CA CA - Hannah, 16, Devonte, 15, & Sierra Hart, 12, Mendocino County, 26 March 2018 #3

[Zelda1010]

Excellent point! I was struggling with that too, when I read it.

Rollover crash in 2012 with a 2003 GMC Yukon- vehicle was 9 years old. When I think rollover, I think extensive damage and a vehicle that age being a total loss. Wish the reporter had asked the Lees a few more questions, like what were the Harts doing at a gas station and did the Lees see the damaged Yukon? It could be that the Yukon had been towed to a garage, that was being called a gas station, and that the Harts were retrieving whatever they could out of their vehicle.

We have pictures and video from Oregon of a 2003 GMC Yukon where the body looks good- no real dings or dents.

So did they manage to find another 2003 GMC Yukon or was Jen lying about an accident to the Lees?

:thinking:

If the Lee's rented a trailer, does that mean a vehicle trailer? To tow the Yukon behind another big enough vehicle like a big RV maybe? Generous folks.

Just doesn't really add up, does it.

 

[Tricia]

Please remember it is against our Terms of Service to bring over posts from Reddit or any other forum.

 

[LonelyChild]

BTW...thank you for info...just so depressing. Beautiful children. Heartbreaking.

That info about Jen saying she had a family emergency was a huge clue imo. Maybe Devonte did run away and thats when Jen meant OR this couldve been her way of premeditating what was to come. She clearly had this planned out to some point. Now, rather or not Sarah was also in on it is sadly something we will not ever know.

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[Zelda1010]

FWIW I just scanned through 207 pages of statewide accident reports for 2012 in Montana, focusing on Missoula County and the two neighboring counties along I94. The article states they met her the day after Christmas which would have been a Wednesday in 2012. Looking for rollover accidents that occurred on Tue or Wed in December I found 3 rollover accidents that occurred in Missoula county on Tuesdays in December involving icy road conditions. One of these may have been the accident in question. It is also possible to not have irreparable damage to a vehicle after a rollover depending on speed, and how the rollover occurred. Sometimes with ice and snow a vehicle does more sliding or wedging into snow than smashing if that makes sense.

http://www.mdt.mt.gov/publications/docs/datastats/crashdata/CRASH_DATA_2012_FINAL_PUBLICReq.pdf

accidents I focused in on are on page 159 (December Tues 9:56 AM), page 174 (December Tues 12:10 AM), and page 204 (December Tuesday 4:00AM)

Like...gently tipped into a snowbank after whipping around - some people do that for fun, just saying, well not the tipping part, not on purpose, but doing "donuts" in the snow... might have turned into (we almost died in a) rollover crash...(Jen in my mind)

 

[LonelyChild]

Also I wanted to weigh in on something. I heard someone said the mothers werent wearing seatbelts when found. If that were the case i think the moms would have also been found outside the vechicle. The reason I say this is cause if the moms were in the front of the vechicle at the time it went over the cliff without a seatbelt theyd have gone through the windshield most likely. You have a chance of that happening regardless when you decide to drive off a cliff but I'd imagine the risk be greater if youre not seat belted in. Something idk what but something made it different for the moms and kids. The moms both were oddly found in the suv but kids were on the rocks and scattered. Maybe the kids went through the front windshield.

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[bluesneakers]

Also I wanted to weigh in on something. I heard someone said the mothers werent wearing seatbelts when found. If that were the case i think the moms would have also been found outside the vechicle. The reason I say this is cause if the moms were in the front of the vechicle at the time it went over the cliff without a seatbelt theyd have gone through the windshield most likely. You have a chance of that happening regardless when you decide to drive off a cliff but I'd imagine the risk be greater if youre not seat belted in. Something idk what but something made it different for the moms and kids. The moms both were oddly found in the suv but kids were on the rocks and scattered. Maybe the kids went through the front windshield.

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It was LE who said it.

 

[LonelyChild]

Jeremiah had a birthday in March. Reported to have just turned 14.

