CA - Hannah,16,Devonte,15,&Ciera Hart,12 (fnd deceased),Mendocino Cty,26 Mar 2018 #5

[Whiteorchids]

So what is the story that is told about them driving at night? Where are they going, do they think? I mean Sarah and the kids.

I think they just drove up the coast so they wouldn’t have to face CPS when they came back. Go on the run until they decide what they were going to do next. Personally I don’t think it was planned I think once all of them asleep Jen got out her bottle of booze under the seat or in her purse while driving thought about it and in her drunken stupor not thinking clearly drove off the cliff. I’m hoping the kids never felt any pain. I think it’s possible they might not have died immediately. Which sickens me to think they could have suffered. I’m hoping the ones that got ejected into the water didn’t drown. Those Yukon’s are well built vehicles made for made for mountain driving and rollovers I just don’t know if they suffered. I hope they didn’t. [emoji53]

 

[RickshawFan]

Thanks for that info. I learned English at school in Kindergarten. My. father spoke seven languages. Here where I live we are trying to learn the language but we are old. I meet people from all over the world who speak several languages.

What an incredible handicap it is in this world to know only English. I teach my neighbors, some who had no English since middle school and now they are in their 30’s. It is incredible how much they know and how complicated their language expression and comprehension is. The gift of multiple languages for
a child is a gift indeed.

I live in a country where the culture was taken away as well as the language, it is being revitalized but the toll it has taken can be seen. Not providing the child’s background is abusive as far as I am concerned. It is telling a child his roots are not worthy of veing celebrated and explored.

I so agree, especially with the last paragraph. Most kids can be bilingual if they are verbal. And forcing kids from other cultures to abandon their roots supposedly in the interest of their long-term assimilation in American (generally Caucasian) culture is a way of erasing their identities. IMO we should not be scrubbing away children’s pasts on the theory it’s beneficial to them; it more likely comes from adults feeling inconvenienced or uncomfortable. Yes, indeed, abusive.

As a policy matter, if the rule of thumb is to sanitize children’s identities, the same rule of thumb should apply to all children, Caucasians, too, and not just non-Caucasians. Howls of protest ensue....

Back to the focus on the Hart family... IMO these kids were being erased every which way, from being bundled up all the time to conceal their bodies, to parading them around events with specific points of view (e.g. political), forcing them to smile, failing to nurture their persons (literally by withhokding food)...

 

[antechinusRAWR]

Given everything else we've found out, I just assumed it was because Jen and Sarah terrorized the kids into being there - and I wonder if they terrorized the kids about the cops. IIRC, Jen posted about this incident and said that when they heard the crowd from some distance away, they talked to the kids and prepped them about what was going on. "So spontaneous, we really had NO idea..." riiiight... but it's true they probably sprung it on the kids at the last minute. So this little family of black kids, who may have heard a LOT of hurtful things about where they supposedly came from, is asked to go up to a protest about another little black kid who was killed. I figured the tears had a heck of a lot to do with what his moms were feeding him about the situation and the cops in general.

In fact... the cops in MN commented that Jen and Sarah were very hostile to the authorities intervening in their business, and they backed that up by taking their kids out of school and essentially never speaking to another state authority again (at least as far as I heard). I wouldn't be surprised if they told their kids a LOT about how scary the cops are... and how dangerous cops are to black kids like them, in particular. It would sure discourage the kids from reporting their abuse again.

This. The officer who hugged Devonte hit the news again later when he "liked" a fellow officer's post in support of Darren Wilson.

I've wondered more than once if the Harts used that to convince the kids that everyone was against them, either explicitly or covertly.

https://www.boston.com/news/national-news/2014/12/02/internet-turns-on-once-beloved-ferguson-hug-cop

 

[musemoon]

I took my 10-year-old to Burning Man last year and we're returning again this year as well. While the drug culture is definitely present, I don't find that it's any more blatant than what we see around my town in the most popular drug-shopping areas (FWIW, most drug transactions go down in the parking lot between our McDonalds and Rite Aid).

This will be my 10th year of attending Burning Man. I've never done any drugs there, nor have I been offered any. Marijuana is probably the most prevalent, but I see (or rather smell) it at local music festivals here in my state as well. Depending on where you live, recreational marijuana isn't even illegal so your stance on that is kind of personal. Alcohol, opioids, and benzos are widely available at BM to but, again, I haven't found them to be any more prevalent than what I've seen at local festivals (or even our county fair).

