GUILTY CA - Erin Corwin, 19, pregnant, Twentynine Palms, 28 June 2014 - #7

[77DarkHorse7]

IMO, I doubt a pregnant girl would be willing to go paint balling. Those things can do some damage.

If I were to go with my personal opinion on everything then we could all go home. I doubt that a married woman would be willing to have an affair. Talk about something that can do some damage. But obviously I am wrong. Paintball sounds like fun to me, but I haven't been before, maybe she hadn't either.

 

[Dallen]

If I were to go with my personal opinion on everything then we could all go home. I doubt that a married woman would be willing to have an affair. Talk about something that can do some damage. But obviously I am wrong. Paintball sounds like fun to me, but I haven't been before, maybe she hadn't either.

Haha! TRue. And maybe it's just another thing she was naive about, like so many others speculate. Personally, I think any individual that has the means to get married understands the ramifications of an affair and knows the simple "right from wrong." It doesn't come with intellects, IMO. Now I'm just rambling...
And FWIW, I have been years ago and came home with bruises everywhere. And I mean everywhere.

 

[77DarkHorse7]

Very good question

in re you're comment about them being good at hiding <modsnip>

 

[Dallen]

Bernina, you bring up some very good points. :thinking:

 

[maskedwoman]

Thanks for the clarification...???? I think everyone is aware of that. My point was we could either nick or further speculate a lot of the theories and unknowns if we knew for certain who left the base, in what vehicles and what times. Obviously the only way to know that is with surveillance and obviously LE isn't going to release that to us.

In defense of LadyLems, I have seen many posts here from various members, grousing about the lack of information handed out by LE. The Holly Bobo case has had dozens such posts, and that is probably being conservative. I have even seen posts that plainly suggested LE had nothing and was hopelessly lost simply because they didn't share their case details with the world. With that in mind, I personally did not find LadyLems' post out of line.

 

[maskedwoman]

<snipped>
Another question here.........Most horse rescues have access to veterinarian supplies/meds/injectables on site. It cuts down on their overhead and usually there's a vet who will give them a supply of prescription pain killers, sedatives, even euthanasia, etc., to have on hand, without actually seeing any horse that is in need of them. There'd be a record of what was given to the rescue, how many units, etc., and the rescue should have a "paper trail" (digital or whatever) as to who (animal) these medications where dispensed to and a physical inventory of what's at hand. If this IS a non-profit, they'd have to keep really good records.

If you've ever seen a horse sedated for castration.......that same stuff would knock out, if not kill a person. As far as euthanasia..........if one of the horses was mortally wounded, the rescue would want to dispatch it ASAP, not wait what could be hours for a vet to get on site, and shooting isn't an option for most rescues, though extremely quick and painless, it just doesn't sit right with most people who release their horses to the rescue, or those that financially support the rescue. So..........it would be quite common to have those available.

Has anyone heard or seen any attempt by LE to inventory the pharmaceuticals at the horse rescue?

Bernina, you are quite right about those drugs but I had no idea that Vets would leave that sort of thing with horse rescues. Perhaps it depends on the relationship you have with your vet? Or perhaps what part of the country you live in? For example, I wouldn't find much difference between a rescue or a boarding facility and I'm sure boarding facilities here in TN would have to call a vet for any sort of emergency. We lost one of our horses to a twisted gut just two weeks ago, and the vet did leave some medications behind for us to administer until he came back that evening, but I would have been floored if he left euthanasia drugs with us or anyone else. And we have been patients for almost 15 years.

 

[Bernina]

Bernina, you are quite right about those drugs but I had no idea that Vets would leave that sort of thing with horse rescues. Perhaps it depends on the relationship you have with your vet? Or perhaps what part of the country you live in? For example, I wouldn't find much difference between a rescue or a boarding facility and I'm sure boarding facilities here in TN would have to call a vet for any sort of emergency. We lost one of our horses to a twisted gut just two weeks ago, and the vet did leave some medications behind for us to administer until he came back that evening, but I would have been floored if he left euthanasia drugs with us or anyone else. And we have been patients for almost 15 years.

It's very common here in Arizona, both with private owners, boarding facilities, and rescues, mainly because many are an hour or more from a veterinarian. Boarding facilities do have legal guidelines and waivers that are usually in place. If my vet is "on call", I can expect at least a 45 minute wait, and that's if he's actually at the horse outpatient/intake/surgery facility and not out in the field. Then he has 3 miles of cattle track that may or may not be flooded or snowed out.
Many rescues in this state are out in the County for tax purposes. County usually means the "boonies".
If you have a good repoire with your vet, and he knows you have a solid foundation of horse ailments, I know I can get and do get painkillers and sedatives with just a phone call.
Any mortal emergencies we've had, we've used a .45. I wouldn't have euthanasia pharmaceuticals kicking around my place, but the dude string I wrangled on at a boarding stable DID have those on hand, both for emergencies with boarders and the dude string.

