CA CA - East Area Rapist/Golden State Killer *ARREST* #2

[Cappuccino]

Pictures and footage by a neighbor.... https://imgur.com/a/jmcCv9s

It looks like they're digging up his back garden in the background.

 

[Gussified]

I can't say for average. This is a quick calculation from my friend's tree, anywhere from 50 - 1250 4th cousins. This is based on the fact that some descendants don't have children, others have a lot. Remember, though-- ALL the people have to be filled in. Once you have the Fourth Cousin, you have to build all possibilities backwards. So imagine all the progeny of of your great-great-great grandparents' siblings!

I foresee a lot of future job opportunities in LE for genealogists!

 

[Texas Red]

I can't say for average. This is a quick calculation from my friend's tree, anywhere from 50 - 1250 4th cousins. This is based on the fact that some descendants don't have children, others have a lot. Remember, though-- ALL the people have to be filled in. Once you have the Fourth Cousin, you have to build all possibilities backwards. So imagine all the progeny of of your great-grandparents' (or great-great) siblings!

That must be about the number of initial suspects the investigators started with.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

It was a 4th cousin according to Paul Holes, and he should know.

That's pretty good going. I'm in contact with one of my 3rd cousins once removed, both of us being descended from a chap who was born in 1812. I guess the authorities could get from him to me or me to him without too much bother, but then we do have a fairly unusual surname that would make things easier.

 

[Lore Listener]

Talk about detectives having tunnel vision on one suspect, & the poor guy spends 39 years in prison for a crime he didn't commit. Just makes you think how many more innocent victims are rotting away in prison from the 70's, 80's & 90's.

SecretAgentMan, you might be interested in the work of the Innocence Project. https://www.innocenceproject.org

 

[Lore Listener]

Pictures and footage by a neighbor.... https://imgur.com/a/jmcCv9s

Wow! Thank goodness Paul Holes didn't go up there alone!

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

Trigger warning: Gross sexual content

Regarding “pump”- there are many victims who said they heard noises (and smelled baby lotion) where he was basically masturbating immediately before the rapes. One description thought they heard a pump used- I’d thought they were referring to those old suction devices that were sold in the back of magazines, not an implant.
From his MO, it doesn’t seem anyone saw him except initially when he was name from the waist down and flaccid.
I think they were all blindfolded and basically hearing the noises that came from using a good deal of baby lotion and elbow grease.
I’m wondering if that one comment where someone imagined he was using a pump didn’t morph into the implant idea? Did they even exist in the 70’s?

I agree, Truthy. The testimony from witnesses says they heard the pumping sound of a lotion bottle and that he used the lotion to “lubricate” himself before the sexual assaults. Iirc

I don’t know why the “penis pump” or “implant” rumor is so persistent in this case, tbh. It could be true, because GSK is proving that nothing was out of bounds for him ... but the witness testimony just doesn’t appear to back that up, from my interpretation.

 

[terpstra1]

Lots, I hope. I also wonder how many people will decide to download their info to GEDmatch because of this case.

LE can also submit a court order to any of the DNA testing sites such as ancestry.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/national/article185198178.html

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[Lore Listener]

It looks like they're digging up his back garden in the background.

It sure does. Good catch. The next few days and weeks will be very interesting--and sadly maybe horrifying--but we can hope some families and survivors with questions will at least get a step toward answers.

 

[Truthy]

I highly doubt it was a 4th cousin. Just because of the speed it took from the time Law enforcement made a partial match to when they had him under surveillance. Roughly 6 days. The DNA match would have to be a lot closer. I would not be surprised if it was his own daughter's dna that was matched.

You misunderstand, six days is from after they spent months looking at hundreds of cousins histories and when they eliminated at least a few other male relatives living in Cali to target him. In those six days they surveilled him and on different occasions picked up two samples of DNA and processed it to confirm the match. I think whittling it down to him took a couple of month, according to Paul Cole.


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[ReadyorNot]

It looks like they're digging up his back garden in the background.

Here is a different neighbors pics which show better what they were doing... https://www.instagram.com/therealgrantgorman/

 

[AnotherSetOfEyes]

I hope they have brought cadaver dogs onto his property!
Ya never know.
Moo

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Surely that will happen. I hope that even if there are no hits, they tear up the lawn and flower beds looking for buried mementos. And they make sure there
Is footage of that happening on the news.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

Random thoughts on DNA...

I know LE has a database of criminal DNA. Do they have a database of unidentified crime scene DNA? Seems like that would be helpful in linking crimes in different jurisdictions.

Also, within the FBI database (CODIS?), can they identify relatives, like they did with GEDmatch? I don’t think they can ATM, but it seems like that could/should be developed. So, maybe they don’t get an exact match in their database, but they identify a cousin (who is in the database) and work out from their.

Frequently Asked Questions on CODIS and NDIS
https://www.fbi.gov/services/laboratory/biometric-analysis/codis/codis-and-ndis-fact-sheet

“The DNA Identification Act of 1994 (42 U.S.C. §14132) authorized the establishment of this National DNA Index. The DNA Act specifies the categories of data that may be maintained in NDIS (convicted offenders, arrestees, legal, detainees, forensic [casework], unidentified human remains, missing persons, and relatives of missing persons) as well as requirements for participating laboratories relating to quality assurance, privacy, and expungement.”

