Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020

[Dawookie]

I have to believe CCPD & the FBI had good reason to excavate the back yard. In addition to whatever indication the dogs gave, there must be other information we are not privy too. Clearing the parents, which may include removing children from the home to interview, adults taking a LDT, seizing their cell phones/electronic devices, vehicle, etc., is one thing.

Getting a search warrant, bringing in lights and digging around in the back yard at night, is a whole other level, IMO.

Exactly, they don't just go through all that to excavate without having a reason and especially at night

 

[Lilibet]

Exactly, they don't just go through all that to excavate without having a reason and especially at night

Yes, excavating is usually something we see after an extensive investigation, not so soon. I wonder if one of the other children saw something. And I wonder what LE found...or didn’t find.

 

[Dawookie]

Yes, excavating is usually something we see after an extensive investigation, not so soon. I wonder if one of the other children saw something. And I wonder what LE found...or didn’t find.

Yep, that's what was has made me think they knew something from the interviews and werent buying the story. I'm interested in knowing what came of it as well because there's been nothing said at all by LE since then

 

[PommyMommy]

The kids may actually answer to their birth names. They were under their grandmother’s care, and as far as I know, they went to the West’s care and got adopted last year, but I might be wrong. Either way, they were adopted in 2019, the oldest boy would be 3. I have a really hard time believing a 3 year old wouldn’t know his name.

So yeah, he remembers. I have a 3-year-old niece, she knows her name. We have a bunch of nicknames for her, but she knows her name.

Plus, we don’t know when the contact with birth mother stopped if it ever stopped. So, if they were still getting visits from their mother, I’m sure she was calling them by the names she gave them.

I actually wonder if someone was supposed to visit this family on Christmas or if they were supposed to go visit someone, making the absence of two toddlers very hard to explain. If you know what I mean.

I would also like to see recent pictures of this children. Where are the recent pictures?

BBM The adoptive mother said she has recent photos but they are on her phone (which was collected by LE). About 7:34 ish: Bayan Wang 23ABC - Facebook

Also, at about the 12:46 minute mark in the same video, someone asks about the rest of the kids and their father says they were at Grandma's. They kept Orson and Orrin home because they were too young. MOO

 

[Lusitana]

BBM The adoptive mother said she has recent photos but they are on her phone (which was collected by LE). About 7:34 ish: Bayan Wang 23ABC - Facebook

Also, at about the 12:46 minute mark in the same video, someone asks about the rest of the kids and their father says they were at Grandma's. They kept Orson and Orrin home because they were too young. MOO

LE took their phones away immediately when they reported the children missing? Hard to believe that. Couldn’t they have just said “okay here’s the phone, do whatever you want with it, there’s a bunch of recent pictures of the babies there”? It took days to make a picture public, and it was of just one of the boys at first. That makes no sense. One of the first things LE probably did was asking for up to date pictures of the kids.

And Orrin and Orson were “too young” for what? To go to the grandparents house? Uh? The stuff they say makes zero sense.

 

[Lusitana]

I don’t doubt these two little boys would be capable of wandering off.

My mother always tells this story of when my brother was about 3 years old, he managed to get out of the house. He wanted to go see our dad at the fire station. It was pretty close to our house but he had to go down a bunch of stairs and walk with cars passing by. Dangerous for a 3-year-old right? He did it anyways. Didn’t even forgot to put his jacket on before leaving the house lol.

So yeah, it’s possible and it happens. The rest of the story here is what doesn’t make it very probable though.

 

[Queena]

LE took their phones away immediately when they reported the children missing? Hard to believe that. Couldn’t they have just said “okay here’s the phone, do whatever you want with it, there’s a bunch of recent pictures of the babies there”? It took days to make a picture public, and it was of just one of the boys at first. That makes no sense. One of the first things LE probably did was asking for up to date pictures of the kids.

And Orrin and Orson were “too young” for what? To go to the grandparents house? Uh? The stuff they say makes zero sense.

Sometimes older people don't like to keep younger kids. I've heard about the police confiscating all electronics.

However, my bet is still on the parents.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Yes, excavating is usually something we see after an extensive investigation, not so soon. I wonder if one of the other children saw something. And I wonder what LE found...or didn’t find.