Adding: Those meds were LOCKED up at the boarding/dude string facility. A boarder had to sign a waiver for such an emergency.

 

[Knox]

Please do not take this the wrong way for it is certainly meant with the best of intentions. LE or any other law enforcement agency be it Federal, County, State, Local, Mayberry or whatever agency involved in this case are not required .....worth repeating are not required to provide any information whatsoever to the public on the evidence they may or may not have at this time. I am sure when such a time arises that they are in a position to release accurate information about their discoveries about the case they will. Until such time patience is needed. Easier said then done I know.

Michelle Le's case was on Dateline Saturday night. She went missing from Hayward, CA., I won't give all the details, but wanted to point out a few things about the investigation in her case.

Michelle went missing May 27th. LE found her car within a day or two. Her body was found September 17th. LE did not share anything with her family or media until after they arrested her friend Giselle Esteban for her murder. LE focused on Esteban fairly quickly. Some of the evidence they had;

• Cell phone pings
• Esteban's hair in Michelle's car
• Drop of Michelle's blood on Esteban's shoe
• Video surveillance footage of Esteban at Michelle's work
• Witness testimony from a man Esteban thought Michelle stole from her/ruined their relationship

Michelle's cell pings were similar to Esteban's. In other words, the phones were obviously together the night Michelle disappeared, then her phone shut off. Also, it took three months for results from the evidence sent to the FBI lab to be returned.

My point (sorry for droning on). LE was developing all this evidence, and for four months it appeared they had nothing. This gives me hope in Erin's case, the same thing is occurring. SBSO has cell phone data, and are searching the triangulation areas. Which by the way, is how Carrie McGonigle found Michelle's body (that's an amazing story in its own right) http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2011...ois-found-michelle-les-remains/?#article-copy

 

[azure]

It's very common here in Arizona, both with private owners, boarding facilities, and rescues, mainly because many are an hour or more from a veterinarian. Boarding facilities do have legal guidelines and waivers that are usually in place. If my vet is "on call", I can expect at least a 45 minute wait, and that's if he's actually at the horse outpatient/intake/surgery facility and not out in the field. Then he has 3 miles of cattle track that may or may not be flooded or snowed out.
Many rescues in this state are out in the County for tax purposes. County usually means the "boonies".
If you have a good repoire with your vet, and he knows you have a solid foundation of horse ailments, I know I can get and do get painkillers and sedatives with just a phone call.
Any mortal emergencies we've had, we've used a .45. I wouldn't have euthanasia pharmaceuticals kicking around my place, but the dude string I wrangled on at a boarding stable DID have those on hand, both for emergencies with boarders and the dude string.

Adding: Those meds were LOCKED up at the boarding/dude string facility. A boarder had to sign a waiver for such an emergency.

I'm a horse trainer with my own facility and I've owned horses for 15 years at other facilities prior. I have never seen euthanasia drugs in a barn before. I have on hand some antibiotics and two kinds of anti-inflammatories. That's it. For any emergency, I call the vet. I have seen mild sedatives (more of an anti-anxiety) like Acepromazine in facilities I've worked at before. That's the hardest substance I've ever seen in a barn.

I've also worked as a tech for small animal rescues, including the largest no-kill shelter in the city of Chicago. All controlled substances were logged and carefully maintained, and they were only administered by a veterinarian. If there were any suspicion of stockpiling illegal drugs, IM would be in jail.

 

[FlamingoLady]

Michelle Le's case was on Dateline Saturday night. She went missing from Hayward, CA., I won't give all the details, but wanted to point out a few things about the investigation in her case.

Michelle went missing May 27th. LE found her car within a day or two. Her body was found September 17th. LE did not share anything with her family or media until after they arrested her friend Giselle Esteban for her murder. LE focused on Esteban fairly quickly. Some of the evidence they had;

• Cell phone pings
• Esteban's hair in Michelle's car
• Drop of Michelle's blood on Esteban's shoe
• Video surveillance footage of Esteban at Michelle's work
• Witness testimony from a man Esteban thought Michelle stole from her/ruined their relationship

Michelle's cell pings were similar to Esteban's. In other words, the phones were obviously together the night Michelle disappeared, then her phone shut off. Also, it took three months for results from the evidence sent to the FBI lab to be returned.