You more or less get what you want out of Burning Man, or any of the smaller reclamations that lead up to BM. If it's sexual freedom and exhibitionism that you want, you'll find it there. If it's uppers or downers or smoking weed with like-minded people you want, you'll find it. However, you'll also find just as much "conservative" activities as well. Each camp has its own theme and there truly is something for everyone. We personally go for the creative vibe; we enjoy the bonding of artists from all walks of life, we like the inspiration that comes from the installations, and we LOVE the community feel (there's nothing for sale at Burning Man except ice-you barter for everything you need). There's even an enclosed area for families with kids called "Kiddsville" where you can find all kinds of "camp" type activities for the little ones. You won't find any sex or blatant nudity or drug use in it.

We are going to Burning Man too as a family and most likely staying in Kidsville....which is far from the drug camps. (BM is thousands of people...it's an actual city) what you will find there is kindness absolute and total kindness across the board, a kindness you will never experience anywhere else on earth. I've been to countries with kind people, but this is deeper...this is ingrained in the culture and it permeates everything. Yes people over indulge there but there are also Christian camps where they offer foot baths to dusty campers....a trampoline zone for kids and parents to bounce....a nap zone....art, music and dance. It's a beautiful thing to show kids and it can be one big mess if that's what you want...however, the culture of kindness for both the kid and the krazy...is always the same.

We went to the Renaissance Faire today and we saw a lot of cleavage and general tawdryness but we also saw diverse families having fun, a white family with two beautiful brown girls dressed up in Elizabethan dresses, a black mom with her white daughter (adopted her foster child) LOVED THAT dressed up like pirates, a family with a Downs Syndrome child dressed up like pirates and my daughter's middle school Vice Principal dressed up like a magistrate of some kind and a famous person and her family. It was fun...and often times hippie festivals can be that, fun...and kind. I hope and pray the Hart kiddos had fun and felt love when they were there....cause most often that's something you don't always get at an Arianna Grande concert...which they should have also gone to.

 

[antechinusRAWR]

I find this strange. Devonte was crying before the hug with the officer? Huh? There are a couple of other photos showing the interaction with the officer -one where it looks like they're shaking hands. There's nary a tear to be seen there, though. So, either Devonte turns from literally bawling to absolutely no trace of it, or the hand shake was before the hug, which was my initial thought on seeing it.

The problem there, though, is this: HE SURE CRIES A LOT. So, he's crying 10 minutes before the hug scene (according to the photographer), then again, 10 minutes later, during the hug. Again, it just doesn't seem right that the photo of the hand-shake would be after the crying --not the slightest trace of a tear. So, it must be before. Odd -crying. Stops crying. Crying again 10 minutes later. Really, really, crying.

Than, the crying in various videos at festivals, etc. Why do I think we're being conned here? Everything about what we see in the way of photos and videos is starting to look and feel very, very staged. (When the friend made a complaint about potential abuse, the response from the police/cps was that they thought the children had been "coached".) I'm starting to think just about everything in life for these children was coached. Including the crying. The laughing. The smiles. Everything.

I don't disagree that they coached the kids but there's a huge difference between his demeanour in the cop hug sequence of photos & every other event.

In every other photo I've seen he & the other participants display a kind of contrived beatific expression & their tears seem to be a response to being overwhelmed by "the love"

I think the cop photo was intended to look like that too, but he was too terrified to control his fear & give the performance Jen wanted from him - hence the trembling described by 2 independent witnesses & which Jen later attempted to explain as Devonte being a special kid who was overwhelmed by his emotions on the day.

I also won't be surprised if the bulk of Jen's anger over the photo going viral had nothing to do with protecting Devonte's privacy, but was actually rage over the fact that she invested time & effort in setting up the shot & then some "stranger" just skipped in & effortlessly stole all the attention out from under her

IMO the death threat claims were about making the other photographer, Johnny Nguyen, look & feel bad for "stealing" the acclaim & attention she'd been seeking for herself via Devonte

 

[Whiteorchids]

We are going to Burning Man too as a family and most likely staying in Kidsville....which is far from the drug camps. (BM is thousands of people...it's an actually city) what you will find there is kindness absolute and total kindness across the board, a kindness you will never experience anywhere else on earth. I've been to countries with kind people, but this is deeper...this is ingrained in the culture and it permeates everything. Yes people over indulge there but there are also Christian camps where they offer foot baths to dusty campers....a trampoline zone for kids and parents to bounce....a nap zone....art, music and dance. It's a beautiful thing to show kids and it can be one big mess if that's what you want...however, the culture of kindness for both the kid and the krazy...is always the same.