This action could have been triggered by what a neighbor *heard*

amateur opinion and speculation

 

[ManicMuggle83]

LE took their phones away immediately when they reported the children missing? Hard to believe that. Couldn’t they have just said “okay here’s the phone, do whatever you want with it, there’s a bunch of recent pictures of the babies there”? It took days to make a picture public, and it was of just one of the boys at first. That makes no sense. One of the first things LE probably did was asking for up to date pictures of the kids.

And Orrin and Orson were “too young” for what? To go to the grandparents house? Uh? The stuff they say makes zero sense.

My mother is 76. I send my older kids to her house to stay but not the toddlers without us. That isn't weird at all. I've known many older adults who prefer not to chase little ones.

 

[rosesfromangels]

My mother is 76. I send my older kids to her house to stay but not the toddlers without us. That isn't weird at all. I've known many older adults who prefer not to chase little ones.

Or fully potty trained.
I know these two tikes were well past potty training age, but do we know if they had hit that developmental milestone?

Potty training often seems to be the centerpiece of many problems

amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Jo in Calif]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=2884870598417447

 

[MoeInVA]

My mother is 76. I send my older kids to her house to stay but not the toddlers without us. That isn't weird at all. I've known many older adults who prefer not to chase little ones.

Agree! Plus, watching a total of six kids for a few days or a week would be too much for many grandparents! Totally reasonable to keep the youngest two at home imo and totally supportive of those grandparents to take 4 of their grandchildren for an extended visit. As a parent, I would be grateful for that assistance and support from the grandparents. JMO

I really find it difficult to fathom what could have happened to these two boys. I looked back at missing sibling scenarios I have seen in the past...

• Siblings huddled together in wooded area (doesn’t seem relevant in this terrain)
• Siblings got themselves in vehicle and it locked or hid in the area (have we heard about any LE searches at all in recent days?? Since the crime scene tape went up, I don’t think we have heard of any... though the report above says LE was “back out in the neighborhood” yesterday and a few community searchers were out yesterday)
• Siblings went near body of water and fell in or swept away/ drowned ( these were searched though not necessarily drained)
• From the full interview video @PommyMommy posted, it appears that the parents agree with observers that the children couldn’t have disappeared in that terrain that quickly, and the parents think it must be foul play/ the kids must be in the neighborhood houses (but wouldn’t have stayed away by choice) or have been picked up by someone.
• Of course custody issues come up, but that seems unlikely here. As far as we know all custody stakeholders are present and accounted for.
• Finally of course there was the Vallow case of missing siblings but that seemed like an outlier
• Very worrisome.

 

[MojaveMave]

And Orrin and Orson were “too young” for what? To go to the grandparents house? Uh? The stuff they say makes zero sense.

Not that unusual. Those in my family with toddlers don't usually leave their toddlers with our grandparents without additional help because their home isn't "toddler friendly" as it were. Little ones love to grab and break things, climb up and down stairs, etc. and our grandparents have lots of stuff everywhere. So if the kids are there, someone younger who can chase them and change their diapers is also there to help out. One of them, in particular, at 3, is an adorable little pistol. She can disappear in an instant.

 

[Kimpossible31]

BBM The adoptive mother said she has recent photos but they are on her phone (which was collected by LE). About 7:34 ish: Bayan Wang 23ABC - Facebook

Also, at about the 12:46 minute mark in the same video, someone asks about the rest of the kids and their father says they were at Grandma's. They kept Orson and Orrin home because they were too young. MOO

Following but haven't had anything to add. However, the fact that the other kids were with Grandma, really peaks my interest. Very coincidental. Hope that my feelings are wrong. I hate that the neighbors are giving them such a hard time though, they shouldn't be at this point. All efforts should be towards finding the kids.
I'd be interested to know how often the older ones visit Grandma.

 

[AncientHysteria]

As mom to a "rambunctious" little boy, I don't find it impossible to believe that the kids wandered away. But I cannot understand why, especially in an area full of environmental hazards, they would not call law enforcment immediately.

