Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #22

[garbagetweet]

One thing that has just come to my mind regarding their business relationship and the pump is why would Douglas be given the opportunity to work on the pump? I believe it was mentioned that Alvin's son recommended that Douglas be given the chance to do the work but does anyone know if Douglas had any formal credentials for doing the electrical work? I know that many boomers in Douglas' age group are self taught in various trades such as plumbing and electrical and what not. If Alvin was actually serious about designing/building some sort of great new pump I would assume that he would partner with or hire a reliable and qualified electrical engineer or electrician. I actually wouldn't be surprised if Alvin had no intention of paying or partnering with Doug and just wanted some free work done because he is cheap.

 

[otto]

One thing that has just come to my mind regarding their business relationship and the pump is why would Douglas be given the opportunity to work on the pump? I believe it was mentioned that Alvin's son recommended that Douglas be given the chance to do the work but does anyone know if Douglas had any formal credentials for doing the electrical work? I know that many boomers in Douglas' age group are self taught in various trades such as plumbing and electrical and what not. If Alvin was actually serious about designing/building some sort of great new pump I would assume that he would partner with or hire a reliable and qualified electrical engineer or electrician. I actually wouldn't be surprised if Alvin had no intention of paying or partnering with Doug and just wanted some free work done because he is cheap.

Regardless of whether Garland had training and experience with the wiring for the pump, Garland's contribution to the product and schematics were complete to the extent that the design qualified for a patent.

 

[Leeesh]

I remember when Allen testified he said that DG was in fact paid for his services that he did. Then in DG's father's testimony he claims that AL did not pay DG. But for all we know DG could have just told his father that he didn't get paid and we all know he has a good record of being a liar. MOO

 

[Sillybilly]

He seemed to be very intelligent...under his assumed identity he became a supervisor though had a breakdown that led to dismissal.

<rsbm>

Just to keep the record straight as we go along, his "breakdown" was supposedly the reason for not continuing his med school education, but he was dismissed from his job at Can Test Ltd as a result of the criminal charges he faced in BC in 1999.

from:
http://globalnews.ca/news/1435807/p...ssing-family-case-has-criminal-history-in-bc/

Garland worked at Can Test Ltd. and the British Columbia Institute of Technology, until he was arrested in 1999. He pleaded guilty to all his drug offences and the charges in connection with his assumed identity, and served time in prison, according to the court documents.

 

[otto]

I remember when Allen testified he said that DG was in fact paid for his services that he did. Then in DG's father's testimony he claims that AL did not pay DG. But for all we know DG could have just told his father that he didn't get paid and we all know he has a good record of being a liar. MOO

There must be paperwork, but that's outside of proving murder. Perhaps it was one or the other - included in the patent, or properly compensated for the patent ideas - but neither happened, or he was not properly compensated.

 

[otto]

<rsbm>

Just to keep the record straight as we go along, his "breakdown" was supposedly the reason for not continuing his med school education, but he was dismissed from his job at Can Test Ltd as a result of the criminal charges he faced in BC in 1999.

from:
http://globalnews.ca/news/1435807/p...ssing-family-case-has-criminal-history-in-bc/

He worked at BCIT, the BC version of SAIT and NAIT ... "his job at Can Test Ltd. and BCIT(British Columbia Institute of Technology)". How was it discovered that he had a fake identify? Was he arrested for drugs, matched to his real identify, and then arrested for fake identity? Then he lost his job, and weren't there questions about his credentials?

Wasn't there also something about a stolen semi?

 

[YYC]

It really doesn't matter what his regular shoe size is. He could be a size 9 and it wouldn't make any difference to the outcome. What's important to know is whether or not he was the person who wore the size 13 shoes that left prints at the crime scene.

In that regard, I would add that I believe that his reason for mopping out the kitchen floor was to hide from the police the fact that the murderer had such a big foot. He probably took into account that he could become a suspect sooner or later, so he wanted to hide this from the police. Luckily, not only that he didn't remove all his footprints but he also left an empty shoe box of the same footwear at the farm.

 

[otto]

In that regard, I would add that I believe that his reason for mopping out the kitchen floor was to hide from the police the fact that the murderer had such a big foot. He probably took into account that he could become a suspect sooner or later, so he wanted to hide this from the police. Luckily, not only that he didn't remove all his footprints but he also left an empty shoe box of the same footwear at the farm.

I thought that the reason he left the shoe box in plain sight is that he never expected to get caught. I don't think he cared about leaving footprints given the prints in the garage.

Do we know that the mop was used?

 

[kmclaren]

He worked at BCIT, the BC version of SAIT and NAIT ... "his job at Can Test Ltd. and BCIT(British Columbia Institute of Technology)". How was it discovered that he had a fake identify? Was he arrested for drugs, matched to his real identify, and then arrested for fake identity? Then he lost his job, and weren't there questions about his credentials?

Wasn't there also something about a stolen semi?