We went to the Renaissance Art Faire today and we saw a lot of cleavage and general tawdryness but we also saw diverse families having fun, a white family with two beautiful brown girls dressed up in Elizabethan dresses, a black mom with her white daughter (adopted her foster child) LOVED THAT dressed up like pirates, a family with a Downs Syndrome child dressed up like pirates and my daughter's middle school Vice Principal dressed up like a magistrate of some kind and a famous person and her family. It was fun...and often times hippie festivals can be that, fun...and kind. I hope and pray the Hart kiddos had fun and felt love when they were there....cause most often that's something you don't always get at an Arianna Grande concert...which they should have also gone to.

People at the festivals that knew the Hart’s also thought the Harts were so kind and no way would they be capable of this. You don’t really know these people. Hundreds of all the “kind” people you talk about can be another Jen and Sarah child abuser and other criminals.

 

[musemoon]

People at the festivals that knew the Hart’s also thought the Harts were so kind and no way would they be capable of this. You don’t really know these people. Hundreds of all the “kind” people you talk about can be another Jen and Sarah child abuser and other criminals.

...and these criminals and abusers can also be at church...that's the nature of humanity, however, in general the culture is one of kindness.

 

[CassieM]

I don't disagree that they coached the kids but there's a huge difference between his demeanour in the cop hug sequence of photos & every other event.

In every other photo I've seen he & the other participants display a kind of contrived beatific expression & their tears seem to be a response to being overwhelmed by "the love"

I think the cop photo was intended to look like that too, but he was too terrified to control his fear & give the performance Jen wanted from him - hence the trembling described by 2 independent witnesses & which Jen later attempted to explain as Devonte being a special kid who was overwhelmed by his emotions on the day.

I also won't be surprised if the bulk of Jen's anger over the photo going viral had nothing to do with protecting Devonte's privacy, but was actually rage over the fact that she invested time & effort in setting up the shot & then some "stranger" just skipped in & effortlessly stole all the attention out from under her

IMO the death threat claims were about making the other photographer, Johnny Nguyen, look & feel bad for "stealing" the acclaim & attention she'd been seeking for herself via Devonte

Oh my gosh, this is such a good point! I never thought of that! She commented angrily that the photographer did not have their permission. I think you are EXACTLY right! Very insightful!

 

[mtnlites]

One of the big things that keeps bothering me is the "free hugs" signs. In our house, we try to teach our kids that our bodies are our own, that they're private and should only be shared when we want them to be shared. I don't make my kids hug relatives or give kisses. I always hated that as a child. I have trouble wrapping my head around virtually making my child "hug" strangers. I mean, my son IS a hugger. He goes around and hugs everyone whether he knows them or not. That's one one; telling him to go around and hug people is something else.

 

[Talullah]

Lee was too old to be pliable. They needed minds to mold. It’s gross how they rolled out these innocent kids like progressive Stepin Fetchits at events they were too young to understand. I believe the goal of the Hart women was to get by on the wits they crafted for their kids.

 

[Whiteorchids]

...and these criminals and abusers can also be at church...that's the nature of humanity, however, in general the culture is one of kindness.

You are absolutely correct they are everywhere.

 

[Starkville]

Off-topic, but why is everyone taking Benadryl for allergies? Isn’t non-drowsy Claritin better?

In my house, we keep Benadryl around in case of an allergic reaction (as opposed to seasonal allergies), or as a sedative. The only thing I ever knew about Benadryl is that people use it to knock out their kids on long trips, and it can help with hives during an allergic reaction.

 

[Aescwynn]

In my house, we keep Benadryl around in case of an allergic reaction (as opposed to seasonal allergies), or as a sedative. The only thing I ever knew about Benadryl is that people use it to knock out their kids on long trips, and it can help with hives during an allergic reaction.

That's why we keep it around-- for allergic reactions (hives). In the past, I've bought its active ingredient (diphenhydramine) packaged as ZzQuil as a sleep aid. We use Flonase for actual allergies in this house.

 

[fiveducks]

It is actually also very effective a an anti nausea med for motion sickness. I give it to my 9 year old instead of Dramamine before road trips sometimes. She has severe motion sickness when in a car for more than a quick drive.

Off-topic, but why is everyone taking Benadryl for allergies? Isn’t non-drowsy Claritin better?

In my house, we keep Benadryl around in case of an allergic reaction (as opposed to seasonal allergies), or as a sedative. The only thing I ever knew about Benadryl is that people use it to knock out their kids on long trips, and it can help with hives during an allergic reaction.