Our 4-year-old slipped out of the house one time while I was getting laundry out of the garage and his dad was in the bathroom. As soon as I walked back into the family room and saw that he was no longer painting with his sisters, we had an all-hands-on-deck alert. We spent at most 3-5 minutes doing a cursory check of bedrooms, closets, fenced back yard, unfenced front yard, etc., then called 911 and started beating on neighbors' doors to ask for help.

We knew that several neighbors had swimming pools, that there was a busy road just a couple of blocks away, and that time was NOT on our side. Our only concern in that moment was finding him before tragedy struck, and we wanted as many people as possible helping us do that.

Thankfully, we found our little one safe (albeit terrified because he'd crawled into our next-door neighbor's new car and gotten himself trapped by their child safety locks) before police ever arrived. Then, we installed loud door alarms and security cameras. ;-)

I've been holding off on commenting here because I dont want to jump to any conclusions. I will input now because I have a similar story.
When my step son was 5 years old, my husband and I took him, his older brother, and our 3 month old dauggter to the public pool. We spent a good 2 hours there before deciding to pack up and head out. We wrapped the kids in towels and told them to dry off while we packed up. The boys were no more than 5 feet away from us. We turned out back for no more than a minute. When we turned back, the 5 year old was gone. We immediately started searching the pool, the bathrooms and the concession. It didnt take 2 minutes for the staff to get involved. They got everyone out of the pool and we all searched. A total of 5-6 minutes in and the police are called. They found him in our car. We couldn't understand how he got out because the lock to the gate is 5 feet up and sticks so it's hard to open. He said that a older boy in blue shorts let him out. We can only guess it was one of the teenage life guards because they all wore blue shorts. He was gone for no more than 10 minutes total (police station litterally right up the road). He has always been a runner. Even at 11 years old he wants to run ahead of us and we are constantly telling him to slow down. My 4 year old is much the same. I still carry him more than not because if I put him down he will try to bolt off. Makes things like mall trips and trick or treating nerve wrecking.

 

[Sprockett7701]

I don’t think it would be unreasonable for either of the boys not to be completely potty trained. My own son wasn’t til at least almost 4, he still occasionally wets the bed, they do say that boys take longer...although always exceptions of course.

MOO IMOO

 

[rosesfromangels]

Following but haven't had anything to add. However, the fact that the other kids were with Grandma, really peaks my interest. Very coincidental. Hope that my feelings are wrong. I hate that the neighbors are giving them such a hard time though, they shouldn't be at this point. All efforts should be towards finding the kids.
I'd be interested to know how often the older ones visit Grandma.

Good post. I too am very interested in why these neighbors turned on the adoptive parents so quickly? Agree that it's odd they wouldn't all be pitching in and providing support, searching, and so forth. Maybe they are and I'm misinterpreting? What would lead them to jump to the negative side so quickly? What would lead authorities to quickly start digging up the back yard!? They must know something I don't, that is for sure.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[rosesfromangels]

I don’t think it would be unreasonable for either of the boys not to be completely potty trained. My own son wasn’t til at least almost 4, he still occasionally wets the bed, they do say that boys take longer...although always exceptions of course.

MOO IMOO

Sure, every kid has a different schedule, and alot of it isn't behavioral it's biological. Nightime wees can do with bladder size as much as anything.
The point I was trying to raise is that having two tikes that age who might (?) have had potty issues could trigger rage in the adults. It seems to be a frequent theme in abuse cases.

I'm still not convinced the parents are involved in this disappearance. I'm waiting to hear more details.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[legalmomma]

DBM. Quoted wrong post

 

[legalmomma]

Good post. I too am very interested in why these neighbors turned on the adoptive parents so quickly? Agree that it's odd they wouldn't all be pitching in and providing support, searching, and so forth. Maybe they are and I'm misinterpreting? What would lead them to jump to the negative side so quickly? What would lead authorities to quickly start digging up the back yard!? They must know something I don't, that is for sure.
Amateur opinion and speculation

During the interview, the full interview, the woman screaming at the parents and others were noted by the adoptive Mom to be from the bio-family. One screamed out “what did you do to my nephews!”
Personally after watching the full interview I feel for the parents and agree all the homes,cars and outbuildings should be searched. And the water again.