CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #8

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roseofsharon said:
Thanks for finding this Dotr!

It is quite interesting how a seasoned detective describes what he saw, as the worst thing ...............................

Just imo, but if I ever came across a scene, such as what Hrab described, I would run for the hills first and then call the authorities.
......................................................

Also, have never read any msm that PK tried to get help from a neighbour, when he first found AG, not to say he didn't try or did, but have not read this anywhere on msm.

Wish we could listen to the 911 call.

IMO as always:seeya:
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Yes, I want to underline what you said! My feelings are the same as yours.
 
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1557345/synopsis


No thought could be absurd enough:

"........... and meet Phil, who tells them they are this season's winners and will receive $ 1 million. ......................................"

But then: why Amazing Grace-email to LF?? I have no idea.
 
FromGermany said:
Very interesting! Can we have hope in our case/cases?
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Well, FromGermany, I'll put it this way: My hope for solving Audrey's and Sonia's murders lies in the posters on this board..... not in those who take from $100,000 to $130,000 for their expertise in solving crimes. Their record for solving the murders committed in 2010 does not warrant much hope.

my opinion only; no others responsible. :stormingmad:

dd2
 
Let's examine the "Perp 1 & Perp 2 Scenario":

Did they commit the murder together?

Did one perp commit the murder and the other one knew about it? And had an alibi.

Does one of the perps have the Camaro?

Do both perps have alibis for the killing time frame?

Why add a sexual component?

Is the Perp 1 & Perp 2 situation part of a polygraph "discrepancy"?

Were both Perp 1 & 2 polygraphed?

Did one of the perps deliver the soup?

Is the situation between the two possible perps the reason AG did not want to attend a wedding?

Had both perps been inside AG's house.....not merely on the bench?

Did one of the perps tell the other perp the code for the garage?

Did both possible perps know of the cake delivery time?

On and on.........
 
OHHHH, I've just had a thought!

Please bear with me here. What if there's also Perp 3!

Let's say "Perp 3" is a young man who is a neighbour of AG. He's either a gay man who's come out or he's hiding the fact from family, friends, etc. He's friends with Perp 1 and Perp 2.

I've said all along that the 'Amazing Grace' vid was sent by the killer.

How's this:

The video was sent as a signal to two people letting them know that the killing was about to soon take place?

Am I nuts or does this make an ounce of sense?

:nuts:
 
Just have to toss this out there.. Had a thing for menstruating women, thinking of a a "simulation" of that process.
Bible John - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/bible-john-police-officer-says-2218723

" Revealed: Bible John was a police officer, says ex-cop in a shocking new book
25 Aug 2013 07:57

WRITER and retired officer Paul Harrison believes Scotland’s most notorious murderer is still alive and he evaded justice because he was a cop"
 
No_Stone_Unturned said:
OHHHH, I've just had a thought!

Please bear with me here. What if there's also Perp 3!

Let's say "Perp 3" is a young man who is a neighbour of AG. He's either a gay man who's come out or he's hiding the fact from family, friends, etc. He's friends with Perp 1 and Perp 2.

I've said all along that the 'Amazing Grace' vid was sent by the killer.

How's this:

The video was sent as a signal to two people letting them know that the killing was about to soon take place?

Am I nuts or does this make an ounce of sense?

:nuts:
Click to expand...

Reminded of this case where the perp Douglas Donald Moore had teenage accomplices, wonder what happened to one of them, the one who helped hide body parts, could he be free?

http://murderpedia.org/male.M/m/moore-douglas-donald.htm
 
Copied from dotr's post above:

thinking of a a "simulation" of that process.



Good thinking!! :applause: It would 'fit' for a few reasons:

- killer likes blood (SV scene was extremely bloodied; same with her car)

- killer/attacker hates women of a certain age (AG = 73, SV and SL in their mid-40's hence approaching menopause)

- this "process" is not really a "sexual" experience but, that said, I can understand Hrab being confused/alarmed by a lot of blood at the scene for AG and he might have mistaken it for a vaginal rape with a sharp implement

:twocents:
 
No_Stone_Unturned said:
:rockon: (3 members and 3 guests)

(2 members and 6 guests)
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IMO, it's a strange thing that we have so many visitors in here- I know that sometimes it's regulars just not signed in, but when the numbers get up to 6 or 7, we must be saying something interesting! This case is cold-no publicity-strange that we'd have regular followers :seeya: Hi out there! MOO
 
No_Stone_Unturned said:

.........................................................
Let's say "Perp 3" is a young man who is a neighbour of AG. He's either a gay man who's come out or he's hiding the fact from family, friends, etc. He's friends with Perp 1 and Perp 2.
..................................................................
The video was sent as a signal to two people letting them know that the killing was about to soon take place?
..............................................
:nuts:
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I would like to reaffirm with your thought; I think of CF.
 
FromGermany said:
I would like to reaffirm with your thought; I think of CF.
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Yes......my thoughts exactly!!

And all would be considered to be "young and close".

Further thinking on my part:

1. The actual KILLER = someone who is at present incarcerated. :jail: And someone to whom killing/attacking is not something new (thinking of SV and SL).

2. Another perp = :cake4u: ( assisted, planned)

3. A third perp = look-out guy to see when/where AG is at various times of the day/night.
 
Re possible perps: did someone whom had spent Boxing Day with AG drop by her home, knowing she had not been feeling well on Boxing Day.

Perp dropped by on the pretense of seeing how AG was feeling, but in reality wanted to borrow from Aunty My Audrey and was turned down.