Pictures posted to social media imply that Devonte's birthday falls in the month of October (his raising $ for charity on his 13th and 15th birthdays)

Someone help and double check me here.

If Devonte did turn 15 in October, he would have been born October 2002 (2017-15). Assuming full term pregnancy, conceived February 2002.



If Jeremiah did turn 14 in March this year, he would have been born March 2004 (2018-14). Assuming full term pregnancy, conceived July 2003.

18 month between Jeremiah and Devonte.

Plenty of time for another baby in between (my brother and I were 10 months apart). But for Sierra to still be 15, things start cutting it close unless these babies were all preemies and conceived 4 to 6 weeks after the birth of the prior baby.

Exactly i found this timeline off too. If anything I think either media and le have ages wrong they prob dont have much to go on or like the other lies they told Sarah and Jen lied about the childrens ages. Im leaning towards the second one.

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[Zelda1010]

Also I wanted to weigh in on something. I heard someone said the mothers werent wearing seatbelts when found. If that were the case i think the moms would have also been found outside the vechicle. The reason I say this is cause if the moms were in the front of the vechicle at the time it went over the cliff without a seatbelt theyd have gone through the windshield most likely. You have a chance of that happening regardless when you decide to drive off a cliff but I'd imagine the risk be greater if youre not seat belted in. Something idk what but something made it different for the moms and kids. The moms both were oddly found in the suv but kids were on the rocks and scattered. Maybe the kids went through the front windshield.

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http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1804/05/ptab.01.html

In here they attempt to explain...he says the injuries that one would expect from seatbelts were not found. I think he also described the wreckage here too. Hth.

 

[LonelyChild]

It was LE who said it.

Thank you i knew i seen an article but there are so many I couldnt remember who said it. So LE first said they were in seatbelts and now they said they werent? Im confused. Did they change their opinion on the kids? Are they saying the kids were wearing seatbelts? TIA

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[LonelyChild]

My youngest had something similar happen. He had a staph infection in his neck, but we were told that lymphoma can present that way, so he was tested.

I do think Markis had some sort of illness. I think he looks sickly as well. Im not sure tho what the illness is. It also strikes me as odd that Markis being 19 wasnt involved in any outside activity, didn't have a job or leave home. Thats another sign of abuse imo. If you remember the children of the Turpin family were into their 20s abd living at home being abused. Im not saying that those three things HAVE to be present with any 19 year old. But usually at 19 uoure trying to get your first place, maybe go to college, get a girlfriend, get a job..you know like making a life for yourself.

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[Quill]

It really bothers me that the moms shut down the woman who offered to help with the girl's hair and to mentor them, as she too was an adoptee.

What would be wrong with allowing her to help you learn how to do their hair? if you decide later that she is too intrusive, then you can distance yourselves. But it seems it would be in the best interests of the kids if the moms were taught some things this woman had offered.

In the event that a narcissist is offered assistance, I can tell you from personal experience it is considered an affront to their shield of fantasy they have built. They live under the assumption that they have everyone fooled. They are at their most satisfied and successful when seen as the hero or the pinnacle of success. No way they want anyone to know that they are struggling or in need of help. They can't show those weaknesses. There will be repercussions against the ones who are not fooled by them. Not knowing these women personally, I am not saying I have diagnosed them as narcissists, however I do, unfortunately, have unwanted experience with one and this is common not to accept help.

 

[LonelyChild]

If the Lee's rented a trailer, does that mean a vehicle trailer? To tow the Yukon behind another big enough vehicle like a big RV maybe? Generous folks.

Just doesn't really add up, does it.

If this was true taking with a grain of salt then maybe Jen considered doing it before but this time she carried it all the way out. [emoji848]

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[Whiteorchids]

What experts and what are they basing this on?

Ive said it before and I will say it now- I think people are placing blame
on Jen because Sarah is younger, more attactive and more feminine than Jen.

