheriff SAR on the ground.
This was on an obscure part of the mountain, NOT where she should have been. There were ZERO dogs in that area, at that time. The sheriff SAR people were all together, also way overdressed for the heat in full body armor, moving slowly, and honestly I think we ordinary citizens covered a lot more ground than they were covering at that point. Those of us who live nearby and run/hike these trails all the time probably knew the lay of the land and the network of trails better than they do.

At 1:30, a Lieutenant of SDPD is asking locals not to be on the hiking path since at the time they were using dogs. That's what I think some people are referring to.

As the news reported it, it sounded like DL went off on her own without the group. Turns out, she did make it to the top, but got lost in the shuffle coming down.

In any case, no one in the entire group of 100+ who made it up to the top were keeping tabs on her, despite the description of the hike having group leaders. It doesn't sound like the organizers had people making sure a group leader kept tabs on those in the huge group. If they had, they would have noticed who was with whom.

 

[Essbee]

At 1:30, a Lieutenant of SDPD is asking locals not to be on the hiking path since at the time they were using dogs. That's what I think some people are referring to.

As the news reported it, it sounded like DL went off on her own without the group. Turns out, she did make it to the top, but got lost in the shuffle coming down.

In any case, no one in the entire group of 100+ who made it up to the top were keeping tabs on her, despite the description of the hike having group leaders. It doesn't sound like the organizers had people making sure a group leader kept tabs on those in the huge group. If they had, they would have noticed who was with whom.

They asked for community searchers to stop helping because of using dogs on MONDAY morning, NOT on Sunday.