My point (sorry for droning on). LE was developing all this evidence, and for four months it appeared they had nothing. This gives me hope in Erin's case, the same thing is occurring. SBSO has cell phone data, and are searching the triangulation areas. Which by the way, is how Carrie McGonigle found Michelle's body (that's an amazing story in its own right) http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2011...ois-found-michelle-les-remains/?#article-copy

I watched that Sat. Freaked me out how Giselle dressed up in the lab coat and walked around the hospital the day prior.....I saw total premeditation but iirc, they didn't get her on 1st degree? Defense tried to make it seem like a "heat of passion" "love triangle thing"? Gotta admit, I got sleepy:facepalm:

 

[Knox]

I watched that Sat. Freaked me out how Giselle dressed up in the lab coat and walked around the hospital the day prior.....I saw total premeditation but iirc, they didn't get her on 1st degree? Defense tried to make it seem like a "heat of passion" "love triangle thing"? Gotta admit, I got sleepy:facepalm:

You missed the best part, lol. Esteban was convicted of 1st degree murder.

 

[FlamingoLady]

You missed the best part, lol. Esteban was convicted of 1st degree murder.

:jail::loveyou::happydance:

 

[FlamingoLady]

You missed the best part, lol. Esteban was convicted of 1st degree murder.

:jail::loveyou::happydance:

 

[FlamingoLady]

Sorry, I was so happy I double posted. :facepalm:

 

[LaborDayRN]

Bernina, you are quite right about those drugs but I had no idea that Vets would leave that sort of thing with horse rescues. Perhaps it depends on the relationship you have with your vet? Or perhaps what part of the country you live in? For example, I wouldn't find much difference between a rescue or a boarding facility and I'm sure boarding facilities here in TN would have to call a vet for any sort of emergency. We lost one of our horses to a twisted gut just two weeks ago, and the vet did leave some medications behind for us to administer until he came back that evening, but I would have been floored if he left euthanasia drugs with us or anyone else. And we have been patients for almost 15 years.

I would be shocked if a vet left a controlled substance (Anesthetic agents, controlled narcotic agents in injectable form) with an unlicensed person.

 

[Bernina]

I'm a horse trainer with my own facility and I've owned horses for 15 years at other facilities prior. I have never seen euthanasia drugs in a barn before. I have on hand some antibiotics and two kinds of anti-inflammatories. That's it. For any emergency, I call the vet. I have seen mild sedatives (more of an anti-anxiety) like Acepromazine in facilities I've worked at before. That's the hardest substance I've ever seen in a barn.

I've also worked as a tech for small animal rescues, including the largest no-kill shelter in the city of Chicago. All controlled substances were logged and carefully maintained, and they were only administered by a veterinarian. If there were any suspicion of stockpiling illegal drugs, IM would be in jail.

Guess the West, or Arizona is different. I trained pre-season track horses for 4 years and we had controlled drugs on site. You have a higher incident of tragedies with chronic gate jumpers or horses that just bugger out. My chosen area has always been training Arabs since I was a teenager, but you go where the jobs are.

Bute, banamine, and ketamine were pretty common pharmaceuticals on hand. Other than a prescription, any of us with knowledge of injection sights and injection modes, sq, im, iv, could administer them.

 

[Bernina]

I would be shocked if a vet left a controlled substance (Anesthetic agents, controlled narcotic agents in injectable form) with an unlicensed person.

:gasp:

I think you can consider yourself "shocked"..........

 

[carbuff]

I've known ranchers (in Montana and the Dakotas) who have ketamine on hand, but mostly as an anaesthetic for stitching up a horse that gets cut up on barbed wire, not for euthanasia.

 

[Bernina]

Ehhhhhhh....the whole point of my question was what controlled substances did the rescue have on hand? We've seen murders committed using controlled substance for horses in the past, so I'm just throwing it out there. It has happened.

Example: Elisa McNabney/acepromazine

 

[maskedwoman]

It's very common here in Arizona, both with private owners, boarding facilities, and rescues, mainly because many are an hour or more from a veterinarian. Boarding facilities do have legal guidelines and waivers that are usually in place. If my vet is "on call", I can expect at least a 45 minute wait, and that's if he's actually at the horse outpatient/intake/surgery facility and not out in the field. Then he has 3 miles of cattle track that may or may not be flooded or snowed out.
Many rescues in this state are out in the County for tax purposes. County usually means the "boonies".
If you have a good repoire with your vet, and he knows you have a solid foundation of horse ailments, I know I can get and do get painkillers and sedatives with just a phone call.
Any mortal emergencies we've had, we've used a .45. I wouldn't have euthanasia pharmaceuticals kicking around my place, but the dude string I wrangled on at a boarding stable DID have those on hand, both for emergencies with boarders and the dude string.

Adding: Those meds were LOCKED up at the boarding/dude string facility. A boarder had to sign a waiver for such an emergency.

Although shooting one of my horses (especially my personal ride) makes me quite ill to think about, if I knew they could not be saved, I'm sure I would do that rather than have them suffer through an extended wait for a vet to put them down. We are definitely not in the boonies but your explanation makes a lot of sense and has me wondering what their pharmaceutical stocks look like, and how well protected they are. Especially with liquids, you might not notice anything wrong until there isn't enough left for the last dose that should be there. Hmm...