I tried to piece together what happened in BC. It seems he flew under the radar here from 1992 until Oct 2, 1998 when he was arrested for possession of stolen property and resisting arrest. By the time he 1st appeared in a BC court on May 21st, 1999 there was a whole new set of charges dating back to Oct/Nov 1992. I was assuming that sometime between Oct 1998 and May 1999, they somehow matched him with his real identity and his old Alberta charges caught up with him.

These may have been posted previously but these are his charges in BC, the 1992 ones I assume are from Alberta although there is limited info on them (from https://justice.gov.bc.ca/cso/index.do)

23-Oct-1992 FDA - 39(1) Traffic in a controlled drug
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 353(1)(b) possessing automobile master key
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 351(1) Possess break-in instrument
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 354 Possession of property obtained by crime
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 90(1) Possession of a prohibited weapon
20-Nov-1992 CCC - 355(a) PSP - Over $1,000
20-Nov-1992 CCC - 355(b) PSP - Under $1,000
02-Oct-1998 CCC - 355(a) PSP Over $5,000
02-Oct-1998 CCC - 129(a) wilfully resisting or obstructing a peace officer

 

[otto]

I tried to piece together what happened in BC. It seems he flew under the radar here from 1992 until Oct 2, 1998 when he was arrested for possession of stolen property and resisting arrest. By the time he 1st appeared in a BC court on May 21st, 1999 there was a whole new set of charges dating back to Oct/Nov 1992. I was assuming that sometime between Oct 1998 and May 1999, they somehow matched him with his real identity and his old Alberta charges caught up with him.

These may have been posted previously but these are his charges in BC, the 1992 ones I assume are from Alberta although there is limited info on them (from https://justice.gov.bc.ca/cso/index.do)

23-Oct-1992 FDA - 39(1) Traffic in a controlled drug
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 353(1)(b) possessing automobile master key
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 351(1) Possess break-in instrument
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 354 Possession of property obtained by crime
23-Oct-1992 CCC - 90(1) Possession of a prohibited weapon
20-Nov-1992 CCC - 355(a) PSP - Over $1,000
20-Nov-1992 CCC - 355(b) PSP - Under $1,000
02-Oct-1998 CCC - 355(a) PSP Over $5,000
02-Oct-1998 CCC - 129(a) wilfully resisting or obstructing a peace officer

Thank you for putting that together! That was the end of his job, and since then he has lived at his parent's acreage. They would have been in their 60s at the time, and most likely appreciated his help around the farm.

Did he spend a couple of years in jail in 1999 and was then released because he was deemed not a threat of violence towards others? Were psychiatric treatments made mandatory for parole release?

 

[YYC]

I thought that the reason he left the shoe box in plain sight is that he never expected to get caught. I don't think he cared about leaving footprints given the prints in the garage.

Do we know that the mop was used?

I would say it is not a sure thing but is very likely that he used the mop. First of all, he had to move bodies of the victims through the kitchen on the way from the top floor to the mud room. However, the only footprints on the kitchen floor seem to be from JO; therefore, after the crime the floor was clear of any footprints. Also, the police took the swabs of the mop's green and white handles, although they didn't send it for analysis as there was no need for that as reported.

He didn't think that he would ever get caught, I agree, but perhaps the word about his grudge could get out to the police at some point so he could become a person of interest.

I believe that he didn't notice that he left footprints in the garage. Probably he turned off the light in the garage as he opened the garage door.

 

[Katharine]

<rsbm>

Just to keep the record straight as we go along, his "breakdown" was supposedly the reason for not continuing his med school education, but he was dismissed from his job at Can Test Ltd as a result of the criminal charges he faced in BC in 1999.

from:
http://globalnews.ca/news/1435807/p...ssing-family-case-has-criminal-history-in-bc/

I am so sorry. I clearly misunderstood article I read on this thread that had a link.

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local...-case-has-link-to-liknes-family-drug-lab-past

"The court heard Garland rose to become a supervisor of more than 30 people at Can Test but was unable to cope and suffered another breakdown. He was fired 1997."

The way it read was incorrect as not reason for being fired. Thank you for pointing this out. I do not like to make mistakes that would cause untruths.

<modsnip>

 

[kmclaren]

<rsbm>

Just to keep the record straight as we go along, his "breakdown" was supposedly the reason for not continuing his med school education, but he was dismissed from his job at Can Test Ltd as a result of the criminal charges he faced in BC in 1999.

from:
http://globalnews.ca/news/1435807/p...ssing-family-case-has-criminal-history-in-bc/

According to the court docs, Garland was dismissed from Can Test because of a *second* breakdown, not because he was facing criminal charges. He was fired from Can Test in 1997 before he came to the Richmond RCMPs attention in 1998/99.

He worked at BCIT after that but part time and a very limited window of time. There are no employment records for him there so we don't know if he was fired or quit or exactly when he started or left there. My guess is he may have worked at BCIT for a few months late 1998, early 1999.

http://www.canlii.org/en/ca/tcc/doc/2005/2005tcc176/2005tcc176.html

 

[kmclaren]

I am so sorry. I clearly misunderstood article I read on this thread that had a link.

