Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #28

[Hatfield]

I was busy today and just now catching up and im going in order from where I left off early this morning so I dont ruin anything. LOL

Its so fascinating reading everyones thoughts I dont want to spoil anything till I catch up. LOL

Ill be able to talk to everyone whenever I catch up. LOL

 

[gunner.]

This was the first trial I have ever followed on Websleuths. What a smart, funny, caring and dedicated group of fine, fine folks I stumbled upon here. I have greatly enjoyed your company and I have learned so much -- not only about crime and law, but also about the basic good and humanity that exists out there in the wide world. And that is as good a rebuke to the likes of DG and his ilk as I can think of. Bravo and brava to you all, the jury, the judge and LE. And even though I never had the pleasure to meet Kathy, Alvin or Nathan, they and their families will remain in my heart. God speed.

I agree with this 100%.

I stumbled on this forum about 5 years ago during a missing persons case and quickly found it to be a group of refreshingly honest, smart, caring people online. Once that case had met it's end, I moved on but continued to check here for real information every time a missing person or mysterious death came on my radar. I followed this case meticulously here from day 1, reading daily, researching and learning an incredible amount about law, crime and the justice system from you fine folks... but never signing up, feeling I had nothing to contribute. Just wanted to add my heartfelt thanks for the encouragement to register, for the warm welcome, for the thought-provoking, insightful posts and for all the things I've learned so much about. It's been an intense ride and I could not ask for a better group to be with. Thanks for having me!

 

[WVWoman]

I didn't say they took too long. And I'm not faulting the jury. They came to the right decision.

What I'm saying is that I'm surprised there was at least one person who needed that much time. It's hard to understand what a holdout would be thinking and how on earth they got themselves so tied up in knots.

Well maybe your overthinking it ..maybe no one was holding out ..maybe they said let's walk through this together and did just that ..and then said ok we all agree he is guilty ...done ....but no one has to be talked into it

 

[gunner.]

Douglas Garland guilty of first-degree murder for killing Liknes couple and their grandson Nathan O’Brien

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...killing-alvin-kathy-liknes-and-their-grandson



Come on Blatchford, it wasn't that long.

No kidding! A little respect for the momentous task they undertook would be great. They took it seriously and they did it right.

 

[dogmatica]

I didn't say they took too long. And I'm not faulting the jury. They came to the right decision.

What I'm saying is that I'm surprised there was at least one person who needed that much time. It's hard to understand what a holdout would be thinking and how on earth that holdout (or those holdouts) got themselves so tied up in knots.

That's what I'm saying - there wasn't necessarily a hold out. It just took that long for them to diligently go through the evidence, as they were supposed to.

 

[musicaljoke]

I didn't say they took too long. And I'm not faulting the jury. They came to the right decision.

What I'm saying is that I'm surprised there was at least one person who needed that much time. It's hard to understand what a holdout would be thinking and how on earth that holdout (or those holdouts) got themselves so tied up in knots.

Maybe they came to an agreement after five minutes, but wanted to make the announcement when the family, the lawyers and the press was fresh and rested. Maybe they spent the morning having tea and crumpets and played a few rounds of euchre.

Nobody will ever know.

 

[dogmatica]

Ultimately what does it matter? They rendered the correct verdict in a timely manner. End of story.

 

[dyannaON]

I really want some crumpets with melted butter and raspberry jam.


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[dogmatica]

I really want some crumpets with melted butter and raspberry jam.


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I really want a beer.

 

[CentralAlberta]

Oh and while that was all happening, I got the call. Back to work for Jade (I called back after the verdict lol, priorities)!

Good for you, Jade. Somebody knew how much you were needed HERE and waited!

 

[lecomte]

I didn't say they took too long. And I'm not faulting the jury. They came to the right decision.

What I'm saying is that I'm surprised there was at least one person who needed that much time. It's hard to understand what a holdout would be thinking and how on earth that holdout (or those holdouts) got themselves so tied up in knots.

I could see how someone might be unsure about the first degree verdict for NO, and wanting to talk through it to decide.