There is zero evidence that Sarah was a victim. None. She pled guilty to child abuse. She lived in that house, stayed home with the kids and was part of the tribe rushing over to find Hannah and yank her back.

She admitted to a friend that she wasn't handling homeschooling very well but bristled when the friend offered assistance.

Both of these women seemed into appearance to me. Like other abusive couples they found their match in one another and IMO egged each other on or reinforced abusive parenting "techniques" because clearly neither one put a stop to what was happening in that house.

I do not believe Jen killed everyone while they slept and were unaware. Sarah rushed home immediately after CPS came knocking and loaded up her kids with her spouse and took off right after that.

Nothing suggests these women weren't making decisions together and both decided to murder their kids rather than face the indignity of having the curtain pulled back. Nothing.

Abigail said Jen beat and bruised her and put her head under water. Wouldn’t you know who did that to you? It seems odd Sarah pled guilty to the charge.

 

[11223344]

Delete

 

[bluesneakers]

Thank you i knew i seen an article but there are so many I couldnt remember who said it. So LE first said they were in seatbelts and now they said they werent? Im confused. Did they change their opinion on the kids? Are they saying the kids were wearing seatbelts? TIA

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https://www.statesmanjournal.com/st...f-crash-were-not-wearing-seatbelts/491545002/

 

[StephanieH]

So was it Sierra they found?

 

[LonelyChild]

So was it Sierra they found?

It wasnt officially releaded to my knowledge yet. I dont know what Abby, Markis and Hannahs race is. It does look theyre african american atleast the girls but I think theyre mixed idk. Sierra Devonte and Jeremiah are african american so I feel it may be Sierra. However i think it could be hannah too. The police said they couldnt identify the person founds age and we all know Hannah looks younger than what she is.

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[gcharlie]

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1804/05/ptab.01.html

In here they attempt to explain...he says the injuries that one would expect from seatbelts were not found. I think he also described the wreckage here too. Hth.

Allman also mentions that the vehicle likely tumbled end over end on its way down the cliff before landing on its roof on the rocks. He cites a v dent on the front end of the vehicle that pushed beyond the radiator. The images I've seen of the vehicle also seem to show a large dent on the rear.

If the women weren't belted in as they say, it is amazing that they weren't ejected as well. Reports are that Sarah's body was wedged between a rear seat and the roof, which stopped her from being ejected.

Nobody wearing seat belts still bothers me and I struggle to understand how that could happen. The women were clearly purposeful in not wearing theirs, but what about the kids? Once my son got to a certain age (probably 7 or so), I don't ever remember having to tell him to buckle up- it was ingrained and automatic. Is it possible that one or both mothers jammed the rear seat belts to make them inoperable?

 

[11223344]

That info about Jen saying she had a family emergency was a huge clue imo. Maybe Devonte did run away and thats when Jen meant OR this couldve been her way of premeditating what was to come. She clearly had this planned out to some point. Now, rather or not Sarah was also in on it is sadly something we will not ever know.

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Yes...I thought so too. I thought info was meaningful or wouldn't have shared.

 

[katydid23]

Jeremiah had a birthday in March. Reported to have just turned 14.

Pictures posted to social media imply that Devonte's birthday falls in the month of October (his raising $ for charity on his 13th and 15th birthdays)

Someone help and double check me here.

If Devonte did turn 15 in October, he would have been born October 2002 (2017-15). Assuming full term pregnancy, conceived February 2002.



If Jeremiah did turn 14 in March this year, he would have been born March 2004 (2018-14). Assuming full term pregnancy, conceived July 2003.

18 month between Jeremiah and Devonte.

Plenty of time for another baby in between (my brother and I were 10 months apart). But for Sierra to still be 15, things start cutting it close unless these babies were all preemies and conceived 4 to 6 weeks after the birth of the prior baby.

There is a slight possibility they were all related to each other through their father---maybe living with him when they were taken by CPS? Thus maybe different Mom ?