Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #18 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

[cluciano63]

We've never heard if Sierra wore headphones while she walked...one of her friend's early on said that Sierra loved music so much it was like her life...so I guess it is possible she did not hear AG drive up and he was able to get out of his car and grab her from behind and throw her inside very quickly.

The teens near me ALL wear headphones, and walk alone.Sometimes I pull up at stop signs on my street right next to one (I live near a high school) and they don't even flinch-I am like 2 feet from them at that point.

But I have never heard anything about keeping an eye out for ear buds etc...

 

[dog.gone.cute]

After reading some here, I am now on the fence as to if Sierra willingly got into the suspects car or not. My main reason for thinking it is possible is because previously I had thought she was stun gunned and dragged into the vehicle. But as another poster stated this would cause her to drop any books etc and would the perp bother to pick those up out of the road, along with Sierra and her purse etc? So now I am back at square one on this one.

:seeya: Just a thought after reading your post ... so jumping in here :

IF a stun gun was used on Sierra AND she was dragged to his vehicle, wouldn't she have SCREAMED when "stun gunned" and when he was dragging her to the car ? I understand he could have come up from behind her and covered her mouth ...

And if he was taking her while she was holding her handbag and school books, she definitely would have dropped the handbag and/or the books !

And JMO and MOO ... I still wonder IF -- a BIG IF here -- she knew him and he offered her a ride ... afterall, wasn't it raining that morning ?

:moo::moo::moo:

 

[MyTinkieGirl]

:seeya: Just a thought after reading your post ... so jumping in here :

IF a stun gun was used on Sierra AND she was dragged to his vehicle, wouldn't she have SCREAMED when "stun gunned" and when he was dragging her to the car ? I understand he could have come up from behind her and covered her mouth ...

And if he was taking her while she was holding her handbag and school books, she definitely would have dropped the handbag and/or the books !

And JMO and MOO ... I still wonder IF -- a BIG IF here -- she knew him and he offered her a ride ... afterall, wasn't it raining that morning ?

:moo::moo::moo:

IIRC, after I was mentioning the ride/rain thing, a local posted it wasn't raining at that particular time...or not a deluge. I STILL think that was what COULD have happened....a ride to keep from getting rained on.
Also, he COULD have known her...BUT, he was asked and denied even SEEING her to his mom and family. And, IIRC, the same was said by himself to LE.
IMO, there COULD be reasons for lying...being the "good son/father", so he keeps denying it...OR, he's denying it because he didn't plan on being caught.
Also, IMO, seems Sierra had some pretty close BFF's, a 15 yo, IMO, would have told her friends about an "older guy" if she knew him.

With all the "other" failed attacks, IMO, he MIGHT have given her a ride ONCE (again, as many have said this about the "awkward" car door closing tweet)... maybe to gain some "trust"...and on Mar 16th, did so again, to do what he tried to do in all the other "failed" attacks. Changing his MO, so to speak.
Gain a little trust instead of a direct attack, and MAYBE get someone into HIS car.

 

[ryanemsmom]

:seeya:

Yes, that photo ... another "mystery" in this case ... actually, one of many "mysteries" in this case ...

:moo:

This threw me too, but then I thought maybe the picture was a private message through FB or Twitter. Then the "she sent the picture to someone" and the "posted to social media site" would both technically be correct.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

:seeya: Just a thought after reading your post ... so jumping in here :

IF a stun gun was used on Sierra AND she was dragged to his vehicle, wouldn't she have SCREAMED when "stun gunned" and when he was dragging her to the car ? I understand he could have come up from behind her and covered her mouth ...

And if he was taking her while she was holding her handbag and school books, she definitely would have dropped the handbag and/or the books !

And JMO and MOO ... I still wonder IF -- a BIG IF here -- she knew him and he offered her a ride ... afterall, wasn't it raining that morning ?

:moo::moo::moo:

According to the weather reports it wasn't raining until later in the day.

To me, it doesn't make any difference whether she willingly accepted a ride or not. The fact is, her cell phone was found a short distance from her house, thrown from the vehicle. Now, LE has her cell pings and would be able to pinpoint the time the cell was thrown in that location. If it was thrown immediately, that would be an indication that she met foul play right away. So, regardly of whether she got in the vehicle willingly or not, she would still be considered kidnapped at that point and time.

As far as her dropping her things. I am still not convinced that she had a arm full of books and a purse. It was never clearly stated as fact. She could have just had the purse as maybe she wasn't lugging a bunch of books that day. I am following another case here where the girl was went missing riding her bike. Whoever took her, also took her bike instead of just leaving it lay. Unfortunately, it was a good move by the perp because it bought him/her time in the investigation.

I, like you would most likely think that someone would scream in this kind of a situation except for the fact that I have been in situations and unfortunately froze due to fear that if I did scream it would result in my death. When someone points a gun at you and tells you don't move or speak or I'll kill you, it's pretty scary. I chose to obey to try and by some time and eventually I was able to outwit the perpetrator and get away. I was very lucky, it could have easily gone wrong at any time.

 

[sindydee]

I'm puzzled by the direct evidence thing too. If my understanding of direct evidence is correct, I think that would mean that someone or something saw him actually taking her against her will, raping and/or murdering her. If they only have her being in the car with him wouldn't that be circumstantial evidence since technically just because she was in the car with him doesn't mean she was there against her will or that he raped and/or killed her, YKWIM?

And then regarding the dogs not being able to pick up Sierra's scent where they found the bag, wouldn't her scent be on the bag since it was her bag? Maybe it's that there wasn't a scent trail from Sierra to the bag? I wonder if it's possible for LE to tell if A's scent was on the bag and/ or a scent trail of his leading to the bag?

This is what I have been thinking about today.

They had the DNA results early on in the case. They had established him as a suspect and at the press conference said they had spoken to him several times in the course of the investigation. This says to me that the DNA wasn't strong enough to arrest him for kidnapping and murder at this point. There was no blood and no murder weapon also.

They had taken his car - he knew he was under surveilance. (so his mother said). There was no way he was going anywhere near her body. The Police said they were following him to see if this is what may happen. I seriously think they did not have enough evidence at that point to arrest him. But had strong suspicions because of the DNA and needed to keep track of him.

I don't think they found his fingerprints on her phone nor do I think they have actual pictures or evidence of her being in his car, or throwing or placing the bag. (unless this came to light later on in the investigation) Because again - an arrest would have been made earlier.

The first thing you would surely do is contact anyone with ANY type of security cameras within the area. This would be the easiest way of knowing what, IF anything was caught on them. Unless, of course if there were just images or pictures of the car and they might not be able to identify the individual, the car was stolen or the person was in disguise. I just can't see them taking all this time from when they had the DNA evidence to when he was arrested.

Maybe a witness came forward or maybe they do have these images and it just took a long time? who knows?

 

[sindydee]

BUT then thinking about it - like I said in my earlier post - How can the police be so sure the clothes she were wearing that day were the ones that were found - unless they saw her AFTER she left the house on video, someone else saw her, there was more messages sent. Wonder if he had a mobile phone and if they found anything on that like pictures?

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Sierra LaMar: Anatomy of a Search Day 59 | The Klaas Act

"This case is getting inside people’s heads. As improbable as it may seem, they dream about Sierra returning home, even walking through the big double doors of the Search Center. They struggle with their own emotional well-being as a child that most of them have never met is somewhere out there. They feel guilty that her best possible scenario has her distressed, hopeless and afraid. Some volunteers have taken to dark moods; some to drink. However, there are no social services available to these good men and women, so they put their heads down and try to move inexorably forward."

More here:

http://100.42.52.148/~klaaskid/blog/?p=237

 

[LLLindsayy]

:seeya: Yep ... that's my interpretation as well ...

RBBM: I totally agree ... and "who knows" IF -- a big IF here -- she MAY know him, or know one of his friends ...

Ya just never know ... no telling WHO she may have been communicating with on Twitter or tumbler or the internet ...


ETA: Just saw this here on WS and am posting the link here as well ... SCARY !!!

Family: Houston girl lured into sex trade by Facebook predators

AUSTIN, Texas -- Family members say a Houston girl was lured into the sex trade by predators on Facebook. Now, the child's aunt in Austin is sharing her story. ...

The girl was missing for 48 hours. Whalon says they were able to track her down thanks to the
GPS on the girl's cell phone. They say it saved her life.

snipped from : http://www.khou.com/news/Child-with-Texas-ties-lured-into-sex-trade--155711925.html

WS Thread : Family: Houston girl lured into sex trade by Facebook predators - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community



:moo::moo::moo:

BBM: IMO, there is telling. It is my strong assumption that LE has seized Sierra's computer or at the very least fully investigated any computer that she had access to. Also, I'm sure they reviewed her phone to the tiniest detail.

:twocents:

LE would have found if and when Sierra had prior contact with AGT via technology.

Of course this does not eliminate the possibility that they knew each other by being in the same location in the past or by having mutual friends, but I think it's safe to say that if the were communication over the internet then LE knows about it.

 

[LLLindsayy]

Since LE was tailing him and he didn't lead them to her body.....maybe LE should look at a direction he didn't go in, instead of directions he went in as possible locations to search.

Ditto. Maybe this is why they are focusing on south Santa Clara county. Maybe he stayed put in the northern part...?

 

[LLLindsayy]

This threw me too, but then I thought maybe the picture was a private message through FB or Twitter. Then the "she sent the picture to someone" and the "posted to social media site" would both technically be correct.

Is anyone here privy to the contents of Sierra's Facebook account? When I go to her profile page I can clearly see that I'm unable to view the content she has posted. It looks like she could have posted a photo to her FB account and we wouldn't be able to see it. (Or is there an insider around here that can verify there is no photo visible?)

On another note, while I was just searching for Sierra's page I saw the profile of another girl who claims her name is initials BJ, that she's married, but she is using all of Sierra's pictures. I found this simply by typing Sierra's name into the search bar. Has this already been discussed?

 

[krkrjx]

Is it possible they were trying to eliminate the possibility of him saying someone else had a red/black Jetta just like his and the police failed to investigate. So LE cast a wide net to look for ANY OTHER CAR that could possibly have been involved, that might weaken the case against AG-T. The tips they got were probably OVERWHELMINGLY about his car, and they called the game off after a day because the volume of calls was overwhelming.

I do not think it is unreasonable to think there are other cars around that look like that Jetta, maybe nearly identical to it. But there was evidence found that puts Sierra inside this particular vehicle. We do not know what that evidence is or where in the vehicle it was found, but until I hear something that shows that evidence as weak, I feel comfortable for the time being assuming that said evidence is what caused the DA to give the go-ahead for arrest.

Now it is up to a defense attorney to produce the other cars, if any, and then show evidence that Sierra has been inside one or more of those other cars, in addition to evidence that places one or more of those cars in any of the critical areas at the critical times that would point to possible involvement in Sierra's disappearance.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Is anyone here privy to the contents of Sierra's Facebook account? When I go to her profile page I can clearly see that I'm unable to view the content she has posted. It looks like she could have posted a photo to her FB account and we wouldn't be able to see it. (Or is there an insider around here that can verify there is no photo visible?)

On another note, while I was just searching for Sierra's page I saw the profile of another girl who claims her name is initials BJ, that she's married, but she is using all of Sierra's pictures. I found this simply by typing Sierra's name into the search bar. Has this already been discussed?

I don't know of anyone here that has access to her FB account.

I tried searching her name and nothing with those initials popped up for me. I do know that there are a lot of accounts using her name in good and bad ways. Also, there are alot of fake accounts on FB and twitter created by internet trolls. As sick as it is, they seem to do this in a lot of high profile cases.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Circumstantial evidence is a very powerful thing! Many criminals have been convicted upon it alone, without direct evidence, and forensic evidence doesn't lie, and can be more reliable than eyewitnesses, whose memories can change!

I agree with you one hundred percent and then some . A circumstantial case (depending on what it is, how much etc.) can be much stronger than one based on an eye witness. I get frustrated when people don't seem to get that.

I wondered about the direct evidence because LE has said that they had direct evidence and from what we've seen I'm scratching my head about what it might be. I'm not saying that I think he is not guilty because LE may not have direct evidence, just wondering what it could be. If they don't have direct evidence I'm not really too concerned that at jury wouldn't find him guilty. Monsters are convicted all the time even without eye witness testimony or a confession, even when the victim isn't found.

 

[Fashionista_Gal]

Is anyone here privy to the contents of Sierra's Facebook account? When I go to her profile page I can clearly see that I'm unable to view the content she has posted. It looks like she could have posted a photo to her FB account and we wouldn't be able to see it. (Or is there an insider around here that can verify there is no photo visible?)

On another note, while I was just searching for Sierra's page I saw the profile of another girl who claims her name is initials BJ, that she's married, but she is using all of Sierra's pictures. I found this simply by typing Sierra's name into the search bar. Has this already been discussed?

I think you have to be her friend to see her wall. IIRC though, she commented on her Twitter that she was getting sick of FB and didn't really use it anymore, so I'm not sure how much she was using it. But, since the statement of facts report says she posted the photo on a social media site, you have to wonder if she did post the photo there since we didn't see it on her Twitter.

And yes, there have already been multiple people who have created fake FB and Twitter accounts using her name and/or photos. Very sick. I've reported a few of them when I see them so they can be taken down.

 

[GrainneDhu]

:seeya: Yes ... that is what LE said, and they were "hoping" that he would lead them to Sierra ... BUT he did NOT lead them to Sierra ...

What I am trying to figure out is this : WHAT EVIDENCE do they have LINKING Antolin to Sierra with respect to the items found near the shed ?

In order for it to be "Direct Evidence" there has to be a video that clearly shows Antolin placing Sierra's items there -- and/or -- Antolin's vehicle's License Plate at the shed while he is placing the items there ... also, they need to have a clear video showing Siera IN HIS red Jetta ...

Otherwise, they do not have this type of direct evidence ... it then becomes questionable and raises doubt ... therefore, it could be any "red Jetta" or any "red car" ...

This JMO and MOO ... but I just do NOT see why Antolin would go there and place Sierra's items at this shed ... it makes absolutely NO sense IMO ... Why not find a trashcan or dumpster where it most probably would have NEVER been found ?

In other words, what kind of criminal would leave a "trail" -- especially since he has had run-ins with the law before ? KWIM ?

And I do not believe he took Sierra to the shed because as I recall, the dogs were brought there and they did NOT pick up on her scent there ...

Of course, all JMO and MOO ...

:moo:

I thought AGT's mother said that he told her he didn't know Sierra and had nothing to do with her.

If I recall that correctly, then I think AGT probably said the same thing to LE: never met her, don't know her, never did anything with or to her.

So then how did his DNA get onto her clothes in the bag (regardless of whether those clothes were the outfit she was wearing, no one seems to doubt the clothes belong to Sierra)? How did her DNA get into his car?

And what happened to good old fashioned eyewitness testimony?

 

[LLLindsayy]

I think you have to be her friend to see her wall. IIRC though, she commented on her Twitter that she was getting sick of FB and didn't really use it anymore, so I'm not sure how much she was using it. But, since the statement of facts report says she posted the photo on a social media site, you have to wonder if she did post the photo there since we didn't see it on her Twitter.

And yes, there have already been multiple people who have created fake FB and Twitter accounts using her name and/or photos. Very sick. I've reported a few of them when I see them so they can be taken down.

In my experience teenagers do this ALL. THE. TIME. They do it for attention. I'm not much older than a teenager myself -- in fact, I've had a Facebook account since I was in high school so I'm more than familiar with this happening. They're looking for people to say, "No, don't go! We'll miss you!" etc. etc. I see posts like this on Facebook itself daily. I wouldn't chalk it up to much, really.

 

[Tuba]

The substantiality of sheriffs' evidence isn't what we need to worry about at this time. We will shortly see the probable cause to charge A.G.-T. with murder and kidnap of Sierra LaMar and a judge will rule on the sufficiency of that probable cause to bind him over for trial. There will be reference to both direct & circumstantial evidence. Direct evidence is any which applies directly to the fact or facts needed to support the charge and to show the fact exists. Direct evidence is not limited to video or eyewitness testimony and is different from circumstantial evidence which is the interweaving and mutual support of a variety of facts that support an inference or conclusion. In other words, circ. ev. is dependent and direct ev. can stand alone. All of our speculation and deductions about the clues can rest in the past until we're exposed to our first glimpse of the totality of the proof law enforcement has against the accused.

What would be constructive is shared knowledge of the area gained from familiarity and from searches plus notions of where A.G.-T. may have taken Sierra.

 

[dluke]

I think you have to be her friend to see her wall. IIRC though, she commented on her Twitter that she was getting sick of FB and didn't really use it anymore, so I'm not sure how much she was using it. But, since the statement of facts report says she posted the photo on a social media site, you have to wonder if she did post the photo there since we didn't see it on her Twitter.

And yes, there have already been multiple people who have created fake FB and Twitter accounts using her name and/or photos. Very sick. I've reported a few of them when I see them so they can be taken down.

I'm wondering if she has any other accounts, like Tumblr? I thought about it because I didn't even know what Tumblr was until I found out my 15 yr old daughter has an account..maybe she posted pics there?

 

[Ransom]

http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-sierra-lamar,0,6729674.story

The car was seen at the time and place where the teenager disappeared on March 16 in an unincorporated area of Morgan Hill.

The same car was also captured on surveillance video from buses and local businesses near where other evidence in the case was found.

Check out this street view map of Laguna and Santa Teresa (right down that road is where the bag was found). There is a BUS STOP right before someone would turn to the right on Laguna (Fisher Rd).

http://goo.gl/maps/6DUp

Click on map. Run your mouse over the right hand side:

BUS STOP
Buses from this station: 68
68 SB Gilroy Transit Center
4:37pm
4:52pm
vta.org

Click on more info> more times for the bus show up.


Just a thought since the above article said surveillance video from "buses".