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[Leeesh]

I'm so happy with the verdict! Thank you to everyone on this group for all your insight to this case and trial. You all have such big hearts. It has been awesome following along with all of you. Thanks to JadeSLeuth and everyone else that did twitter coverage during the trials too, you guys are super awesome and quick! Lol. Hope after tomorrow DG gets 75 yrs and dies in prison so the family never has to worry about the waste of skin ever again. And also they can say a proper goodbye to their loved ones and can move on and start their healing.
❤RIP Alvin ❤ Kathy ❤ And Sweet Little Nathan ❤

 

[ABro]

Ultimately what does it matter? They rendered the correct verdict in a timely manner. End of story.

If ever there was a slam dunk case this was it. I think the fact that it took the jury this long points to number of systemic problems that merit consideration:

1) Overly long and complicated jury instructions
2) The ubiquitous use of overly complex "decision trees"
3) The legal version of the CSI effect where normal people take on the worst habits of TV lawyers and miss the forest for the trees.
4) The requirement for a unanimous jury decision (The UK and Australia no longer have this while US has smaller juries in some states)



I'm a huge fan of juries because they're regular people who don't and shouldn't think like lawyers and judges. That's the whole reason for juries' existence. It scares me to know that someone needed a full day to come to the right verdict. That tells me they were thinking like the worst TV lawyer.

Honestly, I think there might have been fisticuffs if it had taken any longer.

And while we will never know what happened in the jury room, I believe that the fact 10 people came back quickly recommending consecutive sentences gives a hint of what the dynamic might have been.

 

[ABro]

I could see how someone might be unsure about the first degree verdict for NO, and wanting to talk through it to decide.

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Really? Could you come to a second degree verdict knowing what you know? Even if you thought he might have been killed at the house?

 

[Blue Amethyst]

Thanks to everyone for seeing this case through to the end. May the families find peace now as their loved ones will be forever in their hearts and ours as well. This was the first case that I ever followed and it is so remarkable to find out the tough jobs that everyone tackled to bring justice for these families. I hope DG never sees the light of day again and peace to the Hartley family who will never have to worry about this using their son's identity again. This is a great group of people and I would love to check in on a future case and see the familiar names on my screen.

 

[gia2]

RIP Alvin, Kathy and little Nathan. I hope the families can find some form of peace in time.

 

[Halldor]

Here's my random thoughts and questions now that this fitting verdict has come in:

: I am so pleased that this monster has been found guilty. Although I am a province away and do not have a connection via blood or other kin, apparently I have had myself quite worked up over all of the happenings. I have released tension in the form of sudden elation at the downfall of another person. Do not get me wrong - the deserves everything coming his way!

: Now what happens to all of the evidence which has been gathered over the course of the last few years? Does it need to be kept for any period of time pending appeal? In particular I am curious about the articles found (bones and teeth primarily) which were IDd as being bits and pieces of Alvin, Kathy, and Nathan. Will these remains be released to their families for formal laying to rest if they should choose to?


And Superman's cape needs to go home.

 

[winnnancy]

Thanks everyone. Having followed this from the time the Amber Alert was issued nationwide I'm thankful and relieved to have been able to follow both the collection of * evidence* and the trial. Although nothing can possibly make up for the loss of Nathan and his grandparents, theres some peace to be had with the fact that their killer has been convicted.
It has been a privilege and honour to to move through this entire process with the websleuthers.

 

[Leader6518]

I don't think the jury took too long at all. They had a huge amount of evidence, and they wanted to be thorough and get it right. I think they were smart and thoughtful and did their job correctly and carefully. Zero criticism from me on their timeliness.

After such a heart wrenching trial, I would have been shocked if the jury didn't spend some time talking about the evidence, their feelings, and just things in general to relieve the stress. If they were given decision trees, that took time to go through and hear everyone's thoughts.

My heart breaks for his family and Nathan's 14-year old brother. That is a tough age and it worries me that the dad brought up depression and suicide. It scares me for the brother and family. My prayers will be with this family.

 

[otto]

The only downside from this trial is that the internet is currently flooded with crime scene photos that are associated with the names Liknes and O'brien. The fewer times those links are clicked, the more they will become buried behind other similar names. Let's step away from the crime scene photos and hope that they fall into the background before the surviving minor children are accidentally overwhelmed with them.

Great news about the verdict, and very happy to hear that the sentence could include consecutive sentencing of 75 years before he is eligible for parole. That means there is no need to have him designated a dangerous offender.