 

[HeidiTX232]

Really? Where do you get that statistic of twice as many "bad" families using homeschooling to abuse than "good" families using it to educate? That's an astounding claim.

It is an astounding claim. And I would be surprised if there is anything other than personal opinion that backs it up. However, I will say that I homeschooled; and what I saw locally was that fewer than 1/3 are actually educating their children. I didn’t see any evidence of (or even suggestive of) abuse; but people severely abusing their kids aren’t likely to attend homeschool get togethers either.

 

[bears10]

It is an astounding claim. And I would be surprised if there is anything other than personal opinion that backs it up. However, I will say that I homeschooled; and what I saw locally was that fewer than 1/3 are actually educating their children. I didn’t see any evidence of (or even suggestive of) abuse; but people severely abusing their kids aren’t likely to attend homeschool get togethers either.

Isn’t not educating your kids a form of abuse? Or neglect? Imo

 

[Bey]

Very quick point to make... JMO

It is my belief that JH was the nastiest one, and SH a victim of her.

Someone said a few threads ago (sorry I can't quote - I've been catching up for days) that SH pulling along one of the children and leaving bruising was proof that SH was just as abusive as JH. I just wanted to point out that it isn't unusual (best example being in children) that someone being bullied takes out their frustration at the situation on someone smaller than them. So it would be entirely plausible to me that this is why SH has been seen to snap - and has admitted as much to friends. Along the same lines, bear in mind that in the example of wrist pulling, it may have been for something that she knew would anger JH, so she reacted badly because of that, to prevent JH's anger against her or the kids.

I know that if this is the case then SH should have left and taken the kids, but situations are rarely that easy in DV.

 

[mtnlites]

Off-topic, but why is everyone taking Benadryl for allergies? Isn’t non-drowsy Claritin better?

In my house, we keep Benadryl around in case of an allergic reaction (as opposed to seasonal allergies), or as a sedative. The only thing I ever knew about Benadryl is that people use it to knock out their kids on long trips, and it can help with hives during an allergic reaction.

I can only speak for myself but I take Zyrtec for seasonal allergies and Benedryl for my mast cell activation disorder. (Basically, my body can look at any substance at any random point in time and decide that it's allergic to it.) I am meant to take Hydroxyzine 3 times a day for the MCAD, but I sometimes substiute Benedryl for it because Benedryl makes me less drowsy. I know that sounds weird since a lot of people use it for the sedation effect, but if you use it regularly at a high dosage, your body gets used to it eventually. It no longer puts me to sleep. Benedryl is usually a better fit for allergic reactions that have happened, while Claritin or Zyrtec can be more helpful in keeping those reactions from happening in the first place. Both can act as drying agents so if you have a runny nose or drainage it can help dry them out. People's bodies all respond differently to different things, however. That might be the short answer.

 

[Rotten apple]

It really shows you how fake social media can be! I kind of believe the more aggressive people are with posting photos and updates with how "wonderful" their life is, those are probably the people who are the most miserable.

Truth! I have an FB account mainly so I can get to articles...and I see so much fakeness from families who I know have crap going down that it's sickening. I know FB is not a place to air your dirty laundry, but faking it to the other extreme end is ridiculous too. I actually now am trying to understand what is the best use of SM in general? If you don't overshare or act totally fake what's the point? My kids are going to be getting to the age of wanting SM soon and I'm trying to understand how it can be useful.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[Spellbound]

I can only speak for myself but I take Zyrtec for seasonal allergies and Benedryl for my mast cell activation disorder. (Basically, my body can look at any substance at any random point in time and decide that it's allergic to it.) I am meant to take Hydroxyzine 3 times a day for the MCAD, but I sometimes substiute Benedryl for it because Benedryl makes me less drowsy. I know that sounds weird since a lot of people use it for the sedation effect, but if you use it regularly at a high dosage, your body gets used to it eventually. It no longer puts me to sleep. Benedryl is usually a better fit for allergic reactions that have happened, while Claritin or Zyrtec can be more helpful in keeping those reactions from happening in the first place. Both can act as drying agents so if you have a runny nose or drainage it can help dry them out. People's bodies all respond differently to different things, however. That might be the short answer.

Somewhat off-topic, but this is very interesting (to me, at least) . Benadryl has never made me the least bit drowsy so I only use it when I have a major outbreak of allergic reactions to something. I need to look further into “mast cell activation”. Thank you.