Angered inside, the perp kept it cool until reaching the garage, safe from Togi and Schatzen and then went into a killing frenzy. AG came into the garage to see the visitor out imo.

Perp could be someone needing money for their expensive hobbies and gambling habit and wanting money to travel.

Or was it premeditated, knowing a certain relative would inherit a hefty sum and hoping to be able to borrow from that relative.

The perp is someone who doesn't like to be told "no"!!!

IMO - and picturing scenario here.
 
roseofsharon said:
Re possible perps: did someone whom had spent Boxing Day with AG drop by her home, knowing she had not been feeling well on Boxing Day.

Perp dropped by on the pretense of seeing how AG was feeling, but in reality wanted to borrow from Aunty My Audrey and was turned down.

Angered inside, the perp kept it cool until reaching the garage, safe from Togi and Schatzen and then went into a killing frenzy. AG came into the garage to see the visitor out imo.

Perp could be someone needing money for their expensive hobbies and gambling habit and wanting money to travel.

Or was it premeditated, knowing a certain relative would inherit a hefty sum and hoping to be able to borrow from that relative.

The perp is someone who doesn't like to be told "no"!!!

IMO - and picturing scenario here.
Click to expand...
Maybe the perp delivered the soup as a kind gesture? Perhaps he was traveling that way? Since that day was the last day anyone had heard from AG and there's no accounting from LV as to what AG's was doing-where they chatted etc. MOO
 
roseofsharon said:
Re possible perps: did someone whom had spent Boxing Day with AG drop by her home, knowing she had not been feeling well on Boxing Day.

Perp dropped by on the pretense of seeing how AG was feeling, but in reality wanted to borrow from Aunty My Audrey and was turned down.

Angered inside, the perp kept it cool until reaching the garage, safe from Togi and Schatzen and then went into a killing frenzy. AG came into the garage to see the visitor out imo.

Perp could be someone needing money for their expensive hobbies and gambling habit and wanting money to travel.

Or was it premeditated, knowing a certain relative would inherit a hefty sum and hoping to be able to borrow from that relative.

The perp is someone who doesn't like to be told "no"!!!

IMO - and picturing scenario here.
Click to expand...

BBM

Imo, it was a mistake by the killer(s) to have let the dogs be found crated - like LE claims, the perp(s) was/were known to AG. Then again, who is going to uncrate 2 German Sheppards that must have gone ballistic at the commotion in 'their' garage where their owner was.

If the dogs were crated when seeing a guest out through the garage, and AG was killed in the garage, they must have been crated during the visit - whether the visit took place inside the home and or in the garage.

We know from the SV case, and general knowledge as well, a home is harder to sell when a death has taken place inside a home. Nice of the killer to not devalue or complicate the sale of AG's home.
 
Thanks FromGermany,

Yes, I understand that MCM was utilized in the TB case, and also in Sonia V's case, but has anyone seen anything anywhere to indicate that it has been used in AG's case? If L/E has restricted AG's murder to being one by a lone nut, I think that is a mistake. They need to broaden their perspective. (Stone, if you're a nutter, you've got me and one other whom I know for company!! :crazy: )

Does MCM's use in Sonia V's case mean that L/E suspects that her killer(s) have also murdered others ?
 
MsSherlock said:
Maybe the perp delivered the soup as a kind gesture? Perhaps he was traveling that way? Since that day was the last day anyone had heard from AG and there's no accounting from LV as to what AG's was doing-where they chatted etc. MOO
Click to expand...

It stands out for me how much AG's 'illness' played a role surrounding her death.

It starts just before Christmas with LV's friends (who are also acquainted with AG) assuming AG will feign illness and not show up at LV's on Christmas Day - LV happened to change the guest list that year and people seemed to know in advance this would ruffle AG. This is according to 'Suzie' and I can buy into that - why would Suzie need to lie about this when relating it to someone? Suzie was relating what she knew about AG and Christmas Day.

Then PK picks up the illness story with - he called AG on Christmas Day (Saturday) to deliver her present but she was not feeling well and the new delivery date becomes Thursday - yet AG went to LV's on Sunday.

Then, imo, the illness story is passed back to LV who will deliver soup on Monday am. AG contacts PK by e-mail (allegedly) on Monday am just before LV's arrival - secondary infection yada, yada, yada but AG will go to coffee klatch on Wednesday.

PK does not hear from AG again after this e-mail and does not see any red flags after being use to receiving 2 or 3 e-mails per day from AG for years. He is also not alarmed on Thursday when AG does not answer her phone when he calls prior to his arrival, after not hearing from her now for 3 days.

LV also does not follow up after delivering soup to her ill friend - a friend for 30 years, early 70's and a smoker. Just drops it off and carries on. Next thing 'ya know - bingo, LV is almost a million bucks richer (in my estimation).

Then the illness story passes to AG herself (allegedly). If the last e-mail from AG's computer is the Amazing Grace video to her neighbor on Monday pm, then she had to have sent an e-mail or some form of message prior to that to someone in the coffee group - to say she was freakin' ill and would be ill until Wednesday evening. Covered off, or explained why no one in the coffee group needed to call AG to see if she was OK.

Then when no one is looking, someone shows up and kills her - in her garage which is better than in the house from a realty point of view. And didn't leave much of a mess according to PK - he was able to sit on his vehicle in the driveway and wait for a first responder - no concern that a killer was still on the property.

Choreography, imo.
 
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