 

[Cappuccino]

It sure does. Good catch. The next few days and weeks will be very interesting--and sadly maybe horrifying--but we can hope some families and survivors with questions will at least get a step toward answers.

I hope that poor man who spent 39 years in prison for nothing finally gets to see the real culprit convicted. If that crime was one of DeAngelo's then that man is as much of a victim of the GSK as anyone else in this case.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

Surely that will happen. I hope that even if there are no hits, they tear up the lawn and flower beds looking for buried mementos. And they make sure there
Is footage of that happening on the news.

I hope so, too. Some dogs even specialize in buried remains (often used in places like unmarked burial grounds, etc). If LE is indeed digging, I hope they bring in Man’s Best Friend to assist!

 

[molly1255]

It was a 4th cousin according to Paul Holes, and he should know. They also got the match four months ago, not 6 days ago.

It might take a little time to figure out the connection with a 4th cousin, but it is entirely possible that a 4th cousin could be a very reliable DNA match. It is a function of whether that DNA has been passed down to each generation and was inherited by both of the persons who are being compared. It typically becomes a bit more complicated when you reach the 5th cousin level, from what I've experienced.

That said, I do have a very good DNA match with a 6th cousin 2 x removed. That is very distant, but it is there. The common ancestors were my 7th great-grandparents.

 

[gen_bug]

Thinking of the Col. Russell Williams case ( which still reminds me so much of the GGK) and how his wife filed for divorce shortly after his arrest.
Some believe that was a strategic move to protect assets in case victims tried to sue the estate.
Wondering if JJD's wife will now file for divorce in case a similar thing happens?
speculation.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/russell-williams-sued-by-victim-s-family-1.1237014

.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...dpa-according-to-teen/?utm_term=.365e0467d22f

rbbm

*shudder* Russell Williams...was stripped of his military ranking and his uniform was burned. We, at least where I am - don't refer to him with military ranking anymore. I live on a military base, not too far from where this happened. Less than 6 degrees of seperation to victims. He makes my skin crawl.

And I tend to agree in regards to his wife. She most certainly was doing everything to protect assests from the lawsuits his estate etc were under. It surprises me that JJD and his estranged wife never divorced...what with her being a divorce attorney and clearly they had a terrible oil & water relationship from all accounts.

 

[molly1255]

On your second question, my understanding is that yes, they can identify relatives of a suspect's DNA through CODIS. I recall watching a documentary where LE explained they had no hits for the GSK's DNA on CODIS and there were no hits for a relative of the suspect, either.

 

[MsFacetious]

What 3 questions would people most want answered by JJD if given the opportunity to ask them and he was inclined to answer?
At this point, my 3 questions might be..
1- Did you ever feel guilt over any of the alleged rapes or murders?
2- Did you ever confide your alleged dark secrets to anybody?
3-Why did you not steal cash ?

I would just want a list from start to finish of all his crimes.
Also, did he ever travel out of state and commit crimes?
Utah? Nevada? Oregon? Washington? Idaho? New Mexico?

I am sure they have stories to tell. Just have not heard a peep out of them, unless I missed it.

I would be sedated and hysterical. I would be completely freaking out.

His children will probably be keeping a low profile and planning to change their names by deed poll.

I would change my name and leave the country.
I'd be gone and no way would I be doing interviews!
Mark Hacking's father was a Pediatrician at the time Mark murdered Lori.
He was never the same and his patient count dropped a lot.
He was part of a much larger practice so it wasn't a huge deal for him.
If he had been in private practice it's very likely it would have ended up closing.

I imagine that this perps daughters will have similar issues with maintaining their law/medical practices, unfair as it is. That association if it's made public will make it very hard for people to trust them. It's just a psychological thing, messes with your head.

I hope that poor man who spent 39 years in prison for nothing finally gets to see the real culprit convicted. If that crime was one of DeAngelo's then that man is as much of a victim of the GSK as anyone else in this case.

I hate this. I hate that so many innocent people are charged and spend years in jail awaiting trial. I hate that innocent people are still convicted even after that. It's so infuriating. How do you NOT be resentful for the rest of your life if you spent years incarcerated while innocent? Especially those who don't get any compensation. Just released after years with nothing. It's so screwed up.

“As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind, I'd still be in prison.” - Nelson Mandela

Easier said than done for sure though.... :tantrum:

 

[gen_bug]

Interesting, please someone correct me if I am wrong but that would be a great great grandparents children. I question the possibility of that because wouldnt they have had to submit it over 20 years ago for it to be in that database? Did GEDmatch even exist that long ago? There should be at the least an 80 year gap between JJD and his great great grandparents so there is no chance that generation is alive.

4th cousins, should they be straight and not x times removed share 3x great grandparents.
Not sure why they would have to submit 20 years ago? Not following.

I myself am on Gedmatch and its sister company Gedmatch Genesis. Ancestry, FTDNA, MyHeritage, and 23andme.
I can't even begin to tell you how many 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th and beyond cousins I have.

4th cousins - are not that hard to solve the connection if there are no adoptions or NPE (Non parental events, ie: dads not your real dad etc)