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local...-case-has-link-to-liknes-family-drug-lab-past

"The court heard Garland rose to become a supervisor of more than 30 people at Can Test but was unable to cope and suffered another breakdown. He was fired 1997."

The way it read was incorrect as not reason for being fired. Thank you for pointing this out. I do not like to make mistakes that would cause untruths.

<modsnip>

I read it the same way you did. He was fired from Can Test because he couldn't cope and ended up having another breakdown.

 

[Sillybilly]

I am so sorry. I clearly misunderstood article I read on this thread that had a link.

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local...-case-has-link-to-liknes-family-drug-lab-past

"The court heard Garland rose to become a supervisor of more than 30 people at Can Test but was unable to cope and suffered another breakdown. He was fired 1997."

The way it read was incorrect as not reason for being fired. Thank you for pointing this out. I do not like to make mistakes that would cause untruths.

<modsnip>

Katharine, you were right and it is me who needs to apologize. According to the article you linked, it was "another breakdown" and he was fired from Can Test in 1997.

 

[Sillybilly]

According to the court docs, Garland was dismissed from Can Test because of a *second* breakdown, not because he was facing criminal charges. He was fired from Can Test in 1997 before he came to the Richmond RCMPs attention in 1998/99.

He worked at BCIT after that but part time and a very limited window of time. There are no employment records for him there so we don't know if he was fired or quit or exactly when he started or left there. My guess is he may have worked at BCIT for a few months late 1998, early 1999.

http://www.canlii.org/en/ca/tcc/doc/2005/2005tcc176/2005tcc176.html

According to this article, he was working at BCIT when LE found him in 1999:

Authorities found Douglas Garland in 1999, thanks in part to a tipster who contacted police after seeing his picture on an RCMP &#8220;most wanted&#8221; list online.

Douglas Garland was living in B.C.&#8217;s Lower Mainland and working as a chemical mixer at the B.C. Institute of Technology when police found him.

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local...-case-has-link-to-liknes-family-drug-lab-past

 

[otto]

I would say it is not a sure thing but is very likely that he used the mop. First of all, he had to move bodies of the victims through the kitchen on the way from the top floor to the mud room. However, the only footprints on the kitchen floor seem to be from JO; therefore, after the crime the floor was clear of any footprints. Also, the police took the swabs of the mop's green and white handles, although they didn't send it for analysis as there was no need for that as reported.

He didn't think that he would ever get caught, I agree, but perhaps the word about his grudge could get out to the police at some point so he could become a person of interest.

I believe that he didn't notice that he left footprints in the garage. Probably he turned off the light in the garage as he opened the garage door.

BBM

There was a bloody trail from the upstairs bedrooms, down the stairs, out the side door, and to the front driveway. There are shoe prints in the garage. What would he be mopping up in the kitchen?

If there was no need to send the mop for evidence testing, then it was understood (for unknown reasons) that the mop was not related to the murders.

I don't think he was expecting such a bloody crime scene. Given the bloody scene, he may have erratically mopped up some blood, and not other blood.

 

[otto]

I am so sorry. I clearly misunderstood article I read on this thread that had a link.

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local...-case-has-link-to-liknes-family-drug-lab-past

"The court heard Garland rose to become a supervisor of more than 30 people at Can Test but was unable to cope and suffered another breakdown. He was fired 1997."

The way it read was incorrect as not reason for being fired. Thank you for pointing this out. I do not like to make mistakes that would cause untruths.

<modsnip>

Thank you! Yes - a promotion that he couldn't handle, another nervous break down, driving a stolen semi, and his life collapsed.

 

[sublimemumma]

Thank you for putting that together! That was the end of his job, and since then he has lived at his parent's acreage. They would have been in their 60s at the time, and most likely appreciated his help around the farm.

Did he spend a couple of years in jail in 1999 and was then released because he was deemed not a threat of violence towards others? Were psychiatric treatments made mandatory for parole release?

The article that I posted says the he was to have weekly meetings with phych. for an extended amount of time and then possibly longer after he completes that. Looks like he was still meeting with one.

 

[deugirtni]

If the pump had been successful (which I don't think we know whether it was or it wasn't, whether in its then-current iteration or a later one), it could have been worth a LOT of money... ongoing.

It sounded to me from testimony given to date however, that DG was more upset about having been let go, rather than his work on the patent. Either way, it may have been more meaningful to him in the way of future job/business prospects, if he could show his name as a contributor on a patent, or receive a good reference, or develop a reputation in the industry perhaps, for being good at that type of work, etc?

From testimony given to date, it seemed like DG had made a point about AL and AL stealing from him, about AL not paying him for work performed, and about being fired, but I don't remember reading anything about him complaining about his name not being on a patent. (I could have missed it because lots to read). More may be